[Closed] Tell me about... Rohloffs

I've had one for years got it for new ht build years ago but just did not get on with it off road.
But after getting fed up with it sat in my spare room I rebuilt it into a 29er wheel and have it on salsa el mar and works very well. And can't see why I stopped using it in the first
Place.

Can't remember what gearing its useing

I saw one recently at a bike show that had been opened up to show you how they work. They are an impressive piece of kit and easy to maintain. If you keep up with the oil change they should last a lifetime.

Over a 2x10 low end gear system there are about the same weight. They only get heavier vs normal gears as you start to spend more money.

Because they last a long time its well worth considering picking up a 2nd hand one.

have it on salsa el mar

Funny you should say that. Do you have the special NDS alternator dropout?

Yep I did splash out on the drop out , makes it very simple

Had one for about 3 years but sold it . Negatives outweighed the positives for me .

Negatives
Expensive
Much heavier than a regular geared set up despite what they say
Noticeable drag particularly in the lower 7 gears which use a reducer sprocket
Noisy in the lower 7 gears
Not maintainance free - mine had to go back to the factory twice , although both times it was fixed for free .
Have to use twist shifter which I like but many don't

Positives
Ability to change gear while standing still
No rear mech to bash

Biggest mistake I made.
All the shit about the more you ride them the less draggy they get. 😆

Two bearing changes later and it still dragged like a dead fat ****er hanging off the back on the chain off the Titanic.
Oh and still had play in the bearings. 😐

Did I mention the creaking?

Torque arm/Rohloff specific drop out/monkeybone they all creaked like a bastard in the lower gears when the torque switched direction. 🙁

I had one on a Ti hardtail for about 2 years.

I actually got on with it reasonably well - it did everything it should, and I found the range of gears was good. Compared to a 3x9 setup I figured it was 1 gear short, either at the top end or at the bottom, depending on the ratio you use. IIRC I opted for a chainring/ sprocket combo that gave me the bottom end, and tbh I rarely if ever found myself spinning out, even on tarmac.

The residuals on them are excellent; I bought one secondhand on ebay, and sold it 2 years later for about £50 less. In that time I did an oil change myself and had no issues - although the shifter was looking a bit worn by the end of it.

The reason I sold it in the end was not because of any inherent wrongness, but because I just didn't love it. It did the opposite of 'make the trail come alive' - where on a regular geared hardtail I could pop the back wheel over things, and shift the balance of the bike around, with the Rohloff it was very stable and planted, and felt much less responsive.

I don't dispute the weight comparisons - I think the Rohloff is supposed to be about the same weight all-in as an XT 3x9 setup - but with derailleurs that weight's spread across the bike. With a Rohloff, 90% of it is sat on the back axle, and IME you could feel it.

I switched back to 'regular' gears, even thought it felt like a step backwards, and just found myself enjoying riding more.
But everyone's riding is different, so it could be right up your alley. You should definitely try it; as above, get one secondhand, and if you don't get on with it you can always sell it on.

singlespeedstu - Member
...All the shit about the more you ride them the less draggy they get...

I think it's true.

The trouble is you have to put up with several thousand miles of running them in. 🙂

I hated the feel of mine, and I don't like noise from anywhere on my bike so the coffee grinder noises in low gear were a big put off.

On the other hand my brother has done about 15,000 miles on his and it's sweet. Probably best to buy a well used one!

Opinions vary 😀

About half the bikes I do are Rohloff equipped. They're not perfect - nothing is - but they're about as close as a bicycle transmission system gets. For most people, the only maintenance they need is a yearly oil change, new oil seals every 5+ years! and occasional sprockets and cables (though much less often than other systems). My own personal hub is 9 years old, and has had about 20 minutes work total in that time.

Sure, a few go wrong - over the years, I've probably had half a dozen or so that had to go back to Germany - but Rohloff are very good at sorting problems for free.

