[Closed] 2015-16 rugby, world cup year

I see. Not altogether surprising given their roles (backs coach vs defence coach).

I think both are wrong.

But then I'm happy they were on Saturday!

And T Youngs, Lawes and Cole are playing horribly at the minute!!!
I wouldn't start any of them against the aussies.

Hows about Dylan? 😉

I think Farrell is backs coach; Catt is skills coach (or similar).

penalty magnates

I'm not sure I've seen a better typo!!!!

Oh, and Mallinder, Greenwood and Baxter for the england coaching team please.

Brown is too far from things to be captain tbh. I may be biased as I think backs are like tits on a bull.

Brown is too far from things to be captain

I also suspect we'll be asking the "who'll be the next England coach" in the not too distant future.

The green machine had a centre as captain. Not your everyday common or garden centre mind 😀 but still, a centre.

As a Welsh fan I was pleasantly surprised by that result, I know the England team is coming in for a lot of stick, but if the game had been over at 65 mins Lancaster would have been vindicated for his starting XV. IMHO the team on the pitch should take the criticism and move on. Lancasters new starting players all played their part as requested - Farrell kicked well, Burgess stopped Roberts / drove the ball up, the wingers tidied up scraps and the Forwards had the beating of Wales at each set piece. The one thing Wales did better was to play as a team when they started to lose players & fitness. Warburton deserves a big pat on the back as he was immense in the final 10.
This world cup is far from over, Wales still need a good game against Fiji and Aus, just as much as England do.

This is World Cup is vital for England if we go out next week back room staff have to go all of them, sir Clive's sticking his name back into the ring but the games changed too far for that. So do we go southern and pick a foreign coaching staff and try and beat the southern teams at there own game(the way forward I think). Or stick to northern smash and grind.
We have the players in this country I'm sure of that huge depth of club rugby to pick and train from. Lots of talk of bickering between cat and Farrell jrn and snr forwards and backs are no longer separate entities in world class rugby.

Roll on Saturday and let's hope cooper puts the same boots on he had on Sunday

There was talk on the radio of Wood being cited for booting Loopy Liam in the head.

Farrell wants burgess/barritt/farrel wallop type game.

Surely Farrells main coaching role is to act as defensive coach, and he got it wrong against Wales as they ran around the outside. Australia will look to exploit that gap even more effectively.

When picking the captain the first thing to think about is if they are a guaranteed pick which seems to be at the moment Cole, T Youngs, Lawes and Brown none of whom seem to be natural choices. Tom Wood is close and seems to get on the sheet most weeks

Cole and T Youngs are in by default at the moment for lack of other options. Youngs in particular probably shouldn't start if Hartley was better behaved. Lawes and Wood again are hardly England's first choice in an ideal world. Brown is a garunteed starter but not a captain for so many reasons. It is almost as though the Engalnd teams needs some young, fresh, form players to be given a chance and properly guided through the international ranks or something 😉

Farrell kicked well until the crucial lack of confidence at the end, Burgess did his trademark one or two good things a game and was a bit of a liability for the rest of the match, the back 3 are probably the only positive despite a little defensive error and the Forwards looked good off Marler's hinging and Wales struggling set piece.

FTFY if going for a harsher view on things 😀

Yes if the match were 20 minutes shorter they could have got a result but there still would have been big question marks IMO

Surely Farrells main coaching role is to act as defensive coach, and he got it wrong against Wales as they ran around the outside

Pigface - Member

There was talk on the radio of Wood being cited for booting Loopy Liam in the head.

Posted 18 minutes ago #Report-Post

Reckless play,one game and a pack of orange clubs.
Or not cited at all then!
DanW,how much longer is Marler going to get away with hinging? Thats two games and he is so bad even contributers on a bike forum see it. I would be willing to bet the Aussies will be mentioning it to the ref in the meeting before the game.

From the Beeb...

England flanker Tom Wood is free to play against Australia after he was not cited for the incident which saw Wales full-back Liam Williams knocked unconscious on Saturday.
However, Wood has been given a warning after his shin made contact with Williams' head as he tried to secure possession for Wales on the ground in the 28-25 win over the hosts at Twickenham.

Wood is free to play next weekend.

