[Closed] Single/double/triple.... Pros and cons of each.

Have a look at the gear ratios of each set up then you will pretty much answer the question for yourself.

For a lot of riders its not so much a weight saving, more a saving of the whole front Mech and shifter, which makes sense when using a dropper.

If you get that, then go 1xsomething. If you don't, then just pick 2xsomethng, but you really need to understand the ratios first.

Have a look at Sheldon's gear ratio web page to get an idea.

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/gain.html

Why are you changing the race face chainset,is it worn out ?

Single with sram 10-42 is 2 gears less than a 26/38 double so not that much fitness change.
Shimano less gears in 1x11
Doubles give good range for extra weight triple has so many overlaps it's not worth that much.

Going to single saves a bit of weight and looses a few moving parts so thats good. You'll a gear or two off the top and bottom though and there might be some bigger gaps between some of the gears.
You'll get some people on here telling you they ride the Lakes/peaks with 34/36 low gear and their not particularly fit. Their liying or get of and push a lot 😀

There is nowt wrong with the raceface set up but I'm a bit of a shimano fan and just prefer their cranksets. Probably get slated for that but oh well.

I would like to drop some weight from my bike but don't want to at the expense of rideability. I prefer to try and ride up hills rather than push.

Would I need an expander ring on the back ?

Anyone can ride with a single-ring, it's just that they may need to use such a smaller cog (based on fitness and terrain) that they will run out of top speed.

Simplest way is to on use your middle ring of the triple and see how it rides, if you need a lower gear then you could easily add a cassette expander. Once you've worked out what is best for you, then look for a N/W ring for the front.

Once all the rest of the drive-train is worn out, you could then buy either SRAM or Shimano 11-spd in the correct ratio's for you.

I put 1x10 on my FS about 9 months ago (30t front and 40t expander), works great. Once my HT's 9-spd is fully worn out I'll put XT 11-spd on that.

And sod replacing the crankset for the sake of it, wait 'till you've broken it.

All up to you Renton, are you going 10 or 11?
What do you run and where do you run out of gears, what you going to do. It's really quite personal. But a standard 11-36 cassette will be harder work than an expanded one.

It's easy really. Next time you're out, note how often you have to reach for the bottom ring in granny gear (and maybe the next one up), and the two or three top gears in big ring. Those are the ones you'll potentially lose in a 1xwhatever setup.

To my shame, I end up using the former pretty regularly even in the Dales, and the latter on virtually every ride.

As pointed out above - next time you ride your bike just don't use the lowest one or two gears.

If you can cope with that you can pretty much go 1x10.

Learn to spin (well not even spn, more not mash) and you can easily loose teh big ring on a mtb, everyone should be able to loose the big ring on a mtb unless you have slicks on and are powering along the road. The lower end is up to and how strong a climber / the terain you ride.

I was thing about this on yesterdays ride, I was in top gear (44-11, 26" wheel bike) for approx two and a half of the three and a half mile road descent home from the top of the Quantocks.
Even allowing for larger wheels some thing like a 38 chainring (or smaller) is always going to be a compromise.

I've just gone back to a double (38/28) set up on my 27.5 XC race bike.

I found that I was struggling to keep up with the 29ers on the flatter stuff when I ran a 32 or 34 single but a 36 or 38 was a bit too big to push up the climbs sometimes (ok when just riding but started to hurt when trying to go flat out and stay with a group).

I now find I can stay with (and sometimes pull away from) the 29ers with the 38 but I also have a bail out with the 28 should I need it.

I raced at the Southern XC yesterday where it was particularly flat and I did find myself almost topping out along the straights but didn't need to use the granny.

I should point out that this is XTR 2x11....

If you're mainly riding trail centres or completely off-road routes, then I agree, big ring can probably go. I still have plenty of road sections to get through (and part of making them 'entertaining' is to push as big a gear as
possible), and quite often spin out my 32 ring on pedally descents off-road.

If you're the kind of rider who doesn't mind pootling a bit on road or easy track descents, 1x has plenty of other advantages.

Simplest way is to on use your middle ring of the triple and see how it rides, if you need a lower gear then you could easily add a cassette expander. Once you've worked out what is best for you, then look for a N/W ring for the front.

Exactly. If you can ride everything happily in the middle ring then go 1x10. If you sometimes need to switch to the granny and use the 3rd lowest gear then a 40t expander cog will get you that same low gear. If you sometimes need to use the lowest two gears in the granny then stick with 2x or 3x.

If you can spin reasonably fast you should be able to hit 40mph whilst still pedalling on a 1x10 set-up.

I was thing about this on yesterdays ride, I was in top gear (44-11, 26" wheel bike) for approx two and a half of the three and a half mile road descent home from the top of the Quantocks.

Is freewheeling on a road descent a huge compromise?

+1 to using just the middle ring to work out if you can cope with a 1x setup. It takes a little while to get used to it so don't do it for just one ride but for a month or two.

