[Closed] Top quality touring gears and shifters: What's out there?

XT touring is the thing over here.
Or a compact groupset.
Depends what you mean by touring.

XTR is race kit. So is D-A, no idea why you'd want race kit on a touring bike. (Obviously XTR trail isn't race kit. But it's still performance orientated.)

Isn't the point of touring kit that it's dependable and easily sorted/replaced at the next bike shop you find?

Yep. Quality touring kit isn't glamorous so you don't really hear too much about what's available.
My ideal touring group set is 9sp Shimano XT (M770) with a Deore HT2 chainset (not hollow so stronger, steel rings last longer) with an old SRAM X-Gen front mech (heavy, ugly, reliable, unbreakable, I've got 2)
Hubs? XT rear, Exposure Dynamo front.
Brakes? LX Trekking with 180mm rotors front and rear.
So that's pretty close to what I've got, apart from an SLX rear mech (which I got for free, new) and an LX HT2 chainset (£20, matches the bike!)

Touring stuff doesn't need to be light or flashy. It needs to be easy to work on, long lasting and strong. 9sp is also cheap as chips these days.
I wouldn't put XTR, Dura Ace, carbon or titanium anything, 10sp or 11sp anywhere near a touring bike personally.
It's not about the bike, it's not about the ride, it's about the journey. 🙂

Dura Ace 9spd bar-end shifters, XT HT2 chainset, XT F&R mechs & PC991 chain on my tourer (built up last year)

[quote=PeterPoddy ]Hubs? XT rear, Exposure Dynamo front. I'm hearing a few worrying things about Exposure (SP) dynamo hubs and longevity.....

Point taken re DA and XTR. It seems that stuff is just too fragile and over-complicated for what I need. As I said, previous DA and XTR kit was perfectly useable for all sorts of riding. I think what I really want, is something like some old M900 mechs (I really don't need 'functions' like a clutch mech), and some thumbies. It's a pity there isn't a 'touring and just general other types of cycling' version of DA and XTR. I appreciate racers and 'performance riders' want super-lightweight stuff, but there's a lot of us that really don't.

"My ideal touring group set is..."

Ideal for you. I want something lighter. Surprised you've gone for HT2; I'm speccing a square taper BB/Crank set up. Considering a Royce BB to go with my new Middleburn RS7 crankset, but the Royce website looks like it was compiled in the 80s, and doesn't have any bloody prices on anything!

[quote=clodhopper ]It's a pity there isn't a 'touring and just general other types of cycling' version of DA and XTR.

http://cycle.shimano-eu.com/content/seh-bike/en/home/components1/trekking/deore-xt-trekking-t8000.html

That's XT, not DA or XTR equivalent. Although it would work ok. I'd prefer a 9-speed set up though!

"Hubs? XT rear,"

I've never found Shimano hubs to be sufficiently reliable; had several freehub failures. Also had 2 XT disc hubs either crack or had threads strip on the disc mount. Probably going with Hope Pro 4s or similar. And Hope disc brakes. So it's just the mechs, shifters chain and cassette I'm pondering now.

"I wouldn't put ... carbon or titanium anything, ... anywhere near a touring bike personally."

I can understand the concern over 10/11 speed, but why no carbon or Ti? I'll hopefully have a Ti frame, with carbon bars and probably carbon seatpost. Never had any issues with carbon in the past.

Was supposed to be alfine, but that all died away - the brakes were XT level.

xt throughout. 3 x 10 now.
xt wheels built by Spa cycles......i have never even broke a spoke.
bearings take 10 miutes to change.

The perfect touring gruppo depends on where you plan to tour imo.

I'm hearing a few worrying things about Exposure (SP) dynamo hubs and longevity.....

I've got 2. One has done over 3000 miles and is still perfect, the other less than 1000 and still perfect. I know someone who probably does double my milage and he killed one after a few years after riding it through a flood a few times. It was still supplying electricity but the bearings went and they aren't serviceable. It was probably over 10,000 miles old. He replaced it with an XT Dynamo hub.
They're cheap, small and light. You pays yer money and you takes yer choice!

When I was doing a dream tour build it involved Paul's thimbies and Middlebury too.

I remember reading a journal on crazy guy on a bike who had some nu ce custom ti cassette on his touring bike can't remember the manufacturer unfortunately.