Wasn't there an incident around the Attwood kicking North time where someone similarly clumsy got a reasonable ban?

Yes but I think on the whole the Welsh defence is better as they do drift when needed. England didn't seem to be able to do it. As I understand it that was one of areas of the fallout between Farrell and Catt, Catt wants more of a drift defence, along with fast more skillful players for attacking.

Gizza GIF of the head boot/shin a_a please?

Kearney (The "Rob" one, not the "Dave one) an injury worry for Wales. Tbh, if it was any way doubtful, I'd be more than happy to see Zebo in there wearing 15. Perhaps not as polished under a dropping ball, but he's been creative in what I've seen of him so far and (again, while not necessarily as good as Kearney in contact) he's improved that part of his game. Keef (actually looking alright so far) and Tommy can look after the wings. Really looking forward to the Italy game - the first two have been nice and pretty to watch but Italy will be a better test of Joe's combinations and by no means, a gimme. Henshaw due to return for that game too.

Green machine staying nicely under the radar so far this tournament. 🙂

Gizza GIF of the head boot/shin a_a please?

He might be teaching... 😀

There's a link back a few oages from walesonline with a video of it.

One view:

And another:

Found it. No malice, but certainly reckless. He should have had a sit down after that.

DanW,how much longer is Marler going to get away with hinging?

He wasn't even close to setting straight let alone pushing straight. I don't watch enough Premiership rugby to know if it is a trait of his perhaps? I'm fairly sure Cole used to do the same thing a lot (for England at least) so maybe it is a conscious tactic for the team for an easy upper hand that is hard to monitor on ground level for the officials?

I have repeat what other have already said but the Canadian scrum is a thing of beauty!

Green machine staying nicely under the radar so far this tournament.

You'd hope so having only played the teams ranked 17th and 18th in the world 😆

If anyone needed to see that the rankings are bollocks then you'll notice Wales are currently the second best team in the World 🙄 😆

Thinking back to an earlier comment about England caps. Only Care, Ben Youngs, Cole and Haskell have over 50 caps in the current squad (wider squad not RWC squad). Brown, Lawes and Robshaw (and David Wilson!) are in the 40's. Of those probably only Ben Youngs and Brown get in to the team on form which must be a worry.

Also thinking back to who in the current team has a spine and won't take a backwards step- I can only really think of Ben Youngs (though size will never be on his side!) and perhaps someone like Launchbury although he's probably still a bit too nice???

I think if England can find some nasty locks and Catt gets his wishes in the backs then England could be a very, very good team.

England could be a very, very good team

f they step it up and beat Australia then the Wales match will be all but forgotten.

Not by me it wont!

England are in complete disarray. They don't appear to know how they want to play, even the coaches disagree.
The established players seem to be able to keep their shirts regardless of how they perform (Cole, Wood, Lawes, Youngs, Barritt). Young dynamos bought in last minute then not played as they don't have the game time, whilst beginners to the sport are given starting places.
The old term "trundlemuppets" has never been more appropriate to an england team than it was on saturday, and even their trundling was crap.

He should have had the nouse to say "not tonight lads" to the film crew though.

That was sort of my point. He wasn't the right person to do an interview at the best of times so letting, or was it putting, him in front of the camera was stupid.

Oh and the best 15 in the RWC so far?

Goromaru.

My view is that England have a great group of players that amount to a good team. Any international team can beat any other on the day (just look at RSA - Japan) but the current lack of leadership and decision making all around doesn't instill much confidence in the chances of them getting those wins.

Personally I fear that the win took a little too much out of Wales. The last thing they need is knocks to any of the players (starting XV or otherwise). At this rate the WRU will be conscripting any centres with Welsh heritage.

They need to beat Fiji to be fairly sure of getting through to the next round where they could then end up playing Scotland at this rate so even with injuries an optimistic fan would fancy their chances! Wales will always be in a position where injuries will weaken the team significantly but they have the benefit of some direction and knowing how they want team as a whole want to play. It will be interesting to see who gets called up- young guns or British and Irish Lions?

best 15 of the tournament so far I'd say

Well, opinions differ. 😉

Israel Folau and Ben Smith might be a lot better.

Hogg, Cordero and Talebula might be a bit better.

Besides, being England's best performer so far is nothing to write home about..... 🙁

Beale was looking handy too!

