[Closed] So I want to try road racing + build a bike specifically for this

You can go to Redbridge (Hog Hill, East London), Cyclopark (Gravesend) or Velopark (Olympic Park). There are also regular races in Preston Park (Brighton), Alexander Park (Portsmouth) and others. The last two are on outdoor oddly shaped velodromes.

Getting out of 4th Cat is not always easy. It took me 39 races 😉 . It took my clubmate two (he won them both!)

Took me 6, first three were on a day license where I found out I wasn't strong enough - I hadn't done any specific training but wanted to scratch the itch.

Next three (after a winter of training) went 4th, 5th, 3rd

If you're willing to travel and can get up to the Midlands there are some 4th only races at Stourport end of January - they're filling up quick though so get your skates on if you're interested.

Ah that's a shame, I was hoping that if I attended at least half of those at Hillingdon I could be in for a small chance (by sheer luck) of moving to cat 3 which seems to open a lot more race doors. There's a couple E123 ones up north where my folks live I wanted to turn up to (not to get ahead of myself).

I don't mind travelling a little bit, but it's less likely I can attend. Will see what the imperial series brings then go from there. 🙂

[url= http://www.hughesartandphotos.com/Photos/Cycling/Cycling-20162017/IWS-2016-2017/Imperial-Winter-Series-1/IWS-2016-7-1-MenCat4/i-smhWHqj/A ]crosshair [/url]looking comfortable in the bunch

[url= http://www.hughesartandphotos.com/Photos/Cycling/Cycling-20162017/IWS-2016-2017/Imperial-Winter-Series-1/IWS-2016-7-1-MenCat4/i-s5ndnnV/A ]YGA [/url]

[url= http://www.hughesartandphotos.com/Photos/Cycling/Cycling-20162017/IWS-2016-2017/Imperial-Winter-Series-1/Imperial-Winter-Series-201671-Me/i-5sL8xm8/A ]Race mode[/url]

Nath if you have the power to weight, and a little tactics, you'll progress a lot faster than me. But 4th cat at hillingdon is very competitive. There are 62 entries online for this week. A few spaces remaining.

Crosshair, assuming that is you with bare arms and legs. Easy to spot the mountain biker 🙂

Nath if you have the power to weight, and a little tactics, you'll progress a lot faster than me. But 4th cat at hillingdon is very competitive. There are 62 entries online for this week. A few spaces remaining.

As I think I said, practice your sprint. Decent power will help give you some time to think and get into the right position at the right time but you do need to be able to sprint (mine was woeful!)

Before I did a few the season before last I did think cat 4 would be pretty easy. Ultimately I found it a bit frustrating. Had enough power so the pace was easy and could get into the right place at the end of the race but my sprint was dreadful and I'd get swamped. I went for a long range attack a couple of times and almost made it but didn't quite have the legs to hold of the bunch to the line (at the time my 60MP was about 4.6w/kg @ 72kg - got more power, less mass, and a better position these days though 😈 ). Pretty negative racing too with few willing to try or help in a break and most just wanting to sit in for the sprint. I think if I'd have committed to it and tweaked the training a bit I'd have started to pick up points but I didn't really have enough free time to race crits and time trials.

Haha I remember seeing you now @crosshair. The thought of my god that guy is mad showing arms and legs as I'm sat here shivering in thermals. 😆

I've done a couple of virtual races, I know it's not the same by far but it's giving me decent & more importantly consistent stats to compare versus my FTP test (plus I really can tank it in my garage as I know I don't have to cycle home), also learning a little about tactics (as much as you do in a virtual environment):

Current weight: 70kg

FTP:
Duration: 20
Average: 338w

Race 1:
Duration: 21:44
Weighted average: 345w
95% 4.76w/kg
20m 350w
5m 5.24w/kg
2m 5.28w/kg
15s 7.68w/kg

Race 2:
Duration: 52:42
Weighted average: 316w
95% 4.69w/kg
20m 345w
5m 5.28w/kg
2m 5.45w/kg
15s 7.14w/kg

I'm expecting Saturday to be a BIG learning curve, and like I said I'm happy to sit mid pack not causing an accident and learn. Then hopefully regroup in January and try to come in the top 10. 😆

With those levels, I'd suggest attacking on the first lap and time trialing to victory! 😉 I'm about 4.3 Watts/kg. Real Watts measured in real races. You will be fine. Say hello before the race and be sure to stay in front of me!

