[Closed] super glue instead of loctite - will I die?

Superglue slighty more brittle (%15) but fine ..... I use it with no problems (chartered engineer)

You what??? 🙄

Loctite is a brand....they make threadlock compounds and also super glue.

Which bit do you need it for? I don't use threadlock on any cranksets, I just make sure they're nipped up tight. I wouldn't use superglue though, regardless. I get the feeling it wouldn't be that effective either as a glue or a threadlock in this application.

It won't come loose in 10 miles without threadlock. So I wouldn't worry about it.

Could just use no loctite, that's what I do with no problem (software engineer ;))

Can I add "Charted Engineer" to my post too? (Seriously)

However, I did cop out of the welding and adhesives module at uni all those years ago 😳

I assumed he was talking about not having any 609 for the bearings.

Superglue will be fine temporarily but it deteriorates when it comes in contact with water.

However, as said above, no threadlock is fine. If the correct torque is applied and thread condition is ok so that it achieve designed bolt tension, it will never come loose.

Is this why so many engineers walk into bike shops announce that they are engineers and that anything you say Is probably just a load of toss then proceed to show you how they have feked the job .
Super glue 🙄 🙂

Ok you could try loctite 601 bearing retaining compound - but honestly, I build tanks, uav's and silly stuff for the queens army and loctite 401,405,601 & superglue (cyanoacrylate) is great

Thanks all, I was talking about the bolts on non drive side crank, should have said.I'll torque them up and leave early to be on the safe side

Nonk you are a tool 🙂

😆
And an engineer as it happens 🙂

[...]superglue (cyanoacrylate) is great

Agreed - I've just glued my thumb back together (deliberately) with it.

Yeah right 🙂

Wonder why Shimano just give torque values and no 'threadlock here' directions in their tech docs....? 🙄

I assume the Chartered Eng up there ^ is a Civil Eng 🙂

nonk - Member
Is this why so many engineers walk into bike shops announce that they are engineers and that anything you say Is probably just a load of toss then proceed to show you how they have feked the job .

Only Software Engineers 😉

No I am honest 😀
Served some of my time at vickers in fact
My career never took off though 😆

Ha 🙂 idiots all of you - all I can say is in afghan we used superglue all the time - it's fine trust me.

As a Vicar maybe.... 😆

<edit> Cyano in Afghan? For its original purpose mebbies... 😥

Qinetiq, BAE & 8 years in REME here

doncorleoni - Member
Ha idiots all of you - all I can say is in afghan we used superglue all the time - it's fine trust me.

Is that the kit we get in for repair then?

Legend - what kit ? The UTD?

Buck53 - bringing engineers together since 1983. 😉

Lets go back to the original op's question - yea superglue is absolutely fine to use instead of threadlock I assure you.

So which is the best loctite to use on a bike? 222?

Personally 243 for me due to tolerance to oil and other stuff

blutack FTW

(social engineer)

In nearly 40 years of riding and maintaining bikes I've never even owned a tube of thread lock. But then I'm not an engineer 🙂 I find that the biggest problem on a bike is making sure the damn bolts can be undone again when you want them to be.

What's wrong with a dab of grease like us unqualified commoners use?

Rob (5 GCSEs)

Served some of my time at vickers in fact
My career never took off though

Did it submerge instead?

Will Superglue actually set on steel or aluminium?
(non-engineer) 😀

What kind of crank is it anyway? Without that information, surely we are pissing in the wind? (sound engineer)

Get some anti-tracking varnish on too just to be safe

Don, whatever kit we make and the squaddies break!

[img] http://stickymoments.typepad.com/.a/6a0128770ad0fb970c0162ffcaa4f7970d-800wi [/img]

What's wrong with a dab of grease like us unqualified commoners use?

I'll have you know I also just use grease*, and I'm a software engineer.

*except on the Campag UT cranks on my roadie, where after struggling long and hard with my principles I used Loctite as directed in the instructions.

Nothing rob cos its your bike and you look after it so it will be reet
But if you are preping something for someone else you want to make sure it will do what it's supposed to with out being looked after.

The op is worrying about nowt really as he clearly fettles his own bike so it will probably get checked long before it ever comes loose .

