Ageing Car; stick or twist?

Sounds like a decent car - I'd wait till it lets you down in a big way before moving it on.

Our Fiesta (non turbo) is on 166k and aside from the list of parts wearing out growing slightly longer and more expensive each year (a hub bearing here, a suspension strut there) it keeps on going. Occasionally I also have to spend £20 on ali-express for a 99p pattern gear stick plastic bits and interior switches to keep it looking "smart" enough that the OH doesn't dismiss it for being worn out in her mind. But it's never failed to start for anything more serious than a dead battery.

I’m EV curious but not sure they really do what I want (yet). I’ve also heard the argument that the most environmentally friendly thing is to keep running your current care. Even though I don’t fully understand the logic of that argument, it sounds plausible.

A huge amount of any car's carbon footprint is in the manufacturing. If you can keep an old car on the road then it's preventing those emissions even if it's less efficient day to day.

e.g. Kwick-Fit informed me that the Fiesta was uneconomical to get through it's MOT about 6 years ago! Between the warranty on some new parts and cheap fixes I think it cost me £20 to get it through!

Comparing the repair price to the car's value isn't really a fair comparison either, unless you're playing bangernomics. Fixing our basically worthless (£300 on a sunny day with a full tank?) 19yo Fiesta for £650 isn't "economical", but in the real world that's 2 months PCP on it's replacement. If £650 get's it through it's January MOT to the end of the tax year it's already a profitable decision.

So the plan is to keep it going as long as possible, it doesn't really fit our needs (a Berlingo-alike would work best for us), but I can get a bike in the back in bits, and it's reliable, so it's not worth spending £££££ on a new-ish Berlingo.

Have you looked at the price of a newer similar ish spec car. I think you might be tempted to stick.

TLDR: So, to cut a tediously long story short, is it possible to run a small modern turbo petrol engine to, say, 200k miles without it becoming unreliable?

Any modern car I would say yes. Just keep saving ahead for the inevitable wear and tear bills.

I’m EV curious but not sure they really do what I want (yet)

Well, you get inside them, you press pedals and turn the round thing and make it go where you want to go.

So, to cut a tediously long story short, is it possible to run a small modern turbo petrol engine to, say, 200k miles without it becoming unreliable?

You have to understand what's going on here.  Each component of your car has a reliability curve - the chances of a failure increase over time. That probability will be long or short depending on the component and the life it's had.  You can dramatically increase the probability of certain components failing (or steepen the curve) by lack of maintenance e.g. the turbo by not changing the oil, etc.

You can keep running a car for as long as you like as long as you keep replacing parts that wear or fail.  This is almost certainly cheaper than buying a new car; if you buy another older car, then all the components in it are also closer to their respective failure times.  It's worthing out that the future failure time of a component is specific to the one you actually have, it's not the same for all copies of the same car.

So I would say keep fixing it until you get fed up with it.  And also remember that a car isn't one thing, it's a collection of individual components, most of which are unrelated. So if the central locking plays up, it doesn't mean that the injectors are going to fail next. If you fix the central locking the car could go on for another decade. Or the injectors could fail tomorrow.

If its still passing MoTs, not burning oil, no obvious sign of problems - why change? Its doing everything you needs, anything more is vanity.
Run it till it expires, and in the meantime bank the cash that you would use as payments for a. fix this one, or b. buy another.

Ive ran a Ford Ka (2012 plate) to 150k miles easily.

Just stick an amount in the bank every month (£100 maybe) so when your next/first big bill turns up (whether it be service or repair) you've got some cash to cover it, then you start looking at replacement. But if you've just fixed/serviced something expensive it will *tend* to be a reasonable time before the next big bill.
Ex has a ~130000 mile car that's only had two big bills, one service at 80000, one repair (clutch) at 120000. Third big bill will be the decision point (160000 service IIRC). Everything else has been servicing or (very) routine maintenance, next most expensive thing was that the boot lock failed. That was £400 ish to repair at a main dealer.

We have a 55 plate Mazda 2 that has 126k miles on it. It is worth less than 500 quid. It gets serviced every year, new bits when needed, and we'll be keeping it until it until something catastrophic happens to it.