@TiRed - I'm renting a power meter for Jans races to compare.
Now I know what you look like I'll say hello. 🙂

Haha that'd be the dream! I'm not sure though, part of me doesn't believe those stats - but I can always try 😆

With those levels, I'd suggest attacking on the first lap and time trialing to victory!

Death or glory but it's not a bad idea 🙂 Leave it too late and the bunch speeds up considerably in the last few laps (last lap up to about 30mph) so it's harder to get the gap you need to stay away.

Start to finish, the cat 4's I've done have tended to average out around between 24 and 27 mph. If you can go faster than that for 50 mins you're sorted 🙂 (though you will be giving the bunch a nice carrot to chase!)

Edit... FWIW I can remember our local WC XC rider doing just that in his first ever cat 4 race round Thruxton having fancied a go at a crit. I think he needed an NP of about 380W to stay clear for the 50 minutes.

@mrblobby the only chance of that is if you managed to catch the back of the main group and tag along? I don't think I've got it in me for 50 mins.

Only one way to find out 🙂

Death or glory but it's not a bad idea

[url= https://www.strava.com/activities/792512888 ]Average on Saturday was 25 mph[/url]. It felt slower to be honest.

If you lap the field you win! It's pretty rare for a solo rider at Hillingdon. Very common at Preston Park.

Average on Saturday was 25 mph. It felt slower to be honest.

Not to Crosshair 😉

Already got my racing screen ready on my computer:
Speed
Cadence
Heart Rate
Elapsed Time
Distance

So you're saying attack (if possible) around the 38 min mark?

I think I was more riding 'with' the bunch than 'in' it 😀

I averaged 21mph for the 16miles I did. You can see from my lap times when I was working with someone to try and push on and when I was wondering whether to just call it a day right there and then 😀

[img] [/img]

Not to Crosshair

🙂 That's the thing if the bunch is doing 25mph and you're off the back it can be rather hard to get back on. Similarly going off the front at that speed needs a big effort too.

Worked last week.

Just need good timing, a bit of luck, and some strong legs 🙂

It wasn't particulate easy to get back on when they lapped me either 😀 (x4 😀 )

It wasn't particulate easy to get back on when they lapped me either (x4 )

As the bunch comes up behind you, start sprinting. Get off the racing line to allow the bunch to come through smoothly and you should be at full tilt by the time the first third or so of the bunch are through.

Behind that there will be a few gaps, riders jostling for position and leaving spaces so it should be OK to just slot in and adjust to the speed of the bunch. Kind of like joining a motorway from the sliproad and merging to the middle lane. Ideally, you should be looking to join the bunch again while they are negotiating the bends or on a slight downhill section where you'll be able to match their speed more easily.

You should then get about 15 seconds respite while the bunch moves around you to recover from the initial sprint up to speed and find your place. If you mis-time it, that 15 seconds will see you out the back door again!

Thanks. Yes, I was just trying not to get I anyone's way 😉 🙂

Eurgh, I've just seen the weather forecast for Saturday! 🙁

Are the Hillingdon Winter series crew fairly amiable to people using cameras? I won't stop dead on the finish line to press stop or drop it down the road in the middle of the bunch (definitely not if I'm solo TT'ing again 😉 ) or put it on a selfie stick and pose or anything crazy 😀

I've seen a few videos on youtube of hillingdon races. The pros do it!

Which races are you aiming for @crosshair?