No one seem to take my comments seriously, I use to be an engineer specialised in threaded fasteners. (now middle management with a Orange 5 of course) I have a Master Degree in Mechanical Engineering and spent 4 years working out torques on critical bolts on engines. 😆

Back on topic:

For general bike maintenance, you should take notice of the following:

Thread lock is only useful if you haven't torque your bolts up properly.

Remember, it's clamping force that keeps your parts together, torque does not equal to clamping force

If you are experienced, a calibrated elbow is usually better than a torque wrench as torques are very low on bikes and you can very easily miss the click and end up damaging your components.

Always clean the thread before doing it back up. Ensure there is no thin oil on the thread and tighten to the specified torque. If the thread is dirty, even if it reach the specified torque, the clamping force will be low and it might come loose. If the thread is oily, it will be over tightened and damage your components.

A trick is to use copper slip. It's been experimentally proven that copper slip will return the thread friction coefficient very close to fresh threads. This is where the joint is designed to achieve the correct clamping force after tightening to the correct torque.

Thanks for reading.

I don't use copper slip on my bike (and some parts on my car) but I do use plenty on general car bolts. I do use ceramic based anti-seize that is safe for plastics and rubbers on the bike and some car areas.

As for superglue it will be fine but only use a tiny dab znd it will break away easily. But leaving remnants of dried broken glue on threads is not ideal for next time and should be cleaned off. Chances are it won't stick well anyway due to grease as shimano do put their lovely green grease in the crank bolt holes (I need to find who makes that grease as it is very good).

BUT you MUST make sure that the bolts are tight enough to begin with (ie torqued up correct) as it won't matter if your bolts are secure if they are not providing sufficient clamping force and the crank is fretting away on the splines.

I believe this be the stuff. 😀
http://www.dalescycles.com/index.php?option=shop&page=shop.product_details&product_id=1605&l=uk&utm_source=google&utm_medium=base

Or here.
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=24446

I use Marmite. The special XO stuff.

I use to be an engineer specialised in threaded fasteners.

Really? Because this is the sort of stuff I'd expect from somebody dosed up on cycling folklore rather than a professional:

Always clean the thread before doing it back up. Ensure there is no thin oil on the thread and tighten to the specified torque. If the thread is dirty, even if it reach the specified torque, the clamping force will be low and it might come loose. If the thread is oily, it will be over tightened and damage your components.

Now I might not have ever had a job where I had to get the right tension in threaded fasteners, however I am aware of the normal procedures used in industry (by those who actually know what they're doing). You appear to suggest that a dry thread is better than a lubricated one, when it is common knowledge that lubrication reduces the torque-tension scatter you get with dry threads because of the large variation in the friction. The correct quoted torque value should always be for a lubricated thread as that gives far better repeatability of tension - if necessary that torque value should be lower than for a theoretical dry thread to account for the decreased friction.

What's more you then compound that by suggesting ensuring there is no oil on the thread without detailing how you do that. The typical wipe of an oily thread with a cloth/rag leaves a thin film of oil which provides much the same lubricating effect under high torque/tension as a well oiled thread.

...but I did realise that amongst all this engineer waving, nobody had remembered to point out one fundamental to the OP.

Yes, you will die. Even loctite won't prevent that.

Just tighten it up extra mega tight so it won't come undone. Stand on the allen key.

Now I might not have ever had a job where I had to get the right tension in threaded fasteners, however I am aware of the normal procedures used in industry (by those who actually know what they're doing). You appear to suggest that a dry thread is better than a lubricated one, when it is common knowledge that lubrication reduces the torque-tension scatter you get with dry threads because of the large variation in the friction. The correct quoted torque value should always be for a lubricated thread as that gives far better repeatability of tension - if necessary that torque value should be lower than for a theoretical dry thread to account for the decreased friction.

What's more you then compound that by suggesting ensuring there is no oil on the thread without detailing how you do that. The typical wipe of an oily thread with a cloth/rag leaves a thin film of oil which provides much the same lubricating effect under high torque/tension as a well oiled thread.

Most critical bolts are of course tightened wet. Thread oiled, dried between washer and seating face and wet again between washer on bolt head. Standard procedure.

Don't forget we are talking about bolts going onto bicycles here which will be designed to be tightened dry. The torque specified by the manufacturer will be dry torque as well. I will be surprised if you haven't cause damage on your bike if you lube the threads/seating face and do them up to the specific torque!

