[Closed] Where have all the singlespeeds gone?

What am I missing?

A chain tensioner so you can open up your options.

Drop them a query at Singlebe?I have no idea how much their custom framesets are but...

[url= https://www.konaworld.com/unit.cfm ]Kona Unit 2020[/url]

[url= https://www.konaworld.com/unit_x.cfm ]Kona Unit X 2020[/url]

What am I missing?

Just how much modern geometry, dropper posts, grippy tyres and 1x groupsets have opened up the possibilities for most Mountain Bikers...

Out of fashion I suppose, the hipsters have retreated to their converted transit vans and taken all the trendy form-over-function nonsense with them while they work out the next move.

Tensioner +1

It made naff all difference anyway, and now that everythings tubeless the dropout makes no odds as youre not having to take the wheel out every ride to fix punctures.

Sam at Singular was talking about a new swift with track ends, tapered headtube and modernised geometry a couple of years ago, but ive never seen one and the website says singular bikes have been sold.

Stooge?

But really, just get any off the shelf XC frame you like and fit a tensioner.

Out of fashion I suppose, the hipsters have retreated to their converted transit vans and taken all the trendy form-over-function nonsense with them while they work out the next move.

Fashion moved onto.........

Just how much modern geometry, dropper posts, grippy tyres and 1x groupsets have opened up the possibilities for most Mountain Bikers…

Although, you can have all that without the gears too.

None of the benefits (fitness, maintenance, cost, simplicity, silence, weight, handling) have gone away.

Sam at Singular was talking about a new swift with track ends, tapered headtube and modernised geometry a couple of years ago, but ive never seen one and the website says singular bikes have been sold

Where does it say that? All the front page says is..

We are working on a new batch of classic Singular steel frames – stay tuned.

http://www.singularcycles.com/about/

Last parahraph:

Singular is now under new ownership though continues to have Sam’s creative input. We seek to maintain and extend the legacy of the Singular brand by continuing to develop new and innovative bicycles.

And the shop link only shows a couple of Ti models?

I'd be interested to see what they do, but I've got a Scandal now so that's my hardtail itch scratched for a few years at least.

Singular, Stooge, Niner all do EBB frames, plus some Santa Cruz and Salsa frames have drop outs you can change for SS ones?

When was the height of the fashion (2005?) Not surprising there are not the choices 13 years later but as said above they still make sense but not enough sales to warrant everyone making them I suppose.

Specialised Fuse has modern geo and sliding dropouts.
(I’m assuming it’s available in the UK?)

2018 Units in XL size

https://shop.bikesandbuddies.co.uk/2018-unit-frame-fork.html

Stooge is a good shout, a surprisingly capable bike.

However I'd say that unless this is going to be your primary bike then just find any second hand XC 29er frame and build it up.

I was always a bit sceptical about singlespeed until I tried it - as @thisisnotaspoon says the benefits are surprising. Just very simple - ride until you can't! You soon learn how to carry speed and momentum because you have to 😉

Brother cycles Big Bro

To address some replies:

- tensioner. Nope. I want a SS not an unreliable bodge. They just don’t work as well as proper dropouts. It’s not a puncture issue either, I should be easy to tension, align brakes correctly without adjustment and never slip.
- modern geo/1x/dropper post. Got one of those thanks. And my SS is 1x1 with a dropper post 😉
- singular always had the head tube issue, really needs to take a taper steerer to fit most 100mm forks.

I’ll look at some of the options above. Custom is always an option but pretty spendy!

I should be easy to tension, align brakes correctly without adjustment and never slip.

Id argue that a sprung tensioner is actually the one tool free option that archives all of those. With the added benefit that they dont mess with the geometry. And reliability wise my sprung doofer has been on many bikes over many thousands of miles without so much as a bearing change, just works. Ive broken more swinging dropouts.....

They do look like a bodge though.

That Unit X looks awesome, but can’t see it available as a frameset?

