[Closed] Aeropress-track-world (water temp guesstimate)

I set the temp on my kettle to stop heating at 80'C.

Years or "urgh, i've ruined that one" mean I've got my time estimate pretty sorted now, nothing scientific unfortunately.

My aeropress technique is boil kettle to 2 cup line, leave for 30 seconds then crack on. Would have thought it was way more than 80 degrees but gives a decent cup of coffee.

Does it need to be 80? Might be I am missing something, even at near boiling I can under extract if rush it, and that is way more common than over-extraction. I have pondered the scorching that people note too, when espresso machines use steam to brew the coffee - surely that would do the same?

when espresso machines use steam to brew the coffee – surely that would do the same?

Agreed. Simple thermodynamics suggests that steam at high pressure ( which proper espresso machines always drone on about) is way hotter than 100 C

So I've never understood this drive to do wet coffee at less than a hundred.

I switch my kettle off just leading up boiling point, it’s a guesstimate but works.

There is a trick with 1 part ice water to 3 parts boiling but not sure how well that works.

A thermometer, great new invention, might help.

James Hoffman has some recent videos on the Aeropress that may be useful. His take is that 80deg is too low to get decent brew.

Just turn off the kettle as it's coming to the boil, and leave it for 30esc of so. Doesn't need to be super-accurate

My (limited) understanding was that just boiling water will 'scald' the coffee (presumably as a result of being in conatct with it longer than an espresso, which is forced through at pressure and therefore speed). IME of going to rellies who say "oh, you like fancy coffee, we'll do a cafetiere" that's more apparent when it's been allowed to sit for ages in just boiled water. Yeugh.

That said I frequently do it straight after the kettle has boiled with limited to no adverse consequences. If I have a bit more time I'll boil the kettle, then set a timer for 10 mins, and then come back and make the coffee.

Ended up buying a temp controlled kettle for aeropress and stuff like green tea.
Before that i used to do a 50:50 mix of boiling to tap water for the first half fill, then top up with boiling for the second half. That was with the aeropress inverted

Does it need to be 80? Might be I am missing something, even at near boiling I can under extract if rush it, and that is way more common than over-extraction. I have pondered the scorching that people note too, when espresso machines use steam to brew the coffee – surely that would do the same?

The PVT changes the eutectics.
I'm specifically interested because after having loads of (medical) stuff shoved up my bum I found cutting out coffee totally gave me 80-90% relief after 2 days.

I than cautiously retried different ways to get coffee... (without it there is a good chance I bite the postie one morning) and found I can drink a few cups of 100% arabica ..

I started off actually measuring the temp (which is a faff as I was using a 12v thermistor from the van water heater) and an LED driver

1) I'm not allowed to leave any of this in the kitchen or it will get binned so it has to transfer easily to my room (that's just the way things are)

2) Needs to work from the van as well (including possibly not 100% potable water) so I'd prefer to boil properly

The recommended temp does seem to work best and I'm reluctant to push as being able to drink a few cups a day without peeing out of my bum is actually a big plus. (and I probably won't bite the postie after I've had my coffee)

Folks are always determined to make a cup of coffee overly complex.

I pour straight from the kettle boil. Tastes amazing to me.

It's all personal of course but I don't think it's rocket surgery.

If it's important to you (and it sounds as if it is) measure the temperature properly with an actual thermometer. you can pick one up for about a fiver. I expect it was a faff using a thermistor and LED driver (whatever that entails) so don't do it that way!

James Hoffman has some recent videos on the Aeropress that may be useful. His take is that 80deg is too low to get decent brew

Yes, my take was that he found that after testing loads of parameters it doesn’t actually make much difference, so make it how you like.

My semi-educated guess on how temp affects coffee is that darker roasts have more of the bitter stuff in that can overpower the other flavours. So if you’re using dark beans (and IME, supermarket stuff) then a lower temp means you get less of that stuff and more chance of a nicer cup. I think this is the root of the ‘boiling water = bad coffee’ experience a lot of us will have had.

I’d second watching the James Hoffman stuff linked up there. He’s quite good at looking at the ‘over-thinky’ aspects of coffee objectively and usually ends up advocating for really simple approaches. FWIW, he recommends boiling water if you use lighter roasts.

FWIW, he recommends boiling water if you use lighter roasts.

I'm using Illy ... either blend seems to work.

Then a lower temp means you get less of that stuff and more chance of a nicer cup

Much as I'm all up for a nicer cup I'm more concerned about one that doesn't make me pee out of my bum all day.

I've done limited testing as spending a day in the bathroom is non-productive and probably not doing me much good either. Apparently a bile re-adsorption thing.... (or maybe unrelated) but I found that I can have 3-4 shots of expresso a day from 100% arabica and zero filter coffee (not mine but a mates) and the one time I actually used boiling water (straight from kettle on camping stove) I also got the shits... (though I also did 3 shots at once as I was making for 3 people)

TBH the being able to have 3-4 shots a day is a huge bonus..

What Kayak said, I've never noticed any real difference between fully boiled or slightly cooled water regardless of anything.

