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Assuming i have tubeless tyres and tubeless rims, what's the odds of getting them sealed with a track pump ? Just your average track pump bought from CRC a while back. But i don't have a compressor etc.
Wouldn't mind running the new Whyte as tubeless, normally i wouldn't bother as i swap tyres often, wet, dry, fast burly, etc... But the Whyte rubber is staying on so may as well give it a whirl if it's likely to work?
what's the odds of getting them sealed with a track pump ?
Pretty good I'd have thought.
Ive done them with a track pump up till recently. Be prepared for some "rapid pumping". 😉
I've only ever used a track pump - no compressor.
Set them up with a tube first to iron out any folds in the tyres. Leave them overnight. Then crack open one bead, remove the tube, fill with sealant and start pumping. Usually takes a few repeats of the Stans shuffle to get them to seal.
The Stans shuffle ? lol... i'm intrigued.
Its do-able and I've had plenty of successes but id recommend making up a ghetto inflator as a cheap 'last resort'
'fill' how much fluid is 'fill' ?
Nuke.... go on... fill me in please ? I've heard of these... but i have no idea on them yet.
Took me 20 minutes to do 4 this afternoon.
Couldn't be bothered to get the compressor out from the corner of the garage.......
[quote=weeksy ]'fill' how much fluid is 'fill' ?
Nuke.... go on... fill me in please ? I've heard of these... but i have no idea on them yet.
Depends on the size of tyre. I use a bit more in my B+ ones than in my 26" 2.1s
A small co2 inflator with the valve core removed is often enough to seat the tyre on the bead if track pump fails, if not then as stated inflate with an inner tube then remove ensuring the bead stays on one side.
[url= https://mpora.com/videos/AAe841roxcl6#F24k6xR4A0vHfkff.97 ]Easy with the tyre lever method[/url] 😀
I always just brush some water and washing up liquid onto the rims and tyre edges first. Some are easier than others, but they have all gone up with a track pump.
Having used a compressor in a shop recently, and seeing as my track pump is on it's way out and they aren't that much more expensive (actually cheaper than a pump/airshot combo), I'll be buying one ASAP.
I've found that proper tubeless ready tyres on proper tubeless ready wheels are actually quite easy to do. It's the bodges that are a pain in the backside.
I did the Schwalbe G ones (so a smaller air volume than an mtb tyre, admittedly) on my 'gnarmac' bike a few weeks ago and they both went up on the first stroke of the pump. Normally you need to pump quickly* for a few seconds before it 'takes'.
It helps to leave them inflated with a tube at quite high pressure for a bit to get the tyre the right shape for the rim.
*Swiss Tony, beautiful woman, etc etc.
95% if you follow the proper instructions and don't cut corners. Don't scrimp on washing up liquid solution and give it some welly.
with proper tubeless wheels it's easier than doing it with tubes. The section of the wheel is flat, not V, and so the seal as soon as they are on. I did a new Maxxis Ardent that came folded, in about 5 minutes. Longest bit was measuring out the sealant!
Daft QN maybe..
Are we talking a compressor like this ?
[img] 
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Or something more like this needed ?
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The other week I did my wtb plus sized tyres and rims with gorilla repair tape and a mini trail pump. Took minutes
Try your local Aldi for one of theirs that they were selling of at £25 a couple of weeks ago, comes with all the fittings needed and does the job in seconds.
I'll send Mrs Weeksy tomorrow
I got a set of tyres (onza ibex) that wouldn't seat tubeless on DT rims even with a 6 bar airline.
The maxxis forekasters I just put on my transition 29r wheels went up with a couple of leisurely stroke of a track pump and are still holding air 48hrs later without any sealant.
