[Closed] What protein shakes do you use?

people take that to mean they need a protein shake which has way more protein (and calories) than necessary.

A standard myprotein shake has about 20g protein and around 100 calories if made up with water. Hardly overkill is it? Just useful if you havent met your daily protein requirements and haven't got any meat or fish in. Or as others have said a quick breakfast that fills you up more than something carby.

Actually I think you will find that a whey isolate is 1 of the best things to drink after an intense weights session as it's absorbed pretty much straight away in to the 2hour anabolic window & then stock up on carbs & whole food proteins when you get home.

Milk & chocolate milk have also been proven to add muscle mass.

Protein shakes do have there place so they aren't a waste of time/money if your training 4 5 or 6 days a week.They are there to keep your protein intake up if you can't make a meal or straight after training.

If there is an award for meaningless statements then you've just won it!

fail to see how. your comment about an atypical gym user taking protein supplements is pointless. I a lazy bum requires a certain amount of protein a day around 0.8g per Kg (I think) which would be too little for someone trying to build muscle mass in a gym. If you take in more than you need then it will have an effect wither you are me or a body builder. Hence my too much is too much comment. I'll know in future to explain everything to its fullest with references to peer reviewed articles so you don't come back with these replies.

If you're going to go around posting on a Protein supplement thread that people are risking liver and / or brain damage as a result, you really ought to have something to back it up other than if you take an unspecified, but probably huge, amount, you may or may not do some harm

who said brain damage? I wrote impairment which is not the same by a long shot.

AIUI your body can't convert protein to fat

we do, its done in the liver

Just useful if you havent met your daily protein requirements

How many people in reality is that? In the western world, very few.

Protein shakes do have there place so they aren't a waste of time/money if your training 4 5 or 6 days a week.They are there to keep your protein intake up if you can't make a meal or straight after training.

No doubt they have a place (as I said above) but probably not for muscle growth - more for the recovery aspect and only in the pretty small quantities actually required.

For a sedentary person requires 0.75g protein per kg bw daily

Endurance training most studies recommend 1.2-1.4 g per kg bw daily.

I take between 180-200g protein daily..

To much protein does make you fat if you kick the arse out of it just like to much sat fat will pile up on you.

I'm also a nutritionist & I stick with the fact that shakes apart from casein (before bed) serve a purpose.

I have 26g whey isolate soon as I wake up mixed with oats & a spoon full of PB with water in my shaker to keep me full untill breakfast

It depends on the body weight of the person ,If you take more than you need it's a waste.If your training hard a whey isolate is there for the task of getting it into you sharpish when your done

Recovery then?

I'm also a nutritionist

Is that like a dietician only not trained, registered or respected? 😉

Harsh!

Is that like a dietician only not trained, registered or respected

bearing in mind you need a relevant degree to work in the NHS as a nutritionist and some posts require a postgraduate qualification.

apart from casein (before bed)

No doubt they have a place (as I said above) but probably not for muscle growth

Have a read that wrong, are you saying protein shakes don't have a place in muscle growth?

I have a degree (in Engineering). Can I work as a nutritionist in the NHS? I have this diet that I like to call the 'Pie diet' that I'd like to roll out nationwide 🙂

KT - evidence that protein shakes (beyond normal protein in your diet which most people get enough of) help build muscle?

Is it possible to have a thread on STW asking "what protein shake do you use" that doesn't end up in a debate about the merits of protein shakes? Seen about a dozen threads go the same way.

But if you're asking which one then you're asking presumably which is most effective which in turn leads to reasonable debate over whether they actually are effective.

Unfortunately anyone can call themselves a nutritionist and so the title should evoke a certain cynicism...

...as well as the obligatory 'Dr.' Gillian McKeith joke.

KT - evidence that protein shakes (beyond normal protein in your diet which most people get enough of) help build muscle?

But people who are building muscle require extra protein I could be wrong but that's pretty much a given and based on the 1g per lb of body weight they recommend a protein shake is a handy way of getting some of that requirement.

Well that'a load of shit 🙂 (that was in response to Dr Gilllian, not KT though actually it's quite apt 🙂 )

But people who are building muscle require extra protein I could be wrong but that's pretty much a given and based on the 1g per lb of body weight they recommend a protein shake is a handy way of getting some of that requirement.

Agreed. My point still is that most people are already getting enough though if you really aren't no doubt, the shake is an easy way to help.

clubber - Gillian McKeith aint no Dr

I know. I was doing the ironing.

really, ironing - hope you're taking a protein shake after to recover lol

i do love the assertion that "most people are already getting enough protein"

in your own words.... evidence.

Omg. As the OP I did not expect such a mass debate!

Agreed. My point still is that most people are already getting enough though if you really aren't no doubt, the shake is an easy way to help.

So a 200lb guy needing 200g of protein in day. How do you suggest?

What evidence is there for a 200lb guy needing 200g of protein?

