[Closed] V brakes

V brakes are pretty simple, but everything needs to be perfect for top performance. The wheel obviously needs to be true with a good braking track. There are plenty better pads than Shimano stock and keeping the brake track clean really helps bite. Personally I preferred Avid Single Digit v’s to Shimano offerings but this tends to get a bit tribal. Options are fairly reduced these days. Good cables and hoses are obviously important too.

Seven year old thread that’s probably more accurate than most memories here...

What sort of levers are you using? V-brakes need more cable pull than cantis, so might not work very well with your old levers.

Or magura?

Get some of their hydraulic rim brakes?

are there factors which create a better brake than a generic shimano offering?

Yes, cantis are hugely sensitive to an array of factors. The geometry of cables and arms is one (and a lot of Shimanos used low-profile arms with a linkwire design which was often specced with far from ideal linkwire lengths); then pads and levers also play a major part.

The best canti setups are on a par with a decent V-brake IME, but it takes a very good canti setup to compete with even a basic V-brake. And while V-brakes are still sensitive to similar factors, they're less so: a bad V-brake setup is light years ahead of a bad canti setup.

To be honest I'd cut out the inevitable and just get some decent V-brakes and be done with it. Or Maguras if you're feeling a little more adventurous. Although I'm now wondering whether I should play with the self energising cantis I've got in the spares box 🙂

If you can find some on Ebay try some Shimano XTR V brakes and levers with decent pads, have a set on my old Diamondback, they are really powerful and certainly stop you quickly if needed.

If you have drop bars, mini Vs offer a good improvement. They need to be mounted fairly close to the rim. Or you can swap levers to V brake specific pull. Decent xtr and improved pads will make a big difference.

It is easier to swap than fettle in my experience. Is the drag brake cabled separately. My vintage super galaxy had front and rear on a dual lever when I bought it.

Thanks all.

As for the levers - they will be replaced too. Bit of a peculiar set up in that the front and rear canti's are operated from one lever and the drum brake is operated from the other lever.

I think I'll put front and rear v's on, operated as normal with the drum brake being serviced and operated by the stoker.

With the tech for V's being so old, trying to assess whether there is any material/performance difference between a set of clarks for £21 from halfords and a pair of older xtr's... Trying not to do my usual trick of buy a niche toy then throw all the money at it this time!

I would spend the money on some 3 compound pads from clarks, they are very efficient.

Shimanos tend to be a bit easier to set up in my experience.

make sure you get the alloy holder type pads not the all rubber ones

I used a friction gear lever shifter# for the drum brake on ours. The dual Dia Compe levers you have won't pull enough for V brakes. You will need the Dia Compe 287V levers. I assume you are still running down tube shifters? Or have you moved to bar ends? (which is what I did).

#Run with a gear cable not a brake cable, obviously. But I never worried as there are two more brakes.

If you’re buying drop bar levers, personally I find the Tektro RL520s much nicer than the 287Vs. Nicer levers but more importantly comfier hoods. YMMV, I have big hands.

I got Giant branded brake shoes with removable pads from our local Giant dealer - they were outstanding, significantly better than the bog standard pads and most others I've used. Worth a try if you have a Giant dealer.

I've got the Clarks set on my commuter. The levers are great but I couldn't get them set up so the pads didn't rub slightly on my rims with the levers set up fine. Now the pads have worn down all is well. I'd go for shimano.

The bike currently has vintage Mafac brake levers - very similar to these ones, despite the bike being built in the 80's.

http://www.bikerecyclery.com/nos-mafac-tandem-dual-cable-brake-lever-course-121-1950s-1960s/

however in the garage of spares, got a set of midge bars currently sporting some tektro rl520 levers - these will migrate onto the tandem. I've managed to free the quill headset to be replaced with an ahead adaptor and I have managed to get the canti's set up to be more effective - perhaps improved again with the use of the rl520'S.

Original Mafac levers don't seem to have enough pull to be effective on the drum brake unfortunately.

We put Magura HS11s on our tandem to replace our XT V brakes.  Way better, probably due to improvements over the cable run to the back when using hydraulics.  We had thought about trying to retro fit disks but the HS11s have been more than good enough for off road use

Magura rim hydraulics?! Now there's a thought...

