I've been running Sram AXS Eagle on two bikes now for about 9 months, both fitted at the same time. Over the past few rides I've noticed the indexing was slightly out on some of the gears and so I've had to micro adjust one or two clicks down the cassette but that's sorted it back to perfect shifting for the rest of the ride, but then it would be out slightly again on the next ride.
After Wednesdays ride on one bike and Saturdays ride on the other both systems turned into a bag of shite ! I'm actually out of micro adjust positions to use so the mech is as far over as it can be and it still struggles to shift down on some of the gears. It will shift up no problem at all and runs really smooth going up. I've replaced the mech hanger on both bikes and I've tried a complete run through the set up procedure again checking the limit screws and the b-screw distance. I've even tried re-pairing the shifter and mech.
Anyone experienced the same or got any suggestions please. All I can find on line is 'replace the hanger'. Also, does anyone have have a number for Sram or ZyroFisher technical support, if such a thing exists.
Thanks in advance.
Over the past few rides I’ve noticed the indexing was slightly out on some of the gears and so I’ve had to micro adjust one or two clicks down the cassette but that’s sorted it back to perfect shifting for the rest of the ride, but then it would be out slightly again on the next ride.
Had this with Force AXS on the road, turned out the derailleur bolt was slightly loose - quick tighten and it was fine. Was very odd - perfectly indexed for most of the range but one in the middle just wasn't right - almost convinced myself I'd bent a sprocket.
In your case I'd see if a shop can check the derailleur hanger alignment using the Park Tool etc.
Did you check the hanger alignment when you fitted the new hanger?
I would align the hanger
I have heard about the loose derailleur bolt issue. SRAM recommend blue loctite on the bolt and 12NM of torque on the bolt, if I remember right. Apparently if the derailleur can rotate around the mounting while riding it can knock the B tension screw out of the correct setting. Shimano derailleurs have a spring around the mounting bolt which prevents this movement. The latest Cycling Tips Nerd Alert podcast covers it (quite near the end in the "ask a mechanic" section).
I knew you'd all say hanger, hence the subject title. I've put new hangers on both bikes and it's not made any difference. Also did a full bolt check and nothing is lose.
Any other suggestions or experiences please ?
Yes but have you checked the new hanger is straight? They often aren't.
Short of that... Jockey wheels okay? All the pivots on the mech moving okay?
Any other suggestions or experiences please ?
Experience = Almost every bike and/or frame delivered needs the hanger aligning. They do not magically come out of the factory straight. Hangers also need aligning when fitting. It's far more critical on 11/12/13 ratio drivetrains than ever before.
Suggestion = Align the hanger, in both directions, use a tool.
Left field suggestions.
Check the chain and cassette for wear (a proper check, 12" rule). 9 months through winter could quite easily have killed them.
Check the freehub bearings and also that the wheel bearings aren't collapsing, this can move the cassette out of position. Also check you've got the wheel fitted properly. (Don't laugh, i've seen people ride around with incorrectly fitted wheels for weeks.) Unlikely to be two bikes at the same time though.
I had an issue which sounds similar. Turned out the the bottom bushing on the pivot that goes through the motor had fallen out (it's the only one without a retaining clip). Have a look at the bottom of the mech and see if it's still there. Got the mech replaced on warranty by SRAM.
checked chain stretch?
I have had AXS for about 2 years now and recently it wasnt as crisp. new chain and fresh bearings in the jockey wheels and its back to flawless shifting.
I’ve put new hangers on both bikes and it’s not made any difference.
Yes, but did you check the alignment after fitting the new hanger?
Just because its a new hanger does not mean its aligned. Not saying its your issue, but its good to check the basics first; cassette tight, wheel in straight, hanger tight, hanger aligned, mech tight, then go from there. Also check for play in hub, play in freehub, jockey wheel play, play in mech pivots etc etc. 11/12s components performance really goes down with worn parts.
