You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
Over the winters for years now I’ve used a cyclops fluid following the coach Troy spinnervals DVD’s and the last couple of winters global cycling ones too, but I’m bored, I know my dvds word for word, I want Zwift.
I would love one of the direct mount trainers that simulates climbs but it’s not going to happen, by budget is 200 ideally but would go to 300, and that gives me a puzzle I can’t find the answer too, is it better to go with a basic direct mount like the elite Muin or keep my back wheel on and get a trainer like the tackx vortex with a basic electronic brake to simulate lighter climbs?
Trainer noise really isn’t an issue though quieter may be good for the future and I have a bike that just sits on the trainer so no changing tyre issues. Basically I’m trying to find my best option to maximise the Zwift experience.
Anyone?
I have tackx vortex. It works well as a smart trainer with zwift. At no point have i ever wanted it to give me more resistance but then im not that fit.
IANAZ, but pretty sure you don't need a direct drive turbo to zwift - you can get a wheel-on smart trainer for £200 from Halfords that loads of people use.
The muin is extremely inaccurate to the point it is banned from big races.
Is there no way you can push to 500ish. Elite Direto £(550 Halfords) or Zumo (£450 Halfords) are around that and are both really, really good. The newer zumo comes with a cassette as well so at £405 (BC 10% discount or many other ways to get the same) brings it within touching distance.
Sounds like you will actually use it so I would advise going direct drive. Avoid wheel on at all costs. If you can’t afford it now then save a bit longer. Don’t whatever you do buy the £200 Halfords tacx smart trainer. It’s awful and makes turboing a chore.
Troy Spinnervals - that takes me back 🙂
Coach Troy has beasted me many a winters night in my shed, if Zwift does not deliver cheesy 80s up beat stock rock and many motivational ‘don’t cheat on me now’ shouts I will have to cancel my subscription.
If your trainer is supported by Zwift (many are and if it's not, just pretend it's something else) you could just get a cadence and speed sensor for your current set-up. It won't, obviously, increase resistance but you can join in rides based on estimations. I did this on a free trial to see what the fuss was about.
Resistance is resistance. If the turbo increases resistance you just counteract with changing to a lower gear. With a fluid trainer you increase resistance by changing to a higher gear, so ultimately doesn't matter. Power is power. I've been using Zwift for about 6 months now and just use the training programmes which are good...but no better than using my old fluid trainer with a decent training programme from GCN. If you value and want the more social aspects of Zwift with the races and events they do on it then fair enough. The constant power function of the direct turbos is good but not necessary.
If you can stretch to £300 then I'd say you're far better off getting a power meter (assuming you've not already got one) and sticking with your fluid trainer and look for better training programmes, then you get the benefit of the power meter when off the trainer too. Far better bang for your buck.
£300 will get you a used kickr snap
Resistance is resistance.
I don't think it is. If you have lots of resistance the wheel slows too much between pedal strokes and it becomes a right chore. What you want is higher resistance but a higher flywheel effect so it keeps going.
Coach Troy 😀 I have a 3hr spinerval dvd somewhere. Brutal!
What joat said, you can probably get your current setup to work in zwift to an extent, its just that gears work backwards (you have to go faster uphill to make it harder). Id be surprised if a cyclops wasnt suppourted. So you just need an ant+ usb stick and a speed sensor.
Or trainerroad and sufferfest are good halfway houses with shouty instruction and virtual power.
Wheel on trainers might be the holy grail for some, but they're a lot of money and seemingly not all that reliable. Every model seems to come with its own faults from poorly balanced flywheels, wobly shafts, faulty belts, woeful accuracy. At least wheel on trainers were generally bulletproof! Id like one, but id get one with the longest warranty ahead of any features!
bigwatts
Don’t whatever you do buy the £200 Halfords tacx smart trainer. It’s awful and makes turboing a chore
It might not be as good as a more expensive turbo trainer, but it's fine.
I've got one (assuming you mean the T2240 Flow) and have no idea what you mean about it 'makes turboing a chore'.....it's several orders of magnitude better than using a 'dumb' trainer.
If you can stretch to £300 then I’d say you’re far better off getting a power meter
He won't be if he wants zwift.
The biggest bonus if a wheel off trainer us that it feels like riding a bike on the road. No wheel on trainer has done that for me they all feeel like riding a bike with a flat tire through treacle which may be great for traning(to ride a flat tired bicycle through treacle no less) ....it's not great for training to ride a bike . It's an unnatural pedal stroke. .....it is how ever better than sitting on the couch.
^^ Sorry to butt into the thread, the "unnatural pedal stroke", what do you mean by that tr?
Oh, genuine question by the way, not starting an argument! Lol
The spin of the wheel is not smooth on a wheel on trainer.
As time goes on you tend to compensate for the difficult bits in the spin of the wheel by adjusting your pedal stroke subconsciously
It's nothing like riding s bike on the road. How ever it could be argued it is like riding a bike off road at times.