I wouldn't change my washing machine unless it died and, to me, a car is just another domestic appliance so the same logic applies.

Run it till it expires, and in the meantime bank the cash that you would use as payments for a. fix this one, or b. buy another.

C. Spend it on something else. In reality you'll probably never rack up ~£20k in repairs.

I think of it in terms of my pension.

£££ saved on PCP each month, plus tax efficiency = probably a decade earlier retirement than the Jones next door in their nicer car.

My Fabia is about to tick over the 200k mark and on the last MOT back in December the tester said he wouldn't believe had down half the mileage unless he saw the dash himself! No rust whatsoever (10 years old), cleans up really well and only ever carries me and a bike on the towbar so the interior looks mint when hoovered. So yes, modern cars can easily get to 200k with no issues, said Fabia hasn't had anything more than service items in all of those miles. If you know and trust the Suzuki then keep it going, much better to know a car than switch to an unknown.

Stick with it....

Get a saving account start saving

My 2014 diesel Hyundai i40 is just short of 182k (I've had it from new) and has started to develop a couple of issues - looks like a new PS pump and yesterday it popped an injector oil seal - which meant I had to be rescued by Green Flag.

Deciding if I should get it fixed and move it on or stick with it a bit longer.....

Deciding if I should get it fixed and move it on or stick with it a bit longer…..

I always figure that after a bill the car is in better condition than it was a week ago, and I didn't want to sell it a week agao.

has started to develop a couple of issues – looks like a new PS pump and yesterday it popped an injector oil seal 

It hasn't started developing them - it finished developing them and you fixed them.  That's no indication that anything else will go wrong with it.

Thanks folks.

It's not so much the economics of it that bother me. I know there is no such thing as a free lunch and I agree that the comparison is not whatever the car is worth but what the alternative would cost. I'll save on depreciation (vs buying a new, or newer, car) and lose on repair costs. I'm also not going to be spending my weekends wielding a spanner. Been there, done that (when I was much younger/poorer) and have better things to do with my time. So repairs will be at market rates. Even so, it's probably going to be cheaper to repair the current car than buy a new (or even a nearly new) one.

But as @molgrips points out, a car is a collection of parts all of which wear and can fail. I'm not worried about the stuff that wears. It's the failing that bothers me. I've always had it serviced every 12k miles. Not always at the main dealer these days to be honest. But I'm happy to replace anything they recommend replacing at a service/mot. What bothers me is the increased risk of being stranded at the side of the road. One breakdown outweighs all of the potential savings in my book.

But as @molgrips points out, a car is a collection of parts all of which wear and can fail.

Yes - but molgrips usually starts with a complete car - tinkers a lot - and then ends up with a collection of parts! 🙂

most stuff that wears out in newer cars doesn't leave you stranded though - it flashes a light on the dashboard and you get it fixed a few months later - counterintuitively very new cars (under 3 months old) are much more likley to have an issue due to a part thats just been faulty at manufacture.

I'd keep running it, especially at 20k/year milage (which would be awkward to put on an EV, especially one with extra ride height/non-ev-tyres) - when it starts to go wrong more often, replace it then.

I ran our last car to 190k and it only left us stranded once, but I think that was more age related (brittle coolant resovoir cracked).

Once is enough 🙂

It's a good point though. It has been very reliable and modern cars do tend to give more warning of things going wrong, so maybe it is worth the risk.

The 20k/year (actually more like 24k) being a problem for an EV is something I'll need to explore more. The vast majority of that is still trips of less than 200 miles (round trip). There are just 50-100 mile trips most days. That should mean 90% of driving could be on a home charge leading to even bigger savings (over petrol/diesel) than someone doing a more usual 10k/year. Basically what @molgrips says below 🙂

What bothers me is the increased risk of being stranded at the side of the road.

Major engine components are very reliable these days.  I got stuck twice - once the battery was knackered and it wouldn't start at an airport; the other time the immobiliser unit packed up.  A fairly random ocurrence.

which would be awkward to put on an EV, especially one with extra ride height/non-ev-tyres

Eh?