I'm on a 1x10 (cheapo system using XT cassette with 40T extender) and reckon I lose about 1 1/2 ratios at either end of the range. Depending on what your riding priorities are you can shift this around a bit by changing the front ring. So smaller chainring if you aren't bothered about spinning out on descents, larger chainring if you don't have many steep hills about.

On a 29er with 32T chainring and 11-40 cassette I spin out somewhere in the mid 50kmh range, by which time I might as well do a bit of coasting/freewheeling.

Triple:
Pros:
. lots of flexibility of gearing for different terrains.
. Won't spin out so quick so can go faster on any part of the ride on road or hard pack fireroad stuff.
. Comparatively cheaper: chainrings, 2nd hand cranks/front mechs etc.

cons:
. isn't fashionable.

😛

I was in top gear (44-11, 26" wheel bike) for approx two and a half of the three and a half mile road descent

were you pedalling?

90RPM in that gear is ~27mph
Same speed as 36x10 @100RPM, and only a couple of MPH slower if you stuck at 90RPM.

over your 2.5 miles the difference is negligible so I don't think it's much of a compromise unless you regularly use your MTB for raod riding.

Anyway, I normally find that if you reach that point, and it really is a descent then you'er better off just tucking and coasting.

If you can spin reasonably fast you should be able to hit 40mph whilst still pedalling on a 1x10 set-up.

Bikecalc has a 34x11 at over 160 cadence for 40mph. I think my poor old knees and hip joints would implode if I tried to hold that for more than about 10 seconds. 44 ring would give you 120-odd, which I can manage.

30mph is probably a more meaningful speed for MTB though, so I take your point.

There's compromise in all of them really.

I'd suggest that for most folk who aren't racing, then a 40-42t big ring can happily go, OK, they're handy for long fireroad sections, and roadie grinds, but for most off road riding it's a toothy bash guard. If you're happy to keep the left hand shifter then a double makes a lot of sense, lots of chainring options to customise your ratios, a granny ring bailout for the last hill can be welcome. Single ring, less to go wrong, less mud collection, with a wide range cassette you can still get up most things.

I'm happily on single ring 32t front and 11-36 back (10 speed) I spin out at the top end rather than run out of gears at the bottom, I ride in the Pennines. I like climbing though.

Merlin have a zee chainset on offer currently.

Would I still need a nw chainring ?

[i]I found that I was struggling to keep up with the 29ers on the flatter stuff when I ran a 32 or 34 single but a 36 or 38 was a bit too big to push up the climbs sometimes (ok when just riding but started to hurt when trying to go flat out and stay with a group).[/i]

Have you tried an oval ring?

[i]Merlin have a zee chainset on offer currently.

Would I still need a nw chainring ? [/i]

Mate, don't waste your money on a new crankset. And as said try just riding with the middle before buying a N/W.

Would I still need a nw chainring ?

For single ring? Yep I would, and a clutch mech

Quick point: with 1x setups it's worth mentioning wheel size as well as chainring size as it makes quite a bit of difference.

Very roughly (there's about 1% difference) the following are equivalent and give about an 80" top gear (11T):

26" with 34T
27.5" with 32T
29" with 30T

Br can you convert a triple into a single ring setup then.

What nw would you recommend?

Just converted my gyro 29er to 1x10 using the standard triple raceface crank (think it's the same as yours?) Used hope 30t chain ring and a 40t expander. Lost a bit of top end but not enough to worry about. First ride out yesterday was 45 mile mixed ride and coped fine.

I've used a Race Face one and a Hope one. Not noticed any difference TBH so I'd just buy whichever one you find in your LBS or a good deal on.

Petersnell have you noticed much weight saving ?

Do you need to be really fit to cope with a single ring at the front ?

How much weight would you lose going from a triple set up to single ring.

What are the pros and cons of each type ?

There is a loss in range with 1x but you can choose whether to take this off the top, bottom or a bit of both. I've found that's more than made up for by being in the right gear more often.

"jekkyl - Member
Triple:
.....................
cons:
. isn't fashionable"

what goes round may well come around, maybe not the traditional triple but I'm willing to predict that bikes with long mechs, huge cogs on the back and horrible chain lines will be eclipsed by some sort of must have front shifting revolution in the foreseeable future

what goes round may well come around, maybe not the traditional triple but I'm willing to predict that bikes with long mechs, huge cogs on the back and horrible chain lines will be eclipsed by some sort of [s]must have front shifting revolution[/s] gearbox in the foreseeable future

🙂

recently fitted a 30t NW ring, so it's early days, but...

it turns out i like using a front mech, it's a quick way of making a big change in gearing. 1 click, done.

with a single ring at the front, i need to do a lot more shifting with the rear mech to get the gear i want, it (feels like it) takes ages, i'm finding it a bit frustrating tbh.

engaging a climbing gear has gone from:

'click'

to:

'click-click-click-releaseshifter-click-click-click-releaseshifter-click'

i'm sure i'll get used to it, i'll have to, one of the reasons i bought a NW ring was the cheaper cost compared to 2 new chainrings and some bolts (it's complicated). i'm committed to it now.

but 1x is not the no-brainer, no-argument win, that 2x was.

what goes round may well come around, maybe not the traditional triple but I'm willing to predict that bikes with long mechs, huge cogs on the back and horrible chain lines will be eclipsed by some sort of must have front shifting revolution in the foreseeable future

Along with 26" wheels because they are "more robust, lighter and more responsive".

