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No need to pick it up then 😉
Tits on a tom cat and all that.
My phone fits v neatly between my aero bars.
But... the sweat causes all manner of mayhem - screen swipe randomly...can't type as the touch screen doesn't work with 15 drips on it!
I'm also looking for a mount, but a sort of 'aero bar bridge' type thing.. right out of sweat's way!
DrP
dangeourbrain
Truth be told stumpy I found having the phone on the bars just resulted in me drowning it in sweat.
I did wonder if that might happen.
weeksy
i prefer the keyboard for the typing, especially being a bit 1 handed at the moment.
My laptop is currently off to one side, so it's a bit awkward to reach while riding - I tend to use the companion app.
I have a grand plan of setting up a display on a folding arm & re-arrange my set-up so it is much more ergonomic, but it needs some proper re-jigging of the garage including some re-wiring to move things around which is yet to happen...
I have one of these on the bars; https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01N6M0I9M Quick and easy to remove the phone. Don't find sweat to be an issue. Very occasionally a bit drips on but mostly not.
Who's riding, who's resting today ?
I'm still WFH so have the chance to ride as usual, but i'm thinking a rest day may be a plan.
I'm resting today. Really want to join the group gravel ride tonight but not really feeling up to it.
Truth be told stumpy I found having the phone on the bars just resulted in me drowning it in sweat. It works better for me to have it in easy reach and pick it up on the odd occasions I’ve something hilarious to say.
I initially had that problem, the drowning I was not so concerned about as it is in a waterproof case, but the sweat droplets were registering as screen touch inputs and almost asking the system to end my ride a few times.
Now I've got a proper fan it is no longer an issue, volume of sweat is a bit less and the airflow pushes it backwards past the phone (and onto the bike).
I got one of these and added a sticky garmin mount to the back: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B018I3KBTK?pldnSite=1
It was great while it worked. But that was only for 3 weeks.
I’m in the office (on my own) oddly enough today, so got a 15 mile ride home. Will take it gently - active recovery they call it, did don’t they?! Did a 50 mile road ride on Friday and my HR was about 15-20 bpm higher than normal for any given effort, so I think I still hadn’t shaken the bug - that or a heart attack is imminent! Quick blast on Sunday and things were more like normal, so hopefully all good for tomorrow.
Who else has lessons to learn then ? I need to just watch the A/B/Fast C riders wallop head in tomorrows event and sit at 250-260w off the line and the run in to the hill up to the bridge, 270-280w up that then see where that leaves me.
Just did one hour recovery ride over lunchtime today. Legs should feel fresh for tomorrow but it is a recovery week so cant kill myself trying to hang on!
I averaged 315W to get up there is 3min 42secs yesterday weeksy and the strong rider were flying away! That hill is going to hurt although I think the one when you come out of the jungle is going to be worst as when you come out of the jungle it feels like it should be a short easy spin back to the finish.
Anybody actually gonna try bike swapping?!
LOL i know... you don't need to tell me how fast they went up !
3m 57 was 288w.
My planning for tomorrow is to have got hold of a USB extension cable in the hope of no drop-out in connection (to add to the usual hope of making it to the start at all). If it works I might even make it to the end. Wish I had some new legs too though.
I'm having a day off too, was thinking of a easy one first thing but the bottle of red wine I had last night changed that one 😉
@Zilog - Bike change, after yesterdays test recce I am considering it but it depends where I am once we hit the jungle, if I am in a decent group position or if I need to try and bridge a gap. It will be a decision on the day.
One issue is that you need to push much harder in the jungle to create a gap for the change back again, plus the MTB suffers on the boardwalk sections in the cave area.
I decided to do a reccy at snails pace today, but got bored half way though and quit.
Am I right in thinking the last 10km are on flattish tarmac?
If so then I don't think a bike change is going to be worth it
you'd want 2 changes, not 1.
At top of the Jungle climb, then back at the brige. So 2 changes.
Oop North was crazy quick on the gravel bits.
the ZI guy reckons swapping saves him 42s (and that includes the time it takes for the 2 swaps!) over just riding a road bike. BUT that is riding solo and doesn't factor in the draft effect with a group ride. It would be immensely satisfying though to come steaming past the pack though, riding the MTB 😂
group ? lol i wish.
I may go up and recce it now for where to swap. I'm not sure where each section begins/ends.
