Hi you all !
Continuing on my quest for the most perfect FS bike i keep regretting that i sold my cotic flaremax gen 2 a while ago which had the most awesome feel i ever found in a FS bike, very engaging, super smooth and incredibly capable.
i sold it as i couldn’t get comfortable on it during the long climbs and it had too much pedal bob (but maybe it was the shock ?) for long days out ( i live in the southern alps, so a day out is like 40km and 2000d+ or more), and also a little bit heavy to be carried on the shoulders over and over
i’d be super tempted by a new cotic but unfortunately being on the continent doesn’t make it easy, and the prices are a bit off my wallet abilities for now (not blaming cotic for that, their stuff is absolutely reasonable considering how they do it and seeing what are the prices elsewhere for made in china mass products…)
the question would be more like : those who have tried cotic fs bikes, what other frame models have you tried since that matched really closely cotic ride feel and behaviour ?
(i may well end up with a cotic again anyway. If by the way someone here have a flaremax gen4 ou a jeht gen1 laying around 😉 )
I get what you mean. I had a FlareMAX too, and nothing I’ve ridden since has quite matched the way it felt on the trail. It was super fun and stable, just had that special feel. I also struggled a bit with the climbing, and yeah, the pedal bob made long days tough, especially with big alpine rides. Since then, the closest I’ve found in terms of feel is the Privateer 141. It’s not steel, but it rides well and feels planted without being too heavy. Still, I keep thinking maybe the only thing that scratches that itch is another Cotic! Hope you find a Gen 4 or Jeht out there, they’re hard to beat.
very engaging, super smooth and incredibly capable
Never ridden a Cotic but my Canfield Tilt is exactly these things. The CBF suspension is a thing of genius.
My bike history before the Canfield is Pronghorn, Lapierre, Pivot, Banshee, so a mix of suspension types but the Canfield is just so much better than all of them. Buttery smooth going down, no pedal bob going up. I'll accept some of that is maybe down to the CC Kitsuma Air shock but it works so well with their suspension idea that to me it feels like I've found the holy grail of analogue bikes.
No stockists in the UK that I'm aware of but the strong £/weak $ and low import duty on bike frames means you could get a Tilt frame with CC Kitsuma Air to your door for about £1500.
Hi and thanks for the proposal !
I came across the canefield indeed, heard many good things about their bikes so i don't doubt at all they're super nice and smooth, but I'm not really keen on buying something i can't try at all, especially from abroad, here the bike secondhand market is quite dead at the moment so I'm pretty sure i couldn't sell it or for very few
Seeing the geometry, I'm quite sure it doesn't feels like a cotic, it's very different on most points, not the same reach, the super short chainstays won't feel the same at all and won't shift as much weight on the front as on the cotics etc
But thanks for the recommendation and glad you like it ! Enjoy !
I'd attribute the disappointing climbing vibe to relatively slack seat angle. Suspension bob is a shock setup issue IMO (more rebound required usually) but it can be exacerbated by slack seat angle. Essentially you want a steel susser with straight/steep seat tube. Of which there ain't many! Starling is all I can think of.
Yes indeed, it’s something cotic says about the gen 2 and improved on gen 3, it’s definitely the slack seet tube thzt made the gen2 not great on long climbs.
No problem with the shock setup, i had it perfectly dialed and couldn’t reasonably tweak rebound more than i did but i found the cc db il air to be needing very regular services ( i ride a lot though) otherwise it quickly loose it’s qualities as well as a bit too bobly in its lock position too. The more « on the rear » position sure didn’t help much on that too.
That’s basically that, I’ll add lightweight (i have all then components for that) short travel (150/140mm max).
Love starling design but not sure I’d love the kinematics nor having such a bike.
Cotic jeht gen 1 or 2 seem to be quite a match, looked a lot around, didn’t found any stuff like this except Soum
Get a custom shock tune or a custom steel FS frame.
