[Closed] So, 30 weeks...

I thought you were pregnant.

If it can be proven, as in this case, that you were at fault and caused a death by not paying attention whilst driving, you should have the privilege removed forever.

I thought you were pregnant.

Hey there's already another thread about fat shaming... Stay on topic!

Mmmmmm topic...

Or, maybe a standard ban but you have to pass an extended driving test to get your licence back.
Kill someone with a knife you will almost certainly go to prison, kill someone while you’re checking Facebook behind the wheel, you might not.
How can that be morally right?

In the Republic of Irelnd they have much longer bans, tens years is not unheard of and I think someone got a life ban when we were there last. Can't see what the problem with it is, can't be trusted, get a long ban

Boardman shows such intelligence and restraint in every word he says.
We are very privelidged to have someone like that sticking up for cyclists.

My own thoughts are that injury or death caused by driving where the driver's use of a phone is a proven should be treated as 'dangerous' rather than 'careless' driving by default...

But God bless CB, despite being as close to the case as it's possible to be he's put his finger on the right point, punative prison sentences probably aren't an effective deterrent but the prospect of a lifetime driving ban could just be... Same should apply in injurious or fatal drink/drug driving cases IMO.

In such a "car-centric" society as ours never being able to drive again would be a significant limitation for many people, limiting them both socially and professionally...

Being found unfit to ever hold a driving licence would no doubt carry quite a social stigma too...

They need to remove the jury almost* entirely from these cases

*Fine, allow them to establish the facts - was MrX using his phone at and around the time of the collision and was it on a piece of road with good lines of sight?
Now **** off and let the court decide whether that's careless, dangerous, or ****ing evil

The long bans don't do anything but make the mob a little happier that someone is getting hurt for hurting someone.

It's lame and over-emotional.

Ban + education and advanced testing. I'd personally advocate regular testing of all...

My own thoughts are that injury or death caused by driving where the driver’s use of a phone is a proven should be treated as ‘dangerous’ rather than ‘careless’ driving by default

I think there's a good argument for 'deliberate' actions or 'combination' actions that are against law already should increase or impose automatic bans. So speeding but with MOT expired, careless driving while on phone, no insurance, tax and MOT. I also think that the exemptions handed out at times should be stopped. Finally, I think cars should be taken and sold or crushed more.

Regular retesting to remind people that licenses can be removed. No exemptions to the ban at 12 points. Inclined to think that really lengthy prison sentences are more about vengeance than justice unless it's a deliberately dangerous act.

I sort of agree on the long sentences being retribution but the thing is that they have to be commensurate with other "crimes" - you can't keep giving shorter sentences for wilfully shit driving just because it's still a type of driving.

I'm for mandatory IAD (or some other "higher" standard) retests after any careless or higher offence and would suggest, in lieu of custody, mandatory public service where they have to attend a specified number of speed awareness courses and explain why they're there.

I would expect a VERY substantial driving ban, taking into account aggravating factors such as delayed plea or any attempts to remove evidence or offer false evidence.

Agreed on the no exemptions to the 12 point threshold, too. Once back on the road, I'd like mandatory black box/tacho/something similar fitment to their regular vehicle. Immediate and permanent loss of licence and vehicle if ever found to have been disabled; company car? tough shit, maybe they shouldn't let you have one.

I wouldn't crush though - auction and proceeds to .....

I would also like to see some mandatory questions in every driving theory test, to pre-empt any pretence that some things aren't either dangerous or illegal. Would a careful and competent driver ever use a mobile phone for texts or calls while driving? How much space would a careful and competent driver leave when passing a cyclist? Would a careful and competent driver continue driving forward if the sun was blinding them? Why do cyclists and horse riders sometimes ride well out from the kerb?

I don't really think longer sentences are the answer. The correct answer is separate infrastructure.

separate infrastructure is not and never can be the answer. Its simply not possible on many of our roads and creates cyclist ghettos.

Presumed liability, stricter testing, mandatory retesting, zero tolerance policing is much better

Better road design has its place but its only a small part of the solution

As a cyclist I have a legal right to ride on the highway, I'm damned if I'll campaign for separate infrastructure to reduce that right in the eyes of entitled dickhead drivers.

Better to die a free man.....

separate infrastructure is not and never can be the answer. Its simply not possible on many of our roads and creates cyclist ghettos.

Like they've had on the continent for donkeys years?

Better law and better infrastructure are not mutually exclusive.

As someone who has had his life changed by an idiot driver, I'm all for it. The guy that broke my spine didn't even get a telling off.

It's not hard, or even significantly slower, to drive safely.

I believe that is the priority instead of getting cyclists off roads so drivers can be careless. Driving will die out anyway.

And retribution/punishment...is an acknowledged part of justice...if not then why not give 30 weeks for manslaughter?

separate infrastructure is not and never can be the answer. Its simply not possible on many of our roads and creates cyclist ghettos.

Exactly. I ride around miles and miles of narrow country tyre roads. Do people suggesting segregation ever think all of these roads would have cycle lanes, be walled off etc,.
What government is going to put spending 1,000s of billions of pounds above everything else.

And before you say, I didn't mean all roads, are you proposing that I drive to an area with has segregation and then only ride on the segregated roads?

18 month ban means he will have to get a bike and a bus pass, flint has some nice cycle routes though, along with crap bus services and just one railway station with expensive train fares.

Probaly should be a lifetime ban from driving as a warning to all mobile users in vehicles.

Like they’ve had on the continent for donkeys years?

That's a bit of a myth. Have you been cycling in France? Or in Germany outside of towns and cities?

. The correct answer is separate infrastructure.

Separate infrastucture can be useful, but having been run down while cycling on a cycling path, I don't think it is the answer. We need to change the attitudes of problem drivers. The guy who ran me down drove over the path without looking because he didn't care if anyone was cycling or walking on it, and the consequences for him were minimal. I think punitive driving bans would make some people think twice, and it would remove some people from the road who simply shouldn't be driving.

We'll never have comprehensive infrastructure in the UK anyway. There are thousands of miles of rural roads that will never have cycle lanes, and it will never happen properly in our urban areas either. Unlike The Netherlands, we just don't have the overwhelming public demand to do it.

That’s a bit of a myth. Have you been cycling in France? Or in Germany outside of towns and cities?

Yes, though admittedly I was referring to towns and cities. That seems to be where the call for cycling infrastructure is. I do feel though it would be nice to have dedicated cycle routes between major town and cities, for those who would like to escape traffic.