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Yep! Even I haven't watched it yet 😆
No shaven legs here!
@CH - heads up its England vs France 6 nations at Twicks tomorrow afternoon. I'd give yourself a little extra time.
Thanks Nath! I get there fairly early anyway but I'll try and leave a bit sooner- thanks 🙂
I just want to get started now and see how it's going to unfold 😀
No worries!
I've been chatting to a professional bike fitter who's just watched that video. Turns out having my saddle pointing down has over developed my quads (which are quite literally trying to rip my knee caps off).
Anyway saddles flat and higher, it can go an extra 10mm higher but will do it gradually to avoid injury. He's kindly offered to do a proper bike fit next time I'm up north.
Will get outside and do some more fitting on Sunday if the weathers okay.
Looking forward to tomorrow now, performing brain surgery right now (pinning the number to a jersey 😆 )
Lol! I ironed my number this evening 😀
#Marginalgains
I almost swapped last week to get a new one but I'm hoping 2 could be a good omen 😉
Just make sure it doesn't flap if you want gains 😆
I like to scare my opponents- they think a V8 is coming 😉 😀
Your Ford Taurus' V8?
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I'm sorry 😆
😀 Matches my helmet colour.....
Need to sleep but too wired!
Hope it goes well tomorrow. Watched the video too. Nath, I think your saddle is too far back and your arms too outstretched. No point changing before tomorrow's race, but a little bend in the elbows when on the hoods makes for suspension, and easier to reach and stay on the drops.
Over-extended itb due to saddle too high and too far back will produce knee pain on the outside of the joint, it also signals leg length imbalance if it only appears on one side.
Best of luck chaps. Looks a good day for it.
First round at Abingdon today, anyone racing there?
Cheers @tired - it's just the way I'm sat, my main focus was getting the legs right on that vid. My pain has been at the front/knee caps. I have put the saddle as far forward as it will allow though.
Thanks mrblobby, but looks like we're going to get wet today 🙁
Reverse weather psychology hey 😉
Well- I beat the traffic 😀
Haha you're there already?!
It's throwing it down here, yet all the weather apps say it's dry 🙄
rain radar thinks that you've had all you're getting for a while, even if there are some puddles
Good luck !
It's not raining here- the suns out now too 🙂
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Well just raced my first crit (at Abingdon), felt like I was going well and was keeping myself in the first 20 wheels or so fairly comfortably, though I dont think it was an especially fast race. Unfortunately got a puncture after 25 minutes so didn't get a chance to see if I could stick with the bunch the whole way. Really enjoyed it mind, will trry again next week. Just been out for 20 hilly miles at home as well as the sun was out and my legs felt good.
My first one in Abingdon this morning too. Was chilly warming up but race was OK and everyone stayed rubber down.
I have no fitness so was happy to last 40mins before sliding out of the back and finished DFL half a lap down, Need to work on positioning (like everyone) and the accelerations out of corners.
Signed up for next week!
Good job see you there tiim, I will be on a white and red cannondale caad8 say hi!
hmmmm. Keep vacillating between "no #### chance don't want to get taken out" and "really fancy giving it a go", and Abingdon is local to me. Seems a shame not to make something of my CX season fitness too. Glad to hear some positive and crash-free reports, giving it some thought.
Did those of you that race enter 4th or 2/3/4?
I was in the 4s race. The 234 race after looked a bit rapid. Everyone seemed pretty sensible really, the space means there is lots of run off if things don't go well. There were a few punctures and people were shouting or putting their hand up and sliding out the back in a sensible way.
Hillingdon was so sketchy today, almost like people were riding without stabilisers for the first time (700? Club seemed particularly bad?). One guy kept half wheeling me on the inside when I was already on the edge, and kept shouting inside!? Needless to say there was a crash or two, one resulting in broken bikes and another collar bone snapped.
My race was rather boring, exactly as intended, for the first 40 mins or so. With 3 laps to go I sprung an attack which saw me move 2/3s up the bunch to the front. On the last corner I was about 6th feeling really strong and went for it but I got boxed in behind 2/3 riders who weren't very good at sprinting. I watched in horror as 5 or so other riders shot past on the outside. Schoolboy positioning from me then!