I have had AXS for about 2 years now and recently it wasnt as crisp. new chain and fresh bearings in the jockey wheels and its back to flawless shifting.
Which bearing types are in the jockey wheels ?
I think they’re 626 LLB (626-2RS) looking through my last few bearing orders for bikes. Dimensions are 6x19x6.
Just press out the old one / press in the new one.
There was a lip that looked bigger on one side of the bearing than the other so I pressed it out as carefully as I could.
This is GX Eagle anyway - assume the jockeys are the same as AXS.
The jockey wheel bearings are 6x19x6mm
Are you setting the B screw in the sag position and with the newer white setup tool?
I've just had my GX AXS mech replaced under warranty as the pivots got very sloppy and shifting went to shit. It got marginally better on the old one with new jockey wheels, chain, cassette and chainring, but still not perfect. It did get >350 rides worth of shifting in 12 months, though.
Not put it back on yet as it'll be going on the new frame, so keeping the XX1 mechanEagle on for now.
Definitely got the right wheel on the right bike?
checked the cassette over for misalignment? Hasn't come loose and moved away from the freehub?
are the hub and freehub bearings good and free of play
are you seating the wheel the same each time you install
Hanger alignment
Jockey wheel play / rotating out of true
Chain wear (or new chain I sometimes find they need to loosen up a bit)
Cassette wear
Ordered some jockey wheel bearings and some more hangers but I have already replaced the hangers and it made no difference. Everything says it should be the hangers but it can't be now I've replace them with new unused ones. This is on two separate bikes too and its gradually got worse over a few weeks. I'm going to try swapping the mechs over and pairing them with the alternative shifters to see what that does. The b-screw setting has been done using the white tool in the sag position too. No play in the wheel bearings or hub or free hub, all of that gets done regularly. Driving me up the ****in wall, especially as it was all running so well for so long, bloody garage gremlins attacking the bikes in the middle of the night I reckon !
I’m going to try swapping the mechs over and pairing them with the alternative shifters to see what that does.
Be amazed if that changes anything as the derailleur is just asked to shift up/down one - so a different shifter is just asking the same thing of it....
Be amazed if that changes anything as the derailleur is just asked to shift up/down one – so a different shifter is just asking the same thing of it…
I know, but I'm running out of ideas !
as had been said, except checking the alignment of the hangers. New hangers aren't always straight
Everything says it should be the hangers but it can’t be now I’ve replace them with new unused ones.
Have you actually read anything people have written?
Had a freehub sliding on an axle a few weeks back, wrong spacers used, indexing was impossible!
I wonder if it's the hanger alignment?
Have you actually read anything people have written?
Yes, but it's obviously nothing to do with the hanger, they've fitted a new one.
Yes, but it’s obviously nothing to do with the hanger, they’ve fitted a new one.
Probably best changing the gear cable next then 😉
Yes, but it’s obviously nothing to do with the hanger, they’ve fitted a new one.
Don't know if that was tongue in cheek, but a new hanger & correct hanger alignment are in no way related. The alignment needs checking.
Don’t know if that was tongue in cheek, but a new hanger & correct hanger alignment are in no way related. The alignment needs checking.
Somebody should have mentioned that earlier!
Maybe the same person? Several same people?
It's a million to one chance, but it might just work...
Don’t know if that was tongue in cheek, but a new hanger & correct hanger alignment are in no way related. The alignment needs checking.
Somebody should have mentioned that earlier!
:o) I read your post Simon but the message doesn't seem to be getting through.
I'm having an odd indexing issue with my GX AXS. My LBS changed the jockey wheels and I got a new chain ring, cassette and chain fitted as it all needed replacing. First couple of rides were perfect, but now in order to change down a gear I have shift down three and up two, the indexing is shot, after previously having consistently great shifting!! Back to my LBS today under the warranty for a quick check over and tune up. Will let you know what's caused the issue. Still on original mech hanger.