It's a tolllerance flaw in the fact that your wheel /tire combo is never perfectly round leading to variable resistance as the wheel goes round.
It might not be as good as a more expensive turbo trainer, but it’s fine.
I’ve got one (assuming you mean the T2240 Flow) and have no idea what you mean about it ‘makes turboing a chore’…..it’s several orders of magnitude better than using a ‘dumb’ trainer.
Pretty much agree with this. Got the basic Tacx and it was a huge jump from the old dumb turbo. Huge enough that I actually use it now. Didn’t know it was supposed to be awful, but then I’ve never tried a better one so maybe ignorance is bliss.
Still £300 give or take
T2240 Flow is what I have. I was only dipping my toe in. That was two winters ago and I've not felt the need to upgrade.
It works in that it is functional. It has suitable resistance to make it feel like you are going uphill or down. It does Erg mode for structured training. I'm not a great sprinter so it's rare that I flat line the 800W maximum.
The wheel can slip. But this is rare if set up properly. I doubt it is giving power outputs that would meet scientific scrutiny but they are repeatable over time which makes it possible to train to them.
I believe the direct mount ones to be better but at that price point there isn't much in it.
I've tried a few turbos and never found one like a real ride. I agree on the pedalling thing, it definitely is different to ride a turbo. But then so is switching between a flat pedalled mtb and a road bike.
So at your budget the Tacx one works. It has flaws but then so will everything at that price point. I've ended up with a £100 dedicated bike on the turbo. This makes me think that rather than go for an expensive turbo in the future I'd be better considering something like a Wattbike.
But I use it for around 60h a year so can't justify right now.
The spin of the wheel is not smooth on a wheel on trainer
My Elite Crono Fluid ElastoGel Trainer feels pretty realistic to me, quite a smooth realistic pedal stroke all the way round.
Does Zwift do virtual power these days? I’ve not used it since it was Beta and useless without a smart trainer. Back then it told you to put in more power but it had no measure of the virtual power of your turbo
Wheel on trainers might be the holy grail for some, but they’re a lot of money and seemingly not all that reliable. Every model seems to come with its own faults from poorly balanced flywheels, wobly shafts, faulty belts, woeful accuracy.
We've been running a wheel-off Kickr for two years now pretty much. It's been faultless bar wearing out two belts, which were a fiver each to replace from an online shop. Before that I ran a basic non-smart Tacx trainer for about ten years. The Kickr is light years better and the whole controllable resistance / erg mode functionality makes Zwift feel a lot more engaging and training more efficient - no backing on with erg mode. I had far more hassle with my old Tacx wheel-on dumb trainer fwiw.
I'm not sure anyone's mentioned it already, but the dcrainmaker.com website is excellent for in-depth reviews:
Does Zwift do virtual power these days? I’ve not used it since it was Beta and useless without a smart trainer. Back then it told you to put in more power but it had no measure of the virtual power of your turbo
Yes, but it's notoriously random. Cue folk flying past you putting out 10 w/kg for 30 minutes odd.
I'd actively every year get the turbo out set it up and have great intentions of using it.
After a couple of sessions I'd give up on it and go out riding in the rain and cold as none of the turbos I've had over the years despite the realistic feel promises ever managed it.
I bought the refurb kickr core in June and have done 700km on it since and actually enjoy it. It really is as the lad above says light years away from a wheel on trainer. Erg mode makes a huge odds too...infact if anything I'd say erg mode is more of a game changer than the wheel being off.
£300 will buy you a power meter. Then you can use Zwift. The smartness is nice but a bit over rated. A power meter will give Zwift a much better estimate of your work than the speed algorithms they use.
You need a dual ANT/Bluetooth for Zwift on iOS or Apple TV
£300 is a bi low for a direct drive. The KICKR Core is a great device which I’d highly recommend. But there’s nothing wrong with your turbo plus a PM.
Thanks for all the replies, it’s all much clearer now. One that controls resistance is definitely what I want, so possibly the Tacx vortex that can be found new for 200 may be the best ‘wife price friendly’ option just now.
Saw and email for tacx vortex at 199 @crc
Quick read of the bumph and I think the resistance on them is controlled by the system and thus has an erg mode. ....but double check.
Tacx T2240 here as well, had it 3.5 years (since breaking my spine) and it's fine, does what it needs to on Zwift for not a silly outlay. Actually picked up mine for about £150 - Halfords sale 20% plus BC 10%.
I've got a BKool wheel-on trainer, and while it's not the greatest it's fine for training. I appreciate it's not the same feel as riding a proper bike, but it doesn't matter - however great the "road feel" might be you're still stuck in your living room / garage / spare room staring at a screen. It's a means to an end.
So get a smart trainer, wheel on or wheel off, and go for it 🙂
eBay have refurbed TACX T2240s from the UK distributor with 12 months warranty for £120, I picked one up yesterday for £108 when eBay had 10% off (code PLEASED don't know if it's still working)