You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
cromolyolly “Playing the race card” is a political trick a old as politics.
Ah, gotcha. See what you mean. Not sure I would describe it as whipping up hate though, the way Len was using it. Maybe more a dog-whistle phrase. Lots of perfectly reasonable remainers are not totally on board with free movement. Although you have to wonder if the UK had been more prosperous for the last 10 years if that would still be the case. I suspect they are looking at the mess that austerity has made plus free movement and come up with 5.
Yep my bad 27.6% of electorate which equals 40% of the vote share.
Remind me again why the two major parties won't consider Proportional Representation...?
So overdue.
There is not even anything “fairly” hard left about labour policies. just left of centre social democratic policies
How many times are you going to repeat this? Corbyns labour is nothing like Scandinavian social democracy. Social democracy only have at most a minority of essential utilities and public services under public ownership - that is not even the case with many of them in the 21st century. They are NOT countries that look to bring 10 percent of private companies under state control and seize intellectual property - these are policies that are further left than any social democracy.
The labour party needs a female leader, end of.
How authoritarian of you.
matt_outandabout
Subscriber
Yep my bad 27.6% of electorate which equals 40% of the vote share.
Remind me again why the two major parties won’t consider Proportional Representation…?
So overdue.
Yes please!
How authoritarian of you.
Probably the only time using authority is justified. Positive discrimination works. When you have had centuries of ingrained institutional and cultural bias, it won’t change by accident, it has to be forced.
In any case I’m pretty sure Rayner would wipe the floor with her male colleagues in a leadership election so it’s academic.
it has to be forced.
I wonder how over say the last 5 years what percentage of political party leaders in the UK have been female? How many were forced?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leaders_of_political_parties_in_the_United_Kingdom
In any case I’m pretty sure Rayner would wipe the floor with her male colleagues in a leadership election so it’s academic.
Or stand aside if one of them started to identify as a woman. You know since Labour have never had a male identifying as a woman (a transwoman) as leader before and when you have had centuries of ingrained institutional and cultural bias, it won’t change by accident, it has to be forced.
Benv just what are you getting at here? You don’t think labour need a female leader? Or are you just fighting for the rights of poor oppressed middle aged white men?
No, they need a leader voted in fair and square, best one for the job. That wiki link shows that if the best candidate is a woman then they will be voted in without the need for the vote being rigged first.
In any case I’m pretty sure Rayner would wipe the floor with her male colleagues in a leadership election so it’s academic.
Really? Someone who dropped out of school at 16, drops her "T's" and can barely string a sentence together? I guess she might win the Labour leadership election, she'd do even worse than Corbyn in a national election though. There are plenty of electorally capable women in the Labour party, Rayner isn't one of them.
It's a sign of just how low the Labour party has sunk when the bookies are putting better leadership odds on Rayner than Cooper.
Fear not. The 6th formers will elect somebody equally as hopeless to take over the mantle of permanent opposition from Jezza.
Just watched him on channel 4 news talking about the NHS. Labour strongest suite, apparently. Supposedly he’s energised, he’s a campaigner
Yeah, right
He looked barely alive. Virtually catatonic. Every inch the over-promoted shop steward he is. He might as well have had this in his hand
Binners, dont be so unfair. He was present, but not involved.
They are NOT countries that look to bring 10 percent of private companies under state control and seize intellectual property
What the...?
10% of companies under state control?
He's trolling
Labour does need the next leader to be female...
Jess Phillips
Boris Johnson is a liar.
Boris Johnson is an opportunist who screwed up a protest vote by winning it accidentally and then nailed his colours to whatever mast suited his own ambition.
Boris Johnson is a laughing stock worldwide.
Boris Johnson has basically one policy.
But most of all....
Boris Johnson is a tosser.
And yet he is looking likely to win a majority.
Meanwhile Corbyn is just surrendering. He actually looks relieved.
What a ****ing mess.
Remind me again why the two major parties won’t consider Proportional Representation…?
Just remember we had a referendum on that. Our utterly thick electorate turned that down too.
Corbyn is already waving the white flag.
Any leader of the opposition would be running rings around the shambles that is Joris Bohnson
Corbyn looks like it’s all too much trouble as he knows he’s going to lose anyway so he’ll just go through the motions before he gets to shuffle off to the allotment
With his millions though (yay, socialism!) he’ll not suffer the worst effects of post-Brexit Tory Britain. That’ll be left to us mugs.
