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There have been lots of reports of traps being set lately, seems like more than normal perhaps with the sudden uptake of the daily excercise allowance. This time two culprits have been
caught in the act though, near Leyburn in North Yorkshire. It will be interesting to see what action, if any, the police take. The biker who took the video did very well; not sure I'd have managed to stay so calm.
Shocking.
We get exactly the same thing in our local woods. Cross old ladies laying traps.
Shame on them.
Yep, we have the mystery stick lady in our local woods.
Proper couple of ranty old gammons there 🙂
yup standard.
guy did a good job imo
He sounds like one of those angry cyclists we hear so much about in the papers, ranting and raving at defenceless old ladies just minding their own business.
What a couple of old battle axes
Calmer than I would have been.
I came across one of our local stickmen laying logs on a trail last year, recognised him from around town too. I may have implied that if I found sticks across the trail again I would insert them sideways up his rectum. Funnily enough no sticks have been laid since then.
But will anything actually come of it?
You would hope a visit from plod would do the trick, but they seem a vile old pair of witches, so maybe not.
I can mutter how awful those old ladies are but what will happen when I finally retire? When you retire, what will you do with all that spare time? Without realising it you will gravitate towards the daily mail, your blood pressure will subsequently go through the roof and will burn with a sense of injustice at minor things that others do that actually do no harm to others.
Have a thought for the old folk for they know not what they have become.
I wouldn't expect the police to be interested, they are under resourced as it is, waste of time. Just clear the obstacles, give way to walkers, smile and say good afternoon.
What a couple of demented & bitter old dears...
Two prime cuts of screechy miserable North Yorkshire gammon right there.
Nice to see the comments on the dad's Facebook post so positive towards the rider though. Very much doubt anything will happen to the two old battleaxes due to the current pressure on police resources but it would be nice to think that they'd get a quick visit and talking to from the plod.
Very much doubt anything will happen to the two old battleaxes due to the current pressure on police resources but it would be nice to think that they’d get a quick visit and talking to from the plod.
It might actually do them some good if they stopped. It looks like steep bank to the side on that vid. The kind of steep bank you could have quite a nasty fall down if you lost your footing manhandling a log across the trail....
We managed to get a local stickman dealt with. It had been going on for years on one particular bit of trail, more and more people started posting picture of the vandalism and eventually someone spotted him doing it.
Police "had a word" and the trails have been stick free since.
I didn’t watch it all but does he know who they are or know what vehicle they were in?
Are the Police happy for so much detail to be in the public domain before they've done their bit?
With my investigators head on and looking at this objectively but not in anyway defending people putting obstacles in the way!
1) Why were they putting logs on the track? Is this a footpath and they are fed up of cyclists using it?
2) Have people been stravering down it and nearly hitting walkers? Is this a segment and if so, what's the fastest speed they've been doing?
3) Why does he have a saw and spade? Whats he been doing there? Especially if he doesn't have the landowners permission? He says he has the owners permission at the quarry so why did he leave them there?
I've noticed people walking in places I've not seen people before. Lockdown means people are out walking locally. These two have probably not walked that route for years and are upset it doesn't look like they remember it to be.
PS I thought he handled the situation very well.
^^^
I suspect you haven't read the stuff on the Leyburn Residents page.
There’s a trail in Lordswood knows as ‘No Dabs’. Basically it’s a horrific collection of roots that weaves about next to a stream; the runoff into the stream from the bank has left the ‘trail’ looking like one of those mangrove swamps. It’s very hard to ride clean, can be almost trials type riding in places (hence the name).
Amusingly enough someone has recently started laying branches across it. I’m surprised anyone actually wants to walk along it to be honest, more surprised that they might be bothered about bikes on it and also at a loss as to how they think it will stop people riding it given that most of the roots are bigger than the sticks they are deploying!
I don’t agree with what they’re doing but I do understand it from their point of view as well. Putting other people in danger is never the answer though.
I do understand it from their point of view as well.
Care to expand on that whilst I rustle up some Hob Nobs and a cuppa?
Care to expand on that whilst I rustle up some Hob Nobs and a cuppa?
It's very easy to understand their point of view
:
He has the patience of a saint! His dad seems to have named and shamed which, if he's right, is the best way to deal with them.