Australia's backs looked silky...nearly as smooth as the green machine's. 😀

But it was against Uruguay - be interesting to see what they'll do against England. Can't wait for that game. And Wales, in adversity, to beat Australia even if they haven't in the last 157 games...might stick a few quid on that. 🙂

Anscombe likely to be next full back cab on the rank. Hook as a centre. I expect Wales will play as many of the starting 15 from saturday v Fiji as they can. Win and we go through. Expect Charteris to start over AWJ and Owens over Baldwin. Tips at 7 over Warbs. North to 13 Cuthbert to 14. My Nan at 11 and anyone elses nan to 15 tather than Morgan.

If england lose to Oz but get 2 bonus points for less than 7 points and 4 tries, and then win against Uruguay with 5 points they will have 13. If wales beat fiji with 4 points but lose to Oz by more than 7 then its gonna go on points difference.. Don't be counting yer chickens.

The Welsh team for Fiji will be a tough call. They have to go all out for the win (ideally with a bonus point) so for me that means keeping Davies, Biggar and Roberts for sure even though it would be very bad news to get another injury here. North and Cuthburt will probably be on the wing with Lloyd Williams covering them again. No idea on the next pure wing to call up, probably none. Hook at Centre seems like a decent shout as I can only think of Beck as the only other capped centre left standing??? If Liam Williams ins't fit then I can see Priestland starting. Charteris, Owens, Tiperic are good shouts too, maybe also Samson starting fitness depending.

Basically not a very first choice 15 but not far off as you say a_a

Tyler Morgan replaced Allen so he will play 13 if North doesnt. Charteris and Ken Owens on the bench for England was an odd choice but it makes sense now

So essentially, Wales need a bonus point against Fiji to be sure?

[quote=dbcooper ]If england lose to Oz but get 2 bonus points for less than 7 points and 4 tries, and then win against Uruguay with 5 points they will have 13. If wales beat fiji with 4 points but lose to Oz by more than 7 then its gonna go on points difference..

[b]Tournament rules[/b]

Teams receive four points for a win and two for a draw. A bonus point is awarded for scoring four tries or for a defeat by seven points or fewer.
The winner and runner-up in each pool qualify for the quarter-finals.
If two teams are level on points at the end of the group stage, then the winner of the match between those sides will go through.

Just seen Billy Vunipola is out and England have called up Nick Easter to the squad.

Nandnondondlo suspended for game v Wales.

If two teams are level on points at the end of the group stage, then the winner of the match between those sides will go through.

Oooohhhh I like those rules. Didn't know that thanks 😀

What did Nandnondondlonondondlo get up to? I like the citing commissioner's name- Freek Burger!

More being singled out. Got any evidence for this or is it like the Lawes stuff. All in your head?

Evidence? We're not in court ffs!! As for the Lawes comment? You're either confusing me with someone else or making that one up....I haven't mentioned Lawes at all!

Gutted to hear about Billy V....not a huge fan of his but he was okay on Saturday.....good god do I hate Nick Easter-he belongs with the vast majority of the rest of the RWC 2011 debacle, a horrid, distant memory.

scotroutes -

If England and Wales both end up on 13, Wales go through

Gotcha, at least there won't be any arguments...

What if three end up level? And A beat beat B, B beat C, but C beat A. Or is that mathematically impossible?

1.1.3 Rankings at the completion of the pool phase

At the completion of the pool phase, the Teams in a pool are ranked one through five based on their cumulative Match points, and identified respectively as winner, runner-up, third, fourth and fifth.

If at the completion of the pool phase two or more Teams are level on Match points, then the following criteria shall be used in the following order until one of the Teams can be determined as the higher ranked:

The winner of the Match in which the two tied Teams have played each other shall be the higher ranked;
The Team which has the best difference between points scored for and points scored against in all its pool Matches shall be the higher ranked;
The Team which has the best difference between tries scored for and tries scored against in all its pool Matches shall be the higher ranked;
The Team which has scored most points in all its pool Matches shall be the higher ranked;
The Team which has scored most tries in all its pool Matches shall be the higher ranked;
Should the tie be unresolved at the conclusion of steps 1 through 5, the rankings as per the updated Official World Rugby World Rankings on October 12, 2015 will determine the higher ranked Team.