Downsides? They are heavier than a derailleur system, and the twist shifter isn't for everyone. Efficiency is an interesting one - according to all the scientific measurements, they're about as efficient as a derailleur, however subjectively some people find them more draggy. I think it might be that they do make more noise in some gears (especially when new) and people consciously or subconsciously equate noise with drag.

I switched back to 'regular' gears, even thought it felt like a step backwards, and just found myself enjoying riding more.

Just about sums it up.
I really wanted to love my Hoff but at the end of the day it was a bit shit.

The trouble is you have to put up with several thousand miles of running them in.

You've got through more bearings than all my hundreds of Rohloff customers combined...

Downsides? They are heavier than a derailleur system, and the twist shifter isn't for everyone. Efficiency is an interesting one - according to all the scientific measurements, they're about as efficient as a derailleur, however subjectively some people find them more draggy. I think it might be that they do make more noise in some gears (especially when new) and people consciously or subconsciously equate noise with drag.

Not very scientific but I know I was slower compared to my riding buddies when on the Rohloff equipped bike .

 

Got my first one a week ago, 120 miles in and I think it's brilliant,
Yes you do notice the rear wheel doesn't spin as freely as a normal bike but it still spins fairly well.
I bought it on a complete build and the gear numbers were set up backwards, but a quick you tube video search showed how easy it was to swap back.
I'm sold on it (atm)

I'm sold on it (atm)

Keep repeating "it'll get better, It'll get better"

Then sell it 'cause it pisses you off so much. 8)

I bought it on a complete build and the gear numbers were set up backwards

I've been using one for over 8 years on my winter (now) hard tail. I used it as a main all year bike until a few years ago. You get used to the weight concentration on the rear wheel (a bit harder to bunny hop but still doable). The perceived drag is something you get used to too, horses for courses in my opinion as gear 11 is direct drive and more efficient than a normal geared system - get the timing right and out sprint your mates - well that may say more about me than anything else! ;0)

I'm so glad I've got one, in the winter it shifts silky smooth no matter what. I've raced it (done ok if I don't mind saying myself), jumped and single tracked it mainly.

There are negatives, weight and cost mainly. In over 8 years and I do ride a lot! it has been back to Rohloff three times all outside warranty - all it cost me was the carriage out there.

Gearing 38 x 16 (sprockets reversible)

I would say they are great but not perfect and judging by the amount of comments against, not for everybody. Do your research and make sure it's for you.

according to all the scientific measurements, they're about as efficient as a derailleur

Hmm. I've read articles to the contrary. I seem to remember a figure in the mid to high 80%s effeciency. A standard setup is in the high 90%s efficient IIRC if your chain line is straight - this drops to similar to a Rohloff if you use an extreme chain line.

My mate rides a Moulton with a non Rohloff hub gear and he complains bitterly about the drag. He's honest, and a pretty handy rider too (faster than me) so I have no reason to doubt him.

So called custom bike builder can't even cable up a Hoff hub.

The majority of more complex Rohloff repairs I do are caused, not by a fault with the hub, but by an error when fitting or servicing by another shop. Bodging the wrong tool when swapping the sprocket, holding a delicate alloy part with mole grips, using the wrong gear cables and cracking the shifter, stuff like that.

Basically, there's a breed of bike shop mechanic who don't RTFM 😉

it has been back to Rohloff three times

Basically, there's a breed of bike shop mechanic who don't RTFM

i'd have another in a shot on a commuter bike. never again on an offroader though.

a non Rohloff hub gear

So not comparable in any way to a Rohloff 😉

Efficiency figures (admittedly these are from Rohloff, but similar to others I've seen):

[img] [/img]

Cabling up a Hoff isn't exactly complicated though is it.

You'd think so, but the old outer cables with the separate liners would catch out people - people fitted the liner then the end cap, instead of the other way around.

First was a very minor oil leak through the Q/R and I was keen to get it sorted as it was just outside warranty.

Second, was some wheel movement side to side which although didn't affect anything I was again keen to get sorted as it cost so much. New driver bearings, oil seals etc fitted free of charge including return carriage.