Well done Nath! You did exactly as you planned and had a nice snoozy ride and kept well out of trouble.
That was horrendous today- almost enough to make me reconsider doing it. There were 3 or 4 guys in particular who really weren't up to scratch and near misses every lap.
One guy dropped a gel which exploded and got stuck in his wheel nearly causing a crash!
Then two guys collided just in front of me and one decided to collect his nerve on the grass- and turned right across into me!! I smashed into him with a glancing blow and had to ride around him on the grass.
Then, with two to go and the same guys causing the same problems, their luck ran out and about ten went down. I hit the brakes (thank god for the 80psi 28's 😉 ) and scrubbed off most of my speed. It looked like an unavoidable crash like last time again and I braced myself. Luckily, one fell left and one fell right and I slalomed through the middle. I chased like mad but couldn't quite get back in time.
No idea where I finished but it wasn't far behind the bunch and I'm just glad I did finish!!
Well done Tomvet and Tiim 🙂
Nice one tomvet &tiim!
Weighing up whether I should hit the buy button on Rounds 3 & 4 for Abingdon, it's 60 miles away so a bit of a trek...
How's the circuit? How many riders were out?
@CH the more I think about it the more I get frustrated at some of the riding skills shown today. In my "Sprint" finish I used 708W, told you I freewheeled due to getting boxed in! 😆
Let me know about round 3 ^^ 🙂
@weeksy: 231w was all that was needed: https://www.strava.com/activities/854851399/analysis
I'm very tempted to switch next week too (sorry 😳 ).
I don't like not finishing what I started but that was ridiculous today. Like that guy I told you about taking a drink mid corner whilst everyone was bunching up- lethal!
Fair enough- accidents happen. It's fast, on the rivet and twisty so it's bound to. But I felt it was about to happen every other lap this week.
I only felt safe in the front 10 today and I don't have the power to stay there all the time 😉
It took me 282w* (3.2w/kg). I did have to seriously hit the gas after the incidents so that probably doesn't reflect my efficiency.
I am fitter though- the race flew by today and I never felt lacking in the legs department.
*294 weighted
Obviously you'd be missed but there's two reasons I'm not going to try and influence your decision:
1) I have the inlaws round so will be shooting straight after the race.
2) if you get taken out then I'd feel guilty 😆
If I go to Abingdon- I'll blatantly be taken out by Karma anyway now 😀
Hmmm it's a tough one. I genuinely love it at Hillingdon. The atmosphere, the surface, the corners, the routine I've gotten myself into, seeing familiar friendly faces and even the drive home reflecting on the day.
Besides, I want to see you and your new buddy smash things up 😉
On the flip side- I'm in contention for absolutely nothing and the final round - final lap is not going to be favourable to my chances.
Abingdon is also closer and earlier giving me more family time.
Also, it helps my argument for the 18th if I go next week 🙂
I'll be at Abingdon for round 3 8)
Balls! Assumed it was on the 18th. Oh well I won't be at round 3 then 🙁
Oh I assumed that too!!
OTRT Winter Crit Series - Round 3
4th Cat only
25 February 2017, 09:00
OTRT Winter Crit Series - Round 4
4th Cat only
04 March 2017, 09:00
Looks like I can still hit Hillingdon on the 18th 🙂
@CH - behave 😆
Hmm Hillingdon on the 18th... might be able to do that one. Is there space?
Me too!!!!!! How odd! Solves the anniversary problem though 🙂
I've just switched my entry over- sorry Nath 🙁
Most of what went on was completely unnecessary earlier- the more I reflect the more I know it's the right decision.
I know a crash can happen anywhere at any time in any Cat (as we witnessed on our way out Nath!! ) but it just felt so wrong today.
Hopefully if I get my training plan right, I can have a bit more control over my bunch position (I know it's 3/4 but no harm in dreaming big 😉 ) by the April races.
