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So I like using my garmin Fenix for all sorts of things..
Coupled with a power meter and HR monitor on the bike, or simply HR monitor when running, it gives me a 'training effect', figures out how effective my training is, and I can work out training load, and when to rest etc...
Recently, you could simply upload a Zwift/TR virtual ride to strava, which in turn uploads to Garmin connect, which then synchs with the watch (or other garmin device) to update your training LOAD on the device.
But... NOT the Training effect score.
THis annoyed me, because the .fit file that's being shared around all the devices and platforms DOES have the key data; namely power and HR.
Why then does it not create a training effect?
Well, after a bit of research it turns out the patent/licence to calculate training effect is held by a company called Firstbeat. They've licenced it out to Garmin..but the licence/"ability to calculate the training effect" is in the DEVICE, and not garmin connect.
So, it's the Fenix5, or the Edge800 that have the licence, not the garmin software.
So unless the activity has been recirded on the device, you cannot 'back calculate' the training effect, for licencing reasons.
Which, to me, is annoying.
Oh well..
DrP
Your research hasn’t been thorough enough - Garmin has purchased the company behind algorithms, Firstbeat Analytics in June 2020.
So if Garmin wants to use the magic behind TE score it can do it.
Which, to me, is annoying.
Yep, it is annoying. I have an Edge 530 so after anything I record on, say, Zwift, I have to sync the Edge 530 to my Garmin account using Connect. Then do a second sync. Then the Training Status is shown on Connect. I'm guessing the same would work with your Fenix?
I'm hoping it will eventually be integrated into Connect at some point in order to save this Syncing requirement.
If you connect Zwift etc. to Garmin Connect (rather than through Strava), I think it should do the thing you want.
If you connect Zwift etc. to Garmin Connect (rather than through Strava), I think it should do the thing you want.
It gives you Training Status rather than Training Effect (though the two are closely related)
My fenix 5 watch shows training effect, my 520 plus doesn't. That's also annoying
but DOES it give training status? Or just load?
I.e will it tell me if my VO2 has gone up or down??
It will show VO2 trends, yes.
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Cool...
Just also seen this on the garmin page:
Do Activities Recorded With Third-Party Apps Count Towards Training Status?
Qualifying activities from the Tacx Training app or these select third-party apps can also contribute towards your Training Status:Zwift
TrainerRoad
For your Training Status to update from a supported third-party app, you must also meet these requirements:The third-party app must be linked to your Garmin Connect account.
You must have a Training Status capable device that you are actively recording running or cycling activities with. If you remove your compatible device from Garmin Connect, you will not receive Training Status data from a third-party or Tacx app activity.
Physio TrueUp must be enabled on your Garmin device (see What is Physio TrueUp?).
To process Training Status data from the Tacx Training app or a supported third-party activity, Garmin Connect must sync the activity data with your compatible device. To accomplish this, your compatible device must be powered on and fully synced to ensure that all data has been processed and your Training Status is up to date. Exercise load data from the Tacx Training app or third-party activities will be visible in your Training Status reports, but it will not be visible in your activity details. If using a compatible Edge device, you must sync your device twice for an updated Training Status to display in Garmin Connect.
DrP
I wouldn’t be surprised if they add more integration with the newer models as and when they’re released. The Fenix 6 is two years old now so I’d expect a new model to be launched in the near future, no doubt with added bells and whistles.
But doesn’t work with the likes for FulGaz which is annoying. I just end up sending the Fenix data to Garmin connect, and the turbo app data to Strava. Far from perfect but ok bodge.
Scotroutes 47 has put me in my box. I was pretty happy with my 42.
Is that the interface from Garmin on a desktop? I only ever use the app.
Scotroutes 47 has put me in my box. I was pretty happy with my 42.
Is that the interface from Garmin on a desktop? I only ever use the app.
Oops. I fully expect folk to show up with much higher numbers than that. Happy with that for my age though. It doesn't seem to translate into a high FTP 🙁
Yes - that's the windows desktop view.
I knew it updated training LOAD, but wasn't sure it did the effect as well...
well be happy just using the zwift to record then, rather than zwift and garmin!
Oh... also...
Was up at 65 earlier this year!
