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Is it disgusting and squishy, like horrible 10 speed XTR? Or is it properly bolt-action SRAM-ripoff-ey, like lovely 10-speed Saint? It appears I need a new chain and so the logical thing to do is replace the whole drivetrain, right? But Shimano feel varies a lot... What do you reckon?
It appears I need a new chain and so the logical thing to do is replace the whole drivetrain, right?
😀
Its funny how shifters and mechs always fail at the same time that a chain wears out isn't it?
Dunno about XT but 11spd XTR is lovely and positive, really sharp action.
Almost tempts me away from my 10spd SRAM XX.
I would say XT 11 speed feels very positive. 1 click equals 1 shift unless you do a push to go through several gears.
I am comparing this to a really mushy old 7 speed set up, a SRAM 9 speed grip shift and a fairly recent 9 speed XT.
I'm hoping it will be shit, then I won't have to worry about my horrible squishy XTR 10sp being the worst Shimano group ever.
It is like being held aloft by winged monkeys, who select the gear you need to be in before you even know which part of the trail you are going to. It will turn you into a riding deity and make nubile women weak in your presence.
XTR 10spd is horrible and squishy?
Not any I've ever fitted to a bike! 😕
Have had a quick play with XT 11spd on a couple of display bikes, initial shifter feel is it feels slightly more direct than outgoing 10spd version, which was pretty damned good anyway.
The only reasons not to go 1x11 in my book were the hideous price of cassettes and chains. Both those are a non issue now, so fill your boots!
nubile women
Ah I remember them. Just. It was a long, long time ago.
Is it disgusting and squishy, like horrible 10 speed XTR? Or is it properly bolt-action SRAM-ripoff-ey, like lovely 10-speed Saint? It appears I need a new chain and so the logical thing to do is replace the whole drivetrain, right? But Shimano feel varies a lot... What do you reckon?
Well seeing as the 10 speed xtr and Saint shifters are identical in practically every way besides colour I genuinely struggle to see how you've come to that conclusion...
Shifting feels both lighter and crisper. Happy so far 🙂
11 speed xtr felt like breaking glass rods when I had a play.
I've drank deep of the kool-aid and it tasted good.
Cheers folks, sounds positive. I guess I should see if I can have a click on a bike in a shop or something!
lawman91 - MemberWell seeing as the 10 speed xtr and Saint shifters are identical in practically every way besides colour I genuinely struggle to see how you've come to that conclusion...
By using both, funnily enough. Mostly it's just the feedback, but in practical terms I don't like how light the multi-release is on the XTR at all, just doesn't work for me, it's about the last thing I want to be thinking about.
Its certainly not squishy on the upshift, tis a proper solid click..
Works fine although mine needs a bit of tweaking as i never set it up spot on from new. Rode through from Dundonnell to Poolewe yesterday in mud and bog so.. yeah, it lasts approx 3 of those rides as I forgot to take oil with me! It's worn out already but it was a jaunt into the unknown the day after heavy rainfall.
I've just got some of the current 10sp XT shifters and they feel 'clicky' unfortunately and far too much like Sram.
I was hoping for closer to the ace 9sp XTR I had a few years back. Best shifters ever, Rapid Rise and all!
Massive hijack...
Rode through from Dundonnell to Poolewe yesterday in mud and bog
What did you reckon to it then? Did you head over the eastern side of an teallach? Looked a very techy descent there.
We did Poolewe to Dundonnell in June and it was epic.
chestrockwell - agreed 9sp Rapid Rise FTW!
Funnily enough, I've moved to SRAM X1 and it's much softer than most SRAM!
It feels like a glass of fresh milk?
By using both, funnily enough. Mostly it's just the feedback, but in practical terms I don't like how light the multi-release is on the XTR at all, just doesn't work for me, it's about the last thing I want to be thinking about.
You must be a lot more sensitive to differences in shifter feel than I am then, because they feel identical in use to me! Ive got saint on the Foxy, XTR on the Cotic and I can't tell the difference.
Not tried 11 speed XT, but I have 11 speed XTR and it feels very positive, like you'd expect top-end Shimano to feel.
You must be a lot more sensitive to differences in shifter feel than I am then, because they feel identical in use to me! Ive got saint on the Foxy, XTR on the Cotic and I can't tell the difference.
I'm with Northwind, I can definitely tell the difference, I've had both XTR and Saint 10 speed shifters and the XTR is too light for my tastes, I found that I'd occasionally get too many gears at once when the terrain was very bumpy and I needed a quick shift. The Saint is a little more defined in it's clicks, like SRAM is and I haven't had the same issue with it.
I found 9spd x.0 sram to be slicker shifting, much more fluid than 1x9 xtr.
I personally find sram kit much more smoother shifting but the prices are 😯
Suppose all gearing is expensive especially cassettes as harder to manufacture.
BUT SRAM APEX! absolute kak levers and shifting ability.
horrendous stuff.
Apex it is then, cheers!
Yes martinxyz, more information on that crossing. I went half way from Poolewe 2 years ago but was staying in Poolewe so didn't want either a huge ride back on road or trail. So would like to finish it this year, I love Fisherfield, it feels so remote .... er.. because it is so remote.
I rode a SC Nomad on Demo a few months ago with SRAM gearing. This is the first time i'd ever ridden a bike with SRAM gearing and i was very pleasantly surprised by its audible "Click" and precise shift.
So having just been away for a week's riding and having ordered the XT 11 Speed some months back i had it fitted and after a few rides i can say it is definately more precise than than the 10 Speed XT its replaced and much more like the SRAM stuff that i'd never experienced before. Whether my 10 Speed had gradually decreased in shifting performance over the past 2 years or not i dont know?