I've been having some issues since swapping my GX AXS to a different (new) bike and it's been driving me bonkers.
Anyway, last night I figured out what is going on. The new bike has an XD cassette, and it sits about 2.5mm offset outwards compared to the other one, and there's not enough range on the micro adjust to make it up, so I've had to make a thin shim to go between the frame and hanger, and a second one between the hanger and derailleur bolt.
I thought that would be that but, alas, no.
I've got other bikes on hand with XX1, X0, GX and NX derailleurs so fortunately I could compare the geometries of each.
It turns out that the actual shifting part sits much further forward on the AXS because the servo part is much more bulky, and this causes the top idler to be well forward of the cassette compared to the regular derailleur types so the angular deflection of the chain between the idler and the cassette is very much reduced, and it doesn't always want to shift as a result. I dunno why they didn't keep the relative positions of the hanger bolt and mech the same and have the servo more rearward of the hanger bolt, but it is what it is, and it's not the first bit of stupid to be seen on bikes, is it?
So the solution I'm sure is going to be a new hanger with the derailleur bolt hole further back, to bring the top idler closer to the cassette. Unfortunately it's going to have to be custom made, but at least I can address the offset issue in both directions with a single solution, rather than the slight 'bodge' of fitting shims.
Not the same I know but my SRAM Force rear had exactly the same symptoms.I was suffering hanging gears,having to go up 3 and down 2,the indexing was varying all over the place.Turned out that the gear cable had been run bare through the frame and had been rubbing over a plastic guide into which it had worn a deep groove preventing the cable moving smoothly.Peace was restored by running a continuous outer cable through the frame since when shifting has been as good as SRAM gets.
Can't remember which forum i saw this on, but the guts of a SRAM Road mechs are actually quite susceptible to filling up with fine silty crap off the roads when it rains... This kills the indexing (and eventually, the entire mech) needs a good clean, inside and out, and some fresh grease.
I'll see if i can find a link. Might be applicable to the MTB mechs as well.
Can’t remember which forum i saw this on, but the guts of a SRAM Road mechs are actually quite susceptible to filling up with fine silty crap off the roads when it rains… This kills the indexing (and eventually, the entire mech) needs a good clean, inside and out, and some fresh grease.
Sounds unlikely - just based on all the people I know with AXS who ride in all weathers and don't seem to have any problems. 1st Gen AXS Red has being around 5/6 years?
It was eTap, not AXS.
Just found the thread on weightweenies
Recently had this exact problem with a customers bike.
Mech was ultimately sitting too far drive side. Ran out of micro adjust. Couldn't get shifting correct. ( Worked fine on another bike)
Just had to notch this up to frame alignment issue/hanger geometry
Had to give up in the end. Was just flogging a dead horse.
Update, starting in response to all those with the banal comments about the hanger and alignment having not read the rest of the thread (@mert; @simondbarnes; @davesport)...
Have you actually read anything people have written?
Don’t know if that was tongue in cheek, but a new hanger & correct hanger alignment are in no way related. The alignment needs checking.
I read your post Simon but the message doesn’t seem to be getting through.
Despite the fact that this issue is on two separate bikes with two completely different hangers and suspension systems who had their AXS systems fitted at the same time 10 months ago and they were both fitted with two separate brand new hangers this weekend, the problem still exists... I have checked the alignment with a proper alignment tool and guess what... ITS NOT THE HANGER or ALIGNMENT !
I also changed the bearings in one of the mechs jockey wheels and this offered a bit of improvement but not a great deal and it still needed to be run at the end of the micro adjust.
So I've now fitted a new AXS mech to one of the bikes and its working perfectly again from the off with the micro adjust set at 14, so the problem is clearly in the mech NOT IN THE HANGER. Having compared the old and the new mechs there is definitely more play in the pivots (but not a great deal) in the old one but also some subtle changes in the design. I'll be changing the mech on the other bike at the weekend and sending them both back for warranty as there is clearly an issue, especially given the more recent replies in this thread which will no doubt prove to be a bit more helpful than some of the earlier ones about the hanger and the alignment.