Whilst there are riders that do not show due consideration for walkers, I would suggest that most riders do. I would never defend reckless riding. With that in mind, there is clearly no moral equivalence between the annoyance that some walkers feel when having to share trail with bike riders and laying obstacles that could injure indiscriminately.
I didn’t watch it all but does he know who they are or know what vehicle they were in?
Their identities are known, from another post by the lad's mum that I've seen shared on FB.
Are the Police happy for so much detail to be in the public domain before they’ve done their bit?
You'd need to ask them really.
Their point of view is easy to understand (2 legs good, 2 wheels baaaad)
Their lack of forethought about the potential consequences of their actions, not so much...
It’s very easy to understand their point of view
From my understanding it's a long standing MTB trail on private land. So whilst the lad shouldn't be there, it's none of their business - so no, i don't understand their point of view.
From my understanding it’s a long standing MTB trail on private land. So whilst the lad shouldn’t be there, it’s none of their business
And yet none of that matters to understand why locals might get annoyed.
I’m not saying I agree with them I’m just saying I can understand their point of view.
From my understanding it’s a long standing MTB trail on private land. So whilst the lad shouldn’t be there, it’s none of their business – so no, i don’t understand their point of view.
You missed the second line.
:
Ultimately its a long established trail [unless its actually purpose built and sanctioned and signposted as such it absolutely isn't a MTB trail, it's just a trail] and you're they choose to use it is no one else's business.
They don't consider a pile of sticks to be dangerous, it's not barbed wire at neck height, in their head it's the same as a speed bump or chicane. They expect it to slow people down. Possibly ruin their fun but certainly not their lives or teeth, and in making it shower /less attractive to mtb it improves their enjoyment. It's not significantly different to people building kickers and jumps on trails or straightening corners, improving sight lines etc. None of that is done to hurt anyone but it's done to improve 1 person's enjoyment at the detriment (or more to the point ignorance) of others.
Having finally had a chance to watch it, the lad handled it much better than the women.
If the issue is that some riders are hooning it riding dangerously on mixed use paths around walkers, I can see why walkers are concerned, but that doesn't justify putting branches across the trails.
As a definite jeycore mince lite kind of rider anyway, I tend to only ride to the speed I can see to stop at safely, especially on mixed use tracks. I've never got upset by logs across trails. The use of the word "traps" made me assume that nails and wire were involved.
Loads of sticks and branches on the trails this morning. Dry calm weather, followed by strong winds so I don't think stick man was out, but it shows that you do need to ride at a speed you can stop from. I've also seen a lot more walkers and dogs on the bike trails (actual signed, official trails) during lockdown. Luckily the trails are quite open so you can mostly see pretty far.
That said the kind of reckless behaviour shown by these ladies should be dealt with. I was struggling with sound but it seemed she was upset that her dog was endangered by cyclists but couldn't join up the thinking that she was endangering others.
As a definite jeycore mince lite kind of rider anyway, I tend to only ride to the speed I can see to stop at safely, especially on mixed use tracks. I’ve never got upset by logs across trails. The use of the word “traps” made me assume that nails and wire were involved.
That's why I was thinking. A few sticks put on a trail is no different to a branch falling from a tree and landing on the trail. Either increase speed and hop over it, ride around it or carry bike over it. Or do what I did last week and think I could hop over but catch back wheel at an angle and slide down and land on my side with both feet still clipped in. Luckily no one saw it so it didn't happen.
slide down and land on my side with both feet still clipped in. Luckily no one saw it so it didn’t happen.
And luckily none of us have ever done this either so can't imagine it.
Either increase speed and hop over it, ride around it or carry bike over it. Or do what I did last week and think I could hop over but catch back wheel at an angle and slide down and land on my side with both feet still clipped in.
That is worse than my technique so makes me feel better 🙂 See the branch, slam on the brakes, realise I can (and should) ride over it, go back, try again, no, not this time: too slow, one more go, gracelessly thud over it, check no one was looking.
I’m not saying I agree with them I’m just saying I can understand their point of view.
If someone is a horrible bastard they tend to do horrible bastard things?
yeah, "traps" is a bit OTT as a description. If it's branches across the path, in a wood when you could have branches down across the path naturally, then you should be riding so you're able to avoid or stop in time.
If they're hidden, designed so they're not visibly as dangerous as they are ( log with barbed wire, hole covered with leaves, plank under some dirt with nails sticking up, that's a trap.