Oh sorry @mrblobby - Hillingdon is free that afternoon, I was going to do an FTP test outdoors.
@Nath- he was one of the guys who made me feel really welcome there right from rd1- he was really supportive.
I know you've had your differences but surely seeing that break gaining momentum in the E,1,2,3 race made you long for a bit of spice!!! 😉
Not, Zzzzzz- SPRINT- DOH!! 😀
Abingdon course was not overly technical, just a big oval with a couple of tight turns, there was about 50/60 in the field everybody seemed to be riding fairly sensibly and the course was quite wide. Only thing was there was about 10 punctures from bits of sharp flint on the course. Obviously as a first timer I don't have anything to compare it to
@CH nah I wouldn't say we had our differences, just different approaches to getting through the bunch 🙂
Ah man gutting you've done it, but totally understand why!
I've just booked rounds 3 & 4 at Abingdon 🙂
Lol! Sorry- I'm prone to a bit of melodrama (mostly when baiting Weeksy 🙂 ) I didn't mean you were going to ram him off the road or anything 😀
Still getting swings of doubt but it's done now and my entry still stands for the first Tuesday night race....
It will be good to shake myself out of my comfort zone 🙂
@tomvet - Ah the punctures sound a bit horrific!
How flat is it? / do you have a strava link I can peruse? 😆
@CH - haha Yeah, hoping I can do Tuesday nights! There's also a cheeky Saturday race too: https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/events/details/154659/Westerley-Spring-Crits
This is the first race were I haven't even ventured onto a photographers website...
It's an airfield.... couldn't be any flatter if it tried ?
HAHA oh yeah, I forgot it was an airfield!
Hey CH, just seen on facebook, they won: http://www.hughesartandphotos.com/Photos/Cycling/Cycling-20162017/IWS-2016-2017/Imperial-Winter-Series-8/IWS-20167-8-MenE123/i-fpBrHJF
Massive congrats to them that was an EPIC ride!!
Literally about to paste the same link Nath 😀
Yes- epic. They were gaining ground nicely weren't they!
like 7-10 secs per lap wasn't it, now that's a break!
Just watched the video, that's erm a bit cornerless 😆 Definitely a TT circuit!
Yes! Different dynamic fo' sho' 🙂
I won't be cornering my way through the bunch there!!
It's funny how even on such a HUGE open track everyone is really bunched up - some folks very close to the grass there!
No idea on the tactics front, so be interesting for you to scope it out 🙂
I guess the wind will be even more important? They do 30kph at one point!!!! When does THAT ever happen at Hillingdon 😯
I'm attacking if they do it next week 😈
There's an 8.15am open class race tomorrow morning. 9 laps of 2.7 mile volcano route, that may suit you boys pretty well if the legs are left in you?
I'm giving it serious debate that's for sure.
Weeksy- Wrong thread 😀
But no, sorry.... family stuff AM.
Bringing things back on topic- Nath and I were chatting about it today and actually, Zwift and its emphasis on power is such a curve ball when it comes to real life racing.
Both in respect of a) how the stock answer everyone gives about power not being relevant to Crit success is both true and not true. There IS a power requirement for each individual but it can't really be calculated or replicated.
And b) how Nath's Zwift success and apparent power was actually a burden and even more so when he realised he didn't have (all of) it!
With hindsight of course, it makes your earlier races far more of a triumph Nath! But also illustrates the mental side of the game.
🙂
#deepman
@weeksy - planning on hitting Richmond park tomorrow to go race some weekend warriors 🙂
@CH - exactly, its really all just in my head. It's just trying not to let the numbers get to me...
Mine was the right thread, I was thinking for you lads as the layout is likely to be a good mirror for crit racing.
I'll probably do the ZSUN group ride with 30mins warmup beforehand.
That will finish my Build week off nicely before I peak next week for [s]Hillingdon rd9[/s] Abingdon rd2 😀
Haha is that in the women's folder? In our defence that was a warm up lap! 😆
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Sadly this was a chase not a break 🙁
Looks like one though 🙂
Just took a tape measure and spirit level to the commuter.. The saddle is nose down** I've done 1k+ miles on the commuter pain free.