Third, was two years later I did get some intermittent gear slippage. Again returned it, they re-shimmed the gears after the amount of use I put through it. Fitted new driver bearings and oil seals again free of charge and carriage. Main hub bearings are in tolerance although I have suspicions they will need replacing at some point.

Basically, it goes back every two/three years for an overhaul/adjust and at £60 insured carriage one way I think it is a bargain.

I change the cables every 18 months or so, and I still get caught out 50% of the time and get them around the wrong way - easy enough to correct just another 15 minutes of your time.

@ Ben.
Makes me wander how they cope then the indexing is adjusted in the shifter not with a shit load of play even at the shifter box.

Main hub bearings are in tolerance although I have suspicions they will need replacing at some point.

Not that i see them that much any more. But when there were a few folks trying to use them offroad every one I ever saw had side to side play in it.

So not comparable in any way to a Rohloff

How do Rohloffs differ from other hub gears then? Teflon coated cogs or something?

Mines 8 years old gets used all year round on my off road commuter in all weathers gets an oil change once a year, 2 minutes of attention to the chain a week if conditions are really bad and is still running the original shifter cables. I get 3 years from a chain and sprocket and 6 from the chainring which I reverse when I change the chain and sprocket.
If you want gears and a bike to ride in the worst winter conditions day in and day out and would rather sit down with a hot cup of tea or a cold beer rather than clean and lube your transmission there is nothing better. And get some rigid forks as well.

avdave2 +1

First one's over 10 years old now, xc, dh, two trips to the Alps, in a word bombproof.
Changed oil every year, new set of seals after 7 years and new cables when changing over to a new frame.
Drag ..... new laser engraved shell version feels good out of the box, old sticker versions feels draggy compared to a cassette setup but the reality is that a grippy tyre will cause more actual drag.

Got 3 x Rohloff, an Alfine 11 & 8 and I can't see a reason other than cost or weight why I would wish to go back to a standard setup.

Desperate to try a pinion 18, may just be the perfect solution.:)

How do Rohloffs differ from other hub gears then? Teflon coated cogs or something?

Various ways - running in a sealed oil bath (though Alfines mostly do this now), needle roller bearings on all the planetary gears instead of plain sleeves, and a more logical gear layout.

(By that, I mean that it's a simple system. The simplest is a 3-speed, step-down, straight through, step-up. Add another epicyclic and you turn the steps into 3, so get 7 gears. Add an under drive and you get 14. Getting 8 or 11 gears is a more complex gear path)

would rather sit down with a hot cup of tea or a cold beer rather than clean and lube your transmission

I have no idea why people think it takes hours to clean a bike. I simply jetwash mine, carefully, and I don't think I'd do anything different if I had a Rohloff. It'd still take the same amount of time.

Although to be fair, where I live is mostly gritty mud rather than grassy clay, so I don't get wattle and daub stuck in the mech.

Anyone know if the Nuvinci one is more efficient?

Yep I did splash out on the drop out , makes it very simple

What did you do about cable routing?

I have a rohloff and an alfine 8

The alfine 8 is a far superior ride use mine almost daily.

Infact i havnt even fitted the rohloff to my bike for over a year now....(its set up to switch between ss and rohloff in about 10 minutes)

As stu says feels like your hauling a pig around , it killed any skip in the rear end and made it feel like you were riding into every bump rather than over it.

Last time i used it was on a tour of shetland , orkney and back to aberdeen from thurso

The ever popular Simon Barnes had one a good few years ago and it went back to the factory a couple of times due to water ingress. I really don't think they are cut out for Lakeland riding, perhaps somewhere drier...

singlespeedstu - Member
"The trouble is you have to put up with several thousand miles of running them in."

So I got through two sets of bearings by not putting any miles on it?

Must be those mighty single speed legs of yours... 🙂

I was just parroting what my brother says. I don't think I've even got 500 miles on mine. Keep meaning to drag it out for the fatbike. That ultralow gear would be great in the snow.

Sorry bit slow and not a great image
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my hoff is the only gears I run anymore.

