You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
I’ve ridden events with you and you aint all that…
Mincing down a fireroad isn’t the descending that some Ebike riders are looking for.
Huh? Do I know you? I think you may have me mixed up with someone else, or it's an attempt at humour that has bypassed me entirely.
I neither ride 'events' or 'mince down fireroads' as you so succinctly put it. The last time I raced was over 20 years ago!
Oh, and the quote function is fine, if you're technologically able grandad.
Mike you're the biggest Golfer on here
This one geex.
https://www.racecouk.com/product/specialized-turbo-levo-comp-fsr-29-2019/
Integrated headset so no.
Original plan was one of these with an EXT coil shock and a different fork.
Shame it's just a bit too steep on the front and not a lot we can do to change it.
Someone give AJ his teddy so he can go back to bed
Mike you’re the biggest Golfer on here
Seriously, whats the problem here? Are you intent on taking a pop at everyone on the forum?
Nice Stu. shame about the headset
I didn't know some were 27.5
Mike no one cares what you think about everthing/anything.😋
At least I'm able to deal with the simple task of pressing a button to quote the text 😆
I'm still genuinely unsure if he thinks he knows me, or it was just a slightly ill-judged attempt at insulting my riding skillz.
I really am off to bed now. The baby will be waking for a night-feed in a couple of hours, and I need my beauty sleep.
is it me or everyone a bit tetchy on here tonight?
These threads should come with some sort of mental stability entry requirement
Mike, that's quite a statement, coming from you.... 🤣🤣🤣
Tom.
HOTS on several occasions.
Mince baby mince.
Got to be careful when you big yourself up on here.
Specially when you ride round on a [s]Krampus[/s] clown bike with funny bars.
Never know who you've ridden with.🤡
All gone a bit surreal now! Lol
Here’s an article on that Lapierre.
17.5kg
https://www.emtbforums.com/threads/2019-lapierre-ezesty-and-more-at-eurobike-day-2.1018/
Okaaaay. That type of event, one that includes a cider stop. And plenty of beer before and after. And a raffle. Not exactly WC DH racing is it?
Anyway, do we have friends in common or are you just stalking me? You seem lovely, but i'm already taken 😚
l'd happily take you (platonically like) around one of my E Devon loops, and when you're blowing out your arse we can discuss if it's all just mince-core then.
Got to be careful when you big yourself up on here.
Specially when you ride round on a
Krampusclown bike with funny bars
Okay, so it's stalking then.
Never knowingly bigged myself up. I tend to be quite self deprecating generally.
And you sir are coming across a bit weird.
I didn’t know some were 27.5
They're not, they've got the text wrong
Swoon @ ajantom.....
oow bless he's got out of bed just to reply.
Back to bed now lad your trolling is done.😘
I now realise it's one of those threads
Yeah, started off ok.... Then went Black Mirror.
Where's the naughty ladies at then Mike?😀
Nobody has enough mind bleach for the strippers single speeders like
In terms of their evolution, I think aesthetics will be the focus for a while, in terms of making them not look like they have batteries and a motor. The New Ribble Road E Bike looks just like a road bike, which I think you could have some real fun with on the climbs.
Post Brexit there will be the option to legislate to have different legal cutout speeds. California has different types. Class 1 which cuts out at 20mph and is allowed on roads and bike paths unless prohibited by local bylaws.
I came across a Trek E-bike roadshow on tour last year in California. I tested a class 1. It was a revelation. With moderate pedal effort I was doing 19mph on the flat or slight uphill. If they were on the market here I'd buy one for commuting. The EU 15mph doesn't do it for me.
https://www.electricbike.com/california-ebike-laws/
The class 3 which cuts out power at 28mph is correctly restricted to the roads. whether public opinion here would go with 28mph E bikes is debateable but a 20mph limit might be possible with the right campaign.
US is nothing like the UK in terms of road law, access laws etc. Useless comparison.
Black mirror threads are the best ones. Also, that is a classic Simpson's episode!! The town hall bit is pretty much my opinion of all politics. 🙂
The class 3 which cuts out power at 28mph is correctly restricted to the roads. whether public opinion here would go with 28mph E bikes is debateable but a 20mph limit might be possible with the right campaign.