Interested in this too. Weirdly, even the used market is pretty devoid of anything. I've had a few singlespeeds and always sold them and ended up regretting it but wanting another just as a bi-polar option to my Alpine.

How BIG do you need? I'm selling a Large Singular Rooster frameset soon which I run a SS, it has a tapered fork and runs 3" tyres.

Iscg or BB mounted lower roller guide works well. Leaves the back end to function as normal.

Size wise, XL or XXL in most stuff (I’m 6’4” and like bikes that fit. 23” seat tube on my current SS). A large rooster is too small.

I’ve had SS with tensioners in the past, and run bikes with various front rollers/guides. All at some point cause issues, proper sliders never have for me in years. I have horizontal with tugs on the commuter, and that’s more of a faff.

The Brother Big Bro is looking the best option so far. Annoyingly looks like thru axle only but they used to be QR so can maybe get some dropouts. Or I can convert my hubs (some nice american classics).

Remember as well that any frame that uses BB30 or PF30 bottom brackets, there are adaptors to turn them into an EBB..

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Bicycle-Bottom-Bracket-Adaptor-PressFit-30-Frame-Eccentric-8mm-for-SHIMANO-Sram/283289140475?hash=item41f5593cfb:m:mVoGvoT5BVWyQPb8ISx-lbg&var=584153833412

If you cant wait for the new Swifts, actionsports have discounted XL Puffin mk2 frames with EBB for £380. Forks are £100. You’d need new hubs (170/135) though, but have massive clearances, or run it 29+, especially as your 6’4” and should manage supersize tyres. Tapered headtube. 100 bb.

Cleaned and greased, never heard a peep out of my EBB in 2-3 years my swift’s been ss and geared.

A Niner Biocentric 30 Bottom Bracket will convert ANY PF30 frame into a singlespeed by turning the 30mm BB into a 24mm EBB.

I've been using one for 5 years to run an Alfine 11 on a Niner RLT9 frame.

No creaking either as the BB halfs are bolted together.

I chuffing hate sliding dropouts. You constantly have to adjust the wheel to adjust for chain stretch and the disc always seems to end up out of allignment. Even using Surly tug-nuts its a faff.

Speaking generally, i think the EBB also gives alot of weld area for tubes and the insert with the big diameter steel EBB tube gives a stiffer bb area than you might otherwise get.

I run my Trek Stache as a SS. There’s enough adjustment in the drop outs, and huge amounts of mud clearance for this time of year. It’s still one of my favourite bikes. 🙂

I just fitted the Problem Solvers version of the PF30 EBB. Seems great and isn't really a pushfit as it just clamps between the BB faces. However, if you have a carbon frame, rotate the BB so it tensions as the twin bolts are at the bottom of the BB shell, it sounds as though you should not clamp where the downtube/seattube holes are made in the BB shell as there is less material.

I ended up getting a Vassago Verhauen, True Temper platinum tubing/Paragon sliders/70 degree head angle, it’s rocket but it was VERY spendy, £1300ish frame only

The Problem Solvers EBB is great - been using one for a few years on my custom Kite.

New Ti Pegasus is really very nice - oversize headtube, 142mm rear end, internal routing for dropper and a Bushnell EBB.

Don't know what the timeframes are for the steel Swift, but imagine they'll be done in small runs rather than a big container load.

Shand Bahookie with EBB?  Available in XL.  Normally they are boost but you could probably ask for non-boost as they seem to do that on the rohloff versions

Shand is a PF30 BB shell, not EBB. Problem Solvers or Wheels Manufacturing PF30 eccentric required, no bad thing seeing the amount of swearing directed at true EBBs in the past 🙂

P.S I'm one ride in and the Bahookie is a hoot 🙂

[url= https://i.ibb.co/kG9XYcL/IMG-20191230-110937.jp g" target="_blank">https://i.ibb.co/kG9XYcL/IMG-20191230-110937.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

Pivot LES 29er?

I used to have one I ran singlespeed, it was a fantastic bike!