You might also want to consider that 20k a year in a petrol is costing you what, £3.5k a year?  Whereas in an an EV charged at home it could cost you £400-450.

Sounds like a decent car – I’d wait till it lets you down in a big way before moving it on

Agree. If the only major expenditure is "consumables" keep it. Once the big bills start coming in (or are threatened) it's time to get rid.

I'm running a Volvo V70 @205k miles, a Berlingo @ 111k and a Cayenne at 165k miles - all of them are 19 to 20years old.

I'm also rebuilding/refreshing an XC90 with 215k miles.

For me the two things that make me change cars are;
1. Rust
2. The car no longer serves its original purpose.

I don't subscribe to beyond economic repair but admittedly I do spanner my own cars.

Suzuki are generally good well engineered/built cars. I'd imagine your biggest issue and the thing that kills yours will be rust seeing as your in Scotland.

You need to determine how much value the car has now Vs how much life it has left in it. If it's not worth much now (due to its mileage) then keep using it till it dies/rusts. Cars generally don't really break down without warning and you can usually nurse them home.

So the op wants to get rid of a car that he knows inside and out having had it from new, that has never let him down, does everything he needs and having had it for so long (at a cheap price to boot) owes him nothing.....? Right?

I'm with Alpin.
Japanese car, known history, one owner, well placed in reliability scores, ugly and boring AF (possibly denting used values), in Scotlandcestershire and EV killing cold from Nov - April.... but completely happy with it and debt averse...

I'd be keeping that and banking some cash each month against possible wear items.

Out of interest are any of those saying keep it based in the north east of Scotland and using the vehicle. On a daily basis.

Milage means sod all. What age is the car.

Time kills cars here if it's 10 years old. It's got some life left in it. If it's hit 15 years your on borrowed time without major repairs /welding

Sliding scale in between. Even on modern cars.

At 6 years old I wouldn't be considering getting rid. It's high enough milage to be low value to sell. But well known enough to still be reliable. Be as well keeping it till it starts it's major faults. I expect it'll get to 10 years before that's an issue

What bothers me is the increased risk of being stranded at the side of the road. One breakdown outweighs all of the potential savings in my book.

You could buy a new - or new to you - car and still have that happen, it's just how it is. My Mk2 Golf broke a drive-shaft and 'left me stranded at the side of the road' a few years ago. I waited 45 minutes for the AA who recovered the car to my local friendly mechanic and a week later, at a cost of, oh I dunno, a couple of hundred quid, it was back on the road.

It wasted a couple of hours of my time, but it wasn't really a big deal. Cars break down occasionally, it's what they do, being a collection of mechanical parts and all.

You could buy a new – or new to you – car and still have that happen

happened to me in a brand new car that only had delivery miles. Drove from the SE to Sheffield ok, then on the way home lost all power. Fortunately it was just an electrical connector had come loose. But still involved a nice wait by the side of the A1

I’d be inclined to stick with a car I knew

Looks like a slam-dunk for keeping the old car then, which is good as that's the way I was leaning. A bit surprised there weren't any dissenting voices as I didn't think it was that clear cut.

Autotrader reckons I could get £6k for the S-cross. That sounds optimistic to me, so let's say £5k if I could be bothered to sell privately. I paid £20k for it, so that means it's lost £15k in just over 6 years or around £2.5k/year. Autotrader also reckons I could by a 23-plate new model (same spec) with 6,500 miles on the clock for £21k. So, over the next 6 years and 120k miles I could probably match that depreciation cost. Let's call it £3k/year to be on the safe side and allow for a few repairs (brakes/tyres etc). So that's my benchmark.

My car, at 130k miles, has barely cost anything in repairs so far, but keeping it means I'd expect to have to replace tyres, brake pads/disks, exhaust system, clutch and timing chain quite soon at the least.  Probably a few wheel bearings, CV joints and suspension dampers too and then there is the risk of a more major engine/turbo failure. Even at the local independent garage those costs are going to mount up.

