[Closed] What steel roadbike frame

I'd like a happy medium.

Get a Defy and lower the stem if necessary, I severely doubt that it won't go low enough for you.

Quite surprised to see you wanting to spunk £700 on a road F&F when you're usually so proud of your miserly ways when it comes to MTBs!

Mountain bikes see waaay too much slop-gritstone and stone strikes 8)

Buy it and get out and ride. http://www.shinybikes.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=11634&language=en&currency=GBP&gclid=CjwKEAiAmOymBRD0_evS4aTh2hUSJAB7Fkhym1TbWCeRBH_X3kofvj3BhItsul_Zgbiq30xXbHKAcBoCl8nw_wcB

There aren't two definitive sets of geometry right? Just like on a mountain bike - all the manufacturers dont use all the same angles with the same lengths. There are different styles within. I'd like a happy medium.

Again that'd be the Defy/Synapse/Roubaix, halfway between the race bikes and the audax bikes.

Pretty much all race bikes will handle much the same.
Pretty much all sportive bikes will be slightly longer CS/slacker HA /taller HT.

I think you're obsessing over details which will make a very minor differences to the actual ride. A steel bike (probably) wont be stiffer than the PX up front, but will have that intangible astetic that the PX doesn't and maybe you'll like it and ride it more and forgive it's handling as character rather than a cheap carbon comprimise. Or you could just buy a Defy/Synapse or TCR/Supersix depending on what [b]FITS[/b], they'll all be stiff and comfortable in all the right places, then just ride it! It will probably be better in every way appart from not being steel. On the other hand if the bike being steel and comfortable are the defining factors then what you want is an audax bike, bikes which a lot of people do a lot more miles with a lot more speed than you, it's not about the bike.

On the other hand if the bike being steel and comfortable are the defining factors then what you want is an audax bike,

This.
Get whatever you can afford and fits best then ride it forever.

I went from a race geometry alu frame to a cheap steel audax frame. It's mostly as quick, more comfy and does me fine for miles of riding. I'm not racing it, I don't bother taking the guards off in the summer, it hasn't got any fancy kit on it. But it's fine.

(that's not to say I wouldn't want a nicer one though - skinnymalinky or similar 😉 )

Genesis Equilibrium rides nice and I would guess weights 2.1kg.

Hora I have FOR SALE a very rare Sintesi Pegaso 58cm in good condition, 1.55kg, one of (if not the) lightest steel production frame(s) ever made.

(I take it you don't want the Supersix then? 😛 )

I just did a quick edit for you Spoonie 😉

[s]Pretty much all race bikes will handle much the same.
Pretty much all sportive bikes will be slightly longer CS/slacker HA /taller HT.[/s]

[b]I think you're obsessing over details which will make a very minor differences to the actual ride[/b]. [s]A steel bike (probably) wont be stiffer than the PX up front, but will have that intangible astetic that the PX doesn't and maybe you'll like it and ride it more and forgive it's handling as character rather than a cheap carbon comprimise. Or you could just buy a Defy/Synapse or TCR/Supersix depending on what FITS, they'll all be stiff and comfortable in all the right places, then just ride it! It will probably be better in every way appart from not being steel. On the other hand if the bike being steel and comfortable are the defining factors then what you want is an audax bike, bikes which a lot of people do a lot more miles with a lot more speed than you,[/s] [b]it's not about the bike[/b].

Does the new defy disc still take mud guards?

Ok, a shortlist of two so far:

Ritchey Logic 2.0
Enigma Ezona

Possibly the Condor but its an outside third.

🙂

Does the new defy disc still take mud guards?

You can however fit two Genetic Carbon Micro Fenders 8) . Mine wears the SKS Raceblade Long fitting brackets all year round. But then it is caliper not disk.

[url= http://www.freeborn.co.uk/genesis-equilibrium-ti-frameset?gclid=CJOkutqK2sMCFSbHtAod3CEArA ]Genesis Equilibrium ti for £1099[/url]

Honestly, if you're going to spend £750 on a steel frame, spend a few hundred more on a titanium one.

Both the Ritchey and the Enigma are nice but they are both still just mass produced in Taiwan steel frames. You're paying a premium for both because of the name on the down tube. Unless you're also getting great service, such as a professional fitting, bike buil or convenience of them being on your doorstep, I think you're paying a lot for the name.

I don't think there is anything wrong with that mind so this is not meant as a criticism.

The Enigma I'd handmade here.

Unsure about the Richey.

I had an older Ritchey, it is nice, but so is any 1.8kg steel frame.