(and can we start using the metric system?)

[i]Research also indicates that individuals performing strength-training activity require more protein than sedentary individuals.[2][10][21] Strength-training athletes may increase their daily protein intake to a maximum of 1.4–1.8 g per kg body weight to enhance muscle protein synthesis, or to make up for the loss of amino acid oxidation during exercise.[10][22] Many athletes maintain a high-protein diet as part of their training, and so protein deficiency is less likely among this group than among non-athletes.[22] In fact, some athletes who specialize in anaerobic sports (e.g. weightlifting) assume a very high level of protein intake is necessary, and may over-consume.[5][22] [b]Research indicates that many athletes consume more protein than they need even without the use of protein supplements[/b].[5][/i]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-22753620

But there's an elephant in the room. People in
the West usually already get more than enough
protein.
Healthy protein intake depends on weight, with a
recommended intake figure of 0.8g per kg of
weight per day often cited. Age is also a factor.
Over the course of a day, the average man
should be eating around 55g of protein, while a
woman needs 45g, says the British Dietetic
Association. In the US, the national public health
body, the Centers for Disease Control and
Prevention, recommends 56g for an average man
and 45g for a woman.
In the UK the mean intake for men is 86.5g per
day, with women consuming 65g, says
nutritionist Dr Helen Crawley. The CDC says
"most adults in the United States get more than
enough protein to meet their needs".
In the US, UK and most of the rest of the West
people have diets that easily supply enough
protein. A chicken breast might contain around
40g of protein, a cod fillet 30g, a helping of tofu
15g and an egg 6g.

What evidence is there for a 200lb guy needing 200g of protein?

Research also indicates that individuals performing strength-training activity require more protein than sedentary individuals.[2][10][21] [b]Strength-training athletes may increase their daily protein intake to a maximum of 1.4–1.8 g per kg body weight to enhance muscle protein synthesis, or to make up for the loss of amino acid oxidation during exercise.[/b][10][22] Many athletes maintain a high-protein diet as part of their training, and so protein deficiency is less likely among this group than among non-athletes.[22] In fact, some athletes who specialize in anaerobic sports (e.g. weightlifting) assume a very high level of protein intake is necessary, and may over-consume.[5][22] Research indicates that many athletes consume more protein than they need even without the use of protein supplements.[5]

You bolded wrong bit!

Although admittedly that only works out to 162g at the upper limit. But lets work on the basis of research you post...

How would you suggest consuming 162g of protein a day?

What am I, Nigella?

Go look for protein rich foods and eat them...

The last 100+ days of logging everything I eat tells me without protein shakes I would have only just hit protein intake targets for the week falling short on some days, after a heavy day training I'm way off.

Note also the above is talking about athletes...

I suspect the definition of athlete may not encompass many on here.

Note also the above is talking about protein intake related to exercise, not the occasional bike ride with mates....

large chicken breast ~40g
2 large eggs ~ 13g
250 ml milk ~ 14g
28g cornflakes 2g
porridge 100g ~ 11g
84g smoked mackerel ~ 21g
semen 100ml ~ 5g

semen 100ml

100mls?

I'll have a few more eggs thanks...

Note also the above is talking about athletes...

Strength-training athletes at that.

Might be of interest that the guy who finished 2nd in the January mileage challenge on Strava (6500km & 60,000m) eats a raw vegan diet, 95% fruit IIRC.

I find by eating enough carbs from real and varied (vegan) food, I get the protein required. If I'm doing a very heavy week I might throw a scoop of pea protein in a recovery shake but not realy sure I even need that.

100ml's? Where do I spray the rest?

can't all be peter north I suppose

I think most of those on this thread advocating protein supplements are probably fat boys pretending to be athletes.

I read Brendan Foster's biography years ago, and he was the best distance runner Britain had at the time (yes, I know he's not much good as a commentator!). Anyway, when questioned about his diet he replied that he ate what his wife ate, only more or it, and he was regularly running 120 miles a week during the winter.

Nice story but I think thread is about strength training rather than endurance.

hora - Member
100ml's? Where do I spray the rest?

up the curtains

Hora you could cut them and sell them as a post ride high protein chew

Good for your hair too

lols @ 200 grams a day. WTF.

I think most of those on this thread advocating protein supplements are probably fat boys pretending to be athletes.

I'd say the fat boys are probably those guzzling bottles of frijj after doing a lap of cannock and thinking they've done a workout.

1 bottle (471ml) of Frijj has got:

343 calories
19g protein
52g carbs (mostly sugars)
6.1g fat

[quote=_tom_]I'd say the fat boys are probably those guzzling bottles of frijj after doing a lap of cannock and thinking they've done a workout.

I don't think drinking chocolate milk after a ride has got anything to do with weight gain. More likely the beers and takeaways and chocolate and endless wheat (bread / pasta / cake) and lack of other extended exercise.

If you want to get big...

That sounds like a cry for help.

