[Closed] XTR vs XT vs the bastard offspring of shimano sram

I've never felt the performance benefit of a fancy derailleur, I'd go XTR shifter for all the lovely feel and that, and an SLX or even Deore mech, they've all got the same clutch mech anyway I think and I fancy Deore gives you a bit more material to bend back into shape when you inevitably whack it.

I may have misunderstood, but i didnt think you can mix Shimano and Sram shifters and mechs. I thought they had to be the same manufacturer due to the pull ratio.
Im happy to be wrong though.

The pull ratio is a bit of a funny way to look at it. The derailleur is "dumb", it's just a sprung parallelogram, all the indexing is really done at the shifter. However the derailleur needs Xmm of cable pulled/released to move from one gear to the next so you have to have a shifter that provides that exact amount. Use a shifter that moves a different amount of cable per shift and the derailleur will skip or miss-align gears.

SLX derailleurs are perfectly usable, no noticeable difference between them and XT. Combine that with the level of shifter of choice and it will be fine.

One thing I've found between SLX and XT mechs is that you can't take an SLX to bits to lube it, which I find needs doing once a year or so to get rid of creaks and squeaks and the SLX jocky wheels last about 2 minutes!

Ah yes, one thing I don't miss from shimano is disintegrating jockey wheels and cassettes but that's likely a whole different argument.

So seems functionally the mechs are about the same seems to be the consensus.

Re shimano and sram the 11speed pull is very very similar from one to the other, sufficiently so that plenty of folk have tried it and say it works but, what I've not managed to find is anyone saying how well it does or doesn't work, I was sort of hoping to hear from someone who is fussy to be honest!

one thing I don’t miss from shimano is disintegrating jockey wheels and cassettes

Never had either of those occur. The only rear mech failure I've ever had was an XT where the clutch mechanism jammed - as much my fault as I didn't maintain that bit and I suspect it would still be going strong as there was no play in the jockey arm and the cage moved freely. I thought it was Sram jockey wheels that were dodgy?

Couldn’t you just go sram gx 11 speed? I’ve got that on both my bikes and it just relentless works (once I swapped the jockeys to NX bushes ones). Think I paid about £70 for the mech / £80 for the cassette and about £25 for the shifter. Feels nicer than any of the shimano shifters I’ve tried (I’ve not tried any 12 speed drivetrains though at all).

gx 11 speed

I could I suppose but it just doesn't feel tarty enough to be honest. That's a big part of why I'm not running it single speed which I probably would if I could do without a tensioner but in this case won't be possible and tensioners are a bit, naff, really.

I'd go for XT rear mech over SLX just for the cartridge bearing jockey wheels, and in 11sp my personal preference is SLX shifters over XT as they have a much lighter release action (though if you get on well with Sram, you may prefer XT.)Not sure if you know, but higher end Shimano shifters have 2 way release, so you can operate them in a similar manner to Sram.

I had shimano XT 11 speed on the bike which I didn’t get on with, stiff lever & very long levers. Changed out for XO1 shifter & GX 11 speed which was great. The ebike is shimano 10 speed which I run with Saint shifter which is nice & just works. now gone 12 speed on other bike after got cheap XX1 shifter on eBay. Was running a Sunrace rear derailleur now an XX1 derailleur too.

Was running a Sunrace rear derailleur

Ohhh forgot about their more recent offerings. Will go take a look at those.

Long lever actually sounds good as it'll let me run things further inboard and I always seem to find my brake and shifter want to be in each other's way.

I didn't realise there was a lighter action on the slx, two way release was on my old shimano setup moons ago but something about the release lever just never worked for me like that, it was just in the wrong place really.

XT gives you 90% of the features & performance of XTR at 60% of the cost

SLX gives you 90% of the features & performance of XT  at 60% of the cost

laws of diminishing returns innit

SLX is where the bang 4 buck is just right

I’ve just swapped to an XTR shifter with XT mech from all XT, to be honest I only did it to be tarty and move from bar mount to iSpec so I could integrate the shifter with my Hope brakes (and I managed to get a used shifter off eBay nice and cheap).

There’s not a great deal in it in terms of the mechanical feel, however the body of the shifter does feel like it’s made from nicer particularly the carbon shift paddle. I certainly wouldn’t pay retail for the XTR over the XT but at second hand prices it’s a no brainer.

As far as mechs go, I’ve only got experience of the XT and I can’t fault it, I think (although not certain) that it plays better with bigger cassettes than the XTR.

Well it sounds like an xt mech at least is the sensible choice. I think I'll get one and try it with my Sram lever and see how it goes. Would be the perfect combination if it works and, if it doesn't play nice it's no great loss as I'll have to buy another shifter of some sort anyhow

Xtr shifter and Xt Mech is the sweet spot for me. Have Xtr Mech and shifter with SRAM cassette on two bikes, but theres no advantage over the Xtr/Xt mix.

XT gives you 90% of the features & performance of XTR at 60% of the cost

SLX gives you 90% of the features & performance of XT at 60% of the cost

laws of diminishing returns innit

SLX is where the bang 4 buck is just right

Very true expect when XT is only 10% more than SLX which it seems to be on 11sp at the moment.

Well in theory I've ended up with a sram setup having got a good price on a 2nd hand set, assuming it turns up of course

If it doesnt, I have a brand new(fitted but removed) 11 speed XTR shifter and SGS XT rear derailleur somewhere.

Ended up going Eagle 12s although I do miss the finger shift.

Ah yes, one thing I don’t miss from shimano is disintegrating jockey wheels and cassettes

Is this even "a thing"?  It's the first I've ever heard of it.

I don't think 11sp XTR is worth the extra over XT in terms of functionality or even tartiness if I'm honest, even the shifter that used to be an effortless thing of joy became a little too similar in action to XT to be noticeable by most folk. I completely get that the R is totally worth it to some "just because" and you'll get no argument from me about that, but if it's a cheap build, then XT is more than good enough, and reasonable in price to be justifiable

XTR shifter and XT for me. Had all XT in the Jekyll and the XTR shifter on the Cannondale rigid and the XTR just felt nicer.

To confuse things even more... The 12s Shimano stuff works with 11/12s SRAM stuff.

The Shimano pull ratio changed to 1.12 from 1.4 for 12s and the SRAM 11/12s pull ratio is 1.1.

Is this even “a thing”? It’s the first I’ve ever heard of it.

Disintegrate may be a bad choice of word. Short lived would be better. My experience of shimano jockey wheels and cassettes is they wear very quickly. I've put several 000s of miles over 6 years on an xg1195 and it's just started to get sluggish by comparison.

Don't know about Shimano cassettes as I've moved to Sunrace, primarily because there's better steps *for me* between ratios.

All our MTBs (we've six between us) use Shimano rear mechs and I've replaced just one set of jockey wheels and that was as much because I wanted a bit of bling and just added a set of Hope jockey wheels to a CRC order. The originals were slightly worn but still functional.