Weeksy i am very new to tubeless, just set up my first wheels a couple of months back. Tubeless wheels (stans crest) and new spec purgatory tyres and i used a ghetto solution in one and stans sealant in another and they went up easily with my old edinburgh coop track pump which cost me £7! I feared it after hearing some horror stories but it was actually ridiculously easy. One thing i learnt is dont try it with old or second hand tyres as they are a lot of hassle or certainly my nobby nics were. Try it with a track pump first before buying a compressor
Track pumps are usually fine, but often you need to bead one side first with a tube, and other such faff. Get an airshot or other air bomb thing, and then the whole task is quick and easy.
Fit the tyre with tube to the rim first - inflate and leave overnight indoors to let the tyre find its shape. Let the air out the tube and check the bead-fit. If the tyre bead and needs a bit of pressure to move it, it should inflate / seal tubeless OK. If the tyre bead can be removed with finger pressure, you're going to have to address that before attempting to inflate tubeless i.e. rim tape / packing / split tube. Done all my tubeless tyres with a track pump, including 5" fatbike tyres - a webbing strap around the outside of the tyre holds the beads in place better too.
Wait until you have a tyre thats a bugger to inflate.
Airshot is £45 from Tredz.
You then have a portable, reliable tubeless tyre inflator.
Also makes you more more likely to swap tyres knowing how easy it will be rather than arsing around trying to pump up a rapidly deflating tyre like a demented badger
That tyre lever method above is amazing!
If you bounce the wheel as you pump it usually seats really easily. Honestly!!
Only a track pump here. The odd time I've struggled I've stuck a tube in to get the beads seated, carefully undone one side to remove the tube, refitted that side, then put the wheel, unseated side down, on top of a bucket and pumped. Gravity keeps the tyre close to the rim enabling it to go up. Then peel away a few inches of bead to add Stans.
Always pump up outdoors, as if it unseats inside your garage you lose your hearing for an hour or so.
One thing is, it definitely depends on the pump- people think they've got a good pump and it'll do tubeless, but "good" for tubeless means "shifts a lot of air fast" not "is well made and looks nice and has a good gauge". So my old Joe Blow Whateveritwas, that'd go to 120psi and was a really nice bit of kit, was bad at tubeless because it was low volume. My rubbish airtower, which had the build quality of an on one, was a bad pump but it pushed a lot more air so it was better at tubeless.
There's still tyres that put up a fight- I have a compressor and even then, sometimes it's hard.
bails - Member'gnarmac'
You are dead to me.
Just bought an airshot - generally have been okay with a track pump but now pretty much painless. I don't even bother with the soap-y water thing anymore.
Some CO2 as plan B (I've used to sort a few awkward beads or leaky sidewalls when I'm being impatient) but I've survived for a decade of tubeless on track pumps on ghetto,ust and taped rovals.
Edit: airshot has always looked a good tool to me.
The pics above are just electric pumps, for tubeless issues you want to be delivering air quickly. Good rims and tyres, track pump with maybe some washing up liquid as a bonus.
Don't use CO2 with Stans etc as it isn't good for it (extremely cold gas)
Airshot is the quick answer though.
I do tubeless with a track pump no problem. It's a small diameter pump that can also do road tyres. I don't even use fluid anymore. I run UST rims and tyres though, that might make a difference.
CO2 is a last resort only, it diffuses through butyl rubber 11 times faster than air so your tyres deflate after a while, it's solubility in latex might mess up the stans sealant a bit too. If you keep topping up your tyres with air without taking them off then over a period of weeks/month the volume inside your tyres becomes a nitrogen rich gas 🙂
The fluid should only make a difference when you get a hole in the tyre or of the bead/rim isn't in a good gondition. If you get a hole in the tyre with no sealant then your finished and looking for a tube. Are the UST tyres down to a sensible weight yet? Everything has been closer to dual ply weight when I last looked.
The fluid should only make a difference when you get a hole in the tyre or of the bead/rim isn't in a good gondition. If you get a hole in the tyre with no sealant then your finished and looking for a tube. Are the UST tyres down to a sensible weight yet? Everything has been closer to dual ply weight when I last looked.
I figured that I was puncturing with such low frequency on my MTB that I couldn't be arsed with the mess of fluid. Putting tyres on dry does make a difference because it be a bit harder getting the bead seated in fully, somtimes I use a little water to lube it, I do not use washing up liquid as I don't like the idea of surfactants and salts sitting on the inside of my alloy rims. I figured the sealant might also make it a bit easier to slow down air escaping when getting the first bit of air in to make a seal.
I am yet to puncture a UST tyre [1] but I carry a spare tube with me anyway, even when I had sealant I carried a spare tube just in-case I gashed a sidewall or something.
I haven't been counting the grams, the lighter non ust tyres I assume won't have a butyl inner coating so air will pass pretty quickly through the sidewalls unless used in conjunction with sealing milk to act as an air barrier.
[1]Now I've put that in writing I am doomed to puncture multiple times on my next ride.
Thanks to all for the advice. I've now just bought an Airshot from Charlie The BikeMonger 🙂
Airshot is good. Mine lives in the boot. Not infallible though - tried an x-king right out of the box and it didn't go due to too many bead kinks. @Scotroutes offers good advice in this situation.
The airshot coming down in price a bit makes it pretty tempting doesn't it...
BOth of the tyres are currently fitted tubed to the bike, so shouldn't really be an issue there.
After faffing about (albeit successfully) with a track pump and numerous CO2 cannisters on Saturday have now bought an Airshot to make the process easier in future.
The pics above are just electric pumps, for tubeless issues you want to be delivering air quickly. Good rims and tyres, track pump with maybe some washing up liquid as a bonus.
I think you'll find that they are compressors (hint; they compress air). I'll bet that the 1.5HP draper can deliver air more quickly than any of us can with a track pump.
For ages I could never get them seated with a track pump no matter how furious I got with it, and would use CO2. Then I got a proper TR tyre and it popped on first time. Oddly since then having taken it off and tried to get it back on it was a struggle. Though I'm having more success by going OTT with the soap suds. Brew up a massive amount of liberally cover bead area. Generally works. Except the other day when it wasn't having it. CO2 to the rescue.
However, I do have new wheels on one bike that are wider rimmed and the tyres are a right pain to get over the rim, but they seat so easily with a track pump. A few gentle pumps and all pops into place! I think it's the profile of the rim which makes it a very tight seal on the bead even in the well, so pops on easy. Though I suspect these will be a nightmare to remove on the trail if I have to stick a tube in.
Stans fluid and the super inflator have arrived in post today i think....looking forward to giving this a go.... I think i'll be doing it outside and in very old clothes !
Airshot wasn't here but fluid was, I think more by luck than judgement I got the ardent on and inflated. It seemed a little tricky as you need to get it to the edge enough so it doesn't lose the air instantly, but I got it on and inflated.
We now wait and see what happens and whether it stays up or not!
Well it remained completely inflated 🙂
I'm not doing the other wheel yet as i really want to test the Airshot out so will wait for that to arrive.
I'm now tubeless ! eeek !
Only ever used a track pump, never had any problems with proper tubeless rims and tyres.
You can use a CO2 to inflate the tyre to get it seated before adding sealant. Can then take out valve and add sealant through valve hole.
Airshot arrived and worked superbly 🙂 I approve. Both my wheels on the Whyte T130SX are now tubeless
So much so i went on and tried to do the front on the Parkwood too.
However, i'm getting some sidewall leaking.... So i'm wondering if the actual tyre is compatible.
http://www.on-one.co.uk/i/q/CBOOPWX5/on-one-parkwood-sram-x5-mountain-bike
WTB ST I23 TCS Rim On El Guapo Rattlesnake Hubs / 29" / Front 15mm / Rear 135mm QR / Shimano 11 Speed
On-One Chunky Monkey 29"x2.4" Tyre / Enduro / Folding Bead / Single 50a / Black
the Rim is deffo Tubeless, well TCS ready according to the sticker and above.... but is the Chunky Monkey ?
Some tyres can be like that but the sealant should sort it. Make sure you gave the wheel and tyre the Stan's shuffle then take it for a bit of a ride, cross your fingers that it will be sealed. I think someone suggested adding glitter to the sealant to help but I haven't tried that yet
Will do matey... Cheers.
i Took the suggestion of buying an Airshot - slight PSA now £42.50 in Hargroves store in Swindon, online its £50.
Probably been using track pump only method for the last 9-10 years.. just bought a Airshot and it's dreamy.
Occasionally a tyre will deflate overnight and I've found just adding more sealant sorts it. (As does riding it.)
[url= http://www.wiggle.co.uk/mavic-tyre-sealant/ ]Mavic[/url]'s sealant bottle has a nozzle exactly the right size to squirt into the valve hole.
This is brilliant.
(Other stores, including LBSs, also sell them)
I always have a CO2 cart as a back-up too.
Has anyone other then the guy in that Conti vid actually used the tyre-lever method? All the tyre/rim combinations I have tried (mainly Schwalbes, but a Maxxis and a Spesh as well) on Stans have been so tight on the rim that I really doubt I would get a tyre lever under the bead with the bead also seated on the opposite side. I guess it is a reason to buy Conti tyres if you can actually do that with them!
Meh.... on 1 out of 3 currently.
The front Ardent stayed up, the rear trail boss was flat and the Chunky Monkey was flat. I'm hoping the Trail Boss was the valve not being done up tight enough that i noticed...
I've checked everything and re-inflated to about 45psi. We'll see what happens today.
Get out and ride on them, they always go down overnight if they haven't had a good shake about to get all the fluid in all the nooks and crannies.
I've just done that with the Trail Boss. Not far, but enough to get it squishing about. Can't get out for a proper ride today.
Just chuck some more sealant in.
Well the rear on the whyte didn't quite hold pressure, I'd pump up to about 40psi for testing and it should drop to 20. But no visible signs of leaking. So not sure where its being lost from? Do I need to glue/seal the valve?
I've just removed core and syringed in some more fluid so we'll see if that holds better now.
The on one chunky monkey I didn't get very far at all with. That had 2 visible liquid leaks on both sides of tyre, I've tubed it for now as I need to use it, we'll come back to that one. But any tips as to why are appreciated.
Going to bounce this with a few questions etc.
When you swap tyres do you reuse the Stan's or replace with new?
I got some WTB vigilante in tough fast, TCS, folding today. They're are now on my spare wheels and inflated to get their shape, they can in theory remain there till may when I replace and put on tubeless, but they were very very very tight to get on. I don't recall that being common with folding? How do you get folding tyres to seat pre inflating? Obviously they don't hold shape as well as wired ones.
I save what I can when swapping tyres and then top up as needed.
I've never run a wired bead tyre tubeless so no idea whether it's easier than a folding bead or not. I just put the tyre on and pump 🙂
Weeksy
If it is fairly clean I scrape it out with a plastic cup (like the little disposable picnic cups) and pour back in when done.
I've had virtually no issues with wire or folding beads. So long as you get them straight to start either should be good. I have only used wire beads on bmx tube ghetto set up. Not for any other reason other than that's the wheels they happened to go on.
The exception is i would never use very baggy folding tyres tubeless (no way I would have put a "normal" Panaracer Fire xc - remember them? - on tubeless for example). As a random aside the UST versions were brilliantly made.
Thanks guys. May be a lot easier next time as it's now spent time on a rim then. When it arrived it had been folded (rightly so if course) by supplier, so it was all over the place when fitting... But, it was also exceptionally tight.. How much of that was down to it not seating on the rim well at that time, i can't reall say... but DAMN it was tight.
On-One Chunky Monkey 29"x2.4" Tyre / Enduro / Folding Bead / Single 50a / Black
Didn't have any real problems that I remember with the CM I had fitted tubeless to a Stsns Flow EX 26". As it wasn't a tubeless ready tyre it went on with a tube fir a hour or so next to the radiator first, then once on and up out for a 10 min spin round the roads. Maybe had to top up fluid and air but worked well tubeless.
To find any issues fill the bath and submerge the tyre/ rim and valve as you rotate it round. Sometimes if the valve is an old one the rubber Bung deforms/seems to harden and doesn't seal, likewise the valve core gets a bit clogged and doesn't seal correctly. Both easily sorted with a new valve
Spank rims, they have been amazingly easy to set up and hold Tubeless tyres
Panaracer Fire xc - remember them?
Still got them on my 26-inch-wheeled mountainbike. Am I a bit square now?
Am I a bit square now?
No, but your tyre pattern is.
One more question 🙂
Just bought one of these for a 'spare' but at some stage in July i'll want to ideally want to run it Tubeless.
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/mavic-crossride-fts-x-29-rear-wheel/
So was going to order some Stans tape, reading the specs, Great in all conditions due to its 21 mm wide rim, looking at pics, i'm guessing i want 21mm Stans tape ?
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I recently put a new shorty in my hope Enduro rim I used a lezyne track pump and it inflated 1st time, in th past I have put new tyres on and again used the lezyne track pump and they inflated 1st time. I guess now I have said all this the next tyre I do will turn out to be a bigger, ha,Ha.
ARGGHHHHHH.
At Afan on Sat i buckled the heck out of the wheel.... got it straightened and stuck the tyre back on, some new fluid... Walloped some air in it.... nothing.... more... nothing... repeat about 10 times !
Whipped tyre off and scraped off all the now solid residue of fluid.... tried again... Nothing... nothing...
ARRGGHHHH.
What's gone wrong here ?
Went back, inflated with a tube to get 1 side seated, then plenty of soapy water on reverse when I removed tube, Bingo!
Not sure i ever got an answer on what size of tape for the Mavic rim above please guys. I've settled on my XC rubber for the seaon on that rim now, so want to get on and get ordered.
I'd be going with wider tape. 21mm may be the measurement across the rim but the tape needs to follow the contour of the rim well too.
FYI, I just put 50mm tape on my WTB i45 rims, and 30mm tape on my i25 rims as per WTB recommendations. Both went up fine with just a track pump.
Loads of good videos on youtube, give it a whirl, you can always stick a tube back in if it doesn't work.
What rim tyre compo out of interest? My Schwalbe combo on WTB i29s on my 2017 T130 went tubeless easy enough.
It's a Rapid Rob with a DT Swiss 465D rim.
scotroutes - MemberI'd be going with wider tape. 21mm may be the measurement across the rim but the tape needs to follow the contour of the rim well too.
Or narrower, so that it only does the rim well and not the sides.
Northwind - Member
scotroutes - Member
I'd be going with wider tape. 21mm may be the measurement across the rim but the tape needs to follow the contour of the rim well too.Or narrower, so that it only does the rim well and not the sides.
I thought rim tape was supposed to be 5mm wider than the internal width.
FWIW the Magic Mary went down over night but managed to get it to re-inflate with a hand pump. Left it for a few hours then used a track pump to adjust pressure. Been right as rain since.
Ghetto inflator works incredibly well - I was skeptical before I'd bodged one together - I was wrong - It works . .
patriotpro - MemberI thought rim tape was supposed to be 5mm wider than the internal width.
That's one of the traditional ways, but as rims have got wider it's become practical to tape the holes not the rims- it's more durable ime, since there's no risk of the tape getting damaged as the tyre comes off the bead. But it won't work on everything- some rims are too narrow, some are badly sealed and need the tape to be airtight.
Worst case scenario is for the tape to be just narrower than the rim (one taking into account the amount that's used up in the well- if the tyre sits off the tape but it goes up on the bead, or the tyre's half-on-half-off, then it's far more likely to push the tape off when you change tyres.
I assume i need to remove the generic tape first guys ?