[Closed] to clutch or not to clutch

I wouldn't not ride with a clutch now; better chain retention and quieter.

No chain slap.

A crutch would offer more stability & support

Definitely worth it if you're going 1x and not worth going without even with 2x, if only for the noise reduction.

Never noticed any impact when first fitting one on a full Susser.

I've just gone to clutch and so much better definitely worth paying the extra

Consider that even a differently sized chainring than the designer intended can mess up the kinematics. I'd expect a clutch mech *could*easily make a difference - however I'd also expect a designer to be accounting for it - after all, clutches are a feature of 11 and 12spd systems too.

Possibly a consideration if you were looking at old old frames, but then we all happily slapped clutch mechs on anyway BITD and no-one caught fire or died. Plus, anything else you did to improve chain retention and decrease slap would have an effect.

Suspect you're overthinking... 😉

R0cketd0g, needing a crutch right now would probably make me take my time and save up for 11spd 😆

tho just been reading a thread on chainline issues with M8000 1x and thinking it's maybe not a bad idea going with 1x10 on practical grounds too!

reading a thread on chainline issues with M8000

It's going to be a loooong night... 😈

Vincienup, overthinking and underbuying... Now where did I hide that credit card?!!

1x with clutch suits off road riding.

One of the best developments in MTB drivetrains ever. No chain slap, massive noise reduction, almost never lose the chain.

Chris Porter has gone on the record as a clutch hater but I ride a Geometron with the clutch gladly engaged. I left it off for a run at BPW after putting my bike together and the mech was bashing off my chainstay making a right racket.

So theoretically you're adding a friction damper which acts against your suspension but on or off I just can't feel the difference. The extra tension on the chain is a tangible improvement.

Do they even make non clutch anymore?
Clutch. And drop the front mech if you want to save some money to put to it.

I run my clutch in the off position, unless I'm in the Alps.

sharkattack - Member

Chris Porter has gone on the record as a clutch hater

Yup, and he's also gone on the record with his reasoning so everyone knows it's pish- right down to saying Mulaly's chainless run was about avoiding clutch feedback when Mulaly says "I had nothing to lose and just pinned it."

The narrow wide chain ring is doing the heavy-lifting of chain retention, with the clutch mech playing a more minor role. Standard CX set up, for example, is a 105 derailleur with the spring moved to the higher tension position, a NW ring and a short chain [not too short]. Drive train gets flooded with mud (way more than a MTB) yet will still take hard shifts and retain the chain nae bother despite the mud buildup trying to push it off round the BB.

What you don't get in cross are the hard impacts that can bounce the chain off on a rocky MTB descent [albeit mitigated by the rear suspension]. So if you're doing a lot of that then obv the clutch will make a difference. But for general UK riding out on the hills I wouldn't be arsed about a clutch mech.

Simple enough to try in any case - just use a standard mech with the spring moved and see what happens.

I think the N/W ring does the majority of the retention, but combined with a clutch mech it is a bit betterer...

N/W 1x9 on my CX bike with an old SLX non-clutch mech chain retention is pretty good, can't remember dropping the chain on it within the last year but chatter and slap is very noticeable, 1x10 on my HT with N/W ring and an M615 clutched mech (about the cheapest one I could find at the time) retention seems at least as good, far less noise and slap...

For an extra tenner a clutch is worth it IMO...

You've basically got three issues:

1. chain retention. We want this.
2. chain slapping about. We don't want this.
3. shifting performance. This needs to be decent.

NW ring with clutch on: 1 & 2 sorted but 3 isn't so hot, due to resistance.

NW ring with clutch off (or non-clutch mech): 3 now sorted but 1 & 2 are now only so-so.

NW ring, clutch off and chainguard/device: 1 & 3 now sorted but 2 still iffy

NW ring, clutch off, chainguard + fat Nukeproof chainstay cover: all three sorted.