I won’t be changing bike, hoping to be in a group so draft should help. Plan is to try and do the first climb averaging 310/315 watts for approx 4 mins. Then pray I’m in a group I can sit in at 240/250 wattts.....that’s the plan, in all likely hood, 250 watts up the first climb and crawl along solo.
I did a solo 70 miles on the road yesterday and it felt really tough, I’m used to riding much further solo but for some reason the last 10 miles I had nothing. Recovery ride today, 60 mins at sun 130 watts. I’ll probably ride the course just to get a feel of the gradients.
You've all seen this...right?
"Simply put: Cory was right! Here are the Road to Ruins lap times for each of our setups:
Zwift Aero with Zipp 808 Wheels: 50:06 (see on Strava)
Cervelo Aspero: 50:33 (see on Strava)
Specialized Epic: 51:30 (see on Strava)"
Seems road is best overall... but of course that doesn't bring in the idea of SWAPPING!!!
"Since we know that the road bike is fastest on pavement, and the MTB is fastest on dirt, we can easily formulate a smart swapping strategy to test. Road to Ruins goes into the Jungle then comes back out onto pavement, so when we hit the Jungle dirt we’ll swap to the MTB, then once the dirt ends, we’ll swap back to the road bike.
Using this strategy, our lap time went from our previous best on the road bike (50:06) to 49:24. A savings of 42 seconds (see it on Strava)!"
I'd be too slow swapping I think!
DrP
yeah I can't really picture it despite having ridden the route a fair few times. Had a quick look on the net though, seems like it might be worth staying on the road bike until AFTER the initial dirt descent & the wooden bit (because the MTB is really slow on those!) and only swapping after the wood, before the dirt climb. And then keeping on the MTB until the end of the dirt section.I may go up and recce it now for where to swap. I’m not sure where each section begins/ends.
yeah, that's we he says it's 40-odd s faster when he swaps!! of course, you have to not balls-up the swap, but that just adds to the excitement!You’ve all seen this…right?
testing today, 135w on spec venge 30kph
135w on mtb 25kph
on tarmac @ 0% incline
@zilog6128 on the Sunday recce oopnorth was flying on the downhill section on MTB. Road bikes had the advantage on wooden section.
It's true, I made up the changeover time pretty quick and caught the group, however on the wooden section I lost 8 to 10 seconds to the road bikes I was with at the time.
Interesting... I was testing it today. You got to get the bike change right. If you time it wrong going to the MTB you lose more than double the time, if you get it right, then it's good.
I think though the biggest factor is pacing and grouping. I dropped 45-5bpm off my HR following a guy who was 3.4w/kg and barely pedalling on the way down the hill, over the bridge and to the bottom, that's a bigger facotr i think. If you can pace with 2-3 riders and get someone else to work, you'll make up the ground instead of grinding on your own.
As I've said before and during yesterday's test run, on the back half of the jungle you really have to push to get the MTB to be beneficial in gaining time and I was still not able to catch Simon in that section. By that time I was blowing as you have to keep the effort down. So that extra effort may become a factor later in the route when you need it, for example the climb back out of the jungle or around the Italian village and volcano.
Using all your energy in the jungle may not be the best options depending on your endurance levels. Pacing may be the better option for some.
afternoon all !
No bike swaps for me, wouldn't know how to start (thought you had to end a ride to swap over)
Can I ride the tronbike ?
Is it very hilly? 🙁
It's flat up, slightly down then slightly up, then down.
The middle section is only 3-4% mostly. But depends how hard you find 3-4% inclines
Tron bikes are fine!
off out for a recce in a minute, check that the bike's working - not that I don't trust you weeksy! 😉
... tell you what, it is mighty scenic out there innit ?!
Not sure if I've done it before but I think I must've turned up the detail on the computer since I did
I reckon changing bike may be faster on a solo ride, but from what I've seen so far in the series, the most important thing is don't get dropped off the group. If you stop to change bike you won't get back on, and you'll absolutely hemorage time.
Case in point Mr dangourbrain last week. Lost a wheel and ended up losing 2 min to me, despite I'll wager him being a stronger rider on the flat than me.
Bike change only worth considering if you get dropped off the back of a group, and even then I reckon it's a 50/50 call.
Case in point Mr dangourbrain last week.
Not sure about the second bit of you're statement but I'll take the compliment 😉.