You may have made this rebuild a tad more expensive

perhaps improved again with the use of the rl520’S.

Doubt it… should make it worse; in theory more wooden-feeling and less powerful. In fact on my tandem (albeit with flat bars) I currently run the opposite: Vs pulled by canti levers. No harm in experimenting, though… but best tested without a stoker or luggage 🙂

I wish people would stop talking about Maguras, I don't need to spend more money.

But let's say that hypothetically I did find myself yet again sucked into the tractor beam of trawling eBay for cheeky upgrades, what's the clearance like with Maguras? I'm using 2" slicks with mudguards in touring mode and ~2.3" knobbies in off-road mode. And I have the added potential complication of rear-facing brake bosses on the fork.

perhaps improved again with the use of the rl520’S.

Doubt it… should make it worse; in theory more wooden-feeling and less powerful.

...and in practice more power, nicer, shorter lever travel.

Got RL520 with mini-vs on my resident commuter.

Very happy.

Cheers!
I.

…and in practice more power, nicer, shorter lever travel.

Curious. The different mechanical advantage means shorter lever travel but less force at the caliper for a given force at the lever (which is what we're abusing the term "power" to mean). Obviously niceness is subjective… more force doesn't necessarily correlate with more niceness.

I confess I've not tried V-levers with mini-V calipers… I only had a brief relationship with mini Vs because to get a decent bite point at the lever mine ended with too little leeway to unhook the noodle, which meant getting the wheel out involved deflating the tyre or detaching the cable. (Can't remember whether I had levers with QR buttons.)

Fancy selling your cantis? My vintage tandem needs a set and while I'm sure Vs are better, they'd ruin the look of the thing. The fact that the brake levers have split pins holding them together would also limit their effectiveness!

I'll concur that road pull brakes, like mini-Vs, feel amazing with normal v-brake levers. Much less lever pull.

My vintage tandem needs a set and while I’m sure Vs are better, they’d ruin the look of the thing.

Ha ha ,yeah that would be a last thought as you hurtled down a steep hill on a wet day.:-)

I fitted V-brake blocks to the Weinmann brakes on an old Saracen road bike for my son,that plus Deore levers made it stop fine. I had tested it once with the original setup,frightening.

Hmm. If I can muster a cable stop I'm tempted to try replacing the rear V-brake with the self-energising cantis I've got in the spares pile and then play around with various levers…

Come to think of it… the brake is a rear, but I've got rear-facing bosses on the fork, so it'd work as a front, too. And I've got a funky rocker thing (like the old Cannondale Force 40 system) that's been sitting in a box of bits for over 20 years, which might allow it to work there, because a conventional hanger won't.

Hmmmmmmmm…

fasthaggis - the thing's only got 5 gears, the easiest being a 50/28. It doesn't do hills of any gradient! It's just for trundling along on the flat and the brakes are OK for that. You do have to ride within its limitations. It's also got chrome rims, so needs something you can fit leather brake blocks too and I don't think there's many Vs you can do that with.

".... replacing the rear V-brake with the self-energising cantis ...."

Say what now? What makes them self energising / do they work better than V's? I note that SJS cycles have rear ones for a fiver!

I put the Midge bars / tektro levers on over lunch break and braking was still pretty woeful on the ride up the street test.

Yup,chrome rims. I did think I was going to die on that first test run,and it wasn't even wet 🙂

Say what now? What makes them self energising / do they work better than V’s? I note that SJS cycles have rear ones for a fiver!

They have a helical bearing inside them which means that as they get pulled forward, they also get pulled towards the rim. The original ones were made by Scott-Pedersen and came in both front and rear versions (you can't transpose them for hopefully obvious reasons) but then Suntour ended up making just the rear, which is what SJS are selling (and what I have—I'd love to find the originals, my recollection is that they were brutally effective).

Better than Vs? Dunno, and again they'll probably be massively sensitive to all the variables, but I think if you get them right they're fairly potent. Again, though, I'm probably remembering the Scott-Pedersens rather than the Suntours, and a rose tint may apply, because V-brakes didn't exist back then.