I reckon it still works, but only if you stick with it. There will be years when the repair bills are close to (or even higher) that the cost of driving a newer car. You need to be prepared to ride those out to get the years where it doesn't cost much. Even so, the savings may not be that great and of course, you are driving an older car rather than a newer one and do have a higher risk of being left stranded by the side of the road too.

I found an interesting article from a car breakers

https://www.scrap-car-dealers.co.uk/latest-news/post/average-lifespan-of-a-car#:~:text=As%20of%202021%2C%20the%20average,longer%20than%20they%20used%20to.

Which contained the lines "Gone are the days when a standard car would last around 8 years or 150,000 miles. Nowadays, you can expect a car to last you upwards of 200,000 miles – perhaps more depending on the make and model of the car and how well you take care of it", which is encouraging 🙂

Now we've done the economic argument (to death) could somebody explain the environmental one to me? Instinctively I get it. I don't think we can fix the problems that were caused by over-consumption through buying more stuff. Keeping an older car running makes sense, but of course, me selling it doesn't mean it stops running.

I had a look on the MOT site to see what has happened to the last two (main) cars that we've sold.

Diesel Subaru Forester: Bought (new) in March 2011. Sold (well traded-in) in November 2017 with around 150k on the clock. It's actually due a new MOT in a few weeks, but it passed last February with no issues and 168k on the clock. So, it's still seems to be going (at 13 years old) but is only averaging 3k miles per year at the moment.

Diesel Rav4 (4x4): Bought (new) in July 2004. Traded-in March 2011 with 128k on the clock. Passed it's last MOT in January 2019 with 162k on the clock. So lasted around 15-years all in, but only did 34k miles in the 8 years after I got rid of it (just over 4k/year).

I guess that makes sense. Newer high-mileage cars appeal to those who do low mileage as they can get into something a bit newer for the same price and aren't bothered by the mileage.

So (finally) here is the environmental question. Let's say (conservatively) my S-cross is good for another six years (before rust finally takes it). Is it better for me to drive 120k miles in that petrol car, or sell it to someone who only does, say, 20k miles in the same period and drive those 120k miles in an EV instead?

I should start by saying that I’m not into cars. ......... I resent spending money on them.

For them to be able to do the job you want them to - you do have to spend money on them. Not just buying them but running them. The running them is the important bit - if you don't willingly maintain and repair them the money spent on buying them is wasted.

So buy a car you really like - not something sexy or showy - something that does the job you want well. You don't have to like cars but you do need to like the car you've got so that every time you hand over money to keep it in running order you are looking forward to continuing to use it. If you resent paying to keep a car on the road you resent that car so its the wrong one.

It's an extreme example really but I drive a 17 year old Berlingo. My mum has altzeimers. The car was my dad's. It's not like his car - it's the car.  It's the car that they enjoyed their retirement in and that she continued to drive after he died. Theres not much she can express with any clarity anymore but she can point to me as arrive and tell one of the nurses that 'he's one of the good ones' and point to the car and say 'that ones important'. And we can drive around in it for hours going nowhere in particular and sometimes she won't get out when we get home so we drive around again. Or sit in a hand car wash and ask for the longest possible combination of washes and waxes while we eat mcflurries.  There had been a time when we'd drive places together to get a meal or go for a walk or whatever when I realised the journey was in fact the whole point - as an experiment I just didn't stop anywhere - just drove as if we were going somewhere.

I've spent £1000s on keeping this funny little car running - new gearbox, new axel, turbo, injectors, ABS pump, in most instances a bill thats greater than the value of the car  and don't resent a penny.

Out of interest are any of those saying keep it based in the north east of Scotland and using the vehicle. On a daily basis.

Further north, worse weather, similar roads... 😉

So (finally) here is the environmental question. Let’s say (conservatively) my S-cross is good for another six years (before rust finally takes it). Is it better for me to drive 120k miles in that petrol car, or sell it to someone who only does, say, 20k miles in the same period and drive those 120k miles in an EV instead?

Only answer to that is "it depends".

But 9 times out of 10, keeping the original car will be least environmentally damaging.
Unless you're going from an old 12 cylinder jag that burns oil at the same rate as fuel to a tiny EV. Then it's pretty clear cut.

Milage means sod all. What age is the car.