Imperial Winter Series
07/01/2017
14/01/2017
21/01/2017
28/01/2017
04/02/2017
11/02/2017

Trouble is crosshair, that you'll probably also have expended a lot of energy riding around alone (more than being part of the faster moving bunch) once you got dropped. So each time they come past, you'll be that little bit more fatigued, than if you were just trying to latch on from fresh.

Yes I think you're right. You start off in denial, thinking you can catch back on, then you team up and chase for a bit and then when they come around again, you're already maxxed out 😀

Assuming I get dropped again, I suppose saving my energy for a concerted effort to join the group again might be better practice than TT'ing for another 40mins.

I was hanging to the VC10 rider (the last guy to get a finishing spot) then bridged from him to the bunch as they passed... then couldn't hang with either after that 😀

The more I think about it, the more brutal type 2 fun I realise it was. Can't wait for next time!!

Hopefully the last 4 of those dates Nath

Cool - I've just all 6 passed the missus, she seems fairly okay with me doing them all. 😆

May even convince her to come and watch one week 😛

Have to say hello!

I'm in the mindset of I'm doing it for fun this time around. Next season I'll properly train etc. That way I feel better for not getting any points lol.

I'm in the mindset of I'm doing it for fun this time around. Next season I'll properly train etc. That way I feel better for not getting any points lol.

This is exactly the right mindset. If you can stick to it all season (or indeed past your second race) then you're a better man than most 😉

Are the Hillingdon Winter series crew fairly amiable to people using cameras?

Bike mounted cameras and videos are[url= https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/zuvvi/media/bc_files/rulebook/2016/C7_-_Technical_Regulations_For_General_Road_Track_and_Roller_Racing_v2.pdf ] banned from BC races[/url]. Dems da rules. All about liability. Sad I know, and there is a nice video from last year's #9 of me lying unconscious after a very poor overtake and chopping by a rider. a bike mounted camera would have given me grounds to sue for negligence!

10.4 The use in competition of cameras attached to
riders, cycles or helmets is prohibited, unless
previously authorised in writing by the BC Board.
Unless prohibited by the regulations of individual
disciplines, onboard cameras are permitted
during practice or designated training sessions,
but the use of such cameras is authorised solely
when the camera is attached to the bicycle. The
rider is solely responsible for securing the fixation
of the camera in order to avoid any danger or
distraction.

In my 10 milestones of racing, finishing in the bunch is number 2. Entering is number 1! Just keep in the bunch and in front of me!

Are the Hillingdon Winter series crew fairly amiable to people using cameras? I won't stop dead on the finish line to press stop or drop it down the road in the middle of the bunch (definitely not if I'm solo TT'ing again ) or put it on a selfie stick and pose or anything crazy

BC Regulation: The use in competition of cameras attacehd to riders cycles or helmets is prohibited.

The Commissaires should be DQing anyone seen with a camera. Filming from the sidelines is allowed but obviously don't go waving a selfie stick near anyone's spokes!

Outdoor Traders (Abingdon) Winter Crit series now up on BC...

https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/events/details/156700/OTRT-Winter-Crit-Series---Round-1

Damn this thread, I really wasn't intending to race crits this year 😕

Not that I'm a racer, but in case it's of interest but not known: Zappi's (Oxford) has pretty much ceased, so I don't imagine that there'll be any Zappi's Crits this season (was at Enstone last year).

🙁 for Zappi's.

TiRed
Sad I know, and there is a nice video from last year's #9 of me lying unconscious after a very poor overtake and chopping by a rider. a bike mounted camera would have given me grounds to sue for negligence!

Jeez! In the 4th cat? What happened!?

Jeez! In the 4th cat? What happened!?

That's just how it is in 4th cat 😉

Ah ok thanks. I thought it was at the commissaires discretion but glad I asked now.

So all the ones on YouTube should have resulted in a DQ or what?

I know Chris Pritchard who vlogs about training and did the commonwealth games in 2010 was slagging BC off for not allowing people to film at a velodrome but didn't know it applied to other disciplines.