The torque value for wet/dry thread is very different. Doing a wet joint up to dry torque will most likely cause damage.

For me, clean = oil free, perhaps I should have made that a bit clearer? I suggest copper slip anyway.

Don't forget we are talking about bolts going onto bicycles here which will be designed to be tightened dry.

Really? Shimano bolts don't generally come dry, so that seems unlikely. You're just reverse engineering cycling mythology there.

I will be surprised if you haven't cause damage on your bike if you lube the threads/seating face and do them up to the specific torque!

Nope - never damaged anything by overtorquing, despite lubing all fastenings. Even if torque specs are for dry bolts (which seems unlikely), I'm sure there's a substantial safety margin allowed for ham fisted mechanics on most cycling parts.

Oh, and here's a tech note from the company one of my most torque critical parts is made by - a company you'd think knows what they're talking about http://www.syntace.com/misc/popup/detail.cfm?pk=1211

That link for syntace is nothing todo with bolt torque or thread locking compounds
Never ever put that assembly paste stuff on a thread

Read the bit at the bottom, orangeboy

Can open... Worms everywhere...

I grease those bolts and nip them up by hand without a torque wrench. They've never come loose in all the time I've had HT-2 cranks, so maybe 4 or 5 years. You'll be fine without threadlock or superglue. The only things I'd threadlock on a bike would be the fasteners holding the suspension pivots together.
Ex bike mechanic FWIW, and 15 years designing equipment for the oil industry 😉

i wipe all the bolts i use on my cock before fitting and as he is such a big fella i can wipe loads of bolts up and down his huge size. You should try that, but your cock won't be as big as mine.

i find the feathers get in to the threads really well.

So doing everything up so it's just short of 'stripped' on my torque wrench is a bad idea?

[img] [/img]

Should I be aiming for Real Tight in future?

Just do it up until it strips, then back it off quarter of a turn. Job done 🙂

+1 Stop just short of stripped is perfect 😀

(I need to find who makes that grease as it is very good).

Err... Shimano. It is good, not cheap, but I've had a tube for a couple of years! Comes in a workshop tub if you go through lots. About £50 though.

There's a lot of people on this thread claiming to e engineers, but how many are [i]proper[/i] engineers with their own parking space ? That's what I want to know.

[img] [/img]

I notice the sign saying 'Software' immediately above has been removed.

It did say "light" on the removed sign, but due to events yesterday he's been downgraded.

[i]It did say "light" on the removed sign, but due to events yesterday he's been downgraded. [/i]

🙂

"MTG - Prince of Darkness"

In what alternative reality would a Software engineer get their own parking place?

[i]Yes, you will die. Even loctite won't prevent that.[/i]

Precisely, so perhaps its not an issue of whether the OP will die.
But rather, who will be to blame ?

Thread lock is only useful if you haven't torque your bolts up properly.

I'm definitely dropping that into an email to the Head of Clanky Engineering today.

Speshpaul - Member
In what alternative reality would a Software engineer get their own parking place?

One I hope to never visit *shudders*

The way this post is degrading, thread lock is likely to happen shortly..... 😆

Grammar engineer to this thread please...

Oh sorry !.

I follow a strict routine when replacing bolts that ensures consistent tightening of threaded fasteners.
I wipe the offending article on my shorts, maybe add a bit of spit to penetrate the filth, dip it in a pot of contaminated grease, swirl the grease over the thread with a finger then tighten back up until my knuckles turn from red to a little bit white, or until the allen hole has rounded off so no more torque can be applied.

Opps teach me read the whole page

Just use half the number of bolts and twice the torque, saves it coming undone...

Do it up however you like, if it falls out use threadlock next time?*

*may not be the safest approach, but is realistic 😉

Wookie Spaff. accept no substitutes.

Opps teach me read the whole page

[i]Wookie Spaff[/i]
😯

For gods sake - just man-up and tighten the damn bolts! - Your fist is the ultimate torqe wrench - just watch out for them darn Fox 36 pinch bolts. Safe torque for these is tighten 3 turns then back off 4 - remove - throw in the bin and buy something else.

Nick - Bronze Swimming Certificate