He never fails to disappoint, does he?
Imagine having an opposition leader worth calling that without your head in your hands? Labour would and really should be walking this
The fact they’re 10+ points behind is all the comment you need on the clueless, rudderless, half-arsed leadership vacuum at the top of the Labour Party with Magic Grandad and the gang of idiots around him
I will vote for him.
So will I.
I’ve replayed what he said about immigration 3 times, and I haven’t got a scooby what he meant by it. Is this deliberate, or ineffective? I don’t know. It won’t stop me voting for Labour, it will make undecideds just shrug.
Just remember we had a referendum on that.
No we didn’t.
Boris Johnson is a laughing stock worldwide.
As is the UK as a whole. Oh, I see where this is going…
Did I hear on PM that the Libdems are putting 1p on income tax? Personally, I'm in favour.
He actually looks relieved.
Do we blame him? He never wanted this gig, he had it forced on him by events. As useless as he is he's done pretty well to cope as well as he has. I'd have had a nervous breakdown in the first month, I'd think almost all of us would be off with stress by now.
Should have stepped down 2 years ago when he lost the election.
Didn’t
And now he’s about to condemn us all to the hardest of Brexits and five years of Boris Johnson
He’ll be alright though
How very Tory
But think about the poor souls like Milne & Murray…
How will they afford to make ends meet?
Did I hear on PM that the Libdems are putting 1p on income tax?
Yes, both Labour and LibDems have specific tax rises proposals… where as the magic money tree Tories are promising lots of big new spending and vague tax cuts. Only one party peddling full on fantasy policies, and they are also the ones pushing a hard Brexit that will damage the economy and cost billions to prepare for. You can’t trust the Conservative party on the economy or state finances.
Or stand aside if one of them started to identify as a woman. You know since Labour have never had a male identifying as a woman (a transwoman) as leader before and when you have had centuries of ingrained institutional and cultural bias, it won’t change by accident, it has to be forced.
Benv just what are you getting at here?
Seems pretty clear to me. If you're going to have a policy of discrimination why not help people who are clearly being held back? White women have long since got themselves established in the party leaderships stakes, there are many other groups of people who haven't.
What's your case for not helping them?
Kelvin - I’ve no idea how the gang of multi-millionaire champagne Marxists around grandad will weather the storms of turbo-charged, post-Brexit, hyper-austerity their ineptitude will deliver the rest of us
#prayforseamasandlen
they need a leader voted in fair and square, best one for the job.
This, you can't play your B-Team in democratic politics. Most likely a woman will be able to win on merit (they have done in almost all the other parties) if not the job can't go to a woman on that occasion.
Just remember we had a referendum on that. Our utterly thick electorate turned that down too.
Are you counting yourself in that number?
We didnt have an referendum on PR we had it on AV since for that referendum Cameron had the brains to stack the cards and the libdems were incompetent enough to let him get away with it.
AV is a very dubious options. Clegg was right to call it a miserable compromise.
Its advantages against FPTP arent clear as it can actually amplify the imbalances.
White women have long since got themselves established in the party leaderships stakes, there are many other groups of people who haven’t.
Dianne abbot? She's female and black. Ticks a box.
Utterly inarticulate though despite being quite intelligent.
What is corbyn thinking keeping her around, she's just bad press, plenty of more competent people around! Gina Miller springs to mind, unfortunately not in politics though.
Nationalised broadband? Full fibre connection to every home and business?
I think I’m in. Time for the UK to get up to date. Good policy from Labour that spans nonsense left/right divides. The government investing to modernise infrastructure where the market has clearly failed, giving a boost to small and medium sized businesses in areas where connection are currently poor.
Gina Miller springs to mind, unfortunately not in politics though.
Here’s my vote… take it now.
Corbyn has done the same as Johnson. Demanded loyalty as the only qualification (oh, the irony), regardless of any actual ability, which even the most cursory glance reveals to be woefully absent
So we have 2 front benches packed with utter imbeciles (with one or two notable exceptions) with infinitely more capable and able people sat impotently behind them because they didn’t apply for their fan club badge
Our political system now comprises two gangs of equally clueless morons who are just prepared to say yes to their idiotic leaders without asking any awkward questions like ‘WTF are you actually trying to do?’