Think the urban side of it will make regulation / registration a cert, which makes it equally certain that off-road use will come under the microscope.
The Washington state ebike legislation earlier this year was reported as 'Hallelujah, ebikes banned off road,' but really that move was brought about by cycling campaigners trying to enhance ebike provision on the road, by putting them all on a clear legal footing. It seemed that off-road e-cycling was a casualty of the law [which is no joke - default position of ebikes banned off road unless land owner says otherwise, in an area bigger than England, numerous state parks etc] - ebikers must have somehow failed to marshall persuasive arguments that could have influenced the law in their favour.
But I find it weird that that someone on a cycling forum thinks its weird that someone else isn’t a fan of certain types of motorized bicycles
I find it very weird that someone who likes cycling would rather stop cycling completely as they get older, rather than use an ebike and carry on enjoying riding bikes.
But hey, you stuck to your guns and pack in cycling, just to prove yourself right. Won’t have any effect on me 👍
US is nothing like the UK in terms of road law, access laws etc. Useless comparison.
Indeed. It would be more useful to look closer to home for comparisons. Like pretty much all of mainland Europe.
Ebike acceptance is way ahead of where we currently are. And Speed pedelecs (45km/h assist) are also allowed in a lot of Northern European countries.
I think that lapierre is a step towards where we should end up. Lose the Turbo function, you can then have a smaller battery and motor. My ideal would be a system that assists you on the climbs rather than allows you to fly up them like a 1990’s TdF rider!! I’ve had a very brief go on one and it was a cool experience yo have that huge burst of power available on the turbo setting, and so can really see how the eco normal seating could be great on big days out in the Lakes or anywhere to be honest.
I do think ebikes are here to stay and will only get more popular, I’m firmly in the don’t give a monkeys what you ride camp. I’m more concerned with how you ride it to be honest, riding like an arse will get us all banned from trails regardless if it’s on a single speed or ebike.
"US is nothing like the UK in terms of road law, access laws etc. Useless comparison."
What has different USA road laws to do with anything? I was pointing out that the 15mph doesn't have to be set in stone. Other countries have higher E-bike speeds. Increase E-bike speeds to 20 and the speed differential in the increasing number of urban 20mph zones is minimal I prefer urban traffic situations where my bike speed is close to or the same as the other traffic. A 20mph E-bike would make this far more common especially in hilly areas.
"Speed pedelecs (45km/h assist) are also allowed in a lot of Northern European countries."
Allowed here too just need to do the paper work and register it correctly.
Sales will increase, prices will come down but there’s a limit on the battery and motor technology that hasn’t been solved by anyone yet - electric cars have far more R&D put in to them but they are still essentially using the same battery that’s in your smartphone
Europe is ahead of the UK in adopting them, and has a less sniffy attitude, but eventually we’ll catch up. I don’t have one, don’t particularly want or need one but eventually I expect to become an owner.
Threads like these are every other MTB development. Flat bar/riser suss forks/rigid, spd/flats. Pick a side, be a dick about it.
Development : lighter, more powerful motors... As that's the only way they differ from regular bikes, it's the only area worth developing, and the only way developments go is more bang for you buck
From a utility point of view I hope they take off.
Far better use of space and roads than cars.
@ colp, your experience pretty much mirrors my own. It's a surprisingly good and agile bike without e assist. The rear shock does an excellent job of managing drops and trail chatter / rock gardens.
Most of my time is above the 15mph limit so no assist which is fine, then it kicks in to keep the flow.
I don't like the mechanical rubbing noise when pedalling without assist, sounds like rubbing discs. Maybe that's mine.
Further evolution would be noise reduction, as well as weight and battery life.
One of my old customers, ZF Automotive, who cut all ties with Bosch to buy TRW, is getting into ebike motors so there's more competition coming and volumes could easily start to beat car sales in Europe with better margins. Therefore more money in R&D.
There was a 2019 Levo carbon outside the Ohlins rig on Friday that had a coil rear shock and 170 forks that looked nice. Not sure on the rear travel or how it would handle. Didnt feel any lighter than the 2018 carbon one.
From a utility point of view I hope they take off.