Time kills cars here if it’s 10 years old.

Bottom of my 10yr old camper is immaculate.
It's only done 22k summer miles though.
It is an outlier, but miles do matter, particularly if like the OP you batter around rough, twisty, hilly, mucky and gritty Highland miles.

So (finally) here is the environmental question

The true answer is to reduce miles / don't drive.
However that's not a nirvana most of us can afford to or want to embrace.
The vast majority of time is a case of drive it as many miles and years as you can is the least damaging for the environment.

Instinctively I get it. I don’t think we can fix the problems that were caused by over-consumption through buying more stuff. Keeping an older car running makes sense, but of course, me selling it doesn’t mean it stops running.

This is the thing really - So long as someone is buying the new EVs that are being made then over time we'll all end up driving them becuase it time there won't be anything left  to buy new or otherwise. I didn't need to consciously adopt the notion of running cars on unleaded petrol - it time I couldn't buy anything sensible that ran of 4 star. There aren't enough EVs built yet for us all to have one, in a short amount of time there'll be hardly any viable ICE cars left for anyone who'd insist on owning one to buy.  If you sell your car and drive an EV, your car will continue to be driven until it reaches the end of its useful life. If you buy someone else's car becuase they're buying an EV their old car will continue to be driven until it reaches the end of its useful life. The net result is exactly the same.

6 years old is not ageing.

Check out the bathtub failure curve:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bathtub_curve

The reason new cars come with a warranty is the infant mortality phase.

You are in the middle. The "wear out" phase is at 10 years/100k miles as that is the design life of a car like this.

The best time to buy a car is at 3 years old and sell at 10 years old. So long as you service it properly statistically little is likely to go wrong.

 I don’t think we can fix the problems that were caused by over-consumption through buying more stuff.

No, but we can help by replacing the car we were going to buy anyway with a car that has much lower emissions.

that is the design life of a car like this

I'm not sure that statement is particularly helpful...

The best time to buy a car is at 3 years old and sell at 10 years old. So long as you service it properly statistically little is likely to go wrong.

the flipside of that argument is a car of that age that has an expensive failure is
a) unlikely to be covered by warranty
b) worth enough as to not be worth writing off

it might have the fewest failures (I don't actually believe that, the decreasing failure rate is probbably done by 4 months in) - but the potential cost impact of any failure is massive, and significantly more than a car run outside of that window.

TBF, Germans don't feel cars are run in until 120k kilometres

Out of interest are any of those saying keep it based in the north east of Scotland and using the vehicle. On a daily basis.

I used to live in the north east, They had roads there then and when I visited recently they still do. - traded in my Polo (that everyone in the Highlands seemed to drive at the time for some reason - my local mechanic would only work on agricultural machinery or VW Polos) for a 1972 MGB as my daily driver becuase the roads were so nice. I had half a mile of off-road track to my front door - it's a track you can drive cars along them - it was fine. The Highlands and North East have pretty much the best rural roads in the UK condition and specification wise - I'd swap an NE Scotland rural stretch of tarmac for a SW Scotland stretch of tarmac any day.

No, but we can help by replacing the car we were going to buy anyway with a car that has much lower emissions.

Depends on your mileage and how long youo will be driving it for, as EVs have a higher emission cost to start with it will take a while to pass the tipping point of emissions.

An EV is also a heavy beast, if you switch to a lighter, smaller engined petrol car that tipping point will be even further away.

As above definitley stick - you know the car, its been looked after, and its reliable.  its not high milage - i have often taken my cars to 200k+ albiet being used for a lot of motorway miles.   Just a footnote re all wheel drive for the winter - i run rear wheel drive BMW in scotland, BUT, I am evangelical about proper winter tyres which will overcome any reasonable winter snow until it gets silly depth.  They will out perform awd cars with summer tyres easily.

Depends on your mileage and how long youo will be driving it for

No, it depends on how long it's going to be driven for. It doesn't have to be you doing the miles.

OK, in the unlikely event that anybody cares, I think I've sorted out the environmental issue.