Should the tie be unresolved at the conclusion of steps 1 through 5, the rankings as per the updated Official World Rugby World Rankings on October 12, 2015 will determine the higher ranked Team.

Well now that wales are the 2nd best team in the world and favorites to win the group, it shouldn't go down to this now should it?

Easter being called up just means England WILL be expecting 80mins out of Morgan! Coach isn't the forgiving type!

More being singled out. Got any evidence for this or is it like the Lawes stuff. All in your head?
Evidence? We're not in court ffs!! As for the Lawes comment? You're either confusing me with someone else or making that one up....I haven't mentioned Lawes at all!

Anscombe and Hook called up to replace S Williams and Amos. Could we see M Morgan on the wing? Liam Williams they hope will have had his brain unscrambled for the Aus game.

What if three end up level? And A beat beat B, B beat C, but C beat A. Or is that mathematically impossible?

But Eng are reasonably likely to get a BP against Uruguay
Wales the same for Fiji
Aus might get one for just losing to Eng, but less likely to get one for beating Wales, but Wales likely to get one for just losing to Aus
So then it would be
Eng 15
Aus 14
Wales 15

All bollocks but amusing to think about.

My predictions however are

Aus min 17 by beating Eng and Wales
Wales beat Fiji with a BP, lose to Aus with a BP so 15
England lose to Aus with a losers BP and beat Uruguay with a BP so 12

I'd suggest Aus 17, Wales 14 (no BP against Fiji) and England 12.

Indeed I can go for that too. Good news for Wales eitherway, I cannot see them not making it out of the group.

At last, Gatland has found Hook's phone number. He was thought he'd deleted that in 2012.

Some good news for the welsh.. Fijian Nadolo banned for Wales game..

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/34385298

At last, Gatland has found Hook's phone number. He was thought he'd deleted that in 2012.

Must have bumped in to him down the shops and had an awkward conversions where he couldn't not call him up 😆

Lets have some of the effortless running, penalty kick from your own half, strong hand off, creative lines, 45m drop goal Hook please... not the big gap in defense, hospital pass, kick aimlessly to the opponents strong runner Hook please 😆

Easter being called up just means England WILL be expecting 80mins out of Morgan! Coach isn't the forgiving type!

Easter is a man who can think for himself on the pitch and express an opinion off it. I'm surprised Mr Lancaster has allowed that sort of chap back into his classroom. Unless, as you suggest, he'll spend the whole match on the naughty step.

Will this affect Easter's pension? Presumably he will have to suspend collecting it for a [s]month[/s] sorry, fortnight.

All of the discussion about the rankings at the end just show how ridiculous it is to award bonus points for this type of competition. The situation where a team can lose more games than others but still make it out of the group shouldn't ever arise.

how ridiculous it is to award bonus points for this type of competition

Maybe, but all the teams go into the competition knowing the rules beforehand.

Except.....errr......England..... as Billy Vunipola didn't know there was a bonus point for the try HE scored against Fiji.

#carrythemhome

Just watching the game again. When Amos does his shoulder Brown comes over and gives him a tap on the head in a nice gesture of sympathy..nice touch...conflicted about calling hjm a **** now!!

Billy Vunipola didn't know there was a bonus point for the try HE scored against Fiji.

Brown comes over and gives him a tap on the head in a nice gesture of sympathy..nice touch

Was that the same gesture of sympathy as when one of the Welsh lads commiserated with Brown when he'd given away the winning/losing penalty? Brown took that in his typical charming manner.

Actually I did see that and it was a nice touch but even a broken clock is right twice a day.

Just watching the game again.

You genius! I recorded it. That means I can watch it again when I get home on Wednesday night.

From the Mash

THE English are arrogant fops and the Welsh are brave, stocky underdogs, it has been confirmed.

Although rugby is impossible to fully understand, spectators at Saturday’s World Cup match recalled seeing the England team carried onto the pitch in sedan chairs, wearing top hats.

25-year-old Australian Tom Booker said: “From the way they were dressed in safari suits and sipping cocktails, the English reeked of imperialist aloofness.

“The Welsh on the other hand looked like men of steel, forged in the furnace of oppression and burning with vengeful feelings against the foe that had gravely wronged them throughout history.”

