[Closed] Tokens, Rockshox forks- pros and cons with various airshafts?

My understanding was that tokens gave better bottom out resistance but less mid travel support.

Better bottom-out resistance yes, but I'm not sure they remove mid-travel support.

However if air pressure is reduced that might be a consequence.

I'm not far off your weight and find the recommended number of tokens is fine in current RS forks (Lyrik & Zeb). Really like how the new airspring holds me up better when going fast or riding steeps.

What doesn't feel good about your fork?

A Lyrik thread, excellent.
As above, I see tokens as a tool for allowing you to drop the pressure, improve suppleness while resisting bottom out. The down side is that you get less mid stroke support than the alternative of fewer tokens and greater pressure.

I'm running a 160 Lyrik ultimate with zero spacers, about 15psi less than recommended and even with HSC and LSC fully open, I find I'm wanting even less compression damping.

I've also tried more air pressure in the hope of getting them to return quicker in case they were actually packing down.

Tempted by either an Avalanche hybrid damper as I think it's a compression issue, or a smashpot as half the friction in a fork comes from the air spring. That might then allow the compression to feel lighter.

What weight are you kitted up, may I ask Onzadog?

I've found myself using a bit of HSC for the first time in years on the Lyrik Ultimate. Actually dialled a bit more HSC and LSC on after recently fitting an EXT shock - trying to get front and rear feeling balanced.

85-90kg ready to ride I think.

Other bike has a Fox 34 with a Fit4 damper and I do have some LSC set on that.

I was on one token and 76psi. I've just checked the Trailhead app again and it says two tokens and 78psi so I will try that again, albeit with 76 to start so only one variable is changed.

RS also says 8 from slow on the rebound, I think I am usually 15 out of 18 from slow so again I'll try more dampening although I have always run forks fast.

Rear is a coil.

Nothing I can pinpoint just a hazy memory that they were better before. Tyre may be having an impact as its a slightly tougher casing in theroy and I definetly prefer slightly more moisture than the recent dry! Scottish trails.

As a side note I did see very faint striations on the stanchions at the last lower service but I'm aware RS have various marks and imperfections from new so monitoring these..

What version of airshaft are you on Cha****ng?

What version of airshaft are you on Cha****ng?

The C1 version.

Seems a bit Marmite with some people preferring the older one, but I instantly found it just held up so much better so the bike was riding higher in its travel and keeping its shape better as I went faster.

I had it just how I liked it, but now I've changed rear shock I'm scratching my head a bit again. Maybe I'll end up trying another token.

I think I'm right in saying there are two that came out in close succession, and both could be bought as complete or footnut only options?

Will look at that more, happy to try for the sake of £40ish

Got the 2020 170mm lyric that came with the B1 air spring, bought the C1 version when it came out as I like to try different set ups/settings but took it out after a few goes, it was far too harsh for my liking. 78kg,Usually run 110-115psi no tokens but with the C1 had to reduce pressure but then they started to dive too much so started adding compression and were back to being harsh again, could never find a happy medium

markspark why no tokens?

I'm 80kg ish 150mm C1 with 2 tokens around 60psi probably should add another few psi but reasonably happy with performance

Bruneep, just not a fan of a progressive suspension feeling, zero bands in the rear shock too.

With a fork especially, negative air chambers are big enough now that you can get an almost linear setup that holds you up but is more adjustable than coil.

That's the thing though isn't it. Tokens make the spring curve more of a curve. That typically means more spring force at full travel and/or less spring force in the mid stroke.

Having said that, while mid stroke seems to be the current suspension buzz word, it's often mistaken for ride height which can be adjusted other ways.

I’m running a 160 Lyrik ultimate with zero spacers

This.

Unless you weigh more than 80kg, you really don't need to be ramming your fork full of tokens.

IF you do that, you end up running lots of sag to get decent travel - which means you're in the peak force of the spring curve most of the time. Which equals harsh and battering your hands.

My matra now, after much experimentation, is to run as little tokens as possible that stop bottoming out too harsh, while having a good dynamic ride height.

I've actually moved to a DSD Runt. And it's brilliant to tune in - I was running half a token in my 2020 Lyric, as one token was too much, and none was too divey. The Runt lets me fine tune that easily!

even with HSC and LSC fully open, I find I’m wanting even less compression damping.

I resemble that remark.

I'm 92 kg and have always found I dislike ride quality when running the recommended number of tokens on either Fox or Rockshox. I've also found I seem to prefer higher pressures with less tokens.

Rickon - Ive been looking at the Runt recently. Are you able to elaborate on your experiences with it? It seems like it might be the solution Im looking for.