[Closed] £5 Hot Dog & £9 Burger ? Whhaa!

I noticed the same walking around my local city centre today. Some of the places are OK but at the end of the day those mobile units are always spendy, they've got to grab the cash while they can and I've got no issue with that but I tend to retreat to one of the there all year food providers unless there's something special on offer.

It's no different to a summer fete or concert except at least on the high street/town centre you have an alternative.

And don't go to the O2 if you think those hot dogs are expensive!

Christmas market pitches are incredibly expensive in most places. Bath is £12K for a food pitch for 3 weeks. Ergo you need to sell food at inflated prices to make any money.

JP

Ok I do have a bit of knowledge of these sorts of things as I have a friend who runs one of these street food vans - he was featured on George Clarke’s Amazing Spaces.
Anyway I know the prices he had to charge at most normal venues but when he went to anything special the rents were extremely high. He did a few weeks in Leeds in the Trinity Centre food area (they actually lifted his Citroen HY van up three floors on the outside of the building)
He said it was sort of worthwhile but he didn’t make as much money as he had to be open so many hours more so had to employ more cover and the rent for the space was stratospheric - it wasn’t double what he was charging but it was a least 50% more than when he didn’t have to pay for the space.
I could imagine these Christmas markets will similarly charge a lot to have your food offer within them. There might be some taking advantage of the situation but I reckon it’ll mostly be huge rents and higher costs pushing the price up.

It’s no different in Germany.

Plenty of folk paying it at the German market in B’ham the other week.
The price of a Crepe gets me, £5 for a bloody pancake with Nutella & marshmallows.
They took £60 in the 8 mins I was queuing.

I know they need to grab what they can but they are mobile units with no much of a "fixed" cost such as rent etc, surely the price can go down a bit? No?

Yes, they are free to sell at whatever price they wish and nobody forces anyone to buy but I just don't wish to part with such cash even when I want to support them.

Also there is a Sunday market near the quayside but the rent is reasonable at £1.40 per square feet plus free parking for the vendors. (someone selling there local told me) Still the price of food seems to be at minimum £5 ...

I know they need to grab what they can but they are mobile units with no much of a “fixed” cost such as rent etc, surely the price can go down a bit? No?

No. The cost to pitch at these venues is expensive you still then have your other overheads.

I just don’t wish to part with such cash even when I want to support them.

Don’t I won’t be when I’m in town this week, instead I’ll got to one of the independent restaurants that Newcastle is full of.

I know they need to grab what they can but they are mobile units with no much of a “fixed” cost such as rent etc, surely the price can go down a bit? No?

JP has answered that, did you not read it?.

JP has answered that, did you not read it?.

You do realise who started this thread?

No. The cost to pitch at these venues is expensive you still then have your other overheads.

So who set the cost to pitch for Xmas market? Bet it is the council.

Surely the council knows this is a festive season to encourage as many vendors as possible local or otherwise. Are they trying to money grab as well?

Don’t I won’t be when I’m in town this week, instead I’ll got to one of the independent restaurants that Newcastle is full of.

Yes, I also try to support those restaurants but then I also want to try something else.

Are they trying to money grab as well?

Yes. Everyone is.

The one upside to a lack of regulation, is that in Asia, outside of the tourist hot spots - streetfood is affordable for everyone.

Oh, bloody hell it's pointless innit.

Ps don't ever go to Wembley.

So who set the cost to pitch for Xmas market? Bet it is the council.

Surely the council knows this is a festive season to encourage as many vendors as possible local or otherwise. Are they trying to money grab as well?

Yes it’s the council. Yes the council are trying to make money too.

The one upside to a lack of regulation, is that in Asia, outside of the tourist hot spots – streetfood is affordable for everyone.

Yeah I thought that was pretty much the point of street food. I’ve not been but friends who have talk about how cheap it is to eat at these places.

Yes. Everyone is.

The one upside to a lack of regulation, is that in Asia outside of tourist hot spots is that streetfood is affordable for everyone.

No, it is Not lack of regulation. There are inspectors around but you just don't notice them. In SE Asia the councils would charge very little, for example, £50 (well our 50 equivalent) per day. NOT something silly that you need to mortgage the house for. That is why over there everywhere people are selling to earn a living to help themselves because the start up is cheap.

Yes it’s the council. Yes the council are trying to make money too.

Now that is parasitic when they even want to suck the livelihood out of small street food vendors. Time to change me guess.

So who set the cost to pitch for Xmas market? Bet it is the council.