Nationalised broadband?
Nationalised social media sounds like a good shout, I mean having it in private hands is so undemocratic. We could tie it to a social credit score system and ID cards, with your social score based on how untory you are.
Anyway, I'm off to **** over a poster of Mao Zedong.
Sorry, what?!?
So let’s unpack Labour’s latest giveaway - nationalising BT and giving everyone free fibre broadband (ftth) by 2030.
How will it play out?
BT will start making plans to move its corporate HQ and the actual outcome will be:
- Corbyn tries to nationalise BT
- new home country of BT group says no
- the government loses all of the corporation tax
- the U.K. receives no more investment in telecoms
- no-one gets free fibre broadband.
Tomorrow every household will be promised its own Unicorn by 2030.
Openreach is already separate, and has a near monopoly on broadband connections. The rest of BT could choose to go elsewhere I suppose, but it does rely on government licences to sell its other services here, so such tactics could backfire.
binners
Subscriber
Labour does need the next leader to be female…
Jess Phillips
With Angela Rayner as deputy.
Neither of whom are.....
multi-millionaire champagne Marxists
However, they both have unpopular accents, which will probably upset the shallow minded.
Y'know, like beards.
Dianne abbot? She’s female and black. Ticks a box.
Really?
So according to the Brexit nutter on QT, 8 peerages and various other bribes have been offered for Brexit party candidates to stand down in marginal seats
However, they both have unpopular accents, which will probably upset the shallow minded.
Y’know, like beards.
Jess Philips at least seems intelligent and well educated.
Openreach is already separate, and has a near monopoly on broadband connections.
The infrastructure is still a monopoly.
Case study, my boss who's considerably richer than me, recently bought a new build house.
His broadband speed is like back in the days of dial up.
It's about 1meg. Maybe two, whatever.
There's no provision for broadband in New builds, and the builder isn't going to pay virgin or open reach to plumb in FTTC or FTTP if they can help it.
Binners, do yourself a favour, give up on watching QT. It’s trash.
There’s no provision for broadband in New builds, and the builder isn’t going to pay virgin or open reach to plumb in FTTC or FTTP if they can help it.
And even the Conservatives are prepared to plow money into Openreach to try and get even reasonable, never mind good, connections to areas without it. Why not think and act bigger?
Free broadband is as impossible as free NHS.
It's not.
It's should be part of our accepted infrastructure.
Well done on this one. Lots of positive vibes on this.
(Can you unplug binners' connection?)
binners
Subscriber
Labour does need the next leader to be female…
Jess Phillips
She will probably be the next leader of the Libdems.
Bring back Jozzer , Jess is busy with her books and Times supplement shoots.
"go on then, you give I' meh"
It’s not.
It’s should be part of our accepted infrastructure.
Communist! Why don't you go and live in Russia.
You'll be suggesting free prescriptions and free Hospital parking next.
As if that could ever work in a social democracy...
I can remember a time when they all said Boris was going to be the end of Corbyn because he's so much better campaigner than May... Turns out he appears to be worse.
Mops, piss off from the floodlands, leaving town centres quickly, singing songs with kids ... badly.
Ouch.
As if that could ever work in a social democracy…
It’ll be state funded education next. Crazy!
Communist! Why don’t you go and live in Russia.
Getting my tickets from the Tories.
And such a common accent rayban.
How very dare she drag herself up by the bootstraps and make a success of her life?
Silly woman, getting above her station......
Also can we have marker put here as a reminder that this campaign was never going to be completely about Brexit.
Cheers.
It’ll be state funded education next. Crazy!
Solidarity brother! 😀
go on then, you give I’ meh”
if ever there was a ringing endorsement of Rayner it’s Rayban sneering at someone who’s achieved more than you ever will.
Communist! Why don’t you go and live in Russia.
You’ll be suggesting free prescriptions and free Hospital parking next.
As if that could ever work in a social democracy…
Cost to the taxpayer of fibre broadband for all by 2030 has been placed at 30bn - somewhere along the line it would then be immediately reprivatised by the Tories at a knock down price, as I don't think the uk population would viciously defend it like the NHS.