They really are an innovative bunch of modernisers aren't they 😉 😀

I'm surprised they allow Garmins by the same reasoning really (similar size and weight and just as likely to fall off. I.e. Not likely at all 😉 )

I wonder if I can pass a VIRB off as a head unit 😉

And the reason BC gave Chris Pritchard was that they 'don't want people making commercial gains out of the footage' ...... so not safety related at all.

Chris did a good job of keeping a lid on what he was really thinking I reckon- would love to see the proper version 😀

What's the turnout like in the pouring rain? 🙁

Actually it was the E123. I moved up to sixth wheel, someone attacked and a rider chased him. That rider cut across and took out my front wheel. As travelling at 33mph with a speed wobble and I knew I wouldn't make the corner. All I remember was saying to myself "don't hit the bench".

No crashes in the 4th cat last week. One in the E123.

And of course there is the greatest finish of all time in THAT photo 😉 . I wa forced off on the last lap in that race.

In my experience rain makes little difference to turn out.

Ah 🙁

I've just noticed on last weeks pictures, this was [url= http://www.hughesartandphotos.com/Photos/Cycling/Cycling-20162017/IWS-2016-2017/Imperial-Winter-Series-1/IWS-2016-7-1-MenCat4/i-kjD6CqB/A ]ME[/url] sat on the bench 🙂

Firstly nice to meet you @TiRed! Thanks for the tips! Sorry I was going to watch you race but then I realised I had no lights with me, so after a cuppa and flapjack I darted off.

I learnt a LOT today, where to start! 😆

Firstly the new bike is epic, really happy with how it performed today.

I had two mishaps which I can rectify for next time:
1) On the right hand technical turn I overshot it a little on a lap which saw me spewed to the back of the bunch. I should have put more time in on my new bike, the handling is different from both my other bikes.
2) I came off my line as the guy in fronts rear wheel cut across from me, this caused the guy behind to shout at me a little. Next time I'll tap my brakes.

I attacked 3 or 4 times, I mean proper attacked from pretty much the back. One was after chatting to TiRed for a little while. This caught everyone off guard I think. Each time a couple of guys came with me but we weren't strong enough to hold off the bunch. One of the guys at the end even said thanks for carrying him up the field (I think he came in the top 3 in the end). [b]Lesson [/b]- save the energy for the last 5/6 laps and either follow an attacker or try my best to TT it.

To summarise (I hope TiRed agrees) - physically I'm fine I could have sat in the bunch all day. Mentally however I'm far from there yet.

Jolly good fun though!

Rough stats:
Speed - Max: 33.1. Avg: 25.6
Est Power - Max: 1,058w. Avg: 317w
Heart Rate - Max:195. Avg: 174
Cadence - Max:114. Avg:90
Distance - 25 miles
Time - 58:32

Top job buddy!

I spent an hour and half driving to Luton contemplating next weeks race with you guys but in fairness I just don't have enough speed yet. I need a good year more before I'd see anyone after even 1 lap

Thanks Weeksy.

Ah should do, it's good fun. Really isn't about speed or power, just keep with the bunch and out of the wind. I'll be there all Jan/Feb hopefully.

Some guy has just commented on my ride: "4 efforts off the front. Brave/suicidal! No questions who deserved the combativity award." 😀

Excellent! Good one.

Going to sign up then weeksy? 🙂

Unsure buddy. I'm a good 10% slower than crosshair at a guess as well as being both physically bigger than him and 1st+ heavier.
All of this in my mind tells me, if he couldn't hold the bunch then what chance do I have. I'm also not particularly skilled on a road bike and don't do bunch riding.
I'm stacking up to be a complete disaster based on that!

Good work nathb. Sounds much like my first go too! Sounds like more people willing to have a go round Hillingdon, much less negative and more fun than my experience of Thruxton.

When you racing next?

Well done Nath! That's awesome and how I'd dreamt my first race would go until I got a sharp reality check!
I know how hard it was to try and keep with the bunch so to attack at all proves you are definitely in the right fitness ballpark.
A little tweak to your tactics and you'll be contesting the podium I reckon.