Of course it is. Councils tend to be greedy with these sorts of things. For your £12K in Bath you don't get power (extra fee) or get to be in the same place as previous years, so people can find you easily again (extra fee), or even be in one of the higher footfall areas (extra fee).

JP

Tbh that doesn’t sound otherworldly for a captive market, you’d pay more in a Cinema or the like.

Oddly enough I was throwing away some old receipts a while back, seems I spent €18 on a burger in Morzine last summer, seemed okay at the time, but I’ve been obsessing about it ha ha.

Tbh that doesn’t sound otherworldly for a captive market, you’d pay more in a Cinema or the like.

It’s not captive it runs down one of the main areas of Newcastle surrounded by pubs and restaurants but people still think they’re getting something special from a wrestlers burger as it’s Christmas.

Of course it is. Councils tend to be greedy with these sorts of things. For your £12K in Bath you don’t get power (extra fee) or get to be in the same place as previous years, so people can find you easily again (extra fee), or even be in one of the higher footfall areas (extra fee).

JP

Crikey, £12K for nothing and extra fee this and that !!! 😲

No wonder these parasites are getting bloated ...

seems I spent €18 on a burger in Morzine last year, seemed okay at the time, but I’ve been obsessing about it ha ha.

"... €18 on a burger ..." 😲

I can eat for the entire week with that price!

p/s: basically the cost price of the food plus margin and add another 50% go to the council? Yes?

No wonder the cities/towns are dying and only those big corporate vendors can survive while the rest (small vendors if they operate) slave away to feed the councils. The councils are actually slow feeding on the people! This is wrong.

Yeah I thought that was pretty much the point of street food. I’ve not been but friends who have talk about how cheap it is to eat at these places.

Yup.

And this is partly why generally happiness levels are quite high, even if the usual economic markers of development indicate it’s “developing”. As soon as you roll out of your office, factory or whatever - it’s straight down to the nearest street food place to link up with friends and family - eat food, drink beer and watch the world go by in the busy, colourful streets on a warm evening. The only way I can describe it is like being able to go and eat out in a really atmospheric pub surrounded by friends and family at least 3 times a week.

It’s really, really sociable. Meanwhile, pubs here are closing down at a ridiculous rate.

The councils are actually slow feeding on the people! This is wrong.

Who did you/everyone else vote for?

This is the wurst thread I’ve ever read...

“… €18 on a burger …” 😲

I can eat for the entire week with that price!

Not in Morzine 🙂

No wonder these parasites are getting bloated …

Which parasites? Most councils are verging on destitute, and cutting funding for social care, libraries etc. Find me a council that’s got pots of money they don’t know what to do with. If they can raise some money in December to support for some services year round then I’m fine with that.

We live in a capitalist society. You don’t want to eat out (or can’t afford to), don’t. Vendors don’t exist to provide free food for everyone as a Christmas treat. Luckily we’re not SE Asia, we have a more stable economy, less poverty, lower crime, longer life expectancy, better healthcare.

Feel free to go back there, you can have all the cheap street food you want.

Who did you/everyone else vote for?

And here we get to the real problem. It's easy to point at the council and accuse them of taking advantage, but when their funding from central government has been slashed for years, and yet they're expected to maintain services in the face of higher demand due to cuts elsewhere and a general lack of disposable income, you'd expect them to take an opportunity to make a few quid off those who can still afford a £5 hot dog.

Yep. But they suck you in with waft of frying onions and bacon. Even if you were not hungry after 20mins of exposure you are suddenly starving marvin
Then there is the quality of said burgers. Why do they taste like cardboard, are cold within 10 seconds, the onions are a pound more, a pound for 5ps worth of onions
The baps are not buttered either
And don't get me started on the time I had the audacity to ask for a grilled bap. What's a grilled bap was the reply. Time for a change of carrer Mr fast food vendor

Are those Christmas markets run by the same people? Went to the ones in Leicester Square & Leeds and i swear they sell the exact same crap at the same prices.

There does seem to be a monopoly at the bigger ones. I went to the Manchester Christmas Markets a couple of years ago, "7 different markets for your pleasure!" Err, no. It was the same stalls, in 7 different locations, selling the same stuff at the same prices.

Bah humbug eh.

We mixed our Manchester Markets visit with stopping off in warm bars of existing pubs. We did eat on the market, the 3 meat yorkshire pudding wrap was well worth the £7, far better than a burger.

The "best" thing I've seen at Newcastle's Christmas market is "Nutella cookies" - cookies, like those ones you get in a bag of 4 in the supermarket (e.g. Sainsbury's local on the same street) for a quid, with a spoon of Nutella on the top. Yours for £3.