I've ridden ti also and prefer modern steel for a road bike (OS ti feels dead to me).

If the Ritchey is anything like my P-650b then it'll be made in Taiwan. Blooming lovely though.

Rourke custom framesets start at £865. I'd be scraping the extra pennies together...

lightish - not something thats getting on for a mountain bike steel frame weight

You forgotten this bit then of your OP then 😆

I don't know why you're bothering.

He won't listen you know.

'Defy. Like what a mtb-er would choose.' WTF?

I'm not going custom. Bad enough choosing between colours.

For ****s sake. How the **** do I decide between the two?

The Enigma I'd handmade here.

I was going to question this as their Ti frames are made in Taiwan unless you specify a full custom build, which then attracts a premium. But checking their webstie confirms you're right. Not that built in the UK makes any difference really.

Enigma then. Proper guards on that too.

hora - Member

I'm not going custom. Bad enough choosing between colours.

For * sake. How the * do I decide between the two?

Realise that there aren't huge differences, both are good bikes and you won't die even if you do choose the "wrong" one?

If its Brit-made it'll sway me (I've asked to clarify). If its not its a bun-fight.

Enigma framw only I think, a fork is extra. Ritchey is a frameset.

Look.

Promise us one thing.

If you buy an Enigma from Hailsham (or any other custom frame builder who has spent years perfecting his craft) and for whatever reason it doesn't suit YOU, PLEASE don't come dissing them on here, right.

Thank you.

http://cycletechreview.com/2013/reviews/ritchey-road-logic-review/

Promise us one thing.

If you buy an Enigma from Hailsham (or any other custom frame builder who has spent years perfecting his craft) and for whatever reason it doesn't suit YOU, PLEASE don't come dissing them on here, right.

Ok, but tbh the only 'bad' thing I've said about the PlanetX is the flex on the front but its stiffer on the rear.

I bought a Sanderson Life- beautiful ride. Its pretty hard to fault a half decent steel frame.

Just to echo some earlier comments I was in Condor a month or so ago looking at a steel bike to replace my Allez at some point before summer. The guy I spoke to was really helpful and knew his onions, based on that alone I know I'll be back there. It's a happy bonus that the bikes and deal offered on a full build were very competitive. Contrast that with my local roadie shop in Kingston who could not be less interested unless you've got very deep pockets indeed and god forbid if you turn up on an MTB.

Also the condor looks the nuts.

Enigma framw only I think, a fork is extra. Ritchey is a frameset.

The Ezona does include a fork.

MrSmith - Member
I’m done on this thread, i just want to see the final bike shot now.

hora ? final bike...

[url= http://aureliuscycles.com/ ]Winner of bike of the show[/url] at the Yorkshire Bike show 2014
Just remember if its not from Yorkshire its ................[img] ?v=1399038456[/img]

Its pretty hard to fault a half decent steel frame.

Maybe, but we know you'll manage it somehow.

😉

Awesome thread It's easy to slip into the misconception that riding bikes is simple and uncomplicated. This has reminded me of what a serious and exacting business it is. On the other hand, my total lack of discernment means I can simply just get on with riding… 😉

Realise that there aren't huge differences, both are good bikes and you won't die even if you do choose the "wrong" one?

Whichever one he buys, it'll be the "wrong" one. That is just the way it is.

I'm just building mine up!

[URL= http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w44/calumcalumcalum/2015-02-09%2016.46.10_zpsews8mwin.jp g" target="_blank">http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w44/calumcalumcalum/2015-02-09%2016.46.10_zpsews8mwin.jp g"/> [/IMG][/URL]

Calum that looks very promising.

One small point of advice. Order in a spare headset. The ones supplied are pretty rubbish and don't last long.

[/off topic]

I'm well aware.. this is actually getting rebuilt after a respray..

[URL= http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w44/calumcalumcalum/2015-02-08%2017.29.13_zpsb6osljpb.jp g" target="_blank">http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w44/calumcalumcalum/2015-02-08%2017.29.13_zpsb6osljpb.jp g"/> [/IMG][/URL]

New headset next to old...

[URL= http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w44/calumcalumcalum/2015-02-08%2017.28.03_zps6fbiphx2.jp g" target="_blank">http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w44/calumcalumcalum/2015-02-08%2017.28.03_zps6fbiphx2.jp g"/> [/IMG][/URL]

New headset in.