Really chuffed for you 🙂

Well done mate, sounds like you're on the right track. Few more races experience and hopefully you'll start adding some points to the hard work...

@weeksy - won't know until you try it 😉

Thanks for the nice comments guys.

I may have snuck in 10th, I highly doubt it though.

My next one is the 7th January @mrblobby.

I'm aiming to get out on my new bike any opportunity I get until then plus Zwift'ing. Should help being off from the 16th Dec until 4th Jan 😆

My next one is the 7th January @mrblobby.

If I get the race bike built back up over xmas I may well come and play 🙂

Very well done if only my first race was like that! And the second and third etc. Much smoother ride this week with only a couple of incidents.

My tips: don't brake and don't overlap wheels. You'll make no friends. On the long right hand bend (called Brian's Bends) you should look around the bend at the leaders, not straight ahead. You should also try and avoid being right over on the outside.

When it comes to attacking, you need to go from about 10 places back, not the back of the bunch. If you are out in the wind overtaking the whole bunch, you won't have much left. You also need to go with six or seven laps to go. Two laps to go is too late. This is where elapsed time is all that matters on the garmin. That and knowing the length of the race (easy to miss at the briefing).

Glad you enjoyed it. Racing is very addictive.

Avg Max
Speed 40.4km/h 52.6km/h
Heart Rate 160bpm 191bpm
Cadence 103 130
Power 224W 1,197W
Calories 879
Temperature 11?
Elapsed Time 59:10

And for the real race... (I worked a bit harder in this one, but didn't thrash myself ragged!). Not such a huge difference, about 5-7%

Avg Max
Speed 42.0km/h 54.7km/h
Heart Rate 165bpm 194bpm
Cadence 104 134
Power 236W 959W
Calories 1,066
Temperature 11?
Elapsed Time 1:07:32

And yes, I normally average. Over 100 for my racing cadence.

mrblobby
If I get the race bike built back up over xmas I may well come and play

What bike are you building?

TiRed
Very well done if only my first race was like that! And the second and third etc. Much smoother ride this week with only a couple of incidents.

My tips: don't brake and don't overlap wheels. You'll make no friends. On the long right hand bend (called Brian's Bends) you should look around the bend at the leaders, not straight ahead. You should also try and avoid being right over on the outside.

When it comes to attacking, you need to go from about 10 places back, not the back of the bunch. If you are out in the wind overtaking the whole bunch, you won't have much left. You also need to go with six or seven laps to go. Two laps to go is too late. This is where elapsed time is all that matters on the garmin. That and knowing the length of the race (easy to miss at the briefing).

Glad you enjoyed it. Racing is very addictive.

Thanks for the tips - taking them all on board for next time. Today was all about building my confidence which I think it has done.

One time I really didn't even realise I was at the back until I saw you on my right. 😆

In the 1/2/3s do they also bunch up/slow down along the straight - I was expecting it to be very quick but bar the laps I stupidly attacked on I hardly felt like I was pedalling.

How did you get on in your race in terms of rough position?
That's a high cadence! I remember you telling folk to drop gears on the hill.

What bike are you building?

Just my TCR. I pinched the di2 off it for the training bike for this winter.

With your power, you should be at the pointy end! And it is very easy to drop back. Loss of concentration. Racing is non stop concentration and you should be thinkng of nothing else.

In my race I started near the back, worked my way up to top hird, blocked for a team mate. Attacked on the straight after a long chase b cause a counter attack is always fun. And yes, we do slow up a bit, it's not all full gas. That's the Tuesday evening races.

@mrblobby - Ah I see. Some realllly nice bikes there today!

@TiRed - I'll try next time, I'll be more settled knowing what's happening + roughly when and where to attack. If I broke up the bunch a little today then my job was done haha. By the way, just watching the strava fly by thing, attacking on the 3rd lap and TT'ing did not work. 😆

Also I saw 3 or 4 photographers, do you know who they are? I want to guilt my missus into coming to watch next time. 😆

By the way, I saw 3 or 4 photographers, do you know who they are? I want to guilt my missus into coming to watch next time

They're busy taking pics of the riders, so may not have time to take pics of her.