I don't understand why people still go to these Christmas markets. They don't sell anything anyone actually wants, just overpriced tat, overpriced rubbish food and overpriced beer that you have to queue for ages to get.

I hear people at work saying, "Yeah we're doing the Christmas market thing this weekend...." like it's as traditional as Christmas day itself. I just don't get it!!!

Ads678, 43, from Leeds.

If you are earning minimum wage those are prohibitive pricing …

You know maybe if people who didn't earn minimum wage spent their money instead of penny pinching and pretending to worry about how poor people can afford things, those people on minimum wage might earn a bit more. They're on minimum wage Because you* don't value their time or labour and moan about £9 for a burger or 6p extra on your packet of quinoa, because the only cost is 70 pence of ingredients.

Get over yourself, if it's really about anyone else take that £14 and stick it in a homeless person's hand instead.

The novelty was good originally but it soon wears thin. In Manchester there was a bar selling Lees bitter at about £5 a pint. There are plenty of cheaper pubs and bars around. £5 for a burger? Sorry mate I'll go to This and That for 3 and rice.

Years ago a German woman used to come across selling excellent sausage, pickles, sauerkraut and speck. I used to stock up but she stopped coming and I stopped going.

I'm not a huge fan of Christmas markets but if you're trying to justify the cost by looking at the ingredients and alternative suppliers you're missing the point, you miserable gits.

We live in a fairly damp, cold and dark country in December. The Christmas market offers a chance to go outside with friends or family and do something different.

Take the £3 nutella cookie and my 4 year old daughter. I could go and guy a 4 pack of cookies from Sainsburys local and jar of nutella for 3 pounds. However, she goes to shops quite often and is familiar with both cookies and nutella. It would probably hit 5/10 on the excitement index.

I could take her to the Christmas market, and that £3 cookie would seem like the best thing she's ever seen, 10/10 exciting. We would probably spend some time outside and she'd experience something different.

We went to the theater in London at the weekend, my OH insisted on ruining the afternoon by "going to see the Christmas lights/market in Leicester square.

It would be nice if the councils could figure out a way of supporting proper local businesses / market stalls rather than "the generic German market company" coming in and setting up for a few weeks. I'm sure the £9 burger is better than the £2 one the usual market van sells, but if the council supported the local businesses a bit more maybe they'd up their game.

Same with craft fairs, some are nice and have local people selling things to fund a hobby. Others are the same stalls you get at every other one promoted by the same company selling crap made in china.

Same with country fairs, we used to go to the Berkshire one every year as it's huge, but over the past 5 years the number of stalls from local companies has dropped to almost none. There's a HECK sausages stall in every tent though....... Along with handful of other big-ish companies that can obviously afford multiple pitches. Even the local breweries have all disappeared (dunno if this was because they got a green king bar?). Still a nice day out seeing the livestock, but the rest of it just feels like traipsing round a grassy shopping center.

Tim Harfords written loads about this sort of stuff. Theres an extract from his book here....

http://timharford.com/2005/10/go-figure-an-extract-from-the-undercover-economist-2/

Tim Harfords written loads about this sort of stuff. Theres an extract from his book here….

That should be required reading for the next "Planet X just cost me £200" thread.

I’d like to think the local councils make some well needed cash from these but I rather suspect that the only people making any useful money are the organisers/promoters who I suspect are a massive national chain

Does anyone know for sure?

Street food prices in Vietnam were extremely good value! You'd struggle to spend £1 whilst providing dinner for a family of 4 in most places.

I could take her to the Christmas market, and that £3 cookie would seem like the best thing she’s ever seen, 10/10 exciting. We would probably spend some time outside and she’d experience something different.

Fair point - I know it sounded like it, but I wasn't really suggesting people take their kids to Sainsbury's for a packet of cookies and a jar of Nutella (though if you gave her the whole packet and the whole jar, I bet that'd be a 10/10 😀 ). It's just a bit depressing that an "experience" has to equal getting ripped off.

thisisnotaspoon has it.

To add to it, I know at least one of the regular stallholders (fruit and veg stall, there all year round) on the high street where our Christmas market is, is pretty annoyed at having his pitch moved to accommodate overpriced "German" sasuage stalls. Could just be market trader grumpiness though.

Hmm I’m lucky my German markets open all year round and has reasonable prices and they let you use little wheeled trolleys 🙂

That should be required reading for the next “Planet X just cost me £200” thread.

TLDR, but I'm over it now so I'm not really bothered anyway....

