[Closed] 2015-16 rugby, world cup year

Yes, I thought everything was the referees' fault too. Every bloody result. It's a wonder the team's even turn up these days. Just ask the ref to toss a coin to decide the winner.

@mefty pretty certain the deals the footballers where involved in where aggressive tax avoidance structures, the problem the footballers have is that HMRC investigated them and then have claimed back the significant tax relief the "investors" where granted. The films where often not made/completed so that part is worthless too. I have some familiarity as I was shown very much the same structures and the "sales pitch" was all about tax relief and nothing to do with any films,

You should reread the article that I linked to, Jolyon Maugham certainly has considerable expertise in this area and his analysis is very sound. He also wrote a post yesterday on the Sunday Times story [url= http://waitingfortax.com/2015/11/ ]here[/url].

The films where often not made/completed so that part is worthless too.

Except in a couple of tiny cases, this is untrue. All the main promoters Future, Ingenious, Scion and Invicta worked with completed films.

the "sales pitch" was all about tax relief and nothing to do with any films,

The simple fact is that initial government scheme meant you didn't have to take film risk.

Seems like Burgess lost over £90k. No wonder he went back to the NRL for a large pay packet.

Well the saying - a fool and his money soon go separate ways - must be spot on because Danny Care was one of the other big investors. 😆

the refereeing wasn't a great advert for the Pro 12 

The refs in the pro12 are awful. Didnt see any games this weekend though.

Seems like Burgess lost over £90k.

I know nothing of the guy but he didn't come across very bright when he was the highlight of the media attention in the press conference ahead of his only RWC start... 😀

The refs in the pro12 are awful.

I never really gave it too much thought in previous seasons but they really seem to be on to something this year!

I missed this at the time... not a bad end to a Test career!

See Bath have replaced Burgess with Dave Denton. Good luck. 😉

@Dan me too, cheeky 🙂

Bath have got Louw on the bench too, a proper rugby union player.

Thats a strange one, why would Embra release a first choice international? Unless their is money involved as a sweetener.

See Bath have replaced Burgess with Dave Denton. Good luck.

Great, does that mean Not Toby is off the menu?

Thats a strange one, why would Embra release a first choice international? Unless their is money involved as a sweetener.

Significant transfer fee.

Dave Denton came down to his old club today to help out with a video they're making for charity. Not a bad journey he's been on to be fair. Edinburgh Accies 4th team to Scotland.

Our was one of the clubs that the Webb Ellis cup visited during its tour. I took the opportunity to throw a few balls about with Dave Denton.

Scarlets have sent a video nasty of clips from the game against Leinster where they feel they were wronged by the ref to the chiefs of the Pro12. I assume they'll also include footage from the first 6 games they won where they feel the ref has got it wrong too.

You have a real bee in your bonnet dont you? Losing bonus point away to Leinster was a good result.

I note Mike Brown is saying he can't trust his team mates any more because of "leaks".

Anyone else think this is like a fart?

He who denied it, supplied it....

🙂

George isn't holding back...from Beeb...

George Ford believes Sam Burgess 'let down' his former colleagues at Bath after he quit the club to return to Rugby League in Sydney.

Ford said: "A lot of lads would die for this club and would serve Bath for as long as possible. For someone to come in and not do the same thing probably upset a few lads."

George Ford's comments come after his father, Mike, who's head coach at Bath said Burgess "didn't have the stomach" to see out his three year contract at the club.

Would everyone (including me!) stop going on about Sam! 🙂

Sam who?

[img] [/img]

🙂

“If they are going to say something, I think they should put their name to it. But it will come out who it was at the end of the day … it will be interesting when it does because I will be one of the first people to speak to them.”

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2015/nov/10/england-rfu-world-cup-mike-ford

Scarlets have sent a video nasty of clips from the game against Leinster where they feel they were wronged by the ref to the chiefs of the Pro12. I assume they'll also include footage from the first 6 games they won where they feel the ref has got it wrong too.

Did you watch the game?

Pigface - isn't angry basically what MB does? I mean if he wasn't angry, well that would be news. MB - decent player marred by anger issues.