Have you checked the Mech hanger and its alignment?
Have you checked the Mech hanger and its alignment?
That's a very good question...
:o) Easy Tiger! I don't think myself or anyone else was saying that the mech hanger; new or otherwise wasn't straight. What people were trying to tell you was that checking the hanger alignment is a fundamental check if you're experiencing shifting issues. Saves you buying multiple new hangers & jockey wheels whilst trying to diagnose your problem. Looks like you're probably out of pocket close to a grand to sort out an indexing issue until & if SRAM choose to warranty your mechs. Not an issue I've ever encountered.
So something to bear in mind next time you post a request for help. The majority of people on here are keen to assist. As you've found out neither you or me know the answers to your problem. But if I said initially send both your AXS mechs back & buy two more, would that have suited you better? The hanger being aligned is fundamental to clean shifting. You failed or were unable to do do this & simply ignored the advice. I appreciate you closing this out and letting us know you've bought a stack of new parts, but next time instead of writing a reply full of quotes, block capitals & attitude you could simply thank some random people who stopped what they were doing & tried to help you with your problem.
Please have another read of my opening of the thread, then the replies, and then my update, but for your benefit (and because I can see you like quotes)...
Anyone experienced the same or got any suggestions please. All I can find on line is ‘replace the hanger’. Also, does anyone have have a number for Sram or ZyroFisher technical support, if such a thing exists.
Thanks in advance.
Don't assume either that I don't know how to maintain and fix bikes. The reason the title of the thread and my opening say it's NOT (some caps for you too) the hanger, is because I know what a hanger and alignment problem is and I'd checked the hanger, tried replacing it and checked the alignment before and after replacing it. Despite this quite a few people still came on and said its the hanger or the alignment of the hanger and suggested I wasn't listening when clearly they hadn't read the whole thread.
It's clear to me and to others that have posted that there is something else going on with the AXS mechs and that was either going to be an easy fix that someone was aware of or a warranty issue. Having spoken to the stores I originally bought them from they've both said that they've had quite a few back that have had warranty replacements.
Your superfluous attitude in your reply typifies the minority on here that has created the reputation that goes before it.
BTW if your spending a grand on two mechs you're being fleeced mate !
checked the alignment before and after replacing it
If only you'd mentioned that before.....
Please have another read of my opening of the thread
CBA mate! It's a bicycle interest forum not a debating society :o)
Anyhoo, glad your fixed.
It’s a bicycle interest forum not a debating society :o)
It's never just that on here, that's why I rarely bother... I'm off to ride my bike (but I'll let everyone know how the warranty claims go) !
If only you’d mentioned that before…..
All this aggro and rage posting for the sake of two words in the first post.
Two very important words TBH.
Just to bring this one back for an update. My AXS on my Levo SL wasn’t shifting great, I changed hanger and it was still a bit grumbly. On the back of this thread I bought the Park hanger alignment tool and low and behold after some tweaks it settled perfectly. Today I fitted a GX AXS to my 1 ride old drivetrain on my new HT, and it was also a bit grumbly. Took mech off and found hanger to be a bit off alignment. 10 mins with Park alignment tool, some tweaks, mech back on, perfect shifting…
Every day is a learning day. 😁
Update... Sram have replaced both mechs under warranty after examining them. Both shops said they'd had similar issues on other AXS mech returns.
Prior to the claims I had put two new AXS mechs on each bike, both still had the same new hangers on. I also tried them with the hangers I'd replaced to ruke the hangers out. From the off the micro adjust on the new mechs is running at 14, which is the mid point. The old mechs on the same hangers had run out of micro adjust and wouldn't shift.
Only conclusion, there's something wrong in both mechs that has developed over 9 months of use that isn't related to the alignment. I suspect it will be designed out by Sram with a new version if it hasn't been already.