Got a 2Souls Quarterhorse singlespeed doing nothing if anyone is interested?
Chris King hubs/headset,Fox 34 and dropper post.
Great bike, just that I'm far to old and unfit to ever ride singlespeed again.
PM me if anyone is interested in it as it's just been hanging up in the front room for a while now...

[url= https://live.staticflickr.com/7537/16066635358_9e99c45266_c.jp g" target="_blank">https://live.staticflickr.com/7537/16066635358_9e99c45266_c.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/qtKGWs ]2Souls[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/photos/stu-b/ ]multispeedstu[/url], on Flickr

Shand is a PF30 BB shell, not EBB

Then I misunderstood what EBB means.  The singlespeed Bahookie does indeed use an eccentric bottom bracket but maybe that isn't the same an an EBB.

edit: just checked on their site and they say PF30 EBB so maybe we are both correct

P.S I’m one ride in and the Bahookie is a hoot 🙂

Bahootie?

Stanton's (e.g. Sherpa) have replaceable dropouts - you can get it with a sliding dropout.

@leffeboy - Eccentric Bottom Bracket??

O-O Scandal with tensioner here - cheap as Nachos and lightweight, though not to spec, I realise.

Stantons are horizontal dropouts not sliders. I think some people are misunderstanding the distinction. I want nuts and tensioning screw not just a slot.

Shand is not a bad shout if I’m feeling spendy. Though once I’m up near custom frame money my problem’s a different one, it’s one of choice isn’t it?

I’d discounted the various PF to EBB type adapters as a bodge, but maybe I should reconsider? Might open up the possibility of something quite light & spanky and properly XC...

Leffeboy, an EBB is a different size shell, and the bottom bracket expands to clamp inside the shell at the correct location. Can be problems with them creaking or seizing, slipping, or distorting/stretching the shell. (Never used one but have stood by several times whilst spanners, abuse and rocks have been used)

The PF30 eccentric conversion fits in a pushfit BB shell, I think it has a bit more adjustment, and it clamps between the faces of the BB so less likely to slip or creak. Problem Solvers and Wheels Manufacturing include the bearings so the cranks just slot straight in, I think the Niner Biocentric 30 rotates but you screw a normal BB into it.

Indy Fab steel or Ti deluxe - custom.
I have a steel one with original rigid steel fork - the base for a long-running build project; bought frame/fork here 2+ years ago.
Have had it tweaked by Argos in Bristol - and re-sprayed by them.
Will post some pics when IO get to next stage.

I've just built a 2Souls Quarterhorse as a SS and I am very impressed.

Sliding drop outs, 142 mm on mine.

Leffeboy, an EBB is a different size shell, and the bottom bracket expands to clamp inside the shell at the correct location. Can be problems with them creaking or seizing, slipping, or distorting/stretching the shell. (Never used one but have stood by several times whilst spanners, abuse and rocks have been used)

I think your missing a few options there. And they're all called EBB. "EBB" covers a whole plethora of options.

Phill wood (and later tiawanese versions) were just a cylyndrical sleeve in the BB shell with an eccentric BB. They could be locked in position either by grub screws or by the shell having a slot cut in it and clamping bolts.

Bushnell had a similar (and compattible?) One that had bolts running axially through the BB that drove an expanding wedge, a bit like an old quill stem. Dunno if they were all Bushnell or if companies just copied them.

Then theres the PF30 addapters that just rely on clamping force and friction with the end of the shell as you describe.

Then there's ecentriker and similar which are kinda like the BSA version of those PF30 addapters.

And probably more.

Ive had most of them at some point! All will probably creak if installed badly. Although touch wood ive never had one creak or slip that wasnt quickly solved with a smear of copper grease. Id suggest if its been fixed with the aid of a rock then its user error 😂

Most give the required ~13mm of adjustment. Some are limited to about half that, some limit it to save weight (probably halving it, its a big old lump of aluminium) and therefore require a half link or being less picky about ratios, others do the same due to limitations on the BB size.