Logs across is either a bit of fun to hop, or annoying if you need to move them.
Edit: refresh page before typing a reply - mostly said already!
There’s a trail in Lordswood knows as ‘No Dabs’
Stick lady used to just focus on the Motorway trail (or starwars). I don't bother riding down by the brook any more so didn't know they had expanded their attempts.
That said more recently, someone had gone full crazy & done the same on Redundancy recently. Maybe gone a bit gammony over the number of new forest users (well, it's great, I haven't seem a ferral youth on a stolen MX bike for weeks now - too many other people up there!).
Rumour has it, its the people who live in the house at the start of the Motorway trail. Right opposite the enterence.
Branches do fall down in the wind but there's no intent to injure from the wind. Difficult to compare the two.
The two ladies fall foul of Rule No.1, but I am not sure what the police can do. Is there a crime of 'possibly causing harm by deliberate actions' (or words to that effect).
I would also suggest that we have some access issues rumbling locally. We have had some trails discovered by the landowner. It seems as series of doubles leading to a 3m long / 2m tall double were not on his land when he last checked...
For the record, the trail was here 7 years ago when we arrived. It was also beautifully hidden until a youth this summer trimmed back a few bushes and branches, making the access blindingly obvious.
The adults and youths involved involved were spoken to by the landowner on site, who was happy for them to ride but not chop tree branches off or dig further. Frustratingly the riders involved argued they were allowed to dig and ride where the hell they liked, and continued to do so until the police arrived.
The same group is now digging at at least three other spots around Dunblane, at least one of which is owned by same landowner and is already sporting a set of duoubles...and the other a set of doubles which get bigger each week and multitude of small jumps and trails.
In the spirit of 'I cannot change the world, I can only change myself'...
...It does raise the question of what constitutes Rule No.1 when trailbuilding and accessing.
The chap in the video, despite being calm and collected, did have a saw and spade on private land and was making 'adjustments' - perhaps without permission?
Are there just too many video's online of "pro" riders cutting new lines, jibbing down newly felled trees or using old walls for bases...? Have we slipped into too active a trail building (not repairing) culture?
For the record, I don't have the answer. I just know that those of us who trail build have some difficult judgements to make over what is or isn't OK.
And for the record, I do hope the police have enough time to visit the two ladies involved and make them realise what the outcome of their actions could be.
Bensongd, couldn't agree more, even if the "traps" laid were lame.
Well well well a dog owner again who would have guessed!
All land in Britain is their's for their exclusive use as an off-the-lead doggy playground and toilet.
Well well well a dog owner again who would have guessed!
All land in Britain is their’s for their exclusive use as an off-the-lead doggy playground and toilet.
Don't ride off piste in Canada, you won't believe what the bears get up to
😄
Just to add my 2p.....
I appreciate that the sticks/branches may not be a trap as we may define it due to a lack of spikes and barbed wire and also accepting that something similar could have occurred naturally following some strong winds, but...
They were placed there with the intent of causing an obstruction/someone to fall off/injure someone. The execution may have been a bit poor or ineffective and looked to be fairly easy to remove in the video but the intent to cause harm was still there.
The local FB page has a post from the lad or his Dad stating that the names of the two 'ladies' and footage and photos have been supplied to local plod.
Hopefully they will be getting a knock at the door and hopefully they will go back to their cauldrons and boiling up potions.
They were placed there with the intent of causing an obstruction
I think that's pretty much where it ends. She clearly says "to stop you" not to injure/kill maim etc.
The intent to cause harm is a long way beyond the intent to piss someone off. Heck, it's a long way beyond not being worried about causing harm.
If you were criminally responsible every time you coincidentally put someone at risk we'd all be on charges every time we got in a car.
They're objectionable self important people (with doubtless no more authority to be there than he), but there's nothing to suggest they're actually out to cause harm. A polite word from the old bill will hopefully be forthcoming and explain they're being a bit unreasonable and actually putting people at risk, such a word would probably would go a long way.
Well well well a dog owner again who would have guessed!
All land in Britain is their’s for their exclusive use as an off-the-lead doggy playground and toilet.
Nice bit of othering there. Yeah, all dog owners are one cohesive, homogeneous group, who all behave badly in exactly the same way. Just like cyclists in fact.
Most trail saboteurs are ruddy faced gammon dog owners including the ones who have been caught both here and abroad, correct me if I'm wrong.