Commuter / racing bike
Saddle height: 770mm/780mm
Saddle nose to back of stem: 455mm/435mm
Stack (bottom gap between fork and bottom of the stem): 180mm/215mm
*
This is my saddle, it's a pain in the backside to determine what is level on it:
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What does this tell me? I need to slam my racing bikes stem!!
Or just race the commuter 😀
You should do a comparison vid with the app.....
It's got discs 🙁
Not going to do anything until after the last race on Saturday- just hoping I stay upright!
Sort out my position for Abingdon.
I'm sure you'll be fine. What tipped the balance for me was the realisation that I could see the problems brewing but was often powerless (literally lol) to avoid them in the bunch. I had no choice but to ride behind these guys at times as moving up is a 3/4 lap long plan for me when the pace is raised.
Had I realised it was 5 to go- I may not have been where I was in the bunch. Equally- I would have probably have been just far enough forward to actually get taken out!
The thing that annoys me is that they were all being repeatedly told by experienced guys in the bunch to settle down but were too pig headed to reasses their riding!
One guy last week came up and said sorry for yelling at one point (we'd chatted at previous rounds). I told him not to be silly and that if he felt the need to shout then I probably needed a bollocking lol.
I know people game the system and try and yell their way into position but surely you know it's genuine if you're being told every single lap!!
It's almost like they need an experienced rider in the group, say in high viz, to shout at people if they're being a bit silly. Crazy idea I know!
Can't help but think that would have been a safer race!
Quite!!!!
So, time to regroup and plan ahead for next week. Mentally, this was due to be a final 'Saturday Race week' ready for the grand finale @ Hillingdon.
I was then planning on treating Abingdon as a C race or two and just training through them on my quest to get fitter, leaner and better prepped for the spring races.
So what to do now? I think I will treat this week as planned. That means:
Mon Rest
Tue KISS race
Wed Z1
Thur Z1
Fri Very low duration, high intensity leg openers.
Sat Race!
My goal of course is still to tick off more of TiReds list- so a top 50% finish. (I assume this means 50% of finishers not starters?).
Then I will probably take a week off of structure- Maybe hook the MTB out for a week and not worry about power or hr.
Then I need a 7 week plan to get me to 'Build 1' by the first Tuesday night...... I will probably cherry pick the 3 different Base weeks and choose workouts that focus on my key limiters.
Anybody care to help me identify what my main limiters are? (Don't pull punches 😉 )
Well... You'd think the obvious answer would be
"you're too big/fat"
But then you watch riders like Stannard who was FLYING and an absolute beast yesterday .... And you think, "Patience..."
You're wanting to go from nothing to superstar and it just takes time fella. You're putting the time in, you're putting the training in... Just have patience.
You're a quicker/better racer than you were 5 weeks ago... you'll be quicker and better again in 10 weeks from now.... You'll get there... Just wait a while.
You'll always be suited better to certain layouts/courses... I think Abingdon being pancake flat will suit you as you've got a bucket load of power/watts to play with... some riders, no matter how they train will never have 1200w that they can pull out of the hat.
You'll always be suited better to certain layouts/courses... I think Abingdon being pancake flat will suit you as you've got a bucket load of power/watts to play with... some riders, no matter how they train will never have 1200w that they can pull out of the hat.
Indeed, and CH should think himself lucky there are courses that suit him.
Where's my weekly Cat4 race that finishes up a 45min 7% climb?!
@CH, from what you've said you tend to struggle when there are surges in pace - maybe some under/over intervals would suit you?
It's almost like they need an experienced rider in the group, say in high viz, to shout at people if they're being a bit silly.
Thank you. I am inclined to agree. People who have just started racing will not appreciate that the season has only just begun, and that a nasty crash now will bring it to a rapid end. There are some experience old hands in the 4th cats, but the lack of tactics and slightly negative racing (save for the inevitable sprint) really so not help. There are plenty of opportunities for points.