I shouldn't have clicked on that Kona link, the new Shonky looks ace 😎

https://www.bikeperfect.com/news/pivot-revives-the-carbon-singlespeed-hardtail

– tensioner. Nope. I want a SS not an unreliable bodge. They just don’t work as well as proper dropouts.

I rode SS exclusively for nearly 2.5 years with a sprung rolhoff tensioner and it never missed a beat. Unlike my sliding drop out chums, who were either faffing about with the correct chain tension, dropping chains due to incorrect chain tension or slipping dropouts, or desperately trying to orient each side of the hub so the wheel wasn't on the squiff and rubbing the rear disc brake.

Leffeboy, an EBB is a different size shell, and the bottom bracket expands to clamp inside the shell at the correct location.

EBB means what it says - eccentric bottom bracket, where the spindle is off-centre, allowing chain tension to be set by rotating the BB. Some might be held in place by lock bolts, some by expanders, and some, like the Sanderson below, by lock rings. Older designs required a specific bespoke frame, but the arrival of pressfit BBs has allowed EBBs to be made that will fit in any frame with the larger diameter that pressfit requires.

I rode SS exclusively for nearly 2.5 years with a sprung rolhoff tensioner and it never missed a beat. Unlike my sliding drop out chums, who were either faffing about with the correct chain tension, dropping chains due to incorrect chain tension or slipping dropouts, or desperately trying to orient each side of the hub so the wheel wasn’t on the squiff and rubbing the rear disc brake.

🙂

I must say as somewhat of a diehard SS fan the thought of using a tensioner does not appeal.

That said I ran a Rohloff one years ago and have just gone back to one on a build and must agree with the above that of all my current SS builds the Rohloff is the least “faffy” in wheel fitting and correcting chain growth - the spring is also frightening strong - watch your fingers kids!

That all said I’m going with a custom SS frame at the moment and that will have an EBB but one similar to a Niner rather than the likes of my Singular with two pinch bolts

Bushnell had a similar (and compattible?) One that had bolts running axially through the BB that drove an expanding wedge, a bit like an old quill stem. Dunno if they were all Bushnell or if companies just copied them.

My Cannondale 1FG had one of these. Was a pain to release (required a hammer) but once set it didn't budge at all.

ISCG doofer as a tensioner on my bike-

[img] [/img]

It's loads easier to drop the wheel out if I want/need to. Slotted dropouts are a PITA.

Slotted dropouts are a PITA.

I agree, I don’t want those!

I get there are some tensioners that are probably ok, but better than a tensioner is no tensioner. Current frame (voodoo Bokor from 8 years ago) has sliders that also move the disk mount, never any bother at all ever. Easy to remove the wheel, takes about 20 seconds to tweak the tension to adjust for chain wear when needed, and 10 of those are flipping the bike.

What you want is s Stooge.

If the current Mk4 isn’t what your after then a second hand one will be the right tool for the job. Yes they are rigid but my MK3 has a tapered head tube so can run modern suspension forks. I ran mine with 120mm bounce, it was far more capable than me, until I went to the rigid forks.

If you are spendy then Mr Andy Stooge will build you a custom Ti one with your exact requirements.

The EEB on my Stooge hasn’t creaked, groaned or slipped. Same as the one on the Sanderson Soloist I had before. Nearly every issue with EBB is user error.

https://www.bikeperfect.com/news/pivot-revives-the-carbon-singlespeed-hardtail/blockquote >

Lovely, but how much!?!

 

Beard & sandals alive & well here.
SIR.9 with the Niner biocentric EBB.
Puffin with the Singular pinch bolt EBB.

Of the two, the Singular has been rock solid, never creaked or moved.
The Niner has creaked & clicked from day one, wether greased, dry, talcum powdered (yes!!), carbon assembly grease seems to work though.
It is the earlier biocentric though, I gather the latter double bolt version is better.

What you want is s Stooge

Nah, i want spanky fast rather than “capable” and also “one size fits all” will never be right for me - I’m in the 99th percentile for height. From a quick look at the geo chart I’d be on a stem the wrong side of 100mm to make that fit right I reckon, and suspect end up sat somewhere odd with a long enough post.