[URL= http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w44/calumcalumcalum/2015-02-08%2018.55.05_zps9xxi3cfx.jp g" target="_blank">http://i173.photobucket.com/albums/w44/calumcalumcalum/2015-02-08%2018.55.05_zps9xxi3cfx.jp g"/> [/IMG][/URL]

[off topic]

I was going to say, that doesn't look like a stock colour. Very nice it is though.

There's a wee new bike company called Rocketboy who are doing nice looking frames. Only has an alloy just now but carbon and steel models on the way I believe. Website ain't currently up to milch much the guy also knows his onions. On my wishlist one the steel appears For sure.

Another Condor Acciao for you all. Built last summer. Such a lovely ride although unsure if its the frame or hand built tubeless wheels that make it magic?

[img] [/img]

Seriously, the Leggero is even more comfortable than the Acciaio.

This thread does beg the question, if a steel frame will be so good, why did you sell one to get the PX. Odds are that with a 1.1/8 headtube and 27.2 seatpost it'll actualy be heavier than your old one.

As long as it fits ..

[img] [/img]

Thisnotaspoon. It was a check to see if I'd like road riding. Bought it did a 32mile skyride on it. It had a 6speed cassette 😀

Hora old chap, i don't know your timescale, but if not in a mad rush i would advise a trip to Bristol for the Bespoked Bike show.

You get multiple choices to empty your wallet and chat to the builders.

You can also quiz the tubing companies as they attened the show too, the man from Reynolds is very very helpfull.

In the greatest tradition of STW, posting what you have!.

I love my de rosa, very comfy, quick and nice to look at, IMO of course. (This is not mine btw, but v similar)

[img] [/img]

Also posting what I have, I wouldn't go back to carbon.

[url= https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5583/15248591146_4c6f404f01_h.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5583/15248591146_4c6f404f01_h.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/pet1TU ]20140917_160121[/url] by [url= https://www.flickr.com/people/27678965@N00/ ]Cheers Drive[/url], on Flickr

Is that bike easie to wheelie?

I can't wheelie a MTB let alone a road bike!
It's pointing slightly uphill and the flat TT makes the seat angle appear more relaxed.

i ended up with columbus sl and xcr, but at a somewhat inflated price ...
still, it is a dream to ride and brings back some fond memories 🙂

[URL= http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd230/glorfingal/20150202_084517.jp g" target="_blank">http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd230/glorfingal/20150202_084517.jp g"/> [/IMG][/URL]

Isn't that DeRosa Aliminium?

FWIW I am flogging my Sintesi because the ride is not as nice as my Six or Supersix (or previous Roubaix of CAAD10)

I think mrsmith means your saddle position? 😉

First Dibs On your ritchey please

Back to basics, my first road bike was a Genesis Equilibrium, which I really liked, but then I got a Condor Fratello which turned out to be soooooo much more comfortable.

The Genesis Equilibrium might not be as exclusive as some of the lovely bikes mentioned above, but it's a good example of what modern steel road frames can do. And, you'll have a reasonable chance of finding one second-hand, so you can try without losing too much (if at all) should you decide you need something more, or less, 'whatever'...

The Fratello is close to 2,000gm for a 58. Why does it have to be so heavy?

[img] [/img]

Rides like a dream and its aluminium (with a bit of berylium)

With your budget I'd be either going for a custom Steve Goff 853 or somewhere that does a comprehensive bike fit (Condor?) A bike that fits perfectly will make all the difference.

The Fratello is close to 2,000gm for a 58. Why does it have to be so heavy?

I have mentioned this already, but the Fratello is now made from the same tubeset as the significantly more expensive Enigma Ethos - tripple butted Columbus Life. That it is showing as weight 1.9kg versus the Enigma's 1.6kg should tell you that something is incorrect here.

The Fratello used to be made from Dedaccia tubing and the listing on Condor's website doesn't look to have changed other than reference to the tubset. I would not be surprised if it were a little lighter and they just haven't updated the listing.

Also, there are likely to be differences in what size was weighed - maybe they weighed a 58cm Fratello vs a 56cm Ethos. Maybe one was painted and the other wasn't or maybe both those things.

Either way, if it's the same size and the same tubeset, they really will most likely weigh the same when you get them home.

I second the Surly Pacer recommendation if you're on a budget. Absolutely love mine - but I might be selling it 🙁

I went down the Pro Carbon route, then sold the F&F and replaced with the Surly.

[url= https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7126/7459007864_7a8f070c9c_s.jp g" target="_blank">https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7126/7459007864_7a8f070c9c_s.jp g"/> [/img][/url][url= https://flic.kr/p/cn8naS ]Surly Pacer[/url] on Flickr

Irvb are saying is rubbish then ? 🙂

2000g is only 'too heavy' if you want to buy bragging rights.