If you would like to provide feedback to the organizers on my contribution, I would be very happy. I'd like BC to make it something formal - having a rolling Com who is happy to dodge the flying carbon 😉
Rest day today 😀
and mid pack means starters, not finishers, if you've signed on, you're racing.
Maybe you should try doing some one on one off intervals so help you deal with the surges you typically get in crits.
I find with Abingdon you don't get as many tight corners so you don't have to deal with the sprinting out of them. Just use some bombproof tyres because Saturday was an absolute puncture fest.
TiRed
Thank you. I am inclined to agree. People who have just started racing will not appreciate that the season has only just begun, and that a nasty crash now will bring it to a rapid end. There are some experience old hands in the 4th cats, but the lack of tactics and slightly negative racing (save for the inevitable sprint) really so not help. There are plenty of opportunities for points.If you would like to provide feedback to the organizers on my contribution, I would be very happy. I'd like BC to make it something formal - having a rolling Com who is happy to dodge the flying carbon
Rest day today
and mid pack means starters, not finishers, if you've signed on, you're racing.
Yes! I'll chat to Lucy on Saturday or message her.
Honestly it was shocking, I don't think there would have been half as many issues with you around (genuinely). First time I've had someone half wheeling me and shouting "inside"!? I'm relatively new to racing but that's dangerous as its unnecessary risk and distracting! First time I've felt unsafe too.
For abingdon I've got a choice of GP4000s or 4Seasons. Which have he most protection?
Depending on what happens this weekend now i may actually make it to watch. My oppo may have other stuff on that means he can't make Afan, if that's the case then i'll probably come up on the Parkwood for a chat. I should know more later in the week.
I'm a little bit too poor at the moment to enter though i'm afraid.
Honestly Nath, at the moment i'd love to.. but i got hit with a £400+ bill for the fire in living room last week, along with £150 for a rouge rodent in the loft space.... That wiped out my spare holiday money etc... So just not viable at the moment.
Ah I hear you.
I quit my job last Tuesday, serving my 2 months notice and then I've got nothing yet. Hence not buying a stages yet 😆
along with £150 for a rouge rodent in the loft space.
Exactly how much cheese did you put on the trap? 😯
LOL we got a man in because Mrs Weeksy was scared we had a gazillion of them, but it seems it may have just been a lone bandit...
@Weeksy- Sorry, I think you mis-understood what I was asking. I have 7 weeks between series to train. In order to focus my efforts in the right places, I need to objectively understand where I'm [b]most[/b] lacking.
I'm not trying to be something I'm not - I just want to maximise the gains.
@FifeAndy- Yes, when the pace picks up I was most disadvantaged in the earlier rounds but since I've lifted my eyes up the road and started attacking the attacks (IYSWIM) I've been able to hang a lot better. 2-8 minute power is certainly an area that needs work.
I am aware of over/under intervals but find a Zwift race gives me that organically anyhow along with a variety of lengthed Vo2 max intervals. Seperating them out into dedicated workouts would probably give better gains.
@Rawka- yes, definitely will include some 1min intervals in the plan.
I think there is definitely merit in going back to some aerobic work first. With a ramp up in volume too, it should help push the weight towards my target of 85kg. It will also give me plenty of hours to practice my riding position.
My cadence is creeping up- I managed 87rpm last week, but some drills wouldn't hurt so they can get bunged into the mix.
With 7 weeks to play with, I'm thinking 3 x Base 2, 1x Base R+R, 2x Base 3, 1xBase R+R with the first race at the end and then Build 1 etc from there?
I'll probably be a little lacking in top end again for the first race but should have higher overall fitness?
Weekly interval work + lower overall volume (Time Crunched type plan) would be the other option I suppose......
I have no idea what you just said @CH 😆
Lol! I'm not entirely sure either 😀
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So:
3 weeks doing the Base 2 plan.
1 week unloading fatigue doing the Base R+R plan.
2 weeks doing the Base 3 plan.
1 week unloading fatigue doing the Base R+R plan.
Then weekly races as I progress through the Build, Peak and Race week plans.