Thanks to those clearing up EBB confusion, I though EBB was a standard but it sounds like it covers a range of methods to allow an bottom bracket to move 🙂

I’ve got a Pivot Les. Really nice xc bike which I’ll be racing tomorrow actually. The Swinger dropout system is beautifully made and the really cool thing about it is that there is enough adjustment that I can run a 15T to 22T sprocket on the back without having to change the chain length. With a 38T chainring I can easily choose a nice gear for the occasion with the sprocket change taking a couple of mins.
Picked up a whole bike for £1200 secondhand which is good as it’s a pricy frame.

Picked up a whole bike for £1200 secondhand which is good as it’s a pricy frame.

Yep. £2300 for a carbon hardtail frame is certainly that.

I like to see these SS threads popping up from time to time, good to know some interest is still alive.

I was on SS exclusively from 2008 to around 2012. It was a combination of factors for me:
- I was a poor student
- I hated front derailleurs to my guts
- I tried a 29er and loved it
- xc/trailish suspension forks back then were, imo, cr@p

Circa '08 or '09, if you shared any of these conditions and spent too much time at the MTBR forums there was only one type of bike to have, a 29er SS steel rigid.
This fad was interesting as it arose from enthusiast interest rather than marketing.

I built myself a nice Singular Swift, one of the very first blue SS specific ones. It was a beautiful, elegant, efficient and comfortable bike. Back then fun for me was more akin to cram 2000m of gain in 50km than doing some road gap or hitting that rock garden at 40m/h.

The biggest issue for me with SS is that in order for it to be fun I needed to stay in great shape. I started back then to do other competitive sports and going back on the bike became a chore.

Fast forward to the last couple of years and 1x drivetrains are worlds better. And forks are unbelievable good. And now you have what's essentially a shorter travel DH bike that's reliable, comfortable and fun up and down. And along the definition of MTB fun shifts with it.
Sometimes I miss riding SS, but can't really see the point anymore.

Talking to other people I heard this pattern several times. I guess SS was somewhat of a "protest" against the crappy bikes and components we were offered back then

No protest for me. Made sense to have one gear 20 years ago and still makes sense today. The places I ride haven't changed.

I generalised a bit because that's a story I heard several times.

But I'm sure it's still making plenty of people happy

Didn’t someone make an EBB for normal threaded BB shells? Probably spendy though, and if memory serves it needed a half link in the chain.

Edit: These

I loved my Mk2 Scandal and I'm sure the new Mk3 (?) would be fab.
I went for a Stache frame in the end as Stif had sold out of Chameleons. I'm very happy with my Stache, but would probably be just as happy with the Chameleon. Another one worth a look is the Specialized Fuze / Fuse, which looks really well executed. Bear in mind these are all a bit mainstream if you've got a real singlespeed niche thing going on. 😉
I've owned a Singular Hummingbird in the past (I'm too little to fit one of Sam's Swifts) and it is / was a simply perfect frame if you want to go 26" wheels.
It's probably worth bearing in mind that the current geo thinking probably works really well for singlespeed use, so don't discount something that takes longer forks at the front; I'm running 130mm Fox 34s on the Stache and it's an absolute hoot; I have a pair of Genesis carbon rigids in the shed that need a bit of a tweak before they'll fit, but would turn it into a really stupid XC pain machine that'll likely kill off my blobby old fat bloke a**e these days. Looking at what you're asking for, I suspect the Chameleon might actually be quite a fun option - it's quite a bit longerer for each size than the equivalent Stache. There's a crabon option too, I think.

I built up a cheap single speed with bits and pieces that I had in the garage. I bought a second hand Voodoo Bizango 29 frame and stuck all the bits on it .

I love riding it as it makes you fitter and faster. I hold my PB’s on Twrch (54 mins) and Cafall (1hr 1 min) on this bike , it’s quicker than my old Stumpjumper and my Signal Ti. On the ups anyway! Oh and it has sliding drop outs. If you don’t care about the image it’s a great bike.