Patience is not one of my strong points, hence buying the bike at the 'wrong' price!!

petrieboy

Member

I’d like to think the local councils make some well needed cash from these but I rather suspect that the only people making any useful money are the organisers/promoters who I suspect are a massive national chain

Does anyone know for sure?

It's a mix - both organisations make money from it.

It's not a case of the 'poor cash strapped council' being ripped off by the nasty capitalist organisers; both are as bad as each other in most cases. I wouldn't trust Bath Council with Monopoly money, let alone the real stuff.

JP

Try $14 for a hot dog...

runamuk.com.au

Or go to Freo market and get a Bratty in a bun with onions and all the jizz for $5

A friend of mine who had a coffee van (fancy French job) enquired about a pitch at winter wonderland in Hyde Park London quite a few years ago, I can't remember the exact price but it was above 20 grand!

... I can’t remember the exact price but it was above 20 grand! "

Above £20K!!! 😱

Nutella pan cake a slice is £4.50 in the Xmas market here in the North East. 🥶

Make earning a living much harder ...

Surely the council knows this is a festive season to encourage as many vendors as possible local or otherwise. Are they trying to money grab as well?

Bath must be doing something right, because the Christmas Market is getting bigger and expanding every year! And while there may well be some generic food stalls, much of what’s on show is from local and regional sellers, with lots of craft stuff.
Bath is full of places to eat and drink, the vendors in the market are, I’m sure, fully aware of this, and price accordingly.
I bought some locally made cheeses as part of a present for a mate last year, made in Bath, as it happens, bloody good they were, too!
That’s what’s so good about it, it allows the general public a chance to see, smell and sample lots of stuff from small local producers, that are otherwise not easily come across.

I was through the Newcastle one a few times yesterday, it’s astronomically shit. Just utter rubbish no local producers like there were in previous years. going off the very few people we seen bothering with it then I’d hate to be stall holder.

Went to the Bury St Edmunds Christmas Market this year and last, there was a noticeable shift towards the more generic, but still some good independent stalls. Didn't feel very festive either.
Also went to one at Waddesdon Manor, now that was much better. Unique stalls and quite a few local to the Cotswolds.

Neither had sensible food prices, but the ones at Bury were the generic German sausage people.

We went to Otley Victorian* market the other week & it was basically the same, except one stall that was doing ok selling Lincolnshire sausage 'hot dogs', £3.50 with onions & a decent size too.
Busiest vendor was Weegmans butchers selling their normal pies, sausage rolls & pasties. The queue was out the door.

*Xmas

We went to Otley Victorian* market the other week & it was basically the same, except one stall that was doing ok selling Lincolnshire sausage ‘hot dogs’, £3.50 with onions & a decent size too.

That is a good price.👍

Busiest vendor was Weegmans butchers selling their normal pies, sausage rolls & pasties. The queue was out the door.

hhhmmm ... pork pies and pasties ... hhhmmm ... 😀

we changed our groups annual christmas market ride to Brum this year when we realised the bottled beer they were selling for £5 a bottle was £1.49 for exactly the same thing in Lidl. this year we did a tour of the breweries in Stirchley. the beer was fresh and reasonably priced and Brum brewery, glass house brewery and Attic brewery all let us bring the bikes inside and had street food available to buy in their car parks.

Or go to Freo market and get a Bratty in a bun with onions and all the jizz for $5

Can I have mine without the jizz? I'll pay extra.

Burger and fries on the harbour front in St. Tropez is €27.drop one street back and it's €5. Coffee and biscotti in St. Mark's Square in Venice €35. It's life.

£4000 per week is 115 £5 crepes per day for rent (more for power and location). Assume you have two crepe plates, and are pretty skilled to turn out two every five minutes and I’m being generous, then That would be about 4.5 hours just to pay for the pitch. Materials are cheap, but you’ll need two people, one to bake money and/or finish the crepe and serve.

Your crepe friend isn’t going to get rich but he’s going to be very popular.

£4000 per week is 115 £5 crepes per day for rent (more for power and location).

£4k rent/week that is crazy 😱

Might as well rob the livelihood off the people.

Even £400/week is expensive 😒

£50/day is more acceptable and the stalls can pay electricity themselves.

No wonder there are hardly any surviving start-ups as the rent already kill them off before they even have a chance to compete.

the stalls can pay electricity themselves.

There were complaints about generators so I thought they already did.

There were complaints about generators so I thought they already did.

At quayside they use their own generators but not sure about Northumberland street Xmas market. Thinking of it I think some of the big "boxes" might be the generator at the Monument but I am not sure.

Regardless, £50/day rent is much more acceptable.