I averaged 290w I think for the final 3 laps, could have done a bit more but hadn't twigged the folks with me weren't dragging heels avoiding the front so kept backing off a bit to try encourage them forward. Oops. But I digress, there were a few folks in that front group at much lower w but put in 2 mins on me.
Week 1 was the same. I backed off too much on the down hill, lost the group and that was it done. I sat at closing on 300W for the rest of the race and got swallowed by zilog's group about 20min later, 1k from the line. No offence intended to zilog or anyone else in that bunch but none of them would put a few minutes into me normally. The group is king.
Unless you all switch your 42 sec gain will turn into a huge loss as soon as you fall off the group and the reduced aero on the mtb and gravel means you're having to work harder to stay in a group.
I might switch if I'm 30s off the front at the switch point. Otherwise I'd just be switching to drag the group round as they catch while I swap. Otherwise no, power on...
However, there won't be groups, there'll be 3s maybe 4s at best. That hill will shatter any groups as there's no draft. .
If we see a group of 5 after the bridge I'll be astounded
I think that'll depend on the numbers on the start line weeksy and how smart people play it. If there's only 20odd line up it'll split up very quickly but if there's 30odd b/c I think you'll see it hold fairly well and bunch up again over the top.
If I recall the hares and hounds the group stayed well enough to the climb out of the jungle. To be honest, I think that's where the sensible place to push is, get in a bunch and take the benefits of the bunch to there then, when the hill breaks it naturally and the draft isn't worth much, make your push for glory.
So have we decided who is switching and who isnt? I reckon I'm going to set my stall out now and say I'm not. It might work, it probably won't, and the max you'll gain is 30 sec tops. As opposed to how much you'll lose if it doesn't work out itd not worth then gamble.
Unless of course the entire group I'm with switches..then I'd be in alot of bother..
A race pace bike swap using the apple tv remote? Not likely, it's bad enough doing anything with that even if you're not under pressure!
at least it'll look nice, who needs functionality.
Anyone else on a tacx neo? I reckon the road surface simulation will be a disadvantage on this race for sure. Don't think you can switch it off however.
I'm not deciding till i see how things are playing out. I'm inclined to say no at the moment
My challenge is being on the start line, last night I was home from work at 8-15pm. I'm hoping its not the same today cos I really want to do this one!
Hope to see you all later.
It’s a definite no for me. When I’m racing maxed out I can just about think to breathe and drink.
I’m going to try and sit at around 250 watts, I was going to smash the first climb to keep up with a faster group and try and hang on to their coat tails, but the first hill is just too long for a max effort and too early into the race.
if it doesn’t work out it's not worth then gamble.
I'm tempted, partly for the fun of it and also because it's not much of a gamble for me - plans A thru Z haven't led to many points despite my best efforts!!
scaredypants
afternoon all !
No bike swaps for me, wouldn’t know how to start (thought you had to end a ride to swap over)
You can swap bikes once you come to a complete halt on the road - all the other stuff like shoes & jerseys you can swap on the fly.....
No way I'm gonna fiddle about with swapping bikes; I don't think I'd be slick enough at it.
And it seems wrong to switch to a faster bike halfway through a race.
plans A thru Z haven’t led to many points despite my best efforts!!
You sort of were my plan a Phil. I was hoping to get clear of the main bunch with a few but still be with a few folks to group up with for the jungle. No way I'm putting points on the board solo unless everyone ends up on their own.
My record solo effort was just under 53min on a TT bike @ 306W. I've dropped a bit of weight since but even then I can't see me getting below 50min solo. The zwiftpower results google spat out had C race times at 52 to 58 minutes in a very small field. I might make enough on the Cs to cover the handicap if they're at the bottom end of those times but without help I really can't see me making 4 minutes on DrP or 3 on TP
Dr P has to be right at the pointy end of this event doesn't he.. Can't see any work in where he's not top3 at the end.
Hmm.... don't hold your horses....!
I'm feeling "rough in the jungle"!
Sooo full of cold, though it IS the tail end, I'm still not too chipper...
The key will be staying with the front group..
Race 1 i dropped off and don't have enough solo power so was about 3 min back...
2 and 3 worked well as I stayed holding onto the front, and the hill helped... plus I felt strong race 2....
Will see how today goes.. I'll have a recce (just of the route on ZI) to figure out tactics... deffo no bike swap for me as I'm just not feeling I could put lots of w down to get back to speed again...