For the Aeropress I boil the kettle and then leave it for 2 or 3 minutes before pouring it on to the coffee. Seems to work well enough.

I think there's enough stress in life without worrying about this.

I have a hot tap and fill before I run it FWIW, so 50% of the water is cold/lukewarm the rest er, hotter.

1 - boil kettle as normal so that the T drinkers are kept sweet (assumes social characteristics)
2 - pre add a 'splash' of cold from the tap (or bottled if posh) into the aeropress
3 - pour in the boiled water and stir (sod the stirrer, just use the handle of the scoop)

I think a lot of you are overlooking in your recommendations that stevextc's priority doesn't seem to be the absolute finest cup of coffee or even the most straightforward to make but rather one that doesn't have him shitting rusty water.

s that stevextc’s priority doesn’t seem to be the absolute finest cup of coffee or even the most straightforward to make but rather one that doesn’t have him shitting rusty water.

Yeah and it might be it makes sod all difference but spending a day shitting rusty water is crap 😉 pun intended

I'm all for the best taste as well... having had to limit myself might as well be the best but yeah... priority is deffo the lack of rusty water...

Hadn't spotted the medical reasons for wanting the cooler brew temps. I wonder if you can get one of those stick-on thermometer strips that they use on aquariums but in the temp range you want. Stick that on the side of your metal mug.

@stevextc - Maybe switch to a decaf (Swiss water not solvent) or half-caf blend like black cat coffee do?

https://www.blackcatcoffee.co.uk/collections/decaf

Normally the caffeine levels are the triggers for a lot of coffee GI stuff.

The 80 degrees is too cool as others have said unless you are going supermarket pre-ground or 80s style Italian blends.

With immersion brews and modern fruity light roasts beans you can’t really get it too hot so just off boiling water is fine 99% of the time since it cools. You can easily leave a cafetière for 8+ minutes to settle out and still be lovely if you don’t press down all the way to mash up the fines.

Espresso is different, the machine keeps supplying hot water and the pressure at ~9bar make it far easier to burn or extract the bad tasting bits since the coffee is so fine even with a 30s to 60s shot time.

Long time aeropress user, love the gadget. I have one at home, one at work, and the newer smaller travel one, for.. traveling.
The inverted method, water about 30 secs after the boil, not fussed about exact temp.
Also, if you can be arsed, freshly ground beans, wearing a plaid shirt, sleeve tattoo, change your name to Chad Blinkersdorf of [insert quirky name] Coffee Roasters, nose piercing and ear guage optional.

I switch my kettle off just leading up boiling point, it’s a guesstimate but works.

Also, this.

Boil kettle. Pour boiling water onto wife's tea, stir, pour water onto Aeropress.

Kind of works, usually.

Was too busy in Mancoco (coffee roasters) talking about one of the staffs new bikes to state I wanted my coffee ground for aeropress so now I have 500g of whole beans. I have a blade 'grinder' which is a bit shit, is this any good https://www.bodum.com/gb/en/11750-01uk-bistro or do I cycle back and get them to grind? Coffee 'ground' with the blade grinder tastes no where near as good as when they grind it for me.

I've got one of those milk thermometers for steaming milk...I just drop it into the kettle spout to get an idea what 80 degrees is. I also quickly learnt that you'll burn your fingers when removing said thermometer if you drop it in whilst the kettle is still coming up to the boil!

Generally I just preheat my mug and then pour the mug water onto the coffee

The Krups one does a perfectly good grind for Aeropress, @mattcartlidge.

Krups GVX231 Coffee Grinder

Only use the aeropress when camping. I boil the kettle, pour into my mug to warm it up (and cool the water) while I grind beans and load the aeropress, then fill it with water from the mug. Obviously air temp affects things on the day but it’s usually spot on.

I then to boil the kettle and wit before it’s boiled before weighing and grinding my beans. Seems to work unless it’s a real dark roast - then I tend to set the kettle to 90 and do the same as above.

Same issue re temp for making green tea - too hot and it gets bitter and horrible. I boil the kettle, add a bit of cold and that usually works but is a bit variable.

Not sure if I’ve missed it in the replies above, but is there an STW recommended temperature control kettle?

I've always done mine at 100, will I die?

Only use the aeropress when camping. I boil the kettle, pour into my mug to warm it up (and cool the water) while I grind beans and load the aeropress, then fill it with water from the mug. Obviously air temp affects things on the day but it’s usually spot on.

I've been doing this both at home and out. The stainless camping mug seems to get it about right with temps at the moment.
The one time I poured directly was because I was doing 3 at once... though 2 at once yesterday seems fine so far but I did pour into the stainless mug 1st.

Same issue re temp for making green tea

My van hot drinks bag contains coffee, green tea and earl grey... 😉

Not sure if I’ve missed it in the replies above, but is there an STW recommended temperature control kettle?

Needs to be 12v and not take a day to boil though... but also the water from the van might not always be the freshest/cleanest so I do want to boil it first.

kimura54321

The 80 degrees is too cool as others have said unless you are going supermarket pre-ground or 80s style Italian blends.