So what would happen in the long term is that the taxpayer will have paid for private industry to get access to a full uk fibre network.
if ever there was a ringing endorsement of Rayner it’s Rayban sneering at someone who’s achieved more than you ever will.
LOL - Boris has achieved more than you. Boris is therefore awesome.
The level of stupidity shown by the left at the moment is just mind blowing.
Can we move the election forward to tomorrow? I'm sick of it all already and we've got nearly a month still to go.
JP
'Kinnel anyone who embeds from the fail is pushing web-journo hard.
Cost to the taxpayer of fibre broadband for all by 2030 has been placed at 30bn – somewhere along the line it would then be immediately reprivatised by the Tories at a knock down expense, as I don’t think the uk population would viciously defend it like the NHS.
Well the tax payer (if that's what it is) will have a few more quid to spend into the economy too.
Solution: banish the Tories.
Nationalised broadband? Full fibre connection to every home and business?
A HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!
Every home and business? Only someone with no idea of the difficulty of achieving that in remote rural areas could have put forward such a suggestion.
Can we move the election forward to tomorrow?
I’m the opposite. I think more time is needed for Johnson to be exposed, and his policies to be shown up as just repeating past Conservative promises that they’ve already failed to deliver and have no sound plans to fund or make real at any point in the next five years.
Solution: banish the Tories.
That sounds very anti-democratic - almost as if you are a commie sympathizer. 😛
Purge the enemy!
Every home and business?
There will be an * somewhere in the T&Cs!
Cost to the taxpayer of fibre broadband for all by 2030 has been placed at 30bn – somewhere along the line it would then be immediately reprivatised by the Tories at a knock down expense, as I don’t think the uk population would viciously defend it like the NHS.
So, we shouldn't do things for the benefit of the country because the Tories are ****s?
So, we shouldn’t do things for the benefit of the country because the Tories are ****?
It's about doing things that work that the Tories will find politically hard to undo in the future. Minimum wage increases, improvements to the NHS - telecoms is something that could easily be undone - there are better things to be spending 30bn on.
Angela Rayner is unique as a potential education secretary - she’s the only one to literally have no exam passes in anything - having left school with no GCSEs above grade D.
She’s up their with Abbott on her grasp of numbers and we’re told these people are competent to run the country.
Care to answer the question, rayban?
Angela Rayner is unique as a potential education secretary – she’s the only one to literally have no exam passes in anything – having left school with no GCSEs above grade D.
And yet through sheer hard work and determination she has made a huge success of her life.
I thought the Tories would be spaffing themselves over such an example?
I did.
Angela Rayner is unique as a potential education secretary – she’s the only one to literally have no exam passes in anything – having left school with no GCSEs above grade D.
Yeah but I guess that gives her "common sense" (or commoners sense), after all Gove was right when he said we have had enough of educated experts.
And yet through sheer hard work and determination she has made a huge success of her life.
Was it hard work on her part because she's thick whilst it was laziness on the part of Boris because he's clever and had access to a good education?
Rusty - Chris Boardman is on QT and has used it to push riding bikes and walking instead of using cars, so it’s not all bad.
That and asking yourself how James Cleverley has put himself up as the ultimate masochist. Defending the interest of a bunch of posh, entitled white blokes who will drop him like a hot turd once he’s outlived his usefulness as token brown person
He should look to Sayeeda Warsi as to what they do to you if you’re the wrong colour and you’ve served your useful purpose
Ah, my apologies for overestimating you, rayban.
Another right wing frother too arrogant to engage in debate.
I thought we'd got rid of those last year?
Rusty – Chris Boardman is on QT and has used it to push riding bikes and walking instead of using cars, so it’s not all bad.
Wasn't me. I listen to Any Questions. QT makes me far too angry.
Ah, my apologies for overestimating you, rayban.
Another right wing frother too arrogant to engage in debate.
I thought we’d got rid of those last year?
Typical playbook of a Corbynista, accuse anyone who disagrees with the direction of the labour party of being a right winger.
You should watch that video.
No, that comment was just aimed specifically at you and your proclivity to post smart arsed responses rather than answer questions.
It’s about doing things that work that the Tories will find politically hard to undo in the future.
You mean like build a world class broadband network? Are you worried they’ll dig it up? Even if they privatised it once it was finished, at least we’d still have it here.