I move it around between 3 29er/700c frames depending on my plans.
Mainly it stays in my Pompetamine now as I keep my MTB SS now.

I think it's a great bit of kit. reliable, effective, such low maintenance requirement.

I will keep mine till I keel over.

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Ive used a couple of differnet methods to attach it to my On-One slotted drop out frames. All have worked fine.
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Creaking? never experienced it.

Oil leaks - my oldest one needs a seal change but it must be over 7 years old. (Is this still a back to Germany job or can Ison do it in the UK?). A bit of seepage but nothing to worry about on the others. Katie's Alfine 11 has been back 3 times for pissing oil everywhere without being resolved.

Bearings? Every time I think mine are worn it turns out to be something else on the bike that's loose. Based on SFB's experience they don't like being fully submerged but that's not what mountain biking is about for very many people.

They do work better if run in properly - I always put them on a commuter for 6 months to get a few 1k's of miles on before using them offroad.

I rode them on Helius CC/AC's for years and they were fine. Have now switched to a Pinion gearbox and the weight balance *is* notably better but it wasn't a problem in the back wheel. It does alter the balance of the bike but on a hardtail it puts the balance point back where it is on a rigid bike. On a full-sus it's easily adapted to - you can add as much extra weight to the back wheel with a DH tyre.

Cost used to be a real barrier but lifetime costs of either Rohloff or Pinion look a bargain now that you can run to £350 on an 11 speed cassette and chain.

of the bike but on a hardtail it puts the balance point back where it is on a rigid bike.

What forks do you run ? Lead cast lowers ?

What forks do you run ? Lead cast lowers ?

Bombers 🙂

Just as a quick sample though -
On-one rigid CroMo fork - 1200g
A set of Fox Float 32's was about 1700g the last time I looked.

The alfine 8 is a far superior ride use mine almost daily.

Conversely my Rohloff has around 10,000km on it and has never missed a beat*, whereas my Alfine 8 might have done 200k and it's full of rusty water in a Madison service center somewhere right now.

I suspect it is more suited to touring though, it is possible to "jam the synchromesh" and get stuck between gears, as well as forcing you through gear 14 for every shift. Both of these are only problems if you're desperately mashing the pedals at the same time as cranking the shifter all the way around. It is also pretty weighty. TBH though, if you're dropping £1k on a hub, buy a top end crank set and wheel components and you'll likely come out pretty good for weight.

I will never tour on anything else again.

*Except when I bust it's oil seal wrapping a bungee cord around it at 30km/h - but:
.
.
.
wait for it.....
.
.
.
They fixed it for free. In Australia. In 3 days.

My bike was 24lbs all in . Still rode like a dog due to the weight in the back wheel...same bike with a pro 2 ss in the rear was much better to ride... Skippy light and surged forward

Interesting how some peoples perceptions are different. In its original thorn frame it felt like i was riding my old downhill bike just with a steeper head angle

Might go dig mine out the back of the garage and throw it at my bike again and retry it. ( wasnt for lack of trying , mines used to commute and its done a few solo puffers both undr me and my mate - where ill admit it never missed a beat, it just amplified every bump.

My alfines got 5000km on it i opened it once to find it sparklingly clean inside so put it back together without disturbing it and carried on.

Oil leaks - my oldest one needs a seal change but it must be over 7 years old. (Is this still a back to Germany job or can Ison do it in the UK?).

Simon, I purchased the tool and seals from SJS cycle and did it myself.
Sprocket removal tool also required.
If your Midlands based I would be happy to do the seal change for you.

Oil leaks - my oldest one needs a seal change but it must be over 7 years old. (Is this still a back to Germany job or can Ison do it in the UK?).

Ison? Heck, I can do that here in Glasgow 😉

The paper gaskets can be swapped in 5 minutes with only a Torx wrench, the lip seals need a special Rohloff tool which good dealers will have.