Photo links will be posted on the Imperial website. Digi Dave Hayward wad there today, and Dave rakes absolutely stunnng photos. He's on facebook.

The engine looks in fine form. Now you learn to race. Because the fittest do not always win. I bet you're hooked. It's like crack!

http://bit.ly/2gqcjH6

Yep, I'm going to be booking the next ones soon. 😀

I'm not putting pressure on myself this season though - what will be will be 😆

haha found a couple of me, got a right game face on 😳

As the results are pending I've been reflecting on the weekends race, the next race's objectives are simple;

1) Stick in the bunch without hiccups and holding my line (CONCENTRATING)!
2) Try and get a top 10 spot

I'm not going to be doing any silly attacks from the back. I'm going to take each race them as they come and most of all ENJOY them.

I think you should be well chuffed with that position mate! Well done you 🙂

17th (out of 40) 🙂

Well happy!

Thanks @crosshair

Excited, nervous and ever so slightly ill still but I can't wait until tomorrow! Let's hope I can learn how to be lazy 😀 (It's no trouble in other aspects of my life 😉 )

Wow! That was fun! Some progress made- only got lapped twice and finished the race 😀

Thanks so much to TiRed- your instruction was really helpful. Can't wait until the 14th!

Well done. A faster race this week a you held on well. Better still, you got back on when we lapped you the first time. Riding in the bunch is a skill and fitness is only part of the story.

The 4th cats managed to all stay upright, which is more than can be said for the E123 race in which I narrowly missed the last lap pile up!

Ouch! Well done on avoiding!

I thought the riding was very consistent- it seemed everyone was doing a good job (not that I know either way lol)

I think, if I had held on for less than half a lap longer, I would have been OK- as when I got on the second time, it was about 3mph slower! Then that attack came and the elastic didn't have quite as much stretch left in it 😉

I'm still making hard work of it 😀

[img] [/img]

Well done @crosshair!!

Looking forward to January's racing 🙂

Just been given 2017s supply of cycling energy 😆

[img] [/img]

Sponsored already hey 😀

Unofficially yes 😆

The bars are really nice, but I barely use the gels. Got a pile of out of date ones to get rid of - so if anyone wants them let me know! 🙂

Doh! I literally just ordered some on Amazon yesterday.

You/weeksy/tired can have them anyway if you trust them 😆

I'll bring them to Hillingdon in January, going to book my races on payday this week.

Not sure on the yodel direct jersey I got too, but I quite like the white & green skoda one lol

Thank you, but I've only done gels once, they went really really badly. So I'm a no thank you

Cool- thanks. My iron gut can cope with anything 😀

Great, thanks @crosshair - seems a shame binning them! [url= ]These are what I've got[/url]

Also have these if anyone wants them:
1/4 zip: [url= ]PIC 1[/url] [url= ]PIC 2[/url]
Polo: [url= ]PIC[/url]

Having a bit of a Christmas clear out 😆

Ah bugger, I left it too late it seems...

I'm on the waiting lists for the next 2 races. 😥

Oh i'll take as many gels as you can't eat. One thing you will find is that at race pace it is very hard to eat anything solid. I get stomach cramps. The things I do eat are Clif bloks.

For a circuit race, a gel before and another at 30 minutes is all that's needed.

Sign up anyway, plans always change, and illness may see off a few riders. If you are top five, you are normally guaranteed to ride.

I've signed up to 6, 7 & 9.

I'm 8th on the waiting list for the 4th race and 4th on the list for the 5th.

I'll probably come along and watch anyway.

I've also just started to get my body used to gels and bars, I wasn't sure how well I'd cope lol. I think a bar 30 mins before, gel 15 mins before and some energy drink in the bottle is enough for me. Testing on Zwift lol.