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surprised youve not run crying to the mods like you normally do
I'll let you in on a secret here nora. I've never once reported you. Have others then? Just shows you need to be careful when you're being a racist bigot round these parts. There are eyes everywhere. Anyway, do stick to the rugby old chap. I realise you know bugger all about it, but it's a welcoming inclusive thread. 😀
Well i know JW won a world cup medal and odriscoll never got anywhere near one, know that hurts you but they're the facts however much you don't like them, no need to get all arsey dear and deflect the argument by casual accusations of racism... tut tut
😆
I don't even know why you're arguing the point with me, I didn't even join in the debate.
nora, you're a bigot. You're a racist. You've demonstrated it plenty of times on STW. It's there to see for anyone who cares to check your posting history. You don't even deny it.
Anyway, about the Irish bottling in Paris...care to comment?
No, didn't think so. 😆
Funny thing is I'm sure DD couldnt careless about ireland not winning a world cup as I certainly dont care that wales havent. Anyway I would suggest you just leave it DD but I might look a bit hypocritic!!!
To end the debate though we only need two words Dan Luger.
I'll admit that JW wasn't an unbelievable 10 in the Carter, Latham type mold
Latham was a fine fullback, but a 10 he was not. Larkham was a 10.
Funny thing is I'm sure DD couldnt careless about ireland not winning a world cup as I certainly dont care that wales havent.
Much as I agree with you about JW vs BOD, it is an established pshychological fact that people move the goalposts to suit their lot. If you had won or even come 2nd in a world cup you would think it is important.. (Much like we don't care about grand slams..) 😀
Meanwhile I wonder if you would cast your eyes over this vid below.
It is not the best example but I was meaning to ask what you guys think. Everyone says May is great, but to my naive eye he just runs sideways (the break in that vid agaisnt scotland is not a great example as they forgot to bring their tackling pants that day, and flatter May somewhat). Normally he runs sideways looking for a gap, across the front of the whole England line, decides to turn in , and gets flattened. (I tried to find a vid of this but couldn't) Is this good?
I can't see why.. He seemd to do this the whole tournament. Enlighten me.
Much as I agree with you about JW vs BOD, it is an established pshychological fact that people move the goalposts to suit their lot. If you had won or even come 2nd in a world cup you would think it is important..
came third once! You are right though, Wales level is a grand slam every once and a while. We've done well recently in this but lack the playing resources to win a world cup really
May is OK, I'd rather have Cuthbert though and he is pretty flawed too. Young fella on the other wing is tidy, reminds me of 1/2p, reckon he could be a full back in time. Neat, tidy, composed and has pace.
May is merely continuing the English rugby tradition of thrilling, exciting runners......running sideways.
See also Jason Robinson. 🙂
Wales level is a grand slam every once and a while.
more onces and whiles than England though.. Hence my disdain for the paltry achievment..
May's sideways running is more effective at club level, I have seen him have a fair bit of success with it at Gloucester including against Munster in this years HEC.
The best measure of Englands wing play this season is how Marland Yarde's reputation improved the longer he was injured.
As for JW, great player and arguably one of the best Northern Hemisphere OHs but way off Dan Carters level, it's like comparing Beckham to Maradona.
The best measure of Englands wing play this season is how Marland Yarde's reputation improved the longer he was injured.
And Ashton has gone away and rediscovered his International form 😆
The best measure of Englands wing play this season is how Marland Yarde's reputation improved the longer he was injured.
yes I love this.
Going back to JW, he did what he had to do at the time and did it well. For my own personal likes in rugby, despite winning the world cup, it was not our finest hour, as in not the most impressive exciting rugby. I hope to see more creativity and improvement, as well as winning ways in the future..
For my own personal likes in rugby, despite winning the world cup, it was not our finest hour, as in not the most impressive exciting rugby. I hope to see more creativity and improvement, as well as winning ways in the future..
You won the world cup in the Southern Hemisphere, you are the only Northern Hemisphere team to even win it. You should cherish it.
My rugby club has just sent me an email asking us to apply for tickets for the 2015 World cup, half a million tickets available to members of rugby clubs before they go on sale to the general public.
[i]I hope to see more creativity and improvement, as well as winning ways in the future..[/i]
Yeah, how about take on the All Blacks with All Blacks style rugby. That'll work!
[i]My rugby club has just sent me an email asking us to apply for tickets for the 2015 World cup, half a million tickets available to members of rugby clubs before they go on sale to the general public.[/i]
We've had that too - damn expensive isn't it!