I've had a 'hoff for nearly 6 years now, bought secondhand off here.
Its been back to the factory for new bearings twice, fixed for free and a letter of apology that it had failed! I think I've discovered the source of the failure too -the wheel wasn't dished correctly and I was aligning the sliding dropouts by getting the rim central between the chainstays, effecitvly setting it at an angle. Once I fixed the wheelbuild, I've had no more bearing problems.

I love it. The stationary gear changing is brilliant, I've got used to the weight off the back and I don't notice the drag.

I do want to try a Pinion though.

the lip seals need a special Rohloff tool which good dealers will have.

Paper Gaskets I'd done but I think this one now needs the lip seals doing.

Ah - interesting. I'd not seen a tool or seals for sale on Ison's trade pricelist last time I looked(some time back) so assumed it was something Rohloff insisted on doing at the factory (like fitting Gates sprockets for example).

Ah - tool still doesn't show on Ison's site but SJS have them. Not a bad price as these things go.

I was kind of right about it being a back to the factory job - "Only newer hub seals with an outer metal ring (Serial No. 25400 onwards) can be replaced ...using the tool"

The hub that needs doing is 27712 so only just in the DIY range but I think it's the oldest of ours.

http://www.rohloff.de/en/technology/workshop/tools/hub_seal_press_in_tool/index.html

I ran one for 3 years and switched back to regular drivetrains about 3.5 years ago.

They definitely have a place- if you do longer rides on a hardtail that is light in the first place they are great as they reduce maintenance (a bit- the cables they come with are a liability with the liner prone to being pulled into the shifter, making shifting almost impossible) and are generally unnoticeable. I think if your bike weighs about 24lbs in the first place you've not much to lose.

I fell out of love with it for a number of reasons, including-

- Wheel removal is a bit of a faff with the box having to be removed all the time. Not the end of the world though.

- The extra weight if you ride a lot of technical trails on a hefty all mountain bike (I ran it on an Evil Sovereign and weight with the Rohloff was about 33lbs, when I swapped to a regular drivetrain it was 29lbs) the extra weight pushes the bike weight up to an uncomfortable level, making rides more difficult especially when combined with...

-...the extra drag. If you ride a lot of steep hills you'll be in the 1-7 gears a lot, where the drag is. It is noticeable and can be demoralizing. The extra efficiency of a regular drivetrain is definitely noticeable.

In the end, lower weight and less drag were the main reasons I ditched it and I've not looked back. I rode with another guy who had one and his has also gone in favour of a 1x10 drivetrain.

If you do the bulk of your riding in a place that gets muddy and has more rolling hills or flat terrain and your bike is a decent weight and can live with £50 oil changes plus cables every year (I found cables last just as long as with a regular drivetrain) and the upfront cost then go for it.

I also suffered from random bearing failures similar to the poster above.

I bought one and wanted to love it but i hated it - the drag was far more than on a standard bike - ok it was new 2000 miles etc etc but it really felt bad - like pulling a sack of potatoes. Just don't get it!

Gave up in the end.

Now here's the thing - I run 1x10 now (SLX) which costs me about about £50.00 to change over once a year (cassette, chain, front ring). Runs perfectly in the mud, great efficiency, no problem at all and works much better.

No brainer!

DC

I fully understand that some people really don't like Rohloff's and I understand why but always surprised by the misinformation -

£50 oil changes

£50 buys you oil for a lifetime. An oil change kit is [url= http://www.sjscycles.co.uk/rohloff-full-oil-change-kit-8410-prod12171/ ]£17[/url] rrp but you can re-use the syringe and buy the oil cheaper in bulk (It looks like you can [url= http://www.evanscycles.com/products/rohloff/speedhub-oil-250ml-ec045492 ]buy 250ml quantities[/url] rather than litres now)

@orangeboy - have you routed the shifter cables along with the back brake hose?

Yep just cable tied the whole lot together but the bend is a little tighter than I would like but don't notice when I'm riding

Mine's 14 years old and working fine. My mates don't drop me on the climbs but I don't think it would be an advantage in an XC race. Trail riding i dont notice the difference. One of the main benefits is being able to change gear without turning the cranks - like when you drop down a steep decent and are met with a sudden incline. No mashing and crunching of sprockets.