DrP
Isn't the VO2 max calculation just a simple look-up on Max vs Min HR as opposed to anything more scientific...
See!
well be happy just using the zwift to record then, rather than zwift and garmin!
Yep - connect Zwift to Garmin Connect
Ha! Thanks DrP! Lid tightly closed on the box 😉 But I don’t train like you do, and I’ve had long Covid (even then I think think it was ever at 44!).
Scotroutes my FTP is awful. I’m too heavy. I like to think I missed a career as a sprint track cyclist. Ha!
Isn’t the VO2 max calculation just a simple look-up on Max vs Min HR as opposed to anything more scientific…
If that’s the case my VO2 would be similar to DrPs as my max is >190 and my min 52.
Isn’t the VO2 max calculation just a simple look-up on Max vs Min HR as opposed to anything more scientific…
I think it takes more than that, and I find it useful at a trend, rather than absolute figures.
I gues if i'm at a HR of 160 for 280 watts, and then a month later my HR is 150 for 280 watts, i'm fitter, according to teh data? I dunno... science innit..
DrP
I was curious enough to spend a few minutes on Google and it is indeed more complicated but still quite empirical...
https://sportcoaching.co.nz/how-does-garmin-calculate-vo2-max/
I didn't know you could get vO2 max under 90 - does Garmin use a different scale ?
🤣
Numpty!
DrP
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Thanks for the info guys I have now managed to get my training status again. It has been missing for months. I just need to figure out how to do the high aerobic load stuff. Makes sense as I’m either climbing hard or riding steady on the flats. Anyway some useful reading on this thread fora change 👌
Also, as OP, i didn't aknowledge @mmannerr with his observation of
Your research hasn’t been thorough enough – Garmin has purchased the company behind algorithms, Firstbeat Analytics in June 2020.
I'm a bit behind the times there it seems!!
DrP
I just need to figure out how to do the high aerobic load stuff. Makes sense as I’m either climbing hard or riding steady on the flats.
If you are climbing hard, then this should show as high aerobic load (and some anaerobic too, if you are in Z4/Z5). Are you wearing an external HR strap, and have you got your HR zones set to something sensible?
I was curious enough to spend a few minutes on Google and it is indeed more complicated but still quite empirical…
> https://sportcoaching.co.nz/how-does-garmin-calculate-vo2-max/
I'm not sure that's right. I'm fairly sure you need a power meter to get a VO2 max estimate for cycling, so presumably it's actually using the power data.
... the formulas it has for cycling/rowing do have power. It's just that the article is crap and poorly written/researched.
IME Connect won't give you a cycling VO2 max without a power meter.
singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/something-interesting-about-garmin-devices-training-effect-and-3rd-party-integ/#post-12090014
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You may be right I’m not sure my heart rate zones are set up correctly. Although zone 3 is 156-168 which I reckon is whatI normally climb at. I’m not often climbing above 170 hr. My zone 2 HR goes up to 154 which means I have to be working pretty hard to get into zone 3 which seems about right.
I did do a tempo ride this morning. On the road so based on power. That did help my training balance a little.
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Aha I see from my cycle this morning I am riding tempo according to my power zones but not heart rate tempo. One of them is clearly wrong. It did feel like tempo this morning so looks likeI need to adjust my heart rate zones.
Just updated my HR zones in Garmin. Road bike rides were fine as my power zones were correct. However my heart rate zones were rubbish. A HR of 153 was still classed as easy when it is over 80% of my max. This meant all my mountain bike rides, where I don’t use a power meter, were classed as really easy. They don’t feel like that.
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How are you clocking low aerobic activities? or what are you doing to count as low aerobic? My watch and 530 tell me I am below optimal and to do workouts in that area, but nothing seems to count!
Hi Keith the low aerobic activities are any cycle in zones 1 or 2. For me that is anything below 130 heart rate. Well it is now, it was below 154bpm until I corrected my zones in Garmin connect.
When I was stuck on the turbo most of my training was high aerobic. On the mountain bike or road bike I am usually in zone 1 or 2 on the flat unless I’m pushing on at a hard pace. So any 3 hour ride plus has a lot of low aerobic work in it.