He looks after himself very well and is the ultimate professional. We're really pleased he's staying and so are the boys
guess who
He does seem to of won over the haters
My comment about JW being an idiot defender, as a 10 it is not your job to be smashing into 8's and second rowers, he did it and hurt himself more than once
In fairness, JW had to do that at Newcastle because his own back row players weren't doing that job!
@aa I don't think JW was Carter's equal, I think JW was better. So that makes me nuttier than a nutty thing in your book.
@CFH I recall Robinson going mostly forwards to score his try in the RWC 2003. His nick-name in Australia was "fast-forward" BTW
@Pigface, Howley was clearly a better 9 than Dawson (as demonstrated by the fact he was first choice for the Lions until getting taken out). I have it on very good authority that the England coaching staff tried to get JW to calm down with regard to his tackling to prolong his career, fact is he is still playing.
Re "style" it's professional sport, wining first style second. The RWC is a high pressure environment, its unreasonable to expect a spectacle of running rugby under that amount of pressure, NZ won ugly last time.
In other news I am looking forward to the Saracens v Clermont H Cup semi - £16.50 a ticket is a bargain in my view.
You won the world cup in the Southern Hemisphere, you are the only Northern Hemisphere team to even win it. You should cherish it.
I think we could safely say I do cherish it. I rank that day in my life pretty highly, and all I did was watch it on TV at home. (I did go surfing after and that was good). Still have the VHS recording of it, and the next days newspapers. I would just prefer to win the world cup with a prettier style of rugby next time...
@aa I don't think JW was Carter's equal, I think JW was better. So that makes me nuttier than a nutty thing in your book.
not just mine I would think.
So what now for the rabo AA? How about games played on a Sat afternoon? I assume the Welsh clubs will end their fight with the union as the union controls entry to it?
Can we shoot it. Its shite, God knows what the way forward is. The demise of pro rugby in Wales I suppose.
Sky have picked up the broadcast rights for the Pro12 next season have they not? Match times are likely to be dictated by their scheduling.
Further details of the new Euro setup below.
Broadcasting...
BT and Sky have reached an agreement in principle concerning arrangements for the European Rugby Champions Cup and the European Rugby Challenge Cup competitions, both of which would be broadcast jointly by BT Sport and Sky Sports.
The pool matches would be shared equally, both will show two quarter finals each, one semi-final each and the final would be broadcast by both live. The four year agreement is subject to contract.
European Rugby Champions Cup qualification...
•20 clubs qualifying through the finishing positions in their leagues from the preceding season:
•Top 6 from TOP 14?; top six from Premiership Rugby; top seven from the PRO12 (with at least one club from each country participating in the league)
•The 20th place will be taken by the winner of a play off between:
•For the 1st season: The seventh highest finishing club from TOP14 and the seventh highest finishing club from Premiership Rugby. This play off will be played in May 2014, either as one match (in which case, there will be a draw for home advantage) or as home/away.
•For subsequent seasons: The seventh highest finishing club from TOP14, the seventh highest finishing club from Premiership Rugby; and the eighth and ninth highest finishing clubs from PRO12 (or the two highest finishing which have not already qualified automatically).
•From 2015 season, if the previous season's European Rugby Challenge Cup winner has not already qualified through its finishing position in its league, it will participate in the play off by taking a place given to its league.??The play off will take place over two dates.
•1st date: seventh club of TOP14 versus eighth or ninth from PRO12 and the seventh club of Premiership Rugby versus eighth or ninth from PRO 12. The matches will be played at the home venues of the TOP14 and Premiership Rugby clubs.?
•2nd date: The two winners from the first matches. The venue will be selected by a draw.
European Rugby Challenge Cup qualification
20 clubs comprising: 18 clubs from TOP14, Premiership Rugby and PRO12; 2 clubs from the qualifying competition organised with FIRA-AER.
?The competition will take place over nine weekends. The Pool phase will be through five Pools of four teams, which will play each other home and away (six matches).
The five Pool winners and the three best runners up will qualify for the Quarter Finals. The Quarter Finals will be played at the home venues of the four best Pool winners. The Quarter Final winners will play the Semi Finals and the Semi Final winners will play the Final.
Calendar of both Competitions: The Pool phase will be played in three blocks of two weekends and will be completed by the end of January. The Final will take place latest the first weekend of May.
The Qualifying Competition
The Qualifying Competition will compromise between eigth and 12 teams from Tier two countries and Italian clubs as agreed by EPCR & FIRA-AER.
EPCR will be managed through a Board of Directors representing all parties and an Executive committee in charge of commercial matters and assisting with preparations of Board meetings. The EPCR Board shall have an Independent Chairman.