Crikey! They get enough hate now without people making flying ones.
I’m liking the 750Wh batteries that are coming through from spesh & hiabike (& others but these are the big guys), especially if the overall package is not gaining weight when they do so. I personally dislike the jam system, one battery that’s too small or add a battery into a really crap place on the frame balance wise. The general consensus seems to be well get double/triple the range on the same sized battery in the next 5+ years which I’m looking forward to..
As I find I get range anxiety with my 500Wh battery, & that’s with mainly using the eco mode. I’ve totally sacked off the turbo mode on my shimano powered unit, but I really don’t fancy carrying an extra battery. Unless they bring out a 250Wh unit that’s nice & light, to guarantee a good range to get you home.
I’ve heard of groups of guys that only use them in the ‘turbo’ mode & carry an extra battery to do so, which I find disappointing & does exemplify the ‘its all about me & **** everyone else ’ culture we have. Thankfully I don’t believe it will affect (as some of you want it to) any access, as still most ppl still don’t realise your riding an e-bike, and they will only get less easy to identify with smaller motors & hidden batteries.
Ssstu, assuming you tested them locally, what did you see range wise from the kenovo vs the levo? I’m thinking the kenovo with a 750 battery would be great but do wonder if it will happen, as it’s marketed as an uplift alternative rather than an out all day, type of bike.
For some of the riding I do (quick nip out to session local tracks), I’d like a smaller capacity lighter alternative to the Bosch 500 battery the Trek came with. I’d swear the one it came with must be lead acid!
Zippy.
Did 42 miles of local stuff yesterday.
Mainly eco with a little bit of trail and one silly climb up a DH track in boost...
Kenevo was on it's last bar Levo still had around 1/4 of its total left.
Levo was also quicker on climbs even when we switched bikes just to make sure it wasn't my extra weight over Amanda slowing the Kenevo down.
Show me someone who is anti e-bikes and I will show you someone who can't afford and e-bike 😉
The Lapierre looks really good, I think the tech will plateau for a good while. My main issue (well with my Merida eOne-Twenty) is motor protection. I took a tumble off a drop off on a steep downhill section (still getting used to the weight) and my motor casing took a hit. Having the motors more enclosed would be great, but I guess cooling would then become and issue. Maybe more effective waterproofing? I believe the Bosch motors can suffer a bit in this regard?
Anyway, don't wait buy one now they are ace!! I wish I could have got one years ago.
Did 42 miles of local stuff yesterday
Bugger, that's impressive, I wish I could get close to that & would be loads happier with that sort of range, assuming the motors were on full time and no manual cycling (other than over the speed restriction). Interesting that the new Levo is quicker too, and more efficient.. Anecdotally we believe my shimano Eco is more powerful than the bosch, but I use more battery quicker than them.
I want PedelecS to become adopted in the UK or some way of having a legal (even if it means a number plate/insurance) 30mph capable ebike that would offer a lighter more bike like version of a petrol powered 50cc scooter.
yep you can have but it will mean, because at a glance you can't always tell it's not powered or a 15mph type, all bikes will need licencing/plates/insurance and mot.
"I want PedelecS to become adopted in the UK or some way of having a legal (even if it means a number plate/insurance) 30mph capable ebike that would offer a lighter more bike like version of a petrol powered 50cc scooter."
They are. You just need a type approved one for paperwork you can't build your own.
Peugeot do a decent quality one.
"Anecdotally we believe my shimano Eco is more powerful than the bosch, but I use more battery quicker than them."
That ties in with my experience last week in the cairngorms
my Trek powerfly9 bosch drive 2 years old versus Scott Shimano drive . both of us about the same 95 kg we did a ride of 40 miles with 3600 ft of climbing and the last 20 miles with a brutal headwind we both used eco for all the ride and he ran out in the last 200 mtrs where as I still had 1 bar left but it also said 0 miles range so I guess mine was not far from depletion
“I want PedelecS to become adopted in the UK or some way of having a legal (even if it means a number plate/insurance) 30mph capable ebike that would offer a lighter more bike like version of a petrol powered 50cc scooter.”
They are. You just need a type approved one for paperwork you can’t build your own.
Peugeot do a decent quality one.
