[Closed] Tell me what I have just bought please (retro frame/bike ID help)

Raleigh dynatech.

I would guess at a Raleigh dyna tech of some description, but I'm not really sure on that.

Raleigh Dynatech?

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Lugs don't look quite right for a Dyna tech. Also I seem to recall they mostly had wishbone stays. Mine certainly did.

Not sure what else it could be though.

Dynatechs had proper head badges. There'd be some indication of one having been there, which I can't see. Also, weren't the bonded Dynatechs ti tubed?

My brother had those forks, he dropped some steps and the top-cap fired out of them and hit him in the neck.

I'd have said Raleigh too but that proves nothing. How does it ride?

Odd question but .....

Does the chainstay brace behind the BB adjoin both the stays or just one?

The curve brakes are off of a Kona as is the front canti hunger but it's clearly not a Kona.

Sorry, didn't have a chance to get back to the computer.

I've been googling dyna techs and can't see any that look completely right. The routing of the cables along the top of the top tube seems different to the dyna techs which seem to have cables more to the side of the tube.

The person I bought it off said it was "a lot" of money at the time, but to a casual cyclist that could mean £500 so I took that with a pinch of salt. It was also described as "custom made" in the ad, but I assume that she just meant it was built up from parts which, judging by the mix of makes, seems right. Bare in mind it was described as an "Oakley frame" due to the sticker on it, so I don't think too much can be taken from the description.

To answer some other points;
- Don't take too much from my use of the word "bonded". My knowledge extends to the fact that the blue bits of the frame stick to a magnet and the silver bits don't!
- No sign of a badge on the headtube.
- I don't know how it rides. It was dark when I got home and it is about three sizes too small for me. The gears are out of whack. The fork is less pogo-stick like than I was expecting. The brakes seems sharper than any cantis I can remember trying previously. The tyres seem to have not perished at all. All bearings seem nice and smooth.

Does the chainstay brace behind the BB adjoin nothing the stays or just one?

[img] [/img]

Definitely a hotch-potch build.

The Curve canti's are Kona '96 vintage, though seem to have black spring tensioners, normally were red on Kona's but were also available as aftermarket parts, front canti hanger is also of that vintage. Cranks are M569 which didn't come in until '97/'98 (had them on my '98 Kilauea), likewise, the tyres are '98 Kona vintage, let me know if you'd like to part with the tyres!

Looks exactly like the Raleigh M-Trax that my mate had at school in 94-95.

System 2 (handlebar) was a Trek brand for components.

My 1998 Stumpie M2 had those forks.
Didn't really like the bike until I swapped them for a set of Marzocchis and a front disc.

Long travel was, IIRC, 68mm elastomer damped.

That was 3x8 - although they could have upgraded in the mean time.

Looks exactly like the Raleigh M-Trax that my mate had at school in 94-95.

sadly not the ti one

http://cyclingfortransport.com/reviews/bikes/raleigh-m-trax-team-titanium-mountain-bike/

[img] [/img]

Looks like my old Raleigh m-trax with the paint stripped off the ti tubes

I'm happy to be proved wrong, but I don't think it's a Raleigh. I don't remember anyone manufacturing frames by bonding aluminium alloy tubes to steel lugs, and then tig welding the lugs....something just seems odd...

Thanks for the input everyone. Still bugging me what it is!

A couple more photos of some of the more distinctive bits, the seatclamp/rear canti hanger arrangement and the top tube cable bosses just in case they help;

[img] [/img]

[img] [/img]

Whatever it is, it's a fine looking and well made thing.

Reminds me of a Rock Lobster.

Something by Chas Roberts perhaps..

This ^^

I don't think it is a Raleigh.

The riveted cable stops look familiar though ..... Hmm.

The silver tubes look to be aluminium.

Get it on the golden era Facebook page, they'll be all over it.

Get it on the golden era Facebook page, they'll be all over it.

Will do. Ta.

Something by Chas Roberts perhaps..

[img] [/img]

Croydon's finest would never turn out a piece of shit* like that.

*Sorry, OP, but when compared to some CR welding, I hope you realise what I'm saying!

Ha! Yes I had a flick through a gallery of CR bikes and they are definitely a different species to my bike!

It was the top tube cable routing that gave me the impression of a Chas Roberts..

Looks like this no? 😛

[img] http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/download/file.php?id=152638 [/img]

TedC, I have a Kona Enter tyre if you're interested.

Well the Golden Era Facebook group drew a blank, just more rounds of:

- "It's [b][i]definitely, 100%[/i][/b] a Raleigh Dyna tech / M-Trax just like I had"
* me points out why it's not *
- "Oh well I guess it isn't"

Might give retrobike a shot.

Definitely a hotch-potch build.

This. The forks and drivetrain are late 90s, the cantis would be v brakes at that point, there are some Kona and some Trek bits on there.

Can't help with what the frame is, I know Trek did some bonded aluminium ones too but they didn't look like that and AFAIK didn't involve any steel. Of course with the mix of vintage on the parts, it could be a frame from just about any time and I imagine a lot of frame builders tried out things like that.

I'd bet on it being a Raleight frame of some flavour. The seat cluster looks like a M-Trax Duo-tech 500 or 600, but missing braze rack mounts - looks more like a Dyna-tech road frame cluster. The chainstay bridge isn't right for a production one either as they had a sort of half stub mudguard mount rather than a bridge.