Also had 2 XT disc hubs either crack or had threads strip on the disc mount. Probably going with Hope Pro 4s or similar

Where I find XT far more reliable. Hope hubs fall apart on me. Freehub pawls, axles, bearings, hub flanges etc. Also alloy axles and freehub bodies? No thanks.
From new I ALWAYS strip and regrease any cup and cone hub. They then last forever in normal riding.

The perfect touring gruppo depends on where you plan to tour imo.

Very true.

Isn't a rohloff the touring gear system of choice?

Rohloff? maybe last year, its all about the Pinion gearbox now darling.

[img] [/img]

Mmmm - Pinion bikepacking anyone?

[img] [/img]

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/ghost-h-amr-crankworx-whistler-2016.html

I like some of the bits from here. I'm going for one of their square taper bbs for my build.

http://www.interlocracing.com/

I have a rohloff on one bike.

If i was off round the world it wouldnt even get short listed for rear hub of choice.

Rohloff is relatively heavy, and requires specific frame mounting points for the various bits and pieces (otherwise it's just a bodge). I'm sure they are generaly very reliable, but I'm not interested.

Gearbox frames are very interesting, but probably still some years away from being viable in terms of easy servicing/standardisation of parts etc. I'm after a simple, 'traditional' type bike with easily replaceable components.

Does anyone here use 10/11 speed systems for touring? What sort of longevity are you getting? Obviously, the less cogs, the thicker the chain, and theoretically better transmission life, but even 9-speed stuff is getting harder to source good quality parts these days. Is 10-speed significantly better in terms of durability, than 11-speed?

What about other manufacturers? SRAM do a VIA GT group set; what's the quality like compared to XTR/DA? Could a solution involving Campag mechs and 9-speed shifters be possible?

That IRD stuff looks nice, but seems well overpriced.

Obviously, the less cogs, the thicker the chain, and theoretically better transmission life,

The bits of the chain that wear are the same on 8-9or10 cassettes marginally thiner/thicker depending on speed which may lead to a slightly longer life but not enough to warrent being scared of it.

Steel composite cassetes and chain rings are the way to achievE long life. Weighs a bit more than alu mind.

But over all for me for touring, it has to be compatible with what im likely to find on the road.

Ie regular deraileur gears and 9-10speed with cable disks and 4bolt 104pcd chain rings.

Also rohloff doesnt NEED any specific mounts for anything. You either need an extended drop out (which i have on one bike) or a speedbone for your rear disk mount. Which i have on another bike. Both work well and as designed.

For me its the fact they are draggy as **** and as you say heavy (compared to the 3x9 xtr drive train that replaced it.

FWIW I use 105 10sp STI w. Ultegra/105 mechs. Spa cycles crankset with TA rings and a square taper BB. Old fashioned high profile canti's.

The bike gets ridden through all sorts of shit and rarely gets cleaned and it all seems to work OK. The STIs are about 10 years old and still work perfectly though I did snap the cage on one 105 front mech.

I switched to a square taper BB because they're cheap and (IME) last a lot longer than the external bearing stuff.

Only thing I would change is the short cage derailleur so I can get a lower bottom gear. (it can only mange 30t).

However, if you could still get quality 7speed stuff I would prefer that as it last longer and is easier to set up. But its all about the number of cogs nowadays.

Having thought about it, and read some comments on here, I'm sure 10/11 speed will probably be ok for what I want (not long-distance round the world type stuff, but needs to be reliable enough and easily fixable/replaceable if somewhere like rural Spain for example). Even smaller bike shops in such places carry relatively new stuff these days.

"The bits of the chain that wear are the same on 8-9or10 cassettes marginally thiner/thicker depending on speed which may lead to a slightly longer life but not enough to warrent being scared of it."

I suppose I meant more the chainrings and cogs being thicker and more durable. I know from experience that 7-speed stuff lasts longer than 9-speed! I'm more concerned with durability over 'performance'; I'd rather not be replacing parts on a regular basis (hence preferring square taper BBs). Interestingly, there's a fair amount of 7-speed cassettes around (not the lightest, but not that much heavier than other stuff. I have a couple of sets of XT/Deore 7-speed thumbshifters too...

Does it wear less or is it just less fussy about being worn ? Ie the accuracy required is not as high as on 9-10-11speed ?