I've got 2, the first one being circa 9 years old and the second is about 6 years old.

bencooper: Can you remember when I bought them?

1 of them was back to the factory last year for gear slippage issues and got repaired FOC. The other one has run without a hitch...other than a few drops of oil which was easily resolved with new gaskets.

Both are now on HT's. One on a Cotic Solaris 29er with Paragon swinging dropouts and the other on a On One inbred with horizontal dropouts. Both are used across all types of trails but mostly almost daily on techy rocky / rooty trails.

The first hub was originally used almost everyday (inc winter) for commuting on a 18 mile round trip across a mixture of trails / roads and most weekends for thrashing around local trails. For those of you who commute through traffic you'll know that traffic dirt / film is far worse on a bike than good clean mud. With the old XT system, if I didn't give it some TLC every weekend it would jam by day 8 or 9. Now I never have to do anything other than hose down the bike and give the chain a wee wipe with a dry lub once it's dry. It's just something I never have to think about now.

I’ve competed in several 50+ mile off road races through some of the best (worst) terrain Scotland has and I've stopped counting the number of other competitors who who are cursing their fancy XTR / X0 systems that can’t shift properly because of the mud! I did the WHW over 2 days last year without a hitch.

On balance I usually change the cables out every 2 years or so and carry out a 6 monthly oil change as opposed to waiting the full year.

As you can tell I'm a big fan but here's a few thoughts on some of the weaknesses etc

Noise: Yes, it does make a little whirring noise in gears 5 - 7 but if you compare that to a normal system when you try and change gear quickly or when it's full of mud, there's no comparison!

Weight: It’s a little on the heavy side but let's be honest here, we've all spent time and money shaving grams off our bikes and then put on 5lbs over the xmas hols!

Cost: It's expensive and I spent ages making my mind up before I finally took the plunge but it's more than paid for itself in terms of ease of use, reliability and peace of mind on the trail.

I'll never go back to the old way as they are the best bike related investment I’ve made.

I use a metal braided outer brake cable - available from CRC, and xtr inner gear wires. I find this combo the most durable (18mtns-2years) and the smoothest.

I run the hub on a Thorn 853 Enduro hard tail, and the whole thing comes in at 30 pounds or a fraction under. I have had it about 28 but it wasn't durable. It has a place in the winter mainly, and also the summer - I used to run it all year round. But, my geared (xtr) hard tail is so much quicker, or I think so after a winter of riding the Thorn I always feel I have a few months fitness advantage from doing so. FWIW I can't recall ever being dropped on a climb riding the Rohloff'd Thorn - maybe my memory is bad or I ride with slow people..

bencooper: Can you remember when I bought them?

Nope, but I think somewhere there's a list of serial numbers and year of manufacture, could look it up if you're interested.

Next daft question: what cranks, and how easy is it to get the chain line right?

Any cranks you like, and pretty simple - usually just lining up with the big ring works fine.

Chain line is over-rated anyway.

Personaly I use rs7 or older xt hollowtec as I like internal bb

But does not need to be anything special

Looking for something else, I found the list of serial numbers:

000000 - 000400 1998
000401 - 002700 1999
002701 - 006500 2000
006501 - 012000 2001
012001 - 018800 2002
018801 - 027700 2003
027001 - 038500 2004
038501 - 050049 2005
050050 - 065000 2006
065001 - 081600 2007
080601 - 100000 2008
100001 - 115900 2009
115901 - 135800 2010
135801 - 153000 2011
153001 - 171000 2012

I've just heard back - my Alfine is trashed.

Nice one ben , mines is 2005 then number 50039

My cable-routing detail:

[img] [/img]

Silver braided Jagwire brake outer into v-brake noodles, with Jagwire gear inners. I've got another pair of v-brake noodles at the shifter end too to get rid of the silly big cable loop. Works a treat and keeps it tidy.

