[Closed] Terrible Place for a Bicycle Museum

Which bikes did Steve Potts design ? I have not heard of him before

Cool, love to go there. Doubt I'll ever get the (ahem) chance though.

Which bikes did Steve Potts design ? I have not heard of him before

Perhaps you have heard of the company that he started with a couple of mates in 1982, [url= http://www.wtb.com/pages/about-us ]Wilderness Trail Bikes[/url]. Steve has left WTB, and is now an [url= http://www.stevepottsbicycles.com/index.php ]independent frame builder.[/url]

Very cool, thanks for sharing. Especially the new wheelsize, I can see ProTractor+ taking over

Yes I have heard of WTB

Didn't you come on here before with a similar thread and if I remember a few postors refuted some of the claims you made?
Or I might be completely mistaken.

Can we not do this every time he posts please?

Short version Its where downhill MTB started- as in timed races
Since bikes were invented folks have ridden them off road

IMHO lets just be nice to one of the fellas who helped us all have the sport/passtime/gnarfest/pursuit/ whatever that we all enjoy.

Well said Junkyard

Junkyard +1,iolo WTF?

Didn't you come on here before with a similar thread and if I remember a few postors refuted some of the claims you made?
Or I might be completely mistaken.

Bring it then. Be specific.

I never claimed no one ever rode on a dirt track before I did. But there was a time when there were no mountain bikes, and now there are.

What, in your opinion, made the difference between then and now?

I said I might be mistaken.

iolo if you don't know what you're talking about,kindly STFU

What, in your opinion, made the difference between then and now?

THANKS

Yeah, it's all cool, we know the klunkers were the start of it.
You don't have to bite to every wind-up 😆

Yeah, it's all cool, we know the klunkers were the start of it.
You don't have to bite to every wind-up

Sorry if I overreacted to bait dragged through the water, if you know what I mean and I think you do.

The "klunker" era was incredibly brief, just a couple of years from the first modified '30s bikes to the step of designing and building bikes specifically for the purpose. The passionate intensity of that era, the crude bikes, the first DH races etc., has captured the imagination of cyclists all over the world.

One guy who does not get as much international credit as he should is Alan Bonds, who shared the house with Gary Fisher and me. No one mastered the arcane craft of klunker modification better than Alan, and there are people now 40 years on creating replicas based on his ideas.

Take a look at [url= http://clunkers.net/ ]Alan's website[/url] for the most beautiful "klunkers" every built.

Charlie, the museum is top of my to see wish list when I next make it over to Marin. What I've seen of it on various YouTube clips it looks like a top notch exhibit. It's particularly special that you guys are still around to see it come 'home'.

The Fat Tire Flyer book has proven a hit Chez Moont, even non cyclists have enjoyed it. Chapeau.

Its like evolution innit

Probably loads of times through the millennium that a species started crawling out of the ocean for a bit, but got hot and crawled back, before one stuck at it.

Me and my mates back were taking racing bike frames and adding moped forks and wheels back in the seventies. But when we stopped ( & got MX-bikes), it stopped, locally.

MTBing has a unbroken line all the way back to those guys in California and Im kind of glad its that way.

P.S. Honda C90 leading link front forks actually rise ( rather than diving ) when braking & that idea needs bringing into MTBing

I want the bottle to wear Mr Nicol's shirt, the ability to grow a 'tache like Mr Ritchey and the bike that Mr Chance has.... Looks great. One day, if ever I find myself near Fairfax..

I might be over that way later in the year 🙂 If so I'm going to pop in!

the ability to grow a 'tache like Mr Ritchey

If you fit the standard STW demographic you're only 2 years off being able to grow such a thing just with nostril hair.

Jesus wept - this rubbish again.

lovely I'm sure, bikes from the 1800's and some off road stuff - no revisionism at all I'm sure.

IMHO lets just be nice to one of the fellas who helped us all have the sport/passtime/gnarfest/pursuit/ whatever that we all enjoy.

That's your way of putting it and I'd have a some more respect if it wasn't a bloody advert for his book every-effing-time.

Is he a teacher?

OK, so if someone were on, let's say, a dull business trip in the Bay Area, what would be the best way for them to get there?