The EPCR Executive will comprise the Independent Chairman, Director-General, and three voting representatives, one from each of the leagues – namely the TOP14, Premiership Rugby and PRO12. The Director-General shall manage the day to day operations of EPCR.
A minimum eight year agreement...
Equal distribution of funds. i.e. a third to TOP14 teams, a third to Premiership Rugby teams and a third to PRO12 teams, with a guaranteed minimum distribution for the clubs from the PRO12 in years one to five.
Sky have picked up the broadcast rights for the Pro12 next season have they not? Match times are likely to be dictated by their scheduling.
BT sport had it this year and didn't show it,tells you everything you need to know right there.
If bt had it how come it was on bbc and s4c?
Don't think BT ever had the rights was always regional BBC
Sale move next seasons games to Saturday 2pm starts.
Personally very happy about it, but some fans are whining already.
Hopefully more away fans can now make the trip up to see us now though - MsD says Gloucester fans can stay away as they are 'arrogant' :D, she has a bit of a bee in her bonnet about Gloucester!
Personally very happy about it, but some fans are whining already.
Alternative view is that those who have been "whining" for a long time have finally got their way? Given that Sale have been playing on Friday evenings (majority of games) since 2002 I think its fair that many fans feel that it should remain that way and make arrangements accordingly. For many having a game at 2pm on a Saturday impacts on lots of peoples own sporting activities and family commitments.
For me it means I may not renew mine and Surfer juniors ST given we cant make it to every game. Hopefully those that "whined" to get it moved to Saturday all buy ST's as many have promised. Given the turnouts on both Friday PM and Saturday matches recently Friday appears to draw a larger crowd!
I know AA disagrees but some of the Pro 12 games are decent, the 6 irish derby games involving Leinster, Munster & Ulster are always watchable for a start. Sure there are some crap games but the same is true of the Premiership, games I've seen this year involving Worcester, LI,Newcastle and even Wasps have been really poor.
There is decent games and crap games in every league.
I think that in general there is a greater desire in the Pro12 to play attack minded rugby played. Unfortuntely it is hit and miss if the skill levels are there to carry it off successfully.
I guess the fear is that with the new qualification criteria for the HC that may lead to a more defensive approach. Conversely it may also intensify the derbys as each team know that the best of their country qualify irrespective of league postion so beat your country rivals and you have a good chance of qualifying.
But the point behind a bottom of the table clash between say Worc and Newc as opposed to Newport and Treviso is that one will be playing because they have to do so twice a season, while the others will be fighting tooth and nail to win so as to stay up. Makes for good viewing even if the actual game play is poor - which it often is against two bottom the league sides because well, they're not very good!
Well Surfer, we are buying ST next week when they come out. The sheer godawful experience of getting to the ground on a Friday night, then having to leave early if the game ran late, to make the last train had put me off attending every home game. This way myself & MsD can easily train/walk to the ground & not worry about getting home.
Yep the irish derbies are good as are the welsh derbies which kind of sums up why the pro 12 is shite. Read somewhere for example that BOD hasnt played a league game in wales since 2008. If the stars dont play and the teams dont give a shit why would the fans?
I think we could safely say I do cherish it. I rank that day in my life pretty highly, and all I did was watch it on TV at home. (I did go surfing after and that was good). Still have the VHS recording of it, and the next days newspapers. I would just prefer to win the world cup with a prettier style of rugby next time...
I sincerely hope your wish does not come true, it is not in our nature to play pretty rugby, it is contrary to our traditions. The 2003 England side was probably the most complete side we have ever produced and they played wonderful rugby. In the World Cup their decline had just started from their zenith which for me was the game against Australia in the summer of 2003. I would also argue that New Zealand are not the most innovative rugby nation, their tradition is more to do with efficiency - doing the basics faster and more accurately than any one else. The French are innovative when true to themselves, so are the Aussies, and dare I say the Welsh have an innovative tradition. That is not England's way and I don't think a team will be successful if it eschews the ingrained way the game is played in its homeland.
mefty + 1 🙂 (and I don't normally get involved in this thread)
England teams have to remember to grind the win, via a powerful pack and defense that just smothers any Celtic (and that includes Les Bleus) creativity.
Then they have to remember that to succeed they must be able to win despite not only the opposition but the referee, the rugby gods and the weather.
Pro12 is great.
But it's up to the home team to go out and win their home games, and their fans to support them.
That's what might make attractive enough for home supporters to turn up and back them, likewise the team to perform.