You should watch that video.
No one is watching any of the videos you’ve junked up this page with, especially the one with a DM logo in the corner. I’m hoping a mod will delete that one for you.
No, that comment was just aimed specifically at you and your proclivity to post smart arsed responses rather than answer questions.
What can I say, I enjoy highlighting cognitive biases.
You mean like build a world class broadband network? Are you worried they’ll dig it up? Even if they privatised it once it was finished, at least we’d still have it here.
Which private industry would have paid for eventually anyway (perhaps not via fibre, but other technologies such as 5G) - by the time a full fiber network is rolled out by government it may have already been made obsolete anyway.
If we do it, there has to be a way to make sure that even with a Tory government in power - it would be politically difficult to re-privatize the network.
‘Eventually’ is why it needs government intervention.
But why? What difference does getting it by 2030 - versus 2040 really make? How much would that add to our GDP?
All parties have been intervening in government to speed it up… so much money… so many promises from OpenReach, and BT before them, so much dragging of heals. 2040 won’t even happen. Time to stamp on the accelerator.
Don’t pretend to be an idiot.
Don't pretend to know the added value of a quicker roll out? The economic numbers or I call bullshit.
I’m amazed Rayban found the time to post all this stuff tonight given his star turn on QT tonight.
https://twitter.com/borisjohnson_mp/status/1195120565469765632?s=21
I’m amazed Rayban found the time post all this stuff tonight given his star turn on QT tonight.
I would have thought you'd be agreeing with that kid, seeing as you have posted much the same in the past about politicians needing to listen to their constituents and get brexit done.
A while back me and others on here were anti-democratic neoliberal elitists.
To paraphrase a part of the above video, the more you know about a political subject, the less impassioned you are by it.
I would have thought you’d be agreeing with that kid
I see you're still confused at the concept of supporting democracy whilst being anti-brexit. Probably for the other thread though.
Back on topic though, why do you think someone who left school at 16 to look after her child and then worked her way up to the shadow cabinet isn't qualified to be prime minister? I can't think of anyone better quite frankly.
I see you’re still confused at the concept of supporting democracy whilst being anti-brexit. Probably for the other thread though.
Back on topic though, why do you think someone who left school at 16 to look after her child and then worked her way up to the shadow cabinet isn’t qualified to be prime minister? I can’t think of anyone better quite frankly.
Because it requires making decisions about deeply complex world events, that require a level of critical thinking that isn't imparted on people who leave school at 16. Cooper is clearly more qualified for that role, but I'm guessing that she's just not far enough left for your taste?
Trump is poorly educated, look at the brilliant foreign policy decisions he has made. The left are quick to pick up on right-wing leadership being poorly educated, but let it slide when it's their own.
I see you’re still confused at the concept of supporting democracy whilst being anti-brexit. Probably for the other thread though.
Your attitude is little different to that kids then, the only difference is that you say that you are a remainer (which I and others have had their doubts about).
that require a level of critical thinking that isn’t imparted on people who leave school at 16.
Don't hold back on exposing your deep-seated prejudices. I suppose the fact that Angela Rayner grew up in a very troubled environment and still rose to top is immaterial. She's just a bit thick isn't she cos she didn't get straight As in her GCSEs despite having a kid at 16?
Trump is poorly educated, look at the brilliant foreign policy decisions he has made.
Trump inherited millions from his family. Are you seriously trying to compare Angela Rayner to Donald Trump?
So one is thick because he came from a posh background and one is clearly bright and fit to lead because she got to where she was coming from a comprehensive background?
That is a very, very weird cognitive bias/fallacious argument - an argument from authority as long as they are from your own social background.
Rayner grew up in a very troubled environment and still rose to top is immaterial.
Yes it is, it's been shown time and time again that politicians can rise to the top irrespective of ability - for various reasons, including blind luck, appeal to their voters base, cronyism etc.
Why Rayner instead of Cooper? I'm going to go out on a limb and say it's not because Rayner is genuinely more qualified for the role than Cooper, it's because Rayner becoming PM would make you feel validated. After all DazH, you have been very sure of your opinions in the past and the character of elitist middle class remainers, what better way to be sure that your world view is the correct one than have someone more like yourself in a position of power? No more feeling humiliated as an undervalued Northerner hey?