Directions for people who don't hire cars but instead take their bike would be especially useful!

standard STW demographic

Hairy fat knacker who talks more than rides. 😳

http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/did-you-mountain-bike-before-mountain-bikes

Repack Rider - Member - Quote
when did mountain biking start? I would say it started when my mate and I called the bikes we built for that purpose by that name. Can't call the sport mountain biking before you call the machine a mountain bike.

Slight deviation, sorry....

Whilst we are naming stuff and there are some old codgers about; where did the term ATB fit into the timeline exactly and who killed it off? I'm sure it was all terrain bikes in the UK when I first had a crack at it in the early/mid 80s then it goes a bit blurry in my head (acid house generation) and when I refocussed it was all about the MTB. Still think ATB was a better term.

Damn, people . . . this place sometimes!! 👿

Cheers for posting Charlie - looks awesome! Loved the museum at Crested Butte 😀

[quote=convert ]Slight deviation, sorry....
Whilst we are naming stuff and there are some old codgers about; where did the term ATB fit into the timeline exactly and who killed it off? I'm sure it was all terrain bikes in the UK when I first had a crack at it in the early/mid 80s then it goes a bit blurry in my head (acid house generation) and when I refocussed it was all about the MTB. Still think ATB was a better term.
Or the French VTT (vélo tout-terrain)

museum at Crested Butte

Is the museum in Crested Butte still there--I haven't been up there for several years, but remember when it opened.

Charlie, slightly off-topic, but did you ever know a guy names Tom Singer from the early days? Lived in Marin Co., drove an old beat-up yellow Speedster. He would be about your age or a little older and I know he involved in some of the early riding in the klunker days, but don't know how much he was involved.

Visited Crested Butte in 2007 but although it appears the museum is still there it looks like the Hall of Fame exhibits are now in Marin . . . sadly a little off route for this year's USA road trip but definitely one for the future.

Thanks for posting Charlie. Can all those posting negative/disrespectful comments start a fresh thread or something?

Oh, and as for the comments re book marketing, Charlie dealt with something for me a few years back - something I absolutely expected to pay him for. He his own time and money and wouldn't take a penny (or dime, in his case) from me. Any fool can see his original post comes from his seemingly bottomless supply of passion for our sport.

Which bikes did Steve Potts design ? I have not heard of him before

Potts Modification. A big progression for BMX in the early days. The name Potts will be known to old bmx freestylers, probably more so than any mtber will remember the name. This could be lies.. I would need Mr Repack to clarify if it's the same steve 😉

I never claimed no one ever rode on a dirt track before I did. But there was a time when there were no mountain bikes, and now there are.

What the Klunkers/Repack did was do it cooler and with bigger moustaches. Never underestimate the importance of branding!

Oh I love Alan Bond's site - thanks for that Charlie!

Particularly love the "still playing about"ness of [url= http://clunkers.net/650b_1938/650b.html ]this 650b bike[/url]

[img] [/img]

Cool place, cool people there too. If I get to go back to the US one day I'd love to go there and ride in the area, it's been part of mountain biking since I first knew of it. And that's the main point to me, I heard of it all first because of what was started by the klunker scene.

(Convert - ATB was a term used by some brands in the 80s, perhaps because there was already trademark on or use of Mountain Bikes / MTB - thf 'MTB' was first. But I'm guessing and not wanting to add to a debate on this, just interested in it all.)

that bike there ^ is lovely ..

Oh I love Alan Bond's site - thanks for that Charlie!

Particularly love the "still playing about"ness of this 650b bike

I need that bike

Very cool, thanks for sharing. Especially the new wheelsize, I can see ProTractor+ taking over

pfft, ProTractor+ is old hat now, [url= http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/the-next-niche-59er-ss-fs-fatbike ]soooo 2012[/url]

I can see ProTractor+ taking over

Well, that's a new angle on things.

Whilst we are naming stuff and there are some old codgers about; where did the term ATB fit into the timeline exactly and who killed it off?

I'll take that question.

When Gary Fisher and I started our business, it was called simply "MountainBikes." We attempted to protect that name by trademark, but our trademark attorney screwed up the application, and it was denied.

Only Gary and I and the attorney knew that, and it was not in our interest to make it known to anyone else. For a year or so we "bluffed" the entire industry, which assumed it was a trademark. Gary was at the time employed by Bicycling Magazine, which was a conflict of interest but it worked in our favor. He convinced the editors that if you called it a "mountain bike" you were infringing on our name.

