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It doesn’t matter whether you’re talking about places 1 to 5 or 6 to 50 - the rider matters FAR MORE than the bike. But I am amused that you think EWS team success determines how fast you a bike is...
The longshot Rocket is 10mm lower BB than the previous version.
Cotic do race enduro in the UK, often podium and their riders were racing their low low slack longshot bikes last season, before they were released.
Swinny is PMBA champion… and yes, he used the Rocket prototypes. Mind you, he was champion the previous year as well… which I think was on a standard previous gen Rocket. The rider is the winner, not the bike. Anyway, he and Chay are on production new Rockets this year…
The longshot Rocket is 10mm lower BB than the previous version.
Ah yes, so it is. That would explain why they talk about the longshot geometry being lower. It's not on the FlareMax where BB drop has stayed pretty much the same (with the same fork), but as you say on the Rocket it has dropped 10mm.
Anyway, back to the discussion. It's fascinating to hear about what works for the EWS racers, but I suspect it has very little relevance to what might work for me.
Don't own an Enduro bike - and know that my Bossnut V2 would fall apart in such a race and won't win - even with Sam Hill...
Maybe wrong - but my understanding: the Enduro bikes are designed "around EWS" tracks and Enduro bikes are race machines.
For professional teams: over all the EWS races / one year you will see a difference also of the bikes - not only the bikers.
Not talking about Sam Hill and rank #1 ...#5.
But rankings, below #20, average one year: these are the slow teams with slow bikes.
And 2017, EWS, Capra, YT: the Capra was very slow! Nearly to the end of the team ranking.
At the same time: YT Tues, downhill. UCI: #1
Conclusion for me (maybe wrong so): very long travel downhill geo - very long and slack - doesn't work on EWS race tracks.
EWS Enduro races are a test bed for Enduro bikes. Great to have this event. Not really clear for me how you get the idea that the bike doesn't count for EWS race ranking. It's the most important tool for the biker!
im still defending my bear!
megavalanche 2004?
i have the MBUK with their review from 2001 in somewhere, it was nice and short so 'flickble' as was the trend then, I had 120mm floats but it was hard work in the mega, even with the might of 180mm hope minis up front 😉
my mate had vanillas on his (heavier, steeper) enduro and I was a bit jealous of them for the alps
the bear is still in the garage but as I said my long, low slack enduro bike is far more fun!
haha. Great!
Agree: fun is much more important!
Specialized basically took the rear stays from that. beefed them up a tiny bit
they really didn't beef them up at all. they were identical to the standard enduro ones.
Conclusion for me (maybe wrong so): very long travel downhill geo – very long and slack – doesn’t work on EWS race tracks.
That conclusion probably IS wrong. The riders were slower, not the bikes… and Capras aren't "very long" anyway, are they?
Anyway, I'd agree that what is great for use at EWS events isn't necessarily great for you, or I, or any of us. Manufacturers do learn how to improve bikes for all of us by working with these fast as hell riders though… but as far as I can tell, all manufacturers work hard to apply those lessons in a way that is beneficial, not detrimental, for us lesser riders.
@kelvin: o.k. - let'a agree that that.
100 %. Also the trail bikes are getting - sooner or later - better from this racing stuff. The manufacturers use these EWS as test bed - and they learn quick.
Great. That was one thing I tried to express as well.
Cheers!
"Conclusion for me (maybe wrong so): very long travel downhill geo – very long and slack – doesn’t work on EWS race tracks."
Bad data leads to bad conclusions. My 140mm bike in stock form is longer and almost as slack as the original Capra, which was neither long, nor particularly low, nor particularly slack for a 170mm bike.
The manufacturers use these EWS as test bed
One team I have experience of, their riders basically do their own thing, quite often without knowledge of the team manager etc, and using other manufacturers kit - not surprising, they've been doing it with tyres for years.
Rad old skool pic kimbers 😀 Kudos for doing the Mega before guys on fatbikes ruined the bragging rights. 😉
andreas. Why do you keep bringing up your thoughts on Capras racing at EWS? As said to you many times YT don't have a EWS team. The Capra is actually pretty close in geometry and suspension design to a Nukeproof MEGA and you probably noticed what just happened this year by a couple of riders using one of those. Stick Sam/Elliot on the correct size Capra and they'd do just as well.
Your Bossnut would also manage to finish an EWS fine too. infact any decent hardtail would.
As said above every rider in the top 30 at EWS is on a capable competitive bike. They pretty much all ride for teams so have no choice in the brand they use but they do choose the bike and size from that brand that they feel they'll be fastest on.
DH bikes are slower on most enduro stages. They'd work well for the odd one. but it's not the norm.
haha. My Bossnut V2: bit heavy. Really a fun trail bike. Great for 1k. But I fear the bike would be broken into two pieces before it reaches the finishing line... Not designed for EWS. Not an Enduro. Absolutely o.k..
But I like the EWS. Neat what they do.
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frogstompSubscriber
I deliberately sought out a 2017 version of my bike partly because I wanted a reach aroundWas that from your LBS!? That’s certainly one aspect of service you don’t get from the direct online retailers!
This really didn’t get the recognition it deserved, bravo that man!
not much personal prefernce here does.
haha. My Bossnut V2: bit heavy. Really a fun trail bike. Great for 1k. But I fear the bike would be broken into two pieces before it reaches the finishing line… Not designed for EWS. Not an Enduro. Absolutely o.k..
I hope you realise that there are guys on here or people that we know of, that have raced hardtails on national DH tracks. Your Bossnut would likely stay in one piece, at least the frame would. Marcelo who came second, rides a large Reign btw.