I was getting confused by the reports about how many miles you had to drive to make an EV environmentally beneficial. But they are based on a false premise i.e. that the alternative to a new EV is a new ICE car. So they are only looking at the "extra" CO2 required to produce the EV. If your comparison is keeping an existing car (i.e. not buying a new car at all) then you have to look at the total CO2 required to make the EV not just the extra bit and you pretty much never pay that back (at least not with the current energy mix). So keeping the existing car running is indeed the more environmentally responsible thing to do even if it is emitting more CO2 per mile than a newer EV.

That bathtub failure mode is exactly what bothers me. But if the wear out phase is 100k miles then I don't think, at 130k miles, you can say my car is in the middle.

Nice story by the way @maccruiskeen. You are quite right that keeping a car running that you have a connection to is a joy. And yes, we do actually have roads up here 🙂 Some are quite nice. Although some of the tracks I tend to drive down to get to interesting places to ride/run can be a bit more challenging. It's the relatively regular snow falls that keep me going back to AWD drive cars to be honest, but that's a whole other topic.

The “wear out” phase is at 10 years/100k miles as that is the design life of a car like this.

Maybe for a something like a mid-early 90's citycar.
As long as i've been in the business it's been 15 years/150k miles (or 250k km) for everything B segment and up. That's from the manufacturers and the suppliers. Not to say they won't fail before then, or need repairs, but the design life for "reasonable cost of repair" is 150000 miles. Some of the newer manufacturers/new platforms have pushed that out to 200000 miles/300000km and warrantees have extended as well.

But they are based on a false premise i.e. that the alternative to a new EV is a new ICE car

Well not necessarily - every car is new at some point.  Your decision to buy used is independent of your decision to buy EV or ICE no?

When you buy new instead of used, a new car comes into the chain at the top and an old one pops out of the bottom and gets scrapped.  If you buy new EV, it's replacing an old ICE so there's one less ICE on the road.

I was getting confused by the reports about how many miles you had to drive to make an EV environmentally beneficial. But they are based on a false premise i.e. that the alternative to a new EV is a new ICE car. So they are only looking at the “extra” CO2 required to produce the EV. If your comparison is keeping an existing car (i.e. not buying a new car at all) then you have to look at the total CO2 required to make the EV not just the extra bit and you pretty much never pay that back (at least not with the current energy mix). So keeping the existing car running is indeed the more environmentally responsible thing to do even if it is emitting more CO2 per mile than a newer EV.

the EV gets made whether you buy it or not. The car you’ve got keeps being driven whether you keep it or sell it.

we all live in the same environment no matter which of us is driving which car. We’ll transition to EVs in the time that takes to happen  no matter who buys the first one and who buys the last one.

My car is 22 years old on about 160k. I've had it since 10 months and 10k. Runs fine, just flew through MOT. Has a little rust on a front wing that I keep in check, but that's it really. Sat nav, climate, reversing camera. Comfy motorway cruiser. Carries 4 bikes on top and 4 adults.

I am looking to change for a van size people carrier, but that's to do with some plans we have (camping/trips etc).  We'll see how this year pans out, before I think of changing.

I've always paid attention to the underside, so everything's been coated from fairly new and is 'topped up' occasionally - same with MrsF's car - that's 12 now and only has 65k on it.

I'm only driving 3k a year, and that's mainly weekend trips. Is it worth committing £25k to another car for next to no use ? Tough decision.

thinking 130k as "high milage" is not quite right, in the US you get some cars rattling through 100,000 miles a year for the first few years of their life, end up looking brand new. eg

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicle/692621538?allListingType=all-cars&city=Beverly%20Hills&mileage=200001&newSearch=false&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fall-cars%2Fbeverly-hills-ca%3FisNewSearch%3Dfalse%26maxMileage%3D200001%26searchRadius%3D0%26sortBy%3DderivedpriceASC%26startYear%3D2022%26zip%3D90210&searchRadius=0&sortBy=derivedpriceASC&startYear=2022&state=CA&zip=90210&clickType=listing