So Bicycling held a CONTEST in 1980, announced on the editorial page, as to what to call these new machines that they didn't want to call "mountain bikes." Two issues later they announced the "winner." The new name was "All-Terrain Bike," abbreviated to ATB. Or, in French, Velo tout-Terrain, VTT.

Unfortunately, the name Gary and I had chosen was less of a mouthful, and as far as the cycling world was concerned, it was the name of the sport and the machinery. It wasn't long before other bicycle companies picked up on the fact that we could not prevent them from calling the mass produced copies of the bikes Gary and I sold "mountain bikes," lower case and two words.

So we added a term to the dictionary. One other term we added was "Unicrown." Charlie Cunningham and Steve Potts had come up with a way to eliminate the fork crown by bending the top of the blade and attaching directly to the steerer. Since it was a one-piece construction that replaced the fork crown, I came up with the name "Unicrown," with the idea that we would protect that name a little better than our company name, and stamp a little unicorn logo on our product.

This took place just as Gery and I parted company, and Gary did not follow up on the trademark. In addition, the design spread all over the industry, but since it was one of those "old is new" things that had actually been done before, the modern designers could not patent it. But the name stuck.

That is, plainly, complete anglo-centric tosh as it suggests only folk who speak English go mountain biking.

The letter "K" does not appear in the Italian alphabet. A literal translation of "mountain bike" would be "bicicleta de montagna."

They don't call it that any more than we call them ATBs. In Italy they still call it a mountain bike, even if they have to borrow a letter from our alphabet to do it.

I'd love to see that museum, we could do with one over here with some of the early UK bikes in - Overbury Pioneer, 'proper' Muddy Fox etc.

I was doing just what the Repack guys were doing, but in a much less skilled manner, about 5 years later. Amazing what you can do with a pile of old steel tourers and your mates dads welding kit! Although the 2-into-1 tandem experiment was a major fail, still have scars from that! Used to bend a lot of forks too.

Wonderful looking place, hope to make it over one day. Looks like a great get together to give it a grand opnening too. Thanks for sharing.

If you're further north, there is another excellent cycle museum on Bainbridge Island in Seattle, well worth a look if you're in the area.
[url= http://www.classiccycleus.com/ ]http://www.classiccycleus.com/[/url]
It's attached to a fine bike store too.

If you're further north, there is another excellent cycle museum on Bainbridge Island in Seattle, well worth a look if you're in the area.
http://www.classiccycleus.com/
It's attached to a fine bike store too.

Great tip! I hadn't heard of that one. They are a little light on my era of MTB, but they do have a rare Cunningham bike. Allow me to return the favor.

Probably one of the best collections of historic mountain bikes is at First Flight Bicycles which is located in another terrible place for a bicycle museum, i.e. 3000 miles from where I live. Check out the Museum of Mountain Bike Art and Technology, [url= http://mombat.org/MOMBAT/ ]MOMBAT[/url].

Thanks for posting Charlie. I'm in San Francisco a fair bit so good to have a new destination. Made me smile when I saw your book on the stand down at the Ferry Building.

Thanks for the explanation of the ATB Charlie - sounds like I asked just the right person!

Wish you had opened a couple of weekends earlier! I had an opportunity to hire a racing bike from Blazing Saddles in San Francisco and took a ride out to Fairfax/Stinson/Muirwoods and back to Sausalito on the Thursday before you opened. Those were some of the best roads I've ever ridden, wishing I could take more time to explore elsewhere in the area.

Good luck with the museum, looked great from outside with my nose pressed up against the window 8)

I like the ATB term, but just because it my initials!!

I was born to MTB..... 😕

I like the term VTT (and the French pronunciation VayTayTay). I remember that when I was just getting into mountain biking in the late 80s, but young enough to be going on family holidays, my Dad was game enough to hire a couple of technicolour MBKs in the Pyrenees. I don't think he really 'got' VTT but I was happy!
The museum looks great - it's a great part of the world to ride, not necessarily because of the trails but the people and the culture.
Isn't there a small museum at Drumlanrig with an original Horst link bike?

Probably one of the best collections of historic mountain bikes is at First Flight Bicycles which is located in another terrible place for a bicycle museum, i.e. 3000 miles from where I live. Check out the Museum of Mountain Bike Art and Technology, MOMBAT.

Oooh, now that might just be doable this summer 😛

For a year or so we "bluffed" the entire industry, which assumed it was a trademark