With the travel involved it's not down to the opposition ( either the team, the squad, or their fans ) to make any game worthwhile. It's totally at the door of the home team and their fans.
Works well for the Irish provinces, can't speak for the others but it looks more of a mixed success.
There's no point some fans blaming the League set-up itself, or the opposition that their not taking enough stars or supporters to away games, when the problem's on their own turf. More fans - more money -more success - more fans.
Specially from a cosy seat behind a hooky webstream.
Oh yeah the pro 12 is great when you are an irish province subsidised to play in it by the welsh. The irish might want to wake up and smell the coffee. If the welsh go down the pan you'll be left playing with yourself.
Melrose sevens this weekend, unfortunaley i have a Nephews 1st birthday to go to so wont be attending.
Carlin Isles and Niko Matawalu are in the Glasgow squad.
Rugby, beer and maybe a even little sun would make for a pretty good weekend could even have cycled down from Embra for the day.
Oh and the welsh regions get the least cash and yet
"With the significant proposed contribution of £3.2m from Welsh television to secondary TV rights for Pro12, why is the estimated contribution from Irish TV only £910,000 and from Scottish TV only £140,000?"Based on all of the above, have imbalances or subsidies built up in TV revenues between the various International and Club competitions negotiated by the Unions and if so, how did this arise?
V
I would add that I'm pretty sure the Ospreys have won it more than anyone else and I watch it on the bbc thanks.
Gloucester v Bath : 😆
That was a proper old-school derby grudge match!
Inhales,spoilt by the ref,exhales.
Spoilt by lack of discipline.
Spoilt by rugby breaking out in between the fighting!
The fights were certainly more entertaining.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/27141607
He is a long way down the queue I would think. Am I reading that right? does he liken himself to BOD? 😆
Can I just say after spending a season rooted to the bottom of the Championship table Ealing my adopted local club (kids play & I coach minis) are seriously threatening not to get relegated. If Jersey lose away to Bedford we will stay up- well unless they pick up 2 losing bonus points. I am not even sure how I feel about this as a season of being thrashed by teams like Bristol, Leeds etc. with premiership aspirations has been no fun.
Bring back Ashton he's great.
Cipriani playing well could he get a recall? England look very light at ten without Flood.
Great players? If that's not out of context, what a complete prick.
I'd be very surprised if Cips didn't get a recall, seems to have sorted himself out well.
I'll put money on Burns being up there by the next 6 nations though.
I read it as Ashton saying great players dont have drops in form like he has had so he needs to improve.
He's being fairly humble, which he should be as he was never as good as he thought he was. He'll not go on the tour and neither will chippy Cipriani.
Quite a bit of speculation that Stefon Armitage might go with Lancaster having met him recently. No foreign based players was always a daft rule.
I read it as Ashton saying great players dont have drops in form like he has had so he needs to improve.
Me too. Interesting that he mentioned BOD and not JW. 😀
😉 etc.
Does that mean Flood is back in? Coaches son 1, Coaches son 2 and Burns looks weak given an injury.
If anyone is interested in a Saracens / Clermont ticket I have a spare available in exchange for a beer or two - H Cup Semi 15:40 ko Saturday at Twickenham. Downside is that you have to sit next to me. email in profile.
Bet Jambalaya is pissed!!! Wasnt expecting a result like that. Well played Saffacens.
Were they that good or did Clermont not turn up, that is an incredible result.
@aa I was driving and supporting Clermont (I follow Bath and Bristol) so sober, sadly !
Saracens where good, 46-6 good, I'm not so sure. They will carry confidence into the final for sure.
I think the game turned on two key incidents after Saracens had scored a nice try off an inside pass to Ashton. There was a jump ball in the in-goal area and the video ref ruled Para had deliberately knocked the ball out, yellow card and penalty try. Clermont then had a storming period despite being down to 14 men they "scored" a try which was rightly ruled out by the video ref for a block/obstruction. After that Saracens where magnificent in defence, Clermont never really got behind them. Farrell missed a pass knocked it forward with his knee and fell on it for a score, perhaps Clermont thought then it would not be their day and in the last 20 mins they seemed to give up and it was a cricket score.
It was a magic atmosphere before the game and for the first 30 mins, a lot of Clermont fans, wigs, fancy dress, team shirts, flags. The lady behind us was teased by a Saracen fan that there were not many ASM fans at the game and she said they where saving up for Cardiff. All good fun. I felt sorry for them as they where very quiet in the second half, it's a long and expensive trip to London to see your side thrashed.