Ford said: "A lot of lads would die for this club and would serve Bath for as long as possible. For someone to come in and not do the same thing probably upset a few lads."

Is this the same Ford who after coming through the Leicester Tigers academy, then jumped ship and went to play for Bath, with announcements made even though he was actually too young to be approached by another club? That's a bit rich!

I suppose Dave Denton as also welcomed with open arms, even though he's jumped ship in the middle of a Pro12 season to join another club leaving them in the lurch? Somehow it all seems a little one sided!

As much as I will defend Brown from accusations of being a sandwich short of a picnic ... he critises team mates as being untrustworthy for speaking to the press by making a statement to the press 😳

That is a good bit of business that Bath and Edinburgh have done. Denton was leaving at the end of the year anyway and reports vary between 100-200k release. While he obviously shite because he only plays for Scotland (tm A-A)He will suprise a few folk who have only seen him playing in that aforementioned Scotland team.

Be prepared for handling errors galore from Denton.

Bomber GONE!

As Eykyn put it:

@alastaireykyn: A good man, ferociously hard worker, honest & dignified. As an international coach he came up short. Onwards.

Onwards indeed but it would be wrong if he was the only casualty.

Does anyone know if Y Shaun has put pen to paper in Wales yet?

Lancaster resigns, he has maintained his dignity throughout and did his best. You cannot ask for more.

Edwards and Jake White seem the only possibilities of the international Big Hitters who are not under contract? Lower down the food chain, a few Premiership coaches if they are mad or perhaps the England kit man.

Big difference between being Head Coach and Defensive Coach, Head Coach at a club would generally be a better fit.

True, but all things considered Wales defence was pretty decent as expected during the world cup. Particularly against line outs 😆

Big difference between being Head Coach and Defensive Coach, Head Coach at a club would generally be a better fit.

ancaster resigns, he has maintained his dignity throughout and did his best. You cannot ask for more.

Met with Ritchie (his boss) who told him to quit. Not quite the same.....
However, as the same 2 people (Ritchie and Rob Andrews) have appointed the last 3 or 4 'failed' coaches, I wonder what will happen to those? I suspect not a damn thing and most good coaches will rule themselves out due to the internal politics / meddling.

Met with Ritchie (his boss) who told him to quit

That is speculation, but hardly unimaginable - even if that it the case, he has always come across as a thoroughly decent man, albeit maybe without the necessary qualities to do the job as well as others.

Met with Ritchie (his boss) who told him to quit. Not quite the same.....

There's the small matter of a contract with 5 years left to run. So, you agree a package and everyone behaves decently.

Except, of course, whether England rugby union fans can ever feel confident that those running the RFU are directing it in the right way for the benefit of both the domestic club game and the internaitonal team.

Will be interesting to see how this unfolds across the remainder of the coaching staff and into the player contingent. Only Andy Farrell - a man apparently universally despised by the fans - seems to have kept his mouth shut so far!

Only Andy Farrell - a man apparently universally despised by the fans - seems to have kept his mouth shut so far!

There's the small matter of a contract with 5 years left to run.

It has been reported in the past that the term is about intent rather legal enforceability, either party can break with notice, rumoured to be one year.

Would any English domestic coach really want it? Its been a poisoned chalice since Woodward left, IMHO there needs to be more fundamental changes to the set-up at the RFU before the coaching team can work properly.

scared of being exposed. You dont go shouting off after a massive **** up.

Can't say I disagree. Will be plenty more to come out in the next couple of days.

It has been reported in the past that the term is about intent rather legal enforceability, either party can break with notice, rumoured to be one year.

Wasn't aware of that. Suggests the pay off is a year.

IMHO there needs to be more fundamental changes to the set-up at the RFU

As someone more WRU that RFU, I could churlishly wish there won;t be. But in reality, given that the semi finals were all SH teams (and clearly the top 4 teams in the world at the tournament), this is something all the NH teams should watch and learn from.