The English delayed kick off while they finished smoking and telling each other hunting anecdotes in loud posh voices, because that is how arrogant they are.

Booker said: “Being English, they were more arrogant than a cockerel in gold trousers. But they took an early lead because they have longer limbs due to superior nutrition.

“However at half time England were cockily drinking Pimm’s with their coach Stephen Fry, while the brave Welsh huddling in their meagre underground changing room to eat nutritious leeks and sing rousing choir songs.

“Then they gave England the pasting they so richly deserved, and the Welsh rugby captain got to marry Charlotte Church and become their king.”

Love the mash.
Loved Mike Browns interview, he gives a shit, he was pissed off, probably a bit shamed up, and wanted to get out of there. What I don't like is people laughing about it. Rugby is about respect.

What I don't like is people laughing about it. Rugby is about respect.

He should show some respect to the interviewer then.

Good little article here on people booting others accidently.
https://theblitzdefence.wordpress.com/2015/09/27/tom-wood-liam-williams-head-and-similar-incidents/

He should show some respect to the interviewer then.

Give the bloke a break. He was gutted and looked on the edge of tears. I think he plays well but needs to cut out the stupidly aggresive play.

Don't get the wood thing. Not even cited seems strange given the north case, where the no8 showed a lot less intent, no swinging leg. (I don't doubt his intent was the ball but it was firmly tucked into Williams).

It was still bobbling about when he tried to kick it I think.

thegreatape - Member
It was still bobbling about when he tried to kick it I think.

Aye, but once he'd given it a kick his head was still.

Think he's gotten off lightly myself. Not sure he should be hung drawn and quartered, but pro players in the modern game need to rein in their recklessness.

EDIT: Looks like Parisse might be back for the Italy game - he's back in training and hopes to prove his fitness for the game at the Olympic Stadium. Hope he is - the green machine needs a proper game before losing to France in the StagnHennium.

Looked like an accident to me, I was more concerned about englands neck rolls which got ignored.

was still bobbling about when he tried to kick it I think.

It was but it wasnt bobbling about near Williams head which is what he kicked.

Two points.
1) I'm not sure he didn't show any respect he just wanted out.
2) If he didn't show respect does that make it Ok for you to drop your own morals? Two wrongs don't make a right.

1. He should have just said no to the interview then.
2. I havent dropped my morals. I am happy to laugh at his missfortune in this context. Cocky **** gets his rewards

Is it correct to be respectful? Yes.
Are you being respectful to Browne. No.
QED

That Brown interview looks like he took one for the team.
can't imagine anyone in that changing room wanted to go out and face the media,

[i]"look lads, we've got a Media Commitment and someones's got to do the interview..."

"Alright boys, don't want to but I'll face them..."[/i]

Respect to him for doing it.

It was [s]still bobbling about when he tried to kick it I think.[/s] Liam Williams.

Respect to him for doing it.

This, to be honest. We whinge when we hear the usual losers' platitudes and we guffaw when we see someone obviously hurt in defeat giving short answers to stupid questions. I realise that splashing around on the gloat boat is lots of fun, but it's not pretty really. I think we've all had enough of it.

Quite, however I'm suggesting the ball was not 'firmly tucked into Williams' when Wood tried to kick it.

Brown cracked in the game. His interview reflected that. It the same old line between passion and losing it. He is undoubtedly one of England's best players but you need the top players to keep it together. I can't imagine the pressure him and the rest of the team were under but it would appear Brown in particular didn't respond well. Of course the fact he's shown himself to be a whingey, arrogant, petulant [insert choice word here] makes him and easy target- probably both for fans and the opposition which doesn't help the team at the end of the day. Surprised Lancaster hasn't dropped him for a morally bad interview 😆

Wood's kick was like a lock trying to run. Co-ordination of a baby giraffe should be excused in the (NH) forwards so right call 😆

wever I'm suggesting the ball was not 'firmly tucked into Williams' when Wood tried to kick i

No it wasnt but it also wasnt near Liams head

No it wasnt but it also wasnt near Liams head

DD provided the evidence and so in the interest of impartially bearing in mind I'm English I'll re-post the most negative Vid, you can decide for yourselves that the ball was loose: