[Closed] Tubeless fail, why ?

Are the beads seating but not sealing, or just not seating properly? If they aren't seating with that much pressure, I'd suspect it's a bad tyre rim combo. I've never needed soapy water but worth a try.

Also, 150 psi?! 😯 I've never needed more than 60 to seat a high volume 29 tyre. But that's using a homemade 2l bottle booster.

That's about when I'd stick a tube in to get the bead seated then you just work from one side when you take the tube out leaving the other side already seated.

Yep, stick a tube in. Some say to leave overnight but never had a problem removing it straight away. So long as one side has beaded you’ll be reet.
Obviously when you take the tube out be careful not to unseat the opposite side.

Hit it with soapy water, works every time I have a problematic seating....

Are the tyres new or have they previously been used tubeless? If the latter, you get a build up of dried sealant around the bead that prevents the bead from sealing properly. This has been the root cause of many, many really big swears in my shed.

Get some Schwalbe Easy Fit bead stuff. Does the job, no faff

[i]a build up of dried sealant around the bead that prevents the bead from sealing properly[/i]

I wonder if this... https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B081LDW43L ..?

thanks all, new tyres, the 150 psi is in the chamber, not what the tyre goes to ! Will try with soapy water/schwalbe easy fit and report back once the TESA tape arrives !

If the tape is 30mm and the rim is 27mm then hasn't the tape gone into the bead seat? This would prevent the tyre bead from seating.
I always use narrower tape than the rim. If it is a tubeless specific tyre and rim, then all the tape needs to do is seal the nipple holes and help seal around the valve hole, the milk does the rest.

^^^ it hasn't gone into the bead seat as by the time it's pressed down into the curve at the spoke nipple holes it ends up a bit narrower than the 27mm horizontal internal measurement. I have always used tape a few mm wider in dimension than the quoted rim internal width for this reason.

I use silicone lube spray on the bead - definitely helps

it hasn’t gone into the bead seat as by the time it’s pressed down into the curve at the spoke nipple holes it ends up a bit narrower tha

OK, just wanted to eliminate that then.
Go for lube, soap or silicone.

hmmmm, just found this ..

https://www.fulcrumwheels.com/en/technologies/mtb-wheels-technologies/2-way-fit-ready-mtb

the tape kit isn't available in 29 inch MTB version for this wheelset in UK, wonder if normal tape is a nono with these rims...

You're overthinking it, tape will work with rims, get soapy watery (watery soap in reality) slathered on.

Valve core restricting charger airflow?

I perhaps wrongly assumed the valves were out?.

Its not mentioned so Im covering the bases.

valve cores out when trying to seat, yes.

Not sure whether the Fulcrum 2 way kit is some workaround for rims that aren't properly TL ready, though they are sold as such... Bit like the old Stans kits... hope not !

I've got those wheels - no issues using 25mm Tesa tape for me (3 wraps around - one centrally, then one layer off to each side), no leaks and tyres seated easily enough. TBH not any easier or more difficult than average.

I’ve done a few Fulcrum wheels (all 700c) with Stans - all worked.

Haven’t done that one to be fair.

good stuff, will have another go once the Tesa tape comes, many thanks

My general option is to inflate with a tube first and leave for 24 hours for the tyre to gain a bit of shape.

The times I've not done this (with folding tyres), not many have gone up without a bit of fiddling.
Normally holding the tyre down a bit over the valve so the air doesn't rush straight out.

After a couple of failed attempts it is normally obvious where the air is leaking out, which is a pain as pumping to 180PSI+ is a mare. lol.

Hmmm, retaped with Stans, used Schwalbe easy fit, and a Racing Ralph on the back, went up first time no problem.

Did same on front with nobby Nic and it didn’t even nearly seat. Tried a few times, no seating. Put on a Spesh 2.3 ground control and it went up first time…

No more Nobby Nics for me 🙄

The OCD in me will struggle with different brands of tyres front and rear 🤣. I did try a Spesh ground control in back wheel with a tube but only 3-4mm clearance on chainstays so might not be so good for muddy days..

There'll be slight differences in the bread circumference of those tyres. Recently had similar issues getting a tyre to pop on with an airshot. A second layer of tape did the trick. In my case as it already had tubeless tape on I just used one wrap of electrical tape in the rim well.

Thanks, yes, I had planned to wait for Tesa tape to come from eBay and do a couple of wraps but got impatient so retaped with a single wrap of Stans.

twonks
Full Member

My general option is to inflate with a tube first and leave for 24 hours for the tyre to gain a bit of shape.

Also a good idea with new tape, to really press it on

Thanks, yes, I had planned to wait for Tesa tape to come from eBay and do a couple of wraps but got impatient so retaped with a single wrap of Stans.

Might want an extra wrap I guess.

I've just redone a wheel with two wraps of Lifeline tape it has made a massive difference vs. the single wrap of Spesh tape that was on their with my Conti rear tyre.

I've never used a tape that is so lacking in any real "tack" and it was a swine to get to grip on the rim bed enough to rotate the wheel for a complete loop. I've used blooming loads of it experimenting with a fix for a damaged valve hole. 😭

I've got a set of similar but narrower 2-way Fulcrums to deal with on the gravel bike. They're next weekend's job/trauma if I've managed to cure the leak around my damaged spoke bed on the Rovals by then.

Thanks for all the ideas. They are both holding fine for now, a spin round the block and all seems fine. I’ll leave as is for now though if I try the front Nobby Nic I’ll retape first. I suspect the Spesh Control may be a better front tyre anyway…

The only TL wheels I've ever set up were Fulcrum 500s. Two wraps of Tesa tape, narrower than the rim. Overnight with tubes to settle the tape and seat the beads. Airtank to inflate and still they took a couple of rides and a week to fully settle.

Just since all the experts are already here and it was mentioned above - is old sealant on the bead necessarily a problem? I'm fitting old tyres to new wheels and there's a fairly consistent layer of dried sealant all the way round the bead, looks like a nightmare to try and pick off...

I actually popped the Spesh grid control off today during some rainy garage time for a wee look. 24 hrs had bedded all the tape down nicely and the tyre came off, and back on, easily by hand and not even a drip of Stans on the carpet tiles 👍. Went back up with Joe blow booster immediately.

Not going to bother putting the Nobby Nic back on..

@13thfloormonk I’d always peel it off, it’s most likely right along the bead so could cause issues. It normally peels away in a few strings though, in my experience.

Bar towel type rag is excellent for removing old sealant from tyre beads.

Ok, will give it a shot, it seemed to have set hard and only come off (with a fight) in tiny pieces at a time...

Found a good Youtube video where he recommends rubberised work gloves which are really tacky and help you to just rub old sealant off, may have to resort to those

is old sealant on the bead necessarily a problem

Not necessarily. I've never tried very hard to clean old tyres and haven't had a problem. Try it without sealant first, and if air isn't gushing out, sealant will probably take care of the rest.

 Specialized Ground Control GRID 2Bliss tyres, 29 x 2.3

Specialized are the only tyres I have had fail tubeless and / or blow off the rim brand new. This is Butcher and Purgatory, in Grid or BlkDmnD, on 27.5 and 29er, on four different types of rims. Two tyres we returned as they wouldn't stay on the rime, four we have persevered with. A year later my front and sons rear still leak sealant, having tried two brands of sealant.

For reference I am running tubeless on Schwalbe, Conti, Michelin, Vittoria and Maxxis across 27.5 and 19 on four different bikes, plus two bikes running tubeless gravel tyres Kenda tyres. No issues with any of them.

Not necessarily. I’ve never tried very hard to clean old tyres and haven’t had a problem. Try it without sealant first, and if air isn’t gushing out, sealant will probably take care of the rest.

Praise the lord for slack old tyres! 😁 Literally the easiest tubeless inflation I've ever achieved, despite old sealant on bead, crap bubbly crinkly tape job and worn tyres. Tubeless really is a bloody lottery but at least I'm winning (this time).

Sorry for hijack OP.