Go and do some research and prove me wrong.
@ chestercoperpot - I didn't realise dog owners were predisposed to laying sticks across trails. Do you have any links to the other instances of this occurring? The one local arsehole I came across laying sticks near me didn't have a dog - maybe he should get one? Maybe I should have lent him mine?
Or maybe you don't like dogs - fair play. Perhaps you could start a thread about it. Its not very relevant to the behaviour of the two harpies though is it?
And there's more!
Excellent use of the word 'harpy' though. A much underused word, especially in the context of 'local' issues and village FB pages!
apart from their general demeanour, what makes them horrible was their attitude that if he builds something and they hurt themselves then he is culpable, but if they build something and he hurts himself then he is still culpable - that's just nasty.
Not sure whether mental illness, entitlement, dog ownership, old age and rage are all connected.
I was quite pleased with harpy too!
chester - excellent - thanks for your 2017 link - I'll start laying sticks behind me immediately now I know that owning a dog makes you a trail saboteur...
I'll start jumping red lights too since all cyclists do that.
Not sure whether mental illness, entitlement, dog ownership, old age and rage are all connected.
Well as you seem to have have achieved a slack handful, perhaps you can let us know when you get to shout "bingo"
They love a bit of bingo.
More harridan than harpy I'd have thought.
chestercopperpot
Member
More fake news eh:
https://bc.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=544983/blockquote >
How hard do you reckon it would be to trawl the interweb and find links to blokes riding push bikes being dicks? That would prove categorically that they all are, right?
MTB and cycling in general is a male dominated hobby and sport.
Trail sabotage appears (based upon evidence available) to be predominately carried out by old dog owners.
Edit: I would assume but don't know for sure that they live locally to the trails they sabotage
The one local arsehole I came across laying sticks near me didn’t have a dog – maybe he should get one?
Duh, that's what he was trying to do. The sticks aren't a trap, they're dog bait. Everyone knows dogs like to chase sticks so you put a collection on a trail and wait for one (ideally you'd throw them but dogs are quite quick so the head start makes them impossible to catch).
*there is significant risk of catching a small boy (and the occasional unsupervised full grown man) as they also have a natural draw to large sticks for walking with, sword fights and whacking trees. Actually this makes me wonder if the ladies in the video maybe had scalp rash.
I don't necessarily think it's their fault (obviously not the dogs they're animals). It's a shame they need professional help, preferably long term residential, in an institution capable of dealing with their issues.
In fact I'll put myself forward as a Tsar or Commandant of such institutions.
I know they're big fans of zero tolerance and tough justice. Seems apt that's how it should be dealt with, maybe bring back the birch!
Pick up the dog. Ride off.
Hah! I was wonndering how long it would be before this cropped up on here. So, the two ladies aren't truly local even though they have lived here a while but they are very well known local er.. characters shall we say.
The woods are very local to me but for some reason I hardly ever ride through them. Anyway I went there for a walk around today to see what was going on. Definately no features being or been constructed as far as I could see unless they are in a hidden part of the wood. There are many unoficial trails through the wood that people have walked and riden for years but only one public footpath. I'm not certain from the video but that bit could be footpath but as he was pushing the bike at the time he had as much right to be there as they did if it was the PF.
I have known the land owner for most of my life and also the two foresters that look after the estate woods. I spoke to the foresters last year about the posibility of riding through a different wood and they said no, because someone had been building features in a different wood very near this one and the landowner wasn't very happy about it.
Imagine if an old dog walker tripped over the sticks the old bags had laid down? That could be a court case 🙄
@matt_outandabout is the (B?)MX track up the Laighhills still there? That's where I'd send folk intent on digging.
*checks google maps*
Bloody hell that's been fair built on! Last time I was up there the houses between QV and everything west of the burn weren't even built. Anyway, I think the track is that oval on the east side of the railway, looks overgrown but was marked out with sunken tyres and had some fairly hefty jumps from memory (hence believing it's an MX track).
Difficult one putting sticks down is daft, but then carrying spades and saws around is also daft.
In all my years riding MTB I’ve never taken my bike for a walk on a footpath, it’s much more fun riding it. Certainly I’ve never pushed my bike and carry a spade.
I have taken my dog for a walk on a footpath though.
If they have a problem with people riding there they should go to the land owners or police and have it dealt with properly. Not try and hurt people.