Oh there is enough indication on pubmed about usefulness of protein drinks. Though if you are getting protein drinks after exercise for most people it would make sense to consume less calories on other meals. There are also host of other supplements available but none of the legal ones are match the usefulness for good protein drink.

Maybe most relevant studies for this crowd are that protein intake around exercise is beneficial ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17095924 ) and the one discussing that old men had muscle growth only if nutrition was available very soon after exercise ( http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11507179 ) 😀

P.S. One commonly quoted study compared chocolate milk to sports drinks (which contained no protein!) for recovery, no wonder the results were favorable for chocolate milk.

Hmmm I wouldnt say the data on this is conclusive about the benefits of protein around exercise
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20029509
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21535185
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24343835
but overall it does seem that there is some benefit

The problem is that all of the studies are underpowered, ie they dont look at a large enough sample size to really draw firm conclusions

P.S. One commonly quoted study compared chocolate milk to sports drinks (which contained no protein!) for recovery, no wonder the results were favorable for chocolate milk.

and there is even less evidence as to whether there is any difference in getting your protein from an expensive protein supplement or a nice glass of milk

and there is even less evidence as to whether there is any difference in getting your protein from an expensive protein supplement or a nice glass of milk

100mls?

I'll have a few more eggs thanks...

A bit of wee came out when I read that

Milk probabaly has more sugar in it as well.

Right, but as has been pointed out a few times, protein supplements are a cheaper source of protein than milk. Why do you (and others) keep insisting they are all expensive? Just because some of the over-marketed ones are?

Indeed the protein drink that I use that I linked to above cots £43.49 for just over 1 months supply taking in 81g on non training days and 108g on training days and works out at approx £1.40 per day, a 2 pint bottle of milk costs £1.00 and provides approx 40g of protein.

I'll stick with the shake.

choc milk is 4:1 carb to protein

which is similar to a lot of recovery drinks

and there is even less evidence as to whether there is any difference in getting your protein from an expensive protein supplement or a nice glass of milk

I think the point you're missing is to get the equivelent amount of protein you'd need quite a lot of milk. Which would;

a) be more expensive
b) contain a lot of sugar

Indeed the protein drink that I use that I linked to above cots £43.49 for just over 1 months supply taking in 81g on non training days and 108g on training days and works out at approx £1.40 per day, a 2 pint bottle of milk costs £1.00 and provides approx 40g of protein.

You can get a 5kg bag of Impact Whey Protein from myprotein for 45 quid. A couple of months worth there at that rate. You'd be spending nearly twice as much on milk.

choc milk is 4:1 carb to protein

Often just simple carbs (nesquik is mostly fructose I think.) Recovery drinks typically have more complex carbs. A better alternative would be to mix milk with some finely milled oats (loads of low GI carbs, decent fibre, and it tastes good without any flavouring.)

b) contain a lot of sugar

Correct;

0.6g in my shake to get 27g of protein

100ml of milk approx 5g of sugar to get 3.4g of protein.

milk itself is nearer 1:1

and

Often just simple carbs (nesquik is mostly fructose I think.) Recovery drinks typically have more complex carbs.

as shown above have no known benefit over chocco milk as a recovery drink

fair enough if you want to save money
but frankly I cant be arsed with the hassle, Im happy to have a glass of milk after my 40 min cycle to work and when I get home
and a tasty frij and maybe a pork pie and some haribo waiting in the car at the end of an offroad ride

You can get a 5kg bag of Impact Whey Protein from myprotein for 45 quid. A couple of months worth there at that rate. You'd be spending nearly twice as much on milk.

Unfortunately I have to have the more expensive isolate, sensitive tummy and all that.

but frankly I cant be arsed with the hassle, Im happy to have a glass of milk after my 40 min cycle to work and when I get home and a tasty frij and maybe a pork pie and some haribo waiting in the car at the end of an offroad ride

if it works for you then that's great. I find that high GI stuff doesn't work well for me post workout, especially if it's late evening.

choc milk is 4:1 carb to protein

which is similar to a lot of recovery drinks

Unfortunately I have to have the more expensive isolate, sensitive tummy and all that.

[url= http://www.myprotein.com/sports-nutrition/impact-whey-isolate/10530911.html ]10% off at the moment at myprotein[/url] 🙂

Why are you changing the goalposts and talking about "recovery drinks" when this thread is about protein supplements?

i was responding to the pubmed links above

and the entire premise of protein to build muscle after exercise is essentially talking about recovery

a quick glance at myfitnesspal entries tells me i easily acheive my protein intake for the day (about 116g)

choc milk is 4:1 carb to protein

which is similar to a lot of recovery drinks

Personally I use protein drinks after long rides and heavy training sessions if there is no real food immediately available and often use half the dose recommended.
The additional protein is maybe fifth or sixth most important aspect in building fitness (after training, overall diet, rest, skill, lifestyle etc) but as it is one of the easiest to get right why not?