, I suspect the Chameleon might actually be quite a fun option

They come in big enough sizes, but it’s not an XC bike really. I’m sure I’d like how it rides well enough but it’s not what I want for my SS. I like something a bit fast and dangerous that feels like it might have me if I’m not paying attention. Doesn’t need to be “capable” for big rough stuff etc, it’s for hacking round the woods.

If you don’t care about the image it’s a great bike.

For sure, my current frame is a voodoo, but it’s had a lot of use over many years and is getting pretty tired. Already had the bottle bosses come loose three times and next stage will require drilling them out to attempt to replace them which might end in tears, hence looking at options.

Surly Tensioner all day long...
had a Cannondale 29er SS & from day one the BB creaked, tried everything. Ended up locktite into place... & then surly tensioner, never missed a beat (just had to buy a new dropout (eBay) no more creaks... but it was a Cannondale I suppose.

Not all EBBs are the same. Yes a Cannondale EBB can be a bit creaky, but a Bushnell isn't.
I would rather spend the money on a Bushnell than have a chain tensioner personally as part of the appeal of single speed to me is the clean looking bike. A tensioner just looks like a bodge to me (however well they work)
The simplest solution is track ends but they admittedly become a pain when using discs.

My mate has built a Tarn up SS this winter and he's enjoying the challenge.

I would have another if I had more space for an extra bike, because it felt like a big BMX and made me smile. But there was no getting away from the fact that round here in Calderdale it wasn't great for group riding. As the only SS rider the climbs were a lonely place where everybody else chatted and I heaved.

Kona Raijin? Spendy, but very nice. Has your preferred dropouts, non-Boost spacing and traditional XC geo:

https://shop.bikesandbuddies.co.uk/kona-explosif-ti-frame.html?id=87980210&quantity=1

https://2017.konaworld.com/raijin_frame.cfm

Ah wrong link in my last post: https://shop.bikesandbuddies.co.uk/kona-raijin-ti-frame.html

My first SS

Having received the Onion back after its extended loan, I thought I'd try to make some use of it.

Cheapo ring and SS kit and I have a gadabout. Still want some rigid forks for it, and probably flatter bars.

I have some Ice tyres ready to fit fior the forthcoming snowpocalypse too.

Chain tensioner works for me. Had to cut a notch out to clear the drop outs on my Titus fire line. I've run this set up for a couple of years now without issues.

Love riding ss in the winter mud. Low maintenance don't have to worry about mech getting torn off etc. Need to maintain fitness to get up the steeper hills around here but great for messing around in the woods.

Tried an ebb on a payoff and didnt have much luck. It kept slipping so I switched to a modified tensioner. There are no bolts on the shell to clamp it in place. I get the best results from the gusset tensioners.

Scotroutes I forgot all about your tensioner!

I do have some carbon onone forks though alloy crown jobs.

Scotroutes I forgot all about your tensioner!

I do have some carbon onone forks though alloy crown jobs.

Nae probs. This is a cheapie off Amazon.

Forks - do you think for one moment I'd put a set of On One forks near my precious?

Arranged the EBB on my Swift when it was SS, so that any slippage moves the axis of the BB away from the rear wheel - so increasing chain tension as it tries to revolve. You can put it between 9-12 or 3-6 position. I like a low BB and a high STA so put it 3-6 position as you look at it side on non drive side. Can't say I ever had any movement, creek or trouble with, though I did take it out, clean it all and smear it with that blue Mobil grease before I ever used it in anger. I think its a Phill Wood one in there that Singular uses. Also used it with Race Face Atlas cranks which with a heat treated steel axle were mighty stiff in the BB like I've never felt before or since. Maybe that helped. Certainly helped with the mashing uphill!

Forks – do you think for one moment I’d put a set of On One forks near my precious?

I did think that for a second but I did notice you were looking on bear bones and they're basically exotics with removable stickers 😀