A Saracen's win is good for ticket sales (final isn't sold out) and an all French final would be a bit boring. Munster/Toulon is hard to call, home advantage but I don't think Toulon have been playing that well. I would find it hard to resist a trip to Cardiff to see JW play 😉
I went to the Sarries game today too - bought tickets this morning for £17, what a bargain. It was an extraordinary attacking defensive perforamnce, the tackle statistics are incredible, Berger made 19 tackles in the first half. The French fans were colourful and noisy (for the first half), and despite the small crowd (can't believe they can't sell more tickets) it was a brilliant atmosphere - better than many autumn internationals at Twickenham.
@mefty attendance was 26,000 not bad. They only offer the lower tier for sale. There would be a better atmosphere in a smaller stadium which is full but there aren't too many choices.
Only 26k? Jesus.
Its a long say from South Africa to support your team 😉
I follow Bath and Bristol
😯
That's the first time in 42 years that I've heard such blasphemy... ❓
Not born in the area then!
Correct not born there, went to Uni in Bristol at the time Stuart Barnes was in the club side. I did say follow rather than support. We used to go to watch Bristol, Bath and occasionally Gloucester.
It shows how far Rugby has come that I am disappointed with a 26,000, but when Sarrries manage to get over 80,000 for a premiership game (albeit with a long run up), there must be a way to get a bigger crowd for such a big game.
Apparently the RFU encourage the London clubs to use Twickenham for big games to keep the stadium fee money inside the game.
Did you not stick out for having two eyes and just the 10 fingers?
It shows how far Rugby has come that I am disappointed with a 26,000, but when Sarrries manage to get over 80,000 for a premiership game (albeit with a long run up), there must be a way to get a bigger crowd for such a big game.Apparently the RFU encourage the London clubs to use Twickenham for big games to keep the stadium fee money inside the game.
Saracens ended up giving free tickets away for the game with 80,000. The stadium was also a lot more empty then 80,000 would suggest and the count was given from the 'sold' (given away) tickets.
Fair play to Saracens though, they took their chance well and even if the ref was a bit in their favour, they made sure it was well capitalised upon.
* High-sixes duck man *
Did you not stick out for having two eyes and just the 10 fingers?
I can't read and I can't wrrrite but that dont really matterrr, 'cause I com from the West Country and I can drive a tracterrr
Good luck to the Munster men today DD. Do the 6N holders proud.
A last chance to see JW in Cardiff, Allez les Toulonaise
[i]The pitch is perfect, the weather ideal[/i]
[url= http://livescore.planetrugby.com/temp/commentary.php?matchId=7146512#.U10Vv2t5mSM ]live commentary[/url]
Tickets bought, Cardiff here we come, hopefully bring the bike and do some riding as well. Bank Holiday weekend.
Arse biscuits! Oh well...another bloody semi-final loss in France. Toulon were the better side for most of the game and fair play to them. At least Munster crossed their line and once again can go home with their heads held high. Two sides for whom I have little regard in the final. I'd have to hope Toulon would win as I'd hate to see Farrell have any kind of medal hanging round his neck.
@dd it was a high pressure game, evenly matched I thought. I am all for ref's making decisions but surprised Barnes didn't go to the video for the Toulon "try". Don't agree with the balls out kick to the corner, take the 3 and then press again as Toulon know they cannot give away another kick.
Right off for a quick ride with a smile on my face.
Dunno DD,Sarries were more awesum than surf matt yesterday. Boxfish; you owe me a keyboard! 😀
I couldn't care less who wins it duckie...I'm only saying who I'd rather see lift the trophy. Enjoyed the Toulon fans singing the Marseillaise with all of three Frenchmen on the pitch. 🙂
French regular season is done. Lots of tears as Perpignan went down, having lead against Clermont (a win woukd ended Clermont's stunning home win record) they lost and surprise wins eleshwhere sent them down. Biarritz have been dead for a while and finished 20 points adrift. Hard to believe I saw them in the H Cup at Quinns last season and not so long ago Perpignan at London Irish. Both clubs seem too strong to stay down.
Toulon finished top after having been as low as 5th, they've never won the Top 14 and with the H Cup final this may again elude them. Stade Francais slipped from 1st to 7th but will have a play off with WASPs for the new European Cup.
Still some quality rugby to go before the summer tours.
Well, we lost yesterday - a proper thumping from Tigers! Good day out though & the Tigers fans we met were great, lovely atmosphere.
Sale have signed Luke McLean from Treviso so I'm looking forward to the next season already, impatient to find out our European Cup ties so we can plan our French trip 🙂