I think hold the pack for the flat, then prob aim for solo/climber group breakaway once it heads up..
DrP
Dr P has to be right at the pointy end of this event doesn’t he.. Can’t see any work in where he’s not top3 at the end.
Well I did offer his other half some sausage* if she'd jam a stick in his spokes.
*I don't think it's a euphemism but I've really no idea where he keeps those if it isn't.
I think hold the pack for the flat, then prob aim for solo/climber group breakaway once it heads up..
DrP
And that's why you'll be top 3... Race 1 didn't suit you at all... But this one, couldn't be better for your profile as a rider.
I'm still waiting for Richmond flat !
Well I did offer his other half some sausage if she’d jam a stick in his sp9kes
Frozen sausage I hope?
Frozen sausage I hope?
The exact phrase I used was "DrP's Sunday morning sausage", judging from the groan followed by "not again? OK then, but you owe me" I assume his good lady is as familiar with his Sunday hills sustenance as we are.
They defrost after about 12 minutes....
DrP
No need to boast
There is only one climb in the race right?
Two small ones.
No, two. One short and steep. The other longer but not so steep. Same high point though.
Depends how you look at it.
The climb is climb, flat, incline....
then down...flat... then incline.
You could argue 1 climb or 3.... I'm more 3.. But the other 2 are incline grinds.
Remember race to the blue banner – the meetup distance countdown is accurate in this respect – it is just under the level indicator bar. As I have to plug in the distance it may not correspond with the actual banner on the promenade section and may be a couple of hundred miles past it.
Race start – neutralised as before - congregate on the beacon prior to this (I may be behind you based on last week but will accelerate to get to the front)
STW Series Rules/Information
1. This is a handicap race series. The race will be a mass start with the handicap applied to the results at the end of the race. Your handicap can be found at link a few posts back.
2. Any bike is allowed – choose what you think best suits the course. Also wear what kit you want. Traditionally we have worn the bumblebee for Zwift meetups on STW so if you are unsure that would be a good choice.
3. Race starts – as the meetup function is being used we will have a rolling neutralised start. Once the meetup starts I will gently pedal at about 100W. You should adjust your position to congregate on me (I will be very visible with a bright yellow beacon if you haven’t used the meetup function before). As soon as everyone is in a swarm/peloton I will type GO GO GO which will appear across everyone’s screen – then race how you want!
4. Race finish – the race ends when you cross the blue banner. Make sure you race until the blue banner not any other finish lines/sprint line etc on course. Because meetup view is being used this may be a few hundred metres past a sprint line or similar. It is clearly visible on both the map, the distance countdown on the top bar and in view on the screen. Once you finish you will get a results screen displayed. Once this happens you can choose to leave the game, cool down etc. I will stop short of the race finish to remain in the game (my time isn’t counted anyway to any points finish) and provide encouragement and ensure everyone gets across the line (I might just be last anyway!).
5. Results – I will publish the results on the forum within an hour or so of everyone finishing. There will be the overall results. Top 3 from A, B, C and D and then the handicapped results. Points for the series title (and prizes) will be based on the handicapped results. Zwift Cats are based on the cats from Zwift and the FTP and weight you provided me so might not match historical data in ZP etc.
6. Points – points will be awarded for 1st through to 30th so the series will award consistency and hopefully give everyone an opportunity to score results.
7. In game comms – It is a meetup so only messages sent in the race will be seen. I will prob type some messages etc and reminders for encouragement during the race but feel free to join in with any banter, let us know you have fallen of your turbo, the cat has run through the spinning rear wheel and got its tail caught in the chain, you need another frozen sausage etc!!
8. HAVE FUN AND ENJOY YOURSELF!
it may not correspond with the actual banner on the promenade section and may be a couple of hundred miles past it.
Oh, that would be funny. Yay, banner. Boooo 5 more laps to go.
Doh - I meant metres not miles!!! At least it shows someone actually reads it though.
Does anyone use the discord channel for these by the way? I did think last week a bit more coordination in the first half might help some of us shake off the vampires a bit earlier and offset our big handicaps a little.
That or at least Phil can do his PT bit and encourage us when we're falling off.
Doh – I meant metres not miles!!! At least it shows someone actually reads it though.
I was rather looking forward to the "suckered" achievement.