Wouldn't say Argentina were that great, they played very well against a clueless Irish side. The rest of the time no better or worse than the 6 Nations sides.

England coach comes with so much expectation, conflict and scrutiny I wouldn't go anywhere near it.

Is there a "Lancaster must stay" online petition?

@duckman, only in Ireland, Wales and Scotland 🙂

Edwards was a head coach at club level before he moved into first the England (I recall, could be wrong) then Wales setups. Andy Farrell isn't daft he's keeping his head down and his mouth shut. I'd like to see Catt stay involved but its too early for head coach.

As I posted before all expectations for England should be put aside for 2 years while we focus on a style of play rather than results, I honestly couldn't care how we do in the next 6N

I respect Lancaster/RFU for the stance on Tuilagi but had he been picked I don't think we would have had the same Burgess distractions. We'd have still had the Farrell saga at 10.

@Pigface, Argentina made Ireland look poor. My 2 cents is they where better than any of the 6N sides at the RWC.

Lewsey leaving his job in WRU today as well

Edwards was a head coach at club level

Wasps.

Edwards rush defence was eventualy worked out by other prem coaches though.I think he works very well as second in command/specialist coach.

I respect Lancaster/RFU for the stance on Tuilagi but had he been picked

He's been injured so wouldn't have been able to play - Hartley on the other hand - forgot that Edwards was at Wasps, can't remember how he did there.

I respect Lancaster/RFU for the stance on Tuilagi but had he been picked

He's been injured so wouldn't have been able to play - Hartley on the other hand - forgot that Edwards was at Wasps, can't remember how he did there.

Mallinder may have his own nepotism problem, his son captained the U18s and is 19 now. He is a 6ft 5 fly half!

At last Lancaster has finally made a good decision.

I just hope someone decent comes in. Eddie Jones, Wayne Smith, Dave Rennie or even Jake White who seems to be favourite but hasn't coached at international level since 2007.

Don't know if they'll try and poach existing international coaches like Cheika, Gatland, Schmidt or Cotter.

Ian Ritchie seems to be absolving himself of any blame. Funny that.....

Edwards rush defence was eventualy worked out by other prem coaches though.

Shame no one has told the english and scottish coaches then. Welsh defence is still amongst the best...attack is shit but thats Howlers department.

Are you saying he was a success as a head coach? By stressing how good a second in command he is?

No I'm saying if his rush defence was worked out when he was at wasps why is the rush defence still such a strong point for wales?

It's a shame Lancaster couldn't have stayed on as a 'sporting director' as I think he's good for the England set up as a whole but not from a coaching/technical point of view. Even more of a shame that that wasn't his original appointment of course...

Doors officially open to a "coach with proven international experience" - a foreign coach then, who will be responsible for the appointment other staff below him - no decision made on Farrell, Catt or Rowntree by the RFU.

Is it really AA? I thought Wales used their back row to play a zonal game and only rushed when stretched on multiple phases.Especially against England. Wasps finished 9th the year he was head coach.

Why all the talk of a foreign Coach? You have already had one... 😈

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/9035995/Six-Nations-2012-revealed-the-picture-that-proves-England-coach-Stuart-Lancasters-Scottish-roots.html

It still is mainly a rush defence though and is Edwards coached and works well. Cant see him as England head coach though. Whats a zonal defence, my view was that they now rush up once narrow with the back row and then again from out wide. It used to be mainly led by 13 directing the attack to the backrow, now the backrow rush up to chop tackle forwards and the "13" rushes when the ball is spread. I expect you understand the technicalities better than me though.

Woodward spouting again, reckons that there is enough knowledge in the english game that you dont need to go foreign, says people like Dillydaygo and Dawson should be involved 😆 lets get a average scrum half and a bloke who will tell you he can score some coke for a shag in the mix. What can possibly go wrong? No body seems to be looking at the elephant in the room here, england have not got the players or the players aren't committed enough to do the job. Love the adulation and rewards but not good enough on the field.

Love the adulation and rewards but not good enough on the field.

