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Until yesterday i'd never really attempted to build a straight pull hub wheel, something always put me off with the talk of the hassle, but have to say, quite possibly the easiest wheelbuild i've ever had, used squorx nipples as they are just so easy to adjust with the tool, must have saved me half the hassle and a quarter of the time.
Is SP the best way forward, or was this just a fluke!
Pay someone else to do it 😆
^ That
Straight pull is nice to build with but still basically shite. Solves a problem that doesn't exist, is harder to find in the shops, and most SP hubs have small flanges which... ah... OK, actually doesn't really matter except for marketeers, really, but in this strange new world of boost hubs with 0.1% more triangulation to make a .01% stiffer wheel, it's even weirder to be speccing hubs that have less.
Mostly it's just about availability though. Every bike shop in the world will be able to provide J spokes in common sizes. When I broke a spoke in fort william, I went round every shop within miles, including a trip to laggan, and one shop had any straightpulls at all, let alone the right size.
I like to build with- proper normal spokes, proper normal nipples, no weird standards or incompatibilities or special tools or washers or anything that isn't a spoke or a nipple.
Same as northwind.
I'll add i like to build them cheeeeeap 😁.
ACI double butted for life.
As for Northwind and joshvegas.
I have a joggle tool which allows me to cut spokes to size if necessary. Joggled spoke heads do look odd though, so I prefer not to use it.
As for the optimum number of spokes per wheel, I was brought up on 40 spokes for the rear wheel and 32 for the front.
These days hub choices tend to be 36 or 32 hole or less. With modern rims I have a preference for 36 hole wheels, and will build a 32 only if there's no other choice.
Quite happy to accept less spokes will build a strong enough wheel, but I haven't had a broken spoke for decades doing it that way.
Double butted, DTSwiss spokes for me. I'd like to get my hands on some 12 gauge though. My 1932 Sunbeam RR wheels still sing after 88 years.
Ah, i'm quite lucky that i can get access to the spokes, etc quite easily, just found no real faff, just put them in the hub, line up the gap, nipples on and it's all but done, it's almost impossible to go wrong with the pattern due to the way the SP hubs are lined up.
Usually 3 cross interlaced. Maybe 2 cross if small wheel super high flange.
Got to say I am a fan of 36 spokes too, usually minimum extra weight for good strength gain.
Prefer brass to ALU nipples bit do quite like a bit of colour..
32 spoke 3 cross here. Never had to desire to build up a straight pull wheel. J spokes are more readily available. Brass nipples too.
Mostly it’s just about availability though.
Surely the answer to that is buy a couple extra in each length?
I used to like a good snowflake but apparently it is a term of ridicule these days ❄️
Surely the answer to that is buy a couple extra in each length?
I have a draw full of spare spokes for wheels I no longer own!
I used to carry spare Spinergy Spox spokes in my saddle bag as they folded up small. Never broke one mind....
3 cross J bend ACI normally.
my style is build the front first, in a 'not built a wheel for a few years and it's a bit vague' manner, that way the front, which I'm always lighter on is acceptable, where by then I've re-honed my skillz enough to build a good rear wheel.
Normally 32 spoke 3 cross double butted with brass nips.
Just built a set with 28 spoke 2 cross
Pretty much as per Northwind and the rest - ACI DB silver/3 cross/jbend/brass nipples.
32 spoke, 3x, j-bend. As everyone else has said it's nice to be able to get spares almost anywhere and generally they're the most commonly available rims.
Ive got a radial front on my road bike, and the rear is 2x 28, but they were an exercise in how light could I build a wheel.
And my cross bike is 28h, but only because I got some Stans Crest rims ludicrously cheap so didn't care about strength or longevity.
This thread has actually been really helpful as I’d been debating my first wheel build hub choice.
Ta
Epicyclo what does your joggler tool look like?
Epicyclo what does your joggler tool look like?
You can buy modern ones like this
https://www.wheelfanatyk.com/blog/z-spokes/
Ben Cooper cut down a load of spokes for me with his rather beautiful spoke cutter and threader machine, it was almost worth buying the wrong spokes just for that. But then I think it cost more than the bike I was building the wheels for.
Ah that sounds like a philwood tool northwind.
Big crank that cuts it the lifts it into the rolling mechanism?
Ah that sounds like a philwood tool northwind.
Ben has a Morizumi, Big Al has a Phil wood (or 2).
I love using my spoke machine, so satisfying, and perfect spoke lengths for builds whenever you need them.
Epicyclo what does your joggler tool look like?
@joshvegas like the one bigyan shows.
I've also got a spoke threader I bought when the old guys in Munros in Baron Taylor Lane, Inverness, retired and closed down in the 1960s, so it's probably well over 100 years old. It's a bit blunt now. 🙂
I'm getting one.
17quid.
Got a few oddball wheels to build that prettiness is not an issue and oh so many misordered spokes:-D
Always fancied a threader too. Then just bulk buy a bunch of longuns.
He doesn't appear to sell them but it looks very similar to this one:
https://www.rcworld.co.uk/acatalog/Irvine-Super-Z-Bend-Plier-with-Nav-Pin-T_ZB01.html#SID=557
Yeah thats the set i found.
Bought them.
Anyone want shonky spokes?
They arrived.
A quick trial run left me with a nice joggle at one end....
... and a j-bend at the other with a nice bit of thread on the floor.
For gravel and road with discs, 28h 2x. For road non-disc, front radial, rear radial on the NDS and 2x DS.
For MTB, either 28 or 32 (carbon, vs Alu) and 3x.
As for spokes, CX-rays for road/gravel, D-lights for MTB.
I’m a big fan of Sapim Polyax aluminium nipples. 3 years and seemingly no degradation.
Rim - where possible carbon rims from Nextie and LB, not a fan of Stan’s.
My latest set:
3x 32H j bend, I really don't see the point in semi radial etc saves a few grams at best. Have used 2x when I didn't have the right length spokes.
Always looks daft to me! Sorry!
Don't apologise. You're wrong, but don't apologise for it 🙂
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I'll admit that it has it's place.
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I don't mind a radial on the right wheel.
I have just realised i have opened up a whole range of weird patterns.
3 cross J-bend 32h for me. I only build for myself so its not often and I always have to go and refresh my memory for key spoke placement, lacing, etc... so my builds are measured and steady.
Some logic as others on kit - standard kit is available everywhere, including the initial purchase of hubs.
@Daffy regular radial is a bit "look at me" without showing much creativity or skill, this is more like it:
https://minortriad.com/wheel.html
I've done a couple of offset/radial builds which are fun with the right hub (too lazy to take a pic in the shed just now).
I always understood that radial builds need hubs specifically designed for it as it puts stress onto the flange at a significantly different angle (it's not braced by the opposing spoke). Danger of breaking the flange...
But generally - 32 spoke, 3 cross, double butted spokes, eyeletted rims, brass nipples
@tim - That’s right, not all hubs can be laced radially. It’s also true that some hubs are better for 2X than others. Generally a large flange diameter on the hub will lead to 2x being as stiff as a 3x but allow better spoke tension between opposite sides of the wheel.