It's essentially type approved as a moped though, ie you need a license and stuff. It's not suitable.
Due to e-bikes removing some of the concerns about weight of equipment I believe Troy Lee will make metal body armour that allows you to look like Ironman.
"It’s essentially type approved as a moped though, ie you need a license and stuff. It’s not suitable."
In what way ? Vehicle that does speed needs mandatory training. More than suitable I'm afraid cNt have cake and eat it.
Threads like these are every other MTB development. Flat bar/riser suss forks/rigid, spd/flats. Pick a side, be a dick about it.
It's comments like this that make the haters hate and delight in taking the piss out of ebikers. Electric motors are not in any way, shape or form a development on a par with riser bars, spds or suspension.
Stuka-type air intake sirens to alert pedestrians and cyclists, so they move out of your way?
Solar powered charging stations built into all summit cairns (only those you can access by bridleway, of course)?
30mph pedal moped / ebike would be cool and open up many commutes but no way allowed on bike paths etc, 20mph on shared use bike paths would be out of order too. I don't have a problem with the requirement for testing as they they would be the same speed as mopeds.
assuming the motors were on full time and no manual cycling (other than over the speed restriction)
Motors were on full time.😜
Interesting that the new Levo is quicker too, and more efficient..
After a bit more testing today it seems that the Kenevo is as fast or even a little faster in trail than the Levo.
Both bikes set up Eco30, Trail60, Turbo100.
Levo still seems to have more range though.
Amanda's proper torn now between the two of them.
Levo seems more useful as a trail bike
Kenevo still smashes it on the downhills and seems more fun to ride.
Lighter & better range would be excellent. They wont get cheaper though. Ebikes will be the norm in 10 years or so, it will just be low end catalogue bikes that are un-powered.
Will still get a handful riding round on their singlespeed rigids & other pointless toss claiming everyone else is a cheat and crying about it.
Lighter & better range would be excellent.
Lighter battery tech is coming but not massively. If you want lighter and better range then you need to contribute more.... Lower powered motors giving you less help but over longer distances.
Ebikes will be the norm in 10 years or so, it will just be low end catalogue bikes that are un-powered.
I think you are right that e bike will become more popular but the idea that "unpowerd bikes" will only be low end is pure trolling. .
Wall-e wasnt a documentary but sometimes I do wonder about the future of humanity.
They wont get cheaper though. Ebikes will be the norm in 10 years or so it will just be low end catalogue bikes that are un-powered.
I'm guessing this is just a standard troll, but just in case; if they don't get cheaper where is the army of people that will have the money to fund this revolution. By your logic most of us will be riding Tesco specials or still on the bikes we ride now! I'm guessing all racing will be e-bike too? We'll still have GT knocking out the tour fuelling up on a big Mac and a beer, alongside 200 other obese middle age bloke's just waiting for the right time to engage the megaoverdriveturbobastid setting.
😂
I think you are right that e bike will become more popular but the idea that “unpowerd bikes” will only be low end is pure trolling. .
Yep.
Love my Ebike but also love all my other bikes.
It's all riding and different bikes help keep the buzz alive.
Lower powered motors giving you less help but over longer distances.
Mike that's already available. You just turn the level down.😉
Solar powered charging stations built into all summit cairns (only those you can access by bridleway, of course)?
Was riding in the Italian Piedmont Alps on the Torino-Nice Rally (on a gravel bike) a couple of weeks ago and several of the high Refugios had E-bike charging stations for overnight guests to use. Presumably off solar power & batteries as the refugios are quite remote. A lot of high gravel bridleways were also marked as designated E-bike trails and the other riders we saw were either super skinny XC and road whippets or E-bike riders. I guess with the amount of climbing you can only be either one or the other. Quite an eye opener to see the infrastructure that developed.
Nice couple of days just done in the Borders, 326km with 5400m of ascent. Mostly ride-able, one Red trail centre route incorporated, some hike-a-bike required...
Camped/bothied each night, no real possibility of charging.
Hard to see how a zimmerbike is in my personal future - they'd restrict my range, not enhance it.
Oh - I'm 51, you know...
