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Hey STW!
I am hoping someone can shed some light on my current situation.
I purchased a Norco Optic 2020 in December 2019. The bike lived up to the hype and i had many great rides on it.
In January 2020 i took it to my local independent bike shop to have the linkage bearings replaced. Just to keep it fresh and running smooth. It was discovered that the carbon sleeve that runs through the main pivot had come dis-bonded from the frame. Not ideal. So i took it back to Evans Gatwick (the shop i bought it from). They couldn't help as the store was closing. So i then took it to my next local store in Brighton on the 13th of January 2021. They took a look at it and agreed it was a warranty replacement. I also shared images and info with Norco directly. They also confirmed it was a warranty replacement and they would get it processed. A shiny new 2021 frameset in black was heading my way.
So far so good. I assumed it would be a fairly quick turnaround. So waited a few weeks and chased it up. I was told it wouldn't be with Norco until mid Feb, then shipped to Evans. Mid-Feb came and went. i chased it again, to be told it was delayed due to Covid. I then heard that the black wasn't available, so it would be orange. Not a colour i would have chosen, but i would take what i was given, as i just wanted to get riding again.
A few weeks pass and i chase again. Now to be told Mid-April. By this point i am sick of borrowing friends bikes and manage to buy a specialized status. Not quite the trail bike i normally ride, but it was better than nothing and more importantly meant i didn't need to beg and borrow to ride.
Guess what... mid-April comes and i chase again. Yesterdays email from Norco tells me the due date is now mid-June. Needless to say i wont be holding my breath. Norco are putting it down to the pandemic, supply chain issues and the world going a little bit bike crazy. Which i do understand, but equally its frustrating seeing people on forums from the US etc showing off their brand new Optics. So Norco can get complete bikes into shops, but not a frame to an existing customer.... shocker!!
So.... what are my consumer rights with regards to a warranty replacement and delays? Can i demand Evans to give me a refund to the value of a frame set, which is a smidge under £2700. Or am i needing to just suck it up and continue to wait? Is there any consumer law which states replacement items need to be supplied within a time frame?
I am losing what little faith i had left in Evans and the big faith i have in Norco (who do make a cracking bike... literally).
I know its first world problems n'all, so don't crucify me for my little winge too much!
Any helpful info is appreciated (or cold hard slaps to return me to reality).
cheers
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In January 2020 i took it to my local independent bike shop to have the linkage bearings replaced. Just to keep it fresh and running smooth. It was discovered that the carbon sleeve that runs through the main pivot had come dis-bonded from the frame. Not ideal. So i took it back to Evans Gatwick (the shop i bought it from). They couldn’t help as the store was closing. So i then took it to my next local store in Brighton on the 13th of January 2021.
I'm assuming this is a typo, and you originally took it to Gatwick in Jan 2021?
Edit: oh, and I think a manufacturer can do what they like with a warranty, in effect it is "extra" on top of your consumer rights.
The time frame, in law, is defined as reasonable. There's are massive delays on bikes and parts due to a huge surge in demand so reasonable is currently quite a long time.
What Norco can do is fairly irrelevant as your claim is with evans. Those frames you're seeing could all very easily have been sold before your claim (I'm not in the bike trade but some trades will order 2021 stock in January 2020 or earlier) meaning despite Norco producing them evans can't reasonably get their hands on one (see AZ vaccine and EU supply for a good example).
IMO frameset refund would be a no, you bought a bike, you return the bike, but my opinion isn't worth much as I'm not evans cycles. They're absolutely allowed to make reasonable deduction for wear and tear so don't expect full value if they do offer a refund.
Ultimately you need to contact evans, in writing, telling them you think the time frame is unreasonable, and that as they've been unable to fulfil their obligations to repair or replace under the CRA in a reasonable time frame you'd now like to return the bike for refund.
Edit - BTW, bumping your own threads after only a few hours is really annoying.
The time frame, in law, is defined as reasonable. There’s are massive delays on bikes and parts due to a huge surge in demand so reasonable is currently quite a long time.
IANAL, but I'd argue that reason is defined the other way arround. If Evans can't supply a replacement in a reasonable time, then that's unreasonable. Not, anything is reasonable if you give a reason.
AFAIK no there isn't a legally defined timescale, but most businesses would probably give you 28 days to respond to something so that's probably "reasnoable". OTOH, 3 months isn't that long.
Doubt any shop would entertain the idea of refunding the RRP of the frame only, for one the frame only is usually the highest spec, either by design (carbon grades, shock etc) or just by weighing frames as they come off the production line and allocating them to the different build tiers. Secondly, the RRP of the frame is usually inflated to make the bikes look better value. Very few people buy frames from the big brands like giant, spesh, trek, norco, etc, it's just a halo model to make the ones on the shop floor look appealing. If they absolutely couldn't ever get a frame replacement, then they might negotiate something to avoid having to do a full refund. But it sounds like they're just going to wait for the boat to get here from China.
Edit – BTW, bumping your own threads after only a few hours is really annoying.
I think that's just a forum glitch, new threads just don't appear until bumped.
Jim - yup a typo, I meant 2021.
Brain - apologies for the second post. The forum does seem to be playing up at the moment and my thread wasn't showing, so I wanted to 'test' with a reply.