Continuing on my quest for the most perfect FS bike i keep regretting that i sold my cotic flaremax gen 2 a while ago which had the most awesome feel i ever found in a FS bike, very engaging, super smooth and incredibly capable.
i sold it as i couldn’t get comfortable on it during the long climbs and it had too much pedal bob (but maybe it was the shock ?) for long days out ( i live in the southern alps, so a day out is like 40km and 2000d+ or more), and also a little bit heavy to be carried on the shoulders over and over
I ride a Gen 3 FlareMAX with a Cane Creek DB whatever air shock and it's ace. I'd look for one of those secondhand. Steeper seat tube angle for better climbing, best paint job ever - Supernova orange - and lovely, warm feel. I'm no expert, but I suspect the suspension feel is probably partly down to the relatively short travel, which means you avoid that slightly remote sensation you get with a lot of longer travel bikes.
A mate who's ridden all the FlareMAX iterations, including the current one, thinks the Gen 3 version was the sweetspot btw. Of course he may just be saying that to be nice, but it rings true - but obviously I'm biased and I haven't ridden any of the others, but the reason I didn't buy one earlier was the relatively slack seat angle on the Gen 1 and 2 versions.
Is it a steel frame you’re after or a bike with similar geometry to the cotic?
I think it will be difficult getting test rides on bikes from small manufacturers especially in a country as big as France.
there are quite a few custom builders in Europe as well as steel production builders.
Ive just reread your post about looking for second hand purchase.
starling are selling refurbished frames. I had a look on their website but can’t find them. That may be worth looking into.
Me again.
The Radavist website has several tests of steel fs bikes. The review also cross reference between the bikes he’s ridden comparing their abilities and differences. one of his favourites is the flare max
Qwerty : the custom shock tune doesn’t make the geo and behavior of the bike, and well, a custom full sus not everyone can do anything, kinematics especially as well as knowledge about tubing and ride philosophy/feeling are something that are quite unique and differs from makers.
BadlyWiredDog : thanks for the input on the g3 cotic ! I was a bit doubtful about the g1/g2 too but that’s the only flaremax versions that can sometimes be found here so i didn’t hesitate much when a good opportunity passed by
Im definitely keeping a careful eye on the gen 3 and 4 ! And if you say gen 3 is the pinnacle i trust you
Jeht seems nice too !
LAT : thanks for the input, actually I’m not looking for a bike with similar geo as the cotic (geo doesn’t make everything) nor am i looking for a steel full suspension bike ( i read the radavist, the whole thread on mtbr forum about steel fs bikes etc) for the moment I’d just like to know if someone who rode a cotic short travel (flaremax or jeht) has ever found something else that was feeling quite similar in terms of handling/behavior, just to see what other option could exist.
This is something that can only be verified with real life testing, numbers, geo, pivot system and materials may give specs and hints on the behaviour, but it isn’t enough to say if it’ll match or not
ps : there’s probably not anything just like it of course i know that, cotic are quite unique bikes, but anything that could compare closely would be welcome. I demoed a few bikes even with close geos and never found something as engaging, playful and secure as the flaremax in the same travel category.
just looking for possible alternatives of stuff to get inspired from but quite sure cotic will be the way
Also actively looking for a jeht or a flaremax gen3 or above in second hand if by any chance… 🙂
This is something that can only be verified with real life testing, numbers, geo, pivot system and materials may give specs and hints on the behaviour, but it isn’t enough to say if it’ll match or not
Very true. Good luck with your search
I have a Gen4 Medium Flaremax lying around if of interest? 🙂
I'm disappointed that the question wasn't "...but with internal cable routing."
Tops5 : i’d be super interested indeed ! Sending you a PM about that 🙂
Disappointed you didn’t add « headset » between internal and routing, don’t we all love that even more 😉
Tops5 : got several emails telling me you answered but i cannot find any message from you in my inbox here, i guess the problem comes from my side ?
Something that rides like a Flaremax with 2 bottles cages inside the front triangle would be my perfect FS.
Well it made me discover hydration hippack and i must say i love them now, but i do get the point although the design doesn't make it easy at all
I have a gen 1 jeht in nimbus blue. Size L. Kitsuma shock (vastly reduces the bob). Great condition and going to be put up for sale very soon. PM me if your interested.
Top5, received indeed, replying !
Blackflag : may well do the job too thanks ! Sending you a pm (well tomorrow due to the 2 messages limit and the fact an unfortunate click made me waste one…)
Got your message heyne and have sent you my email. I too am limited by the number of messages i can send on here :-/
Received and replied on your mailbox ! The 2 messages limit here is quite restrictive… but just enough to send the email adress indeed 😉