Fwiw I run Shimano Claris groupset with a deore touring triple and hope hub rear/sp8x up front mostly because I wanted drop bars and cheap cassettes/chains

The new Sora 9 speed groupset has STI's, can go up to 36 at the rear and has a 30 inner ring at the front.
Put an MTB/trekking chainset on and it'll make a great touring groupset.

I'm using:
10 speed bar end shifters (Dura Ace?).
Spa chainset, 24/36/48 with the Zircal rings.
105 front mech.
Stronglight square taper BB.
9 speed Deore rear mech with a 10 speed 36 cassette.
Works perfectly.

As above, groupset hierarchy is irrelevant on a tourer, just pick whatever works for you.

Most tourers are a bodges because it's whatever works for the rider.

Mine's:
Suntour GT downtube shifters from the 80s (will be replaced by 7700 at some point as I want indexing)
XT meech from the 90's
11-28 cassette (9 speed, think it was XT)
Shimano chain
Stronglight 28-48 triple and UN52 BB.
5800 hubs, open sport rims, 32 DB spokes.
Shimano CX75 cantilever Brakes
Weinmann levers.

None of it's glamarous, but it all does it's job, reliably and suits the bike.

Nothing wrong with 10speed or 11speed, and I'd probably put money on the DA on my road bike probably surviving more miles than the cobbled together tourer. But I think to an extent I prefer the tourer to be cheap, it's not supposed to be 'bling' or expensive, it's supposed to be ridden places, locked up in town centres and left outside hostles, survive a few rainy days without TLC, etc.

There's nothing wrong with a titanium frame, DA groupset, and bling parts to make a tourer. But it's a tool for a job, and lot's of people do far more epic 'jobs' on BSO's. Once met a guy wh'd ridden an On-One Fatty to Spain along the French coast!

Exactly.

Just back from a trip to France:
My bike, set up as above.
My wife's - road triple with a a 28 at the back.
My neice - singlespeed, Surly 1*1 with huuuge knobbly tyres.
Her partner - flat bar LHT with MTB gears.

We all road the same stuff, pretty much at the same speed.

"Does it wear less or is it just less fussy about being worn ?"

In my experience, 9-speed chainrings and cogs 'hook' noticeably quicker than 7-speed. The 7-speed chains seemed to wear out noticeably more slowly.

"There's nothing wrong with a titanium frame, DA groupset, and bling parts to make a tourer."

Which is what I want. I want a really nice bike. With parts I know to be reliable and durable. Which will be used for everything from nipping down the local pub (bikes can be stored safely inside; in fact there's more bling on display most nights, than in most decent bike shops!), to hopefully doing stuff like cycling round Iceland next sumer. So I want something pretty lightweight, pretty durable and definitely reliable. I won't be hauling 50kgs of gear around with it, but will need it to take a reasonable amount.

I freely admit there's a bit of 'blinginess' about the proposed build. So what? 😀

I have an old set of Shimano XT M730 cranks somewhere, in good condition. I could use them, but have just bought a set of Middleburn cranks. Why? Why not? I've wanted some MB cranks for ages, and whilst they won't offer anything the Shimano's can't, they're part of the nice, shiny newness of things. Also, I had hoped to include as much Made in England stuff on the bike, so MB, Hope, Royce etc are all good.

What frame are you looking at, out of interest?

And wheels?
You're going to HATE choosing touring wheels - for strength it's all Deore and £15.00 rims.
🙂

And how about bar end shifters?
The indexing is good, but you can turn it off and run pretty much anything if you need too.
Not even all 10/9 speed brifters are compatable now.
😐

I'd put most thought into the wheels. Make sure you have reliable wheels. A large percentage oft touring breakages on long tours which are potential stoppers are rim and spoke problems.

And low enough gears. Other than that suit yourself for transmission and shifters.

My Long Haul Trucker is bar end shifters, XT/Deore. 22/32/42 and 12-34. Rear wheel a Sputnik rim and XT M770 hub built by Spa Cycles. Only work done on it in 13-14K touring miles was tweaking two spokes for a very slight wobble.

In 3 USA coast to coast trips the only thing that broke was a seatpost. Mid range Shimano kit is fine for touring.

I'm typically starting a tour weighing 17 stone and carrying 30 pounds weight (including pannier weight) before food and water.

Lighter riders with smaller loads could get away with lighter rims.obv