Crikey, he had the patience of a saint, my blood was boiling just watching. Good job fella.
Difficult one putting sticks down is daft, but then carrying spades and saws around is also daft.
Not really, many a time I've cleared old trails to open them up for use again with a saw or a billhook, and also used a spade to dig out some drainage to stop said trail being 10 foot wide due to folk walking or riding around the puddle.
How's that daft?.
How’s that daft?.
Apparently not pandering to the prejudices and hangups of everyone else in the entire parish (irrespective of their actual legal standing on that piece of land) is somehow 'insensitive'.
@matt_outandabout is the (B?)MX track up the Laighhills still there? That’s where I’d send folk intent on digging
Yes, but overgrown. Unfortunately the Laighills is full of other folk with different views on what young people should or should not be doing. I went to the consultation a couple of years back about the Laighills - according to a couple of older ladies (!) and very forceful gent, young people were at the BMX bowl 'on bikes' (the horror!), gathering in groups (gasp!), even at night (OMG!) and there was even drinking and graffiti going on... Apparently what was needed was a full bulldoze, no gathering for young properly and a heavy police presence... My question of what they thought should be provided for said young people which got them in fresh air to exercise and socialise was ignored... As was the one about the elderly folk and what they got up to.
Eldest_oab did do some digging there about 5 years ago - and was harrased by a few folk as it's so public...
The issue we have is further out, currently 4 dig sites around town...
I own a mother aged 90 who is a fit rambler and occasional walker of her fat neighbour's dog. Sorry to say it but she and her peers are exactly like the two harpies in that video, entitled and complaining, the sort of people who whine and gossip about everybody else. Two days ago she said: "At weekends we get big groups of cyclists coming through the village, they wait and block the junction and you can't get past them, they really take up the road!"
Eldest_oab did do some digging there about 5 years ago – and was harrased by a few folk as it’s so public…
That's really frustrating, more so since he's only clearing up and adapting existing, neglected infrastructure.
Sadly your town meeting rings true here, seems a bit of money makes folk think they own the world.
At least you have some dig sites though, can imagine certain areas would be ideal (including one that is certainly very cheeky and liable to earn you some high velocity rock salt from the grumpy farmer that owns it).
@globalti, I presume both stopping or not stopping at the junction would result in equal levels of complaints.
I was at the centre of all that booby traps debate last year having similar activity nearby then the catalyst of a prat in a local rag calling for razor wire over paths.
We pushed the debate to access problems rather than traps so hopefully it's moved on a bit. I would love to see these two made an example of though.
http://peakdistrictmtb.org/levelling-the-field-peak-district-mtb-on-the-bbc/
I presume both stopping or not stopping at the junction would result in equal levels of complaints.
As mentioned on another thread...
Cyclist A with no bell: "Hello, good morning".
Perpetually grumpy walker: "Get a ****ing bell".
Five minutes later...
Cyclist B with bell: Ding!
Same perpetually grumpy walker: "There's no need to ring that bloody bell at me, a simple 'hello' would suffice".
Some people are arseholes. Lots of clever folk make lots of money analysing and postulating why this might be. Is it nature? Nurture? Chemical? Choice? Reflex?
Luckily it isn't my sphere, so I can get by just ignoring them.🙂
Funnily enough our local Stickman had a dog too.
Just ask any dog owners having a moan about cyclists when was the last time they had to clean bike shit off their shoes.
As mentioned on another thread…
Cyclist A with no bell: “Hello, good morning”.
Perpetually grumpy walker: “Get a **** bell”.
Five minutes later…
Cyclist B with bell: Ding!
Same perpetually grumpy walker: “There’s no need to ring that bloody bell at me, a simple ‘hello’ would suffice”.
Some people are arseholes. Lots of clever folk make lots of money analysing and postulating why this might be. Is it nature? Nurture? Chemical? Choice? Reflex?
Luckily it isn’t my sphere, so I can get by just ignoring them.
Whatever we do it’s wrong.
Not supposed to be on the road - we don’t pay road tax..
Ok the pavement then - get in the fing road, pavement is for pedestrians..
Where’s your hi-viz? After you Mr Pedestrian & Ms Motorist..
Use the cycle path, I paid for it - I can’t it’s sh1t. Oh & I pay taxes too don’t you know..
You can’t educate that kind of entitled stupidity.....,