I'm using Illy... either way needs to be bought somewhere as I can't get stuff delivered.

I just managed the aeropress itself ... not sure I got away with it yet.

I have pondered the scorching that people note too, when espresso machines use steam to brew the coffee – surely that would do the same?

espresso machines don't use steam to extract coffee.

Randomly popped up on YouTube- heat the water in the microwave. If you know it takes 2min to heat to 80C on full power, you can repeat without needing the thermometer

James Hoffman has some recent videos on the Aeropress that may be useful. His take is that 80deg is too low to get decent brew.

I followed this for my morning brew. Really nice, cheers for the link.

Folks are always determined to make a cup of coffee overly complex.

Yep, Which is the hilarious thing really about aeropress "aficionados" it's just a minimalist alternative to a cafetiere but there's so much bloody theatre whenever an aeropresser prepares their drink, the grind (still essentially the same stuff) has to be just so (trust me I've had the conversations with them), the temperature is allegedly "critical" (although I am convinced that's more to extend the life of the clearly degrading plastics). Ultimately pretty much the same brown liquid pisses out into their mug after all that, as I decant from my ten quid cafetiere...

Yep, Which is the hilarious thing really about aeropress “aficionados” it’s just a minimalist alternative to a cafetiere but there’s so much bloody theatre whenever an aeropresser prepares their drink, the grind (still essentially the same stuff) has to be just so (trust me I’ve had the conversations with them), the temperature is allegedly “critical” (although I am convinced that’s more to extend the life of the clearly degrading plastics). Ultimately pretty much the same brown liquid pisses out into their mug after all that, as I decant from my ten quid cafetiere…

Except of course the brown liquid tastes completely different and contains far less caffeine...from expresso machine or aeropress than a cafetiere.

espresso machines don’t use steam to extract coffee.

I did wonder where people got that idea from ???
Possibly because expresso machines in the UK are not actually expresso machines but frothy milk machines.

Following this with interest, purely because I've got nothing better to do. I've used it aeropress loads and the results vary more taste wise due to brew time and dose in my experience than temp.

I didn't know that the caffeine output read lower in espresso and aeropress than cafetierre - why is that?

How are espresso machines in the UK not espresso machines?

Ultimately pretty much the same brown liquid pisses out into their mug after all that, as I decant from my ten quid cafetiere…

And then you get to clear up the mess from your cafetière, while the aeropress user pops a puck of compressed grounds neatly into the bin, rinses the gadget and strolls away.

Except of course the brown liquid tastes completely different and contains far less caffeine…from expresso machine or aeropress than a cafetiere.

completely, If you say so. Both are pretentious toys for a home or work kitchen in my book (Opinions will of course vary)...

I use a percolator on the hob at home and a cafetiere at work because they're cheap and minimise faff. Plus people would probably get upset if I pulled out a camping stove in the office... I suppose it's the difference between choosing an item of kit to suit the application and choosing something to signal to others that you're a "coffee expert"...

A cafetiere produces satisfactory enough coffee for my unsophisticated pallette, and I don't have to lean on a china mug three times day or get all princess and the pea about +/- 5°C for hot water...

If excess caffeine content is a concern, why not use decaf or half-caf coffee?

rob

I didn’t know that the caffeine output read lower in espresso and aeropress than cafetierre – why is that?

Caffeine relates two tyhings

1)how much water passes through...
If you look at non chemical decaf for example its basically run water through.
Lower temps / less water = more coffee flavour for the amount of caffeine (bitter taste)
2/ The bean variety (Robusta vs Arabica or a mix)
that should probably be 1st ....
Robusta grows easily... doesn't need shade .. and has more caffeine (insecticide) .. Arabica only grows in specific circumstances under trees... making it far more expensive to harvest as well.

How are espresso machines in the UK not espresso machines?

They are designed/tuned to froth milk... its mostly one or the other (basically set too hot for espresso...lots of steam to froth milk or condense water for expresso.

They are designed/tuned to froth milk… its mostly one or the other (basically set too hot for espresso

Not really though. The cheaper thermoblock ones generally have two heat settings, one for espresso, and one for steaming milk. You do need to wait between them for it to warm up/cool down.

HX/DB machines are fairly well set up for both.

They are designed/tuned to froth milk… its mostly one or the other (basically set too hot for espresso…lots of steam to froth milk or condense water for expresso.

Glad I bought my sage duo temp then 😘

Not really though. The cheaper thermoblock ones generally have two heat settings, one for espresso, and one for steaming milk. You do need to wait between them for it to warm up/cool down.

HX/DB machines are fairly well set up for both.

off topic, but just a quick note to say that my Lelit Mara (HX) is excellent at this - you can set it to espresso or steaming priority, and at 3 temp (range) settings for whatever bean you are using. It has 2 PIDs: one on the boiler, and one on the grouphead thermosyphon outlet. It basically holds the grouphead at a consistent temp, but then cranks up the boiler temp for short periods for extra steam when it thinks you need it (ie: after pulling a shot). Works well