Hard to see how a zimmerbike is in my personal future
a charging point in every bothy and at the base of every turbine or a couple or 10 spare batteries in your pack !
I predict many peoples wallets will be lighter but not their bikes or bellies. 😉
Monty.
I'm sure you loved it but why even open a thread about the evolution of Ebikes if it's not your thing?
Looks like you have the perfect bike for that trip.
Why not post it on a relevent thread about bikepacking or even start your own thread?
I'll even help you out with a thread title.
How I love to flagellate myself with nettles in my little tent on my own.😉
Mines enhanced my ability to carry the weekly shop without arriving at either end a sweaty mess
In that first photo, some farmer has left an old gate lying in the middle of the track. Disgraceful.
Yup, trail rat, I'm a big fan of using ebikes to do chores most people do with a car. That IS an evolution in transport.
The problem isn't the thread title, Stu, it's the thread location. I'd like to see a separate e-bike forum, personally. That would also be progress.
The idea of sticking a motor on a bike is as old as the bike itself. So, has there been some recent step change in the technology that suddenly makes it viable, or is it just that they are being marketed more aggressively now ?
I’d like to see a separate e-bike forum, personally. That would also be progress.
Best get yourself over to the soon to be old classifieds, and put in your bid with mark. Can't be any worse than the PSA thread idea, and might stop all e-bike threads just becoming a shite storm for trolls. I would give your plan my vote.
I predict that ebikes will become passé in a few years and the new trend will be for E-xo skeletons for joggers so they can run further and faster and have more fun then regular joggers.
roverpig - motor tech has moved on a it so more powerful lighter motors are available but its battery tech that has now made this viable in that you can get a usable amount of power in a not stupidly heavy battery.
Used to sell 24 v lead acid powabykes with front wheel motors
Pretty much unridable with a flat battery due to the fact it was 70+ lbs and the drag in the motor. Batteries lasted 16miles.
No drag in modern quality motors.
Batteries are 4kg and you can go for 60+km on them in assist mode
Combo of low weight and no discernable drag (certainly less drag in the vacant motor that. A rohloff hub) means they are just more user friendly now
What length stem did yours come with?
The spec says 60mm but mine has a 75mm
Had another blast on mine today. Did 6 laps of a hill / tracks that I’d normally only do 2 on.
Was blowing and sweating keeping it at 15mph up the hill all the way, proper workout.
One thing I have found is a bit of a hole in the 8 speed cassette between 14mph and 16mph. Like it needs 1 tooth less or more on the front sprocket.
When I wear this set out, might look at 11 speed.
monty.
Try MTBR...
http://reviews.mtbr.com/categories
They could even open up a forum just for you where you can talk to yourself in your little tent on your own.
I promise i'd not be posting there as I've no interest in what you choose to ride/do.
So it's mainly lighter (LiPo?) batteries coming down in price that makes them viable now ? Fair enough.
I'm still not sure that the market for people who want their bike to be heavier, more expensive and less reliable is that large. They do seem to appeal to people who enjoy trail centres (your own uplift) though, so I can see them being a decent minority of bikes there. But outside of trail centres I suspect (once the marketing guys decide to move on to something else) that they'll eventually revert to being mainly an aid for those who can no longer enjoy the rides that they did in the past. But who knows, my crystal ball is no clearer than anybody else's.
I've lost count of the number of times I've heard people claim that "in future almost all bikes will be X". It never seems to come to pass though and I've still yet to see one in the wild. The humble bike has remained popular for lots of good reasons.
They are massively popular in Austria, outside of the DH parks, I guess at 50% ebikes and rising. People using them for commuting, shopping and areas where the lifts aren’t running or don’t take bikes.
Loads of village centre charging stations and also loads of mountain hut charging stations.
Good article of battery limitations and the future roadmap
https://ebike-mtb.com/en/e-mtb-battery-revolution/
I met 2 in glen bulig while I was on the Cairngorm loop.
They rode from kingussie to tomintoul charged tomintoul to braemar charged and braemar to Blair atholl for the train. Over three days .
By their own admission they were reliving a ride they had done many moons ago.
They seemed to be loving life
All power to their elbow then 🙂
All power to their elbow then
That’s a feature of the exo skeletons mentioned above I bet.