I rode bikes with derailleurs for 15 years, then a Rohloff-equipped bike (in fact two or three frames worth) for 9 years, and both over the last two years (not at the same time :). There may be disadvantages to internal hub gears, but perceived drag, and weight and its distribution are not really amongst them, currently wheel removal due to the horizontal dropouts annoys me more...

Half a pound more at the rear? People who now run 1x10 don't complain that suddenly the weight distribution of their bikes changed as they lost front derailleur and chainrings. Also, the weight is thankfully in the hub and not further away, a heavy rim makes a bigger difference (to acceleration). Drag? Some friends still believe I have a little eMotor in there, and I am not that fast. I also think that a super-tacky Evo triple-Nano compound stick-to-rocks tyre creates more drag than a Rohloff, if the latter does at all.

The only reason why I changed chainrings (and sprockets) in the last few years was to try slightly higher/lower gears, and change 'the looks', wear is hardly an issue. Which is the main point, with a few oil changes over the years, one return journey to Rohloff for a service, and no maintanance other than oiling the chain even after very muddy rides, I can spend more time actually riding my bike rather than servicing it, and that's what counts most to me.

Gratuitous pic of my latest build and cable routing (since ir_b posted his):
[img] [/img]

If I got one it would be to create a mud proof drivetrain, with a belt.

MidlandTrailQuestGraham did exactly that. He also put a Lefty on his, and possibly gone 29er, in an effort to outniche everyone else... 😉

I rode a Rohloff equipped Airnimal for about 12,000 miles. Only annual oil changes and one set of cables in that time.

If I got one it would be to create a mud proof drivetrain, with a belt.

The guy on the Rohloff stand at Handmade showed me a rear gates carrier that had come of a Rohloff. You could have shaved with it it was that worn and sharp. Gates now supply steel carriers as a result of wear. Combine that with a snubber and the extra weight to both stiffen and allow the rear triangle to split and there are no weight savings over a chain. The belts are expensive and have to be handled carefully and can break in use if stones get picked up with mud into the drivechain. I believe MTG has broken at least one belt. I only spend 2 minutes a week on my chain in the worst winter conditions and it's used off road to get me to work every day. The drivechains already filthy so I can't see a single advantage to the belt off road.

2005 here too according to Ben's year/part numbers list.

The reason I want a belt is because I hate the thought of all that mud grnding my chain away. It's not about cleaning as such, more the destruction of a part.

I might install a chain guard though if I was using Rohloff, to keep it clean 🙂

I've had 4 years from a chain without it being ground away. The first cheap 9 speed SRAM one lasted over 3 and I only changed that because I thought I should. It would almost certainly have gone on a lot longer. I'm sure anything that will wear a chain will wear a belt. I damaged my year old chain recently and replaced it with another £10 kmc one keeping the same chainring and sprocket. It was a little noisier for the first few miles but is running perfectly now. It turned out that the original chain was ok it was the link that I'd used for the life of 2 chains that was on its way out.

Did I mention I've got a belt drive ss too? One day I'll merge them together....

molgrips it looks like MTG thinks I may be right. [url= http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/belt-drive-i-t-may-be-time-to-admit-defeat ]Thread here[/url]

Bah.. Shame that. My search continues. I still thing I would like to fab some kind of chain guard if I had a hub gear.

i think id just buy and fit a hebie chainglider if i was looking for a solution to a problem that doesnt really exist.

I can see the point of a chainglider on the road - even a belt drive but come on half the fun of a mountain bike is being a kid again and getting covered in mud.

i think id just buy and fit a hebie chainglider if i was looking for a solution to a problem that doesnt really exist.

Having my chain covered in crap is a problem. It causes shitloads of wear.

In response to simon_nicolai's post, my details about 50 quid oil changes is not misinformation. That is how much they cost at the dealer I got mine from. I didn't want to do them myself, regardless of how easy it is perceived to be.

I'll charge you £100 to pump up your tyres if you like?

It's not really fair to blame Rohloff because you were stung by a shop 😉