Otherwise, thanks for the info and opinions. I get that frame sets are over priced, but that's what I am owed, hence my train of thought being that if they can't supply something that is technically available as a stand alone product, then the value is the same.
Unfortunately I can't return the complete 'bike', as Evans has my broken front triangle and due to upgrades, I don't have all the original bits. For reference, the frames are identical across all specs of Optic's.
I guess this thread stems from my own frustrations with the situation and maybe I just needed to vent. I have asked Evans for my available options, be it a refund, alternative or just having to wait. So will see what they say.
Whilst I'm just over 4 months wait, at least I have time to enjoy my status and the lovely spring weather we are having. Once again, thanks for the feedback chaps!
Can’t wait with what your rights are, but directly asking evans (as you have done) will hopefully yield a reasonable result. Fingers crossed as it’s a really crap situation to be in.
If it makes you feel better I ordered a canyon gravel bike in September and it arrived three days before Christmas, but scratched and with a dent on the top tube. Canyon offered £50 (for a dent!), I asked for a swap for one that hadn’t been thrown down a flight of stairs and was told I could only get a refund and would have to reorder, at the newer price (+£200) and with a new eight month wait.
OK.
Your consumer rights and a manufacturer's warranty are two different things, the latter is in addition to the former and you need to stop conflating the two because it's not helping you.
Could you shore up your OP correcting timeframe typos for me please? Because:
"Is there any consumer law which states replacement items need to be supplied within a time frame?"
Yes there is, it needs to be 'reasonable', but we first need to ascertain whether you're making a Consumer Rights Act claim or a warranty claim. Under CRA Evans is liable. Under warranty Norco can do what the hell they want so long as they're abiding by whatever terms they promised. You do not have any legal agreement with the manufacturer beyond goodwill.
If I were you I'd stop using the W word, tell Evans that the goods were not of satisfactory quality (a three grand frame shouldn't break after a year unless you broke it), you've given them the opportunity to repair or replace without unacceptable inconvenience to yourself as is your obligation under CRA in the first instance and they've failed in this capacity, therefore you'll have your money back thanks and any problems with warranties / covid / delays is between Evans and Norco to resolve and whilst unfortunate is not your problem.
I've typed this so often now that I think I'm going to get "just so we're clear, please can you confirm in writing that you're refusing to honour my statutory rights" printed on business cards.
I think that sadly not being able to return the whole bike will waken your position in terms of legal rights.
Maybe ask Evans for the trade value of the frame up front acc they can sell the grave when it arrives. He trade value is what the grave is worth to you. But this would be a gesture of good will.
Takes around 12 weeks for Norco to ship a frame to UK outside of Covid.
Best speaking to them to see if it’s actually on a boat / realistically if it will hit at any point in the next month or two.
If not and you have a few spare £’s ask them what they have in stock your size and if they will let you trade towards that out of the interest of reasonable timeframe.
Unfortunately I can’t return the complete ‘bike’, as Evans has my broken front triangle
That much at least would help you - it is at that point absolutely within reason that the "bike" you return would be simply a pile of parts which add up to the original.
and due to upgrades, I don’t have all the original bits.
That's much less helpful - wear and tear things like tyres they'd be hard pressed to argue should be original. Bigger stuff like forks etc would be a more of an issue and depending on what you're meaning by "upgrades" very possibly will give the wiggle room they need if they're looking for it - upgraded to a 20mm longer fork/bigger rotors and so on its now out of spec and possible it contributed to the failure etc.
A lot of this will come down to how friendly you are and how approachable Evans are.
Firmly setting out your position and your interpretation of the CRA in a fairly worded and understanding email will go a long way to seeing you get a decent resolution.
If Evans want to break rule 1 you'll struggle regardless of the validity of your claim, if they want to be helpful you'll get a unicorn in any colour you like.
Fair do re the bump. Sorry I picked up on it on your thread specifically I just happened to be posting here. Explains why it suddenly seemed the norm in the last few days
Takes around 12 weeks for Norco to ship a frame to UK outside of Covid.
More like 5-6 when they were bringing them in direct from Asia. Don't know if they still are but would assume so.
Thanks once again all for the info and advice.
@cougar - are you basically saying then that regardless of whether it's a warranty claim or not, my case will be arguing if the goods are going to be supplied in a reasonable timeframe from Evans?
The 'upgrades' to my Optic haven't effected the way it rides. It still has same forks and shock. I changed out the drivetrain, dropper post and wheels. Annoyingly I sold most of the original parts to help fund the new ones.
Evans have a very slow response time to communications, so sound like I have a bit of time to pen a reasonable response to them.
I would like to think I am a reasonable guy, even if my OP may not have come across like that, so hopefully there can be a happy resolve.
ordered a canyon gravel bike in September and it arrived three days before Christmas, but scratched and with a dent on the top tube. Canyon offered £50 (for a dent!), I asked for a swap for one that hadn’t been thrown down a flight of stairs and was told I could only get a refund and would have to reorder, at the newer price (+£200) and with a new eight month wait.
I think this example of absolutely shocking service from Canyon needs a reiteration. Piss poor.
Agreed. A refund and spending the money elsewhere is what I would have done.