Going to be tough for me tonight. Will be over the moon if I manage to finish with DrP and J-R in sight, no hope in making up the 1:15 and 30 seconds respectively. Just hoping I am in a decent group going over the bridge after first short climb.
Anybody actually gonna try bike swapping?!
Nah, because that'd mean stopping on rollers and I tend to fall off when I do that.
If Zwift linked different equipment to different power meters then I could just change physical bikes.
So am I right in thinking the first climb is on tarmac about 5km in and is pretty short . Then the second is part of the jungle loop and lasts 3/4 km but is very shallow?
The First steep leg snapper after the bridge isn’t long but steep enough to cause some splits, then one long climb in the jungle never steep enough to change down to the small chain ring but a grinder, big effort over the wooden swing bridge, a bit of down and then a medium length and medium effort grind before an undulating finish.
Personally I now need to aim for an even higher group to finish with, whereas aiming to finish amongst the likes of zilog and Andy berghin would seem me well placed I’ll now be way down the final Standings.
Should again be a interesting race with more but smaller groups forming after each of the break points.
Motivation
You're welcome to join me again if you find me kirky,and on the upside as I've now figured out you're not just sucking and waiting for the sprint I'll not try encouraging you to the front and keep the effort up!
I have no idea how I am going to go tonight. I haven't really performed at any of the races so far. Definitely not at the level that I should be and nowhere near what I can achieve on the Thursday TTTs. I wonder if the stress of actually getting it off the line saps something from me after the debacle of the first week.
I would hope that I can put in a decent turn on the first climb and see where it goes from there. That means staying relative to those around me with similar handicaps.
The second climb suits my strengths as it requires a constant high power output which I can deliver on. I cant put music on tonight which always makes it harder for me - the wife is out so I need to keep an ear out for my son who will be in bed.
RATM - Killing in the Name is great for climbs when you get to the end!
I've not even looked at the handicaps. I'm going more Froome than Nibali today.
I've got a power and a HR goal/target, i won't be passing
I'll try to find tou dangerbrain, although that's the easy part staying with you up the hills js a different matter.
really think ill need to be over 300w until the slight deacebt towards the jungle maybe even later. if I don't get a rest then I cant see me maintaining 260/300w up the next long climb out of the jungle.
I’ll try to find tou dangerbrain, although that’s the easy part staying with you up the hills js a different matter.
It'll be a good effort to the bottom of the first climb I think then assess for me. Ideally I'd like to be clear of you lot with a few like minded souls but if I don't think I'll get clear enough in a decent group by the top of the first hill I think I'll be sitting up to join the main bunch and taking it easy in honesty then hoping I can put in a big turn come the last climb and the final drag to claw some time back. I reckon if I can sit in an "easy" group for the first 20k or so until the second climb, I can kick clear and then bury myself over the last 10k. If I've got my big boy legs on I should be able manage 350+ over the last 10k which with luck will see me distancing any (hopefully small by that point) group and crossing the line before I pass out and choke on my own vomit.
350+ eeeeek ! That's big boy numbers
Jeesh...at present I'm just going to aim to finish!
having to use my inhaler, and legs feel like jelly just walking up stairs at work!
Will have a nice mug of lemsip before the race, and stick with my plan of 45min of sub 100w warm up, just to get the blood flowing...
As I'm doing it all through ant+ now, i won't have BT issues, so will live stream from the laptop again..
Click here to see my hacking up my gizzards!
DrP
It gets a bit lumpy towards the end too...
DrP
Isn’t an inhaler a form of drug cheating?😀
I never tend to ride in the PM always an early morning upto 10am latest, so I have resorted to taking barroca, a coffe before hand and then dosing with those dextrose sweets before and during the race just to stay awake.
350+ eeeeek ! That’s big boy numbers
Yeah, 10 mins at 4.5w/kg will kill me but I should manage it if I pace the first chunk well. ZP has me at 339W as my best average for just over 20min round crit city bell lap, 4.4 as my 20 minute best and 4.6 for my 5 minute best.
I've had better runs out in non races though which aren't on there so fingers crossed. It'll all be worth nowt though if I can't get clear on the hill.
After my lack of success over the last few weeks unless the splits are favourable in the first 5k I think that's about the only course of action available to be honest, I've just got to take it very steady, get over the 2nd hill at least a few m in front of DrP and hope I can leave him behind after that.