Paraphrasing your first post:

' light (weight) is pointless as I'm never going to win anything, but I want more comfort'

Then try riding different bikes, and buy a comfortable bike.

Or is that not complicated enough? 🙂

Bob Jackson? £700 for a lugged 853 frame and forks, I love mine
[img] [/img]

2000g is only 'too heavy' if you want to buy bragging rights

I'll ask on the new un.

My first serious road bike was from Condor. Because I didn't really know what I was doing I basically told them my budget, and they specc'd me a bike (an Italia with Campag bits as it happens). After the chap had spent a bit of time with me sat on the measuring device and whatnot, I waited a while, and then they delivered a bike. Apart from dropping the seat 5mm, I changed nothing about it for years. It was exceedingly comfortable.

I tend to think therefore that getting the bike fitted and specc'd by Condor was the most important factor in the process.

Several people have mentioned the Donhou signature steel without linking, so here it is:

[url= http://www.donhoubicycles.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/SS_detail_image2.jp g" target="_blank">http://www.donhoubicycles.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/SS_detail_image2.jp g"/> [/img][/url]

Very fine indeed, but GBP4,000...

You've ruled out stuff like Cotic Escapade and Salsa Colossal2 as not race-y enough presumably?

Isn't that DeRosa Aliminium?

Yes, but this is Hora, and he hasn't ridden his current bike for anywhere near long enough to know his arse from his elbow...

Twas just a suggestion.

Nobeerinthefridge I wont bite. Please keep it on topic of steel frames.

The spirit-framed Fratello is circa 100gm lighter across all the sizes. The 1900gm weight was based on the older 55cm size.

Bob Jackson? £700 for a lugged 853 frame and forks, I love mine

Hora, its an 853 Olympus Road. Its a 59cm built up with Ultegra/DuraAce mix, it weighs just under 20 pounds with 32 spoke wheels buts its a big bike. The forks are Columbus, nice curved blades that suit the bike.

I guess the geometry is what they used to call 'stage racer', slightly slacker head angle but stable beyond belief.

I bought some 'climbing' wheels from Strada last year and they brought it alive.

I reckon the lugs add 1/4 pound but this one in a 52cm is 17 pounds.

http://velospace.org/node/42777

^ linked is stunning 😯

It was my motivation.

I live in Leeds so got to go to the Jackson workshop, chat, see them building so it was a nice experience.

Its still not a Ricky Feather but from a functionality point of view its no less of a bike.

I genuinely can't fault it, I'm the weak link.

Looking at the site/yours they don't offer the Olympus road in 853 (or on the tube upgrade?)

How tall are you for the 59? I remember going to Bob Jacksons over a decade ago- from memory it was off a roundabout or dual-carriageway in a row of small shops?

Edit- ah £180+£545 for frame only in 853. What colours yours and the one in the link (do you think).

I'd love to have a spin on yours (unless they have a similar one in shop). I'm not going to rush into a frame. Looks like the Enigma Ezona will sell out but I cant see any reviews on it and I dont want to rush this buying something without at least trying/seeing in person etc.

I'm popping into Condor too.

just had a look and the tube upgrades are in the side bar, £180 for 853 (its gone up since I got mine 2 years ago).

http://www.bobjacksoncycles.co.uk/default.php?cPath=73

I'm 6'2", I had a bike fit a few years back and the stock geometry on the 59cm was within mm of the the recommendations.

Mine is sparkle silver metallic, think the link is champagne or fine sliver metallic

Looks quite a racey/short headtube? Maybe its the linked-size. Will visit them though.

These frame weights just remind me why steel died on it's arse for as a road frame material years ago. Plus if steel is so comfy how come everyone is specing carbon forks.

Looks quite a racey/short headtube?

Which is what you wanted is it not?

These frame weights just remind me why steel died on it's arse for as a road frame material years ago.

What reason is that? For the vast majority of riders, a 2lb difference in bike weight is neither here nor there.

What about a willson

Their custom frames are just a smidge over budget, built in sheffield

[img] [/img]

You could ask for a discount if they dont use a named sticker on every tube

[advert]
you can buy my Kinesis GF ti frame and fork for £700
[/advert]

[url= http://wilsoncycles.co.uk/shop/bespoke-frame-range.php ]Wilson's website[/url] is quite amusing.

😀 they put all their money into the pricing not the web design 😀

Edit: Incorrect statement about Wilson not being in business anymore...