I respect Lancaster/RFU for the stance on Tuilagi but had he been picked

Tuilagi informed Lancaster he was injured and wouldn't make the squad. 24hrs later there is a press release saying he's been dropped due to the court case.

Again, not the same thing! On the rest of the coaching setup, Catt hasn't added any attack, Wiggo (who's also silent) seemed to have done a good job on the forwards, right upto the world cup when they were bloody awful and I simply can't think what Farrell ever added, other than being "an inspirational leader"

I think I'm saying a clean slate, and with any luck, a number of decent, internationally experienced coaches!

I don't get the clamour for international experience. Some of the best coaches around had no international experience (proper) before their current appointments; Cotter, Cheika, Schmidt. Hourcade was an assistant coach at portugal, then womens coach and look at what he's achieved.

AA,against England and Oz I thought Wales used a man to man defence from set pieces/first couple of phases relying on Roberts as a big target to avoid/push attackers out.Wales only used one centre to rush or press the midfield,catch the 10's eye,and on later phases switched to relying on the back row more and the players having an area to cover as the game breaks down.This worked well against England as they had a dominant back row,and could rely on the 6/7/8 to then plug holes/turnover tackled player.Oz play the same way,so it was less effective.

Love the adulation and rewards but not good enough on the field.

Describes all of the home nations IMHO.

Two of the home nations have won stuff over the past few years. One hasn't had a Grand Slam for over 10 years and the final one has managed to win more games this RWC than they have for ages in the 6N so are improving. [Tongue in cheek] The NH teams weren't good enough in the latter stages against the strong SH sides but don't go dragging 3 good teams into England's level of shambles 😆 [/tongue in cheek]

One of those two teams has finished third twice in a row in a competition considered second rate, and scraped past a team which hasn't won a GS for over 10 years.......
The other was quite comprehensively beaten in a QF by one of the weaker SH sides.

Is none of us beating the RC teams "good enough"?
I'd suggest not.

England are shocking at present, but none of us can consider ourselves good enough.

I will bow to your greater wisdom duckman. I watched both games from behind the sofa! Wonder if the loss of Jiffy junior meant they wated to take pressure off the 13.

I don't think we are apart in our descriptions of the Welsh defence,the original rush was that you pushed up the oppos inside shoulder forcing him out. Edwards Wasps got away with it for two years,then it's success was diluted a little each year as teams introduced the menace of the crossing/dummy runner. I wonder how much input chin and Williams had,I rate the Dr as at least as clever as Greenwood or BoD. And the best centre in Europe now Burgess has gone. 😀 One of the failings of a rush as teams tire is that the line doglegs. They would move up with Roberts in front and I suspected at the time that was a really KISS way of unfamiliar,tired backs in position.If that is all Edwards,then fairymuff. But back to the original point,the rush defence is ten years old now and I don't think we see it much from anybody.

Cipriani charged with drinking and driving.

Mini Jiffy back to the Scarlets

North has learnt a lot at Northampton. None of it good.
Good effort in the first half by scarlets.

brave effort in the end. If McShingler could kick..............

Meanwhile in the other code England show how it's done.

[url= http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/34801235 ]#wallofwhite beat the kiwis![/url]

Ospreys win which surprised me and the Dregs get past Sale.

Fairly positive for the welsh teams, dont see any getting past the groups though. As for Leinster.....sheeeet whats happening there?

The same as happened to Leicester - the head coach Matt O'Conner) left and went to Leinster. Look what happened!

On that note, good results in all round for the AP teams in the European. As well as Wasps, good wins for Saracens and Tigers.

Jonah Lomu RIP. 🙁 40 years old; that's just rubbish.

Awful news one of the greatest ever players

Very sad.

What a hero - even when he was running over half the England team.

A great man off the field.

My wife woke me with the news earlier. Very sad. One of the few players I ever made an effort to see play. (Ieuan Evan's commemorative game at Stradey, years ago.)

Express reporting Eddie Jones is going to be new England coach, heard the same from well placed sources in SA.

Looks like McCaw's called it a day.

Just seen the news. Extraordinary player.

reporting Eddie Jones is going to be new England coach