It's been that long since I used a non clutch mech I wouldn't even be able to say shifting performance was bad. Given non of my mechs have an off switch for the clutch it's one of those things that just work. Wouldn't be without one.

How low is the budget? XT Shadow Plus and SRAM GX Type 2.1 can be had for around £40. Both clutch mechs (though need Shimano shifter for Shimano and SRAM for SRAM. Cassette doesn't matter so long as it fits the freehub you've got).

I absolutely love clutch RDs. Now that I got used to them I can't go back to a "normal" one. I would put them on every bike, even road bikes (actually I did that).

Now when I jump on a bike with a non clutch RD and the chain starts slapping my first thought is that something is broken.

So, CLUTCH!

does your bike have ISCG mounts? you could ditch the clutch, and get a 1-up chain guide.

[url= http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/oneup-components-chain-guide/rp-prod141767 ]1up chain guide [/url]

I only really use mine in the Alps but you won't drop the chain with one on.

A chain guide won't give you the same quietness as a clutch tho since it doesn't do anything about chain slap.

FS with 1x11 NW clutch RD and a chain device. Just works, no slapping, no dropped chains.

HT with 1x9 NW clutchless RD, lots of chain slap and drop the chain on sharp hits, drops, rock gardens, etc. Have bought a chain device to fit to remedy the dropping, will have to live with the slapping. Would fit a clutch RD if I could without the expense of upgrading to 1x10/1x11.

So yes go for a clutch.

sharkattack - Member - Block User - Quote
So theoretically you're adding a friction damper which acts against your suspension but on or off I just can't feel the difference. The extra tension on the chain is a tangible improvement.

But it'd be a friction damper that only acts when there's chain growth, right?

Yep, but there is chain growth when the rear suspension compresses.

to clutch or not to clutch:

on the full suspension bikes which have the clutch: always on

When I ride the other bikes which don't have the clutch yet: chain drop / chain slapping / hell of a noise...

The clutch is a good piece of equipment!
😉

[quote=hollyboni ]Yep, but there is chain growth when the rear suspension compresses.

Yes but what I was getting at is that not all sus designs have the same amount and the growth is not linear throughout the suspensions travel. So some designs may be affected (in theory) a lot more noticeably than others as they have more chain growth around the 20-30% sagged point.

I still think it'd have very little effect though, considering all the other sources of friction. Bushings, air sleeve seals etc. That said, the needle bearing upgrade on my old shock's eyelets did make a big difference to vibration.

nickc - Member

does your bike have ISCG mounts? you could ditch the clutch, and get a 1-up chain guide.

True, but his reason for asking was to save the extra price of the clutch mech over a standard one so a $50 chainguide's probably not the answer

I found the clutch amazing when I first got one, maybe I've been unlucky but as I put miles on it I found it's increased the shift tension terribly, so is now only run off. Not dropped any more chains (running a super star nw chainring) but it's noticeably noisier.

I don't think I'd ever go back to a mtb rear mech without a clutch.
Price difference is worth it for the clutch option imo.

Ignorance is bliss I say. Recently went to 10 speed using a NW on the front and the latest non clutch SLX medium cage mech. A lovely bit of kit - less to go wrong and a very solid mech, giving a nice mechanical feeling shift with a Saint shifter. Don't really notice chain slap or anything, helped possibly with an inner tube on the chainstay. Not dropped a chain yet and if I went somewhere really rocky id' just put my stinger back on.

If you run an oval chainring then the cage moves very slightly every peddle rotation and activates the clutch. This is energy lost to friction. Yes its absolutely tiny but it still annoys me. Not going to stop me using them though...although I did switch it off for an hour ling climb recently in Spain. Of I course i didnt notice a difference but i felt happier.

NDT - interesting point! Tho how noticeable is that compared to chain growth due to pedal bob?

DeadKenny - where have you seen xt for £40?! Was going to get Deore for £34, not seen XT for less than £50 in medium