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicle/704852640?allListingType=all-cars&city=Beverly%20Hills&mileage=200001&newSearch=false&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fall-cars%2Fbeverly-hills-ca%3FisNewSearch%3Dfalse%26maxMileage%3D200001%26searchRadius%3D0%26sortBy%3DderivedpriceASC%26startYear%3D2021%26zip%3D90210&searchRadius=0&sortBy=derivedpriceASC&startYear=2021&state=CA&zip=90210&clickType=listing

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicle/705697909?allListingType=all-cars&city=Beverly%20Hills&mileage=200001&newSearch=false&referrer=%2Fcars-for-sale%2Fall-cars%2Fbeverly-hills-ca%3FisNewSearch%3Dfalse%26maxMileage%3D200001%26searchRadius%3D0%26sortBy%3DderivedpriceASC%26startYear%3D2021%26zip%3D90210&searchRadius=0&sortBy=derivedpriceASC&startYear=2021&state=CA&zip=90210&clickType=listing

My brother lives in Australia. 100k miles to them is brand new delivery mileage.

Best thing you do for your 'Zuk is to wire brush as much rust off the underside, paint any remaining with Fertan rust converter, then spray Bilt Hamber S50 over and into everything.
Don't waste your time with Waxoyl or Lanoguard.

I used to live in the north east, They had roads there then and when I visited recently they still do

Observant but that's not the issue with driving in the north east

Well not necessarily – every car is new at some point.  Your decision to buy used is independent of your decision to buy EV or ICE no?

Generally yes. In most cases, it probably isn't going to matter is you buy new of second hand. Even if you bought a second hand ICE car the net result may well be that a new EV comes in at the top of the chain and an old ICE car gets scrapped. But, of course, if you are not the one buying the new car you don't really control what happens. You could buy a second hand EV and then the person you bought it from goes out and buys a new Range Rover. It's also possible that the person at the bottom of the chain doesn't scrap their car so the net result of you selling yours is just one more car on the roads.

the EV gets made whether you buy it or not

I'm not sure that's true. Surely the EV only gets made if there is a demand for it. If you don't create the demand then the supply should reduce. Of course the actions of one person make very little difference, but I still reckon it's worth trying to work out what the effect of your actions are likely to be and trying to do the "right thing". But that may not be what seems obvious at first.

I thought that, since I drive in excess of 20k miles/year it would be better if I did those miles in an EV rather than an ICE car. But looking at it more closely it seems that it really is better for the environment to keep doing those 20k miles/year in my old ICE car rather than buying a newer EV.  Of course it's better not to do them at all and if I am going to replace the car anyway switching to an EV is better, but I shouldn't kid myself that buying a new(er) car is actually benefiting the environment.

thinking 130k as “high milage” is not quite right, in the US/Austrailia...

Not sure about Oz, but the US situation is a bit different. The only car that I've ever actually driven beyond 200k miles was an old 8-cylinder Pontiac that I bought for the princely sum of $200 when I moved to the western US and then drove all over that side of the country for five years. It was a big naturally aspirated engine though that barely broke a sweat in normal driving. The Americans also change the oil every 3,000 miles (or did back then) with places that do it while you grab a coffee/bagel. Rust isn't much of a problem in a desert either 🙂

Best thing you do for your ‘Zuk is to wire brush as much rust off the underside, paint any remaining with Fertan rust converter, then spray Bilt Hamber S50 over and into everything.
Don’t waste your time with Waxoyl or Lanoguard.

Not sure what any of that means but I'm sure you are right 🙂 I'm also sure that there is no chance of me doing that myself. Not while there are still mountains I can explore instead.

it really is better for the environment to keep doing those 20k miles/year in my old ICE car rather than buying a newer EV.

It starts to get pretty hard to predict, as if someone cannot get hold of a good car in a lower price bracket (i.e. yours) they might stretch to a more modern car and that could ripple up the chain resulting in someone else buying new 🙂

The other thing to consider is that someone else who buys the EV off the production line probably isn't going to do the miles you are, so the EV your hands is saving a lot more CO2 emissions than it might be in say mine. Or, whoever buys your car probably won't do as many miles so the car will stay on the road longer than if you were to drive it.

In any case, you haven't got that many years left at 20k a year before you'll need to replace anyway.