But its definately better.
Why on earth would Shimano want to ape the cheap feel of Sram when they already had shifters pretty much nailed. 🙁
clunky / definite
light action / vague
It's just opinion, isn't it.
Yep, same as everything else.
Where is everyone buying theirs from? Any outlets doing 1x11 11-42 with brakes yet?
It's the precise action that I am trying to relay through words as opposed to posting a video OR letting you actually ride my bike so that you can see for yourself.
For me it was a NO Brainer, replace with 1X10 OR stick the 1X11 on. Had it been SRAM then I wouldn't have bothered I'd have gone 1X10 again because the drivetrain costs less than the rear cassette from SRAM.
But as I choose SHIMANO and because it looked like I could get my hands on it after
My Alps trip replacing an already tired setup it all kinda dropped into place.
It's all relative I suppose, if you find it difficult getting the lid off a jar of Mayonaise it's going to seem like a clunk as the indexing shifts, if you try and impress your mates by sticking your little finger through a beer mat then the shifting will seem more of a snickety click as opposed to clunk.
I'm in the market for new cranks for the SS - "new XT! " I thought!
checked the shops - £100! Not bad at all! cranks only, but I've got a wonky jobby I want to use anyway.
Only new XT has got a proprietary bloody bolt pattern hasn't it? Total ****ers. No benefit whatsoever* - just mean-minded tie-in tactics.
Harrumph.
*Oh, it's for slightly better power transfer is it? Discernible by anybody, ever?
I've calmed down now. Still irritating though.
http://singletrackmag.com/forum/topic/oval-chainring-talk-to-me
Ned - new BCD allows down to 30T without messing with chainlink (as on 104) and supports the ring better where needed, to allow for Di2 which requires stiffer rings.
OK, smaller = better. makes sense, with chainrings getting smaller.
Why would Di2 need stiffer chainrings? I can't imagine offsetting the bold pattern makes any significant difference in the real world.
Anyway, enough people are going to be buying them that absolute black et al are going to produce rings for them.
My boots are chilled!
Di2 is precise but unforgiving - it goes from A to B without mechanical empathy and so needs a ring that doesn't move out of line in order to shift as it should - hence the hollow forged rings on Dura-Ace, Ultegra, 105 and now XTR and XT. The hollow rings are super stiff, and supported where they benefit most by the asymmetric rings. (Di2 shifting on non Shimano cranks is noticeably poorer).
Like you say - it'll soon become a mainstream bolt pattern so most aftermarket brands will offer rings to suit.
how are people finding the Shimano teeth design opposed to narrow wide?
I never once dropped a chain with n/w until about a month ago when the ring is now too worn and its happening regularly.
Everything will need replacing soon so currently umming and ahhing over groupset upgrade. My plan at the moment is to go for xt mech, xt(r? as not much more) shifter, XT 11-42 cassette and want a single ring specific crank with a 36t ring.
Uncertain whether to go for xt cranks with xtr 36t ring (no xt 36t) or get some other cranks and standard narrow wide. I'd like to go hope for the bling, but no lighter than xt and £100 more expensive. It seems to me that you can't get better value single ring specific than XT cranks at the mo?
OneUp do a N/W ring that fits new XTR cranks - assume XT are same BCD (but I probably shouldn't assume that....)
XT and XTR are both the same 96 bcd. Black do one too - the new oval ones which look interesting.
I've 1x11 XT on one bike and have been running SRAM 1x11 on other bikes for the last year. The XT stuff is really good for the price. With the XT cranks and chainring, it's very predictable, no issues at all with dropped chains. The chainring has slightly hooked teeth that apparently grab the chain better.
However, whilst the shifters are good, they are nowhere near the quality of the SRAM ones. I've got full XT except for the shifter where I went XTR for the sake of an extra £30. They feel a bit more plasticky and not quite as substantial as SRAM. The shift is ok although it does take a bit of getting used to the lighter action required for just one shift, it's quite easy to push through to several shifts by mistake. I've run both shimano and SRAM 2x10 in past, so can see how folk think SRAM stuff is cheap n nasty but the XX1 and XO1 is quality kit imho.
The gear ratios on the shimano 11-42 cassette are really good though, very close together so gear changes are much smoother than on SRAM where sometimes you feel caught between gears.
Given the price difference it's well worth considering the shimano stuff....if only they made an XTR 11-42 cassette.
SO, will [url= http://absoluteblack.cc/oval-94bcd.html ]this chainring[/url] fit the XTs then? Is it just a smaller BCD, or are the bolts unevenly spaced?
SO, will this chainring fit the XTs then? Is it just a smaller BCD, or are the bolts unevenly spaced?
No, that's a SRAM 94BCD fitting. You need the 96 BCD fitting, it will specifically noted to fit XT M8000. Absolute Black ones are not available yet, One Up ones here http://www.oneupcomponents.com/collections/all-products/products/xt-m8000-traction-chainrings
Cheers Doug, can't seem to find a 34t one (of any brand) anywhere.
I think you will just have to wait. At a guess, since Shimano don't endorse aftermarket rings, most of the manufacturers will likely have to wait until the retail cranks become available to get a set for development and testing of their rings, so given the cranks are just available in the last few weeks, it will take a bit longer.
Absolute Black say theirs should be up next week, they will also have a slightly cheaper version available via CRC. http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/black-by-absoluteblack-narrow-wide-oval-xt-m8000-chainring/rp-prod139806