What you did get in the early 90s was Raleigh Special Projects stuff which was made to measure (ordered via your local Raleigh dealer). If you went into a Raleigh dealer at the time and essentially wanted the best you could get then that's what you may well have ended up ordering. I wouldn't be at all surprised if this was a made-to-measure frame that happened to use an odd selection of the lugs they had available, which might also explain the top of the top-tube cable guides - which I've only seen on "special" frames made for sponsored riders and the like. I don't think anyone else was making lugged/bonded frames quite like this at the time. There were Alan and maybe Vitus lugged/bonded frames around, but the lugs were alu and look very different.

Univega dabbled with bonded frames too. Not sure if they did a mtb version though.

Is there such a thing as a database of frame number formats for different manufacturers?

The frame number of this thing is GC3050211 - which someone on the Facebook group reckons shows it is definitely not a Raleigh.

defo a raleigh Ti something- is it really flexy and wobbly?

Not a Raleigh - they didn't use lugs like that.

defo a raleigh Ti something- is it really flexy and wobbly?

Not flexy and I really don't think it is Ti.

Is it a Carrera Mission?

Dean used to mix and match materials a lot, but very rare and that doesn't quite look up to their standards.

Giant did a few lugged bikes, but more often carbon tubes.

Definitely a lot of Kona build kit.

I think the frame number does look Raleigh-ish. G would be where it was made (Gazelle), C would be February, 3 would indicate 1993, the rest would be the serial number. It's the same format as my 4 1980s Raleighs.

I thought Univega

Me too

I thought Univega

No dropped chainstay. Think they all had those BITD.

Carrera is a good call, I reckon....

This thread is great! It's like a late night pub debate but slower and much more interesting!

Where it will all end no one knows 😀

Raleigh special products used to make the odd prototype and frame in Alu. I would guess its something like that.

I'd wager it's a Trek 8700 from mid-late 90s

Wait, they were carbon? A Trek 8something?

I'd wager it's a Trek 8700 from mid-late 90s

No chance! Weren't they all carbon anyway?

Trek never did any lugged metal frames AFAIK.

Maybe it is a custom frame - note no bottle cage bosses. Surely all 90's standard MTB's came with bottle cage mounts?

^ You need to zoom in a bit 🙂

^ You need to zoom in a bit

Ah yeah - further rules out a Raleigh then, as they all seem to be on the seat tube...

It has one on the [i]back [/i]of the seat tube... see op's second post!

The one on the back of the seat post was when they tried some awful front mech cable routing. Along the TT down to a cam wheel fixed there and then back up to the front mech. Can't recall many people doing it which could narrow it down a bit.

Yep. Looks like a Raleigh of some sort. Probably isn't.

My money's on some sort of weird home-brew frankenbike frame. Perhaps somebody actually tried (and succeeded in) bonding aluminium tubes to (what was once) a fairly ordinary steel frame?

Or it's simply a Taiwanese oddity. Not to put too fine a point in it, but the build quality in some of those close ups appears to leave a little to be desired.

Why would anyone with knowledge of metals knowingly design something with steel and ali held together?

Looks like a fun hack bike though, OP!

Carrera Mission

Seem to be lots of subtle differences to mine.

Univega

Got a model I can google? Initial searches aren't bringing up anything obviously similar.

Mainly seems we are back to "It's a Raleigh" and "it can't be a Raleigh" though 🙂

Retrobike thread here if you are interested; http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=357010

Has it got any spoons involved...

I think it's far newer than 1992/93 as suggested on Retro bike. 1.125" headset suggests 1995-96 to me.

IME, Raleigh Dyna Tech lugs were cast, whereas the ones in the pics are welded. I know that Raliegh did do some cheaper frames that used similar technology (Duotec?), and there's their USA stuff that never got sold in the UK, but I still don't think it's a Raleigh.

Trouble is, the bike pictured actually does ring a distant bell, but I can't remember where/when it was I saw it.

I'm 99% certain I have seen one before though. It's bugging me now! 😡

My old Raleigh Mirage was a 1990-1991 (the purple one) - that had a Tioga Avenger 1.125" threaded headset, so the size was about pre-95. Could be retro-fitted threadless headset.

Its Probably some early On One prototype, is the seatpost a good fit as that would be a dead giveaway 😉

Where is the frame number stamped?
And can you take a photo of it and post it?

Some manufacturers put theirs in special places, or they appeared on certain parts of the BB.

Could be retro-fitted threadless headset.

Aye, true.

I think its a early merlin special with a build kit i can remember the adds for these and the carbon version's in the old mags...might be merlin or some other company my mate had the carbon alu frame.

[b] paging pyschobiker [/b]

Over on the facebook thread someone posted a pic of a Claude Butler that looks very similar (though still different, the scallop at the top of the seat tube on mine, and the rear canti hanger arrangement). It's the closest hit so far anyway. A bit of reverse Google image searching actually shows the image posted on facebook (not by the owner), originated from a old thread on here!
http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/when-did-you-get-your-first-mtb/page/3#post-3786326

So, psychobiker are you out there and do you have any other info other that it's a Claude Butler?

Here's the image;
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