I'll use the middle six sprockets most of the time; the next two (2 & 8 ) occasionally and the outer two (1 & 10) slightly less than that. So I don't have "horrible chain lines" very often

There will be more wear on the chain ring as there's no sharing of the load as there is with a double or triple but I got 3000Km out of mine and the same out of the cassette but used two chains over that period of time. The 40T extender wasn't really worn so I've continued with that.

That's about 15 months worth of riding through all sorts of conditions. Not sure how it compares with a 3x setup for longevity.

Which do you think are the climbs round our way which you've missed the granny the most? I can think of one or two which I clear now where I'd be close to taking a walk without the granny - not sure how much MTFU I have in reserve.

[i]eclipsed by some sort of must have front shifting revolution in the foreseeable future[/i]

I understood that the move to single ring has in part been driven by the needs of suspension design, especially for LT29ers? I appreciate that single ring up front has been around for ages, but it's largely been confined to a minority of riders, wider 1x11 set ups, I thought, were developed by SRAM to get over some design issues. I can't see the return of front mechs in a hurry.

I use 1x10 to race with (30t) and 3x10 to train with. 3x10 helps keep in the correct power zone.

The weight saving of 1x10 doesn't make much odds, the quietness,reliability and simplicity does when racing. Those 3 things are less important for training when the ability to have the right gear for the right situation is more useful.

I don't like 2x10 as neither chain ring is right for me.

@martinhutch

Mastiles Lane from Kilnsey and Barden Moor from Rylstone are probably the two I struggle with but then even with a granny ring I've never cleaned the latter - there's that bit just after the gate, I just run out of oomph 😳 The climb over from Arncliff to Kettlewell is so steep I doubt I'd do it even with a granny ring. In fact I doubt I'd clean any of those climbs over that ridge no matter what the gearing.

Climbs I'm most likely to fail on are usually those with a loose surface and I'll just get the wrong line.

"jekkyl
Triple:
.....................
cons:
. isn't fashionable"

Damn, nicked my post!

triple - rolled up sleeves on a flecked linen jacket
double - long ginger beard and undercut
single - top bun

Renton just ride more and save for some light but strong wheels instead, they'll make more difference to the feel of the bike

Renton,

What is on the bike at the moment, 9 or 10 speed?

If you are running 10 speed it is easy to go 1x10. However as others have said if you ride the trails you normally do and see how often you change up or down you give yourself a good idea if this is going to suit your riding and or allow you a best guess for what front chain ring will work for you.

The kit and tools you will need to go 1x10 are a new front chain ring, short chain ring bolts and a chain tool.

Remove, the front shifter, front mech and all three chain rings, put new front chain ring on where the middle ring used to be and shorten the chain accordingly.

[i]Br can you convert a triple into a single ring setup then.

What nw would you recommend?
[/i]

Yes, just put a N/W onto the current middle ring position and buy an expander (either Shimano or SRAM depending on your cassette).

tbh though, wait until your drivetrain is knackered and then buy:

Hope 30T N/W
Hope 40T expander
Shimano XT 10-spd 11-36 cassette
Chain
Jockey Wheels
Narrow chainring bolts

Or, as I will be doing soon; a complete Shimano XT 11 speed setup, minus the cranks.

Suppose there's weight saved Steve but didn't really notice it! Thought I'd try it to simplify the bike really, one shifter and a dropper post remote is all I need to worry about now. To be fair I live in Essex now so pretty flat really, no massive hill's so it suits me, could have went for a 32t which I might try later.
I was going to try a double chain set but looking at the orange Web site they reckon the bike isn't suitable for it and to use a triple and bash ring. Didn't seem to make sense to go this route.

Oh yeah, didn't need to buy new chain ring bolts with the hope 30t as the raceface ones fit fine.

Is freewheeling on a road descent a huge compromise?

Yes, when my tea's at home waiting for me. 😉

Mastiles Lane from Kilnsey and Barden Moor from Rylstone are probably the two I struggle with but then even with a granny ring I've never cleaned the latter - there's that bit just after the gate, I just run out of oomph

I've only ever cleaned the Rylstone climb in my easiest gear on granny ring. Dab fairly often on the last bit. But the fact that I have done it means I'd be forever irritated to not even have a shot at it.

The climb over from Arncliff to Kettlewell is so steep I doubt I'd do it even with a granny ring. In

Ditto to that! Virtually everything at that end of Wharfedale is pushing territory for me.

NickC is right that some FS bikes are optimised for a single ring. Having two bikes running 1x10 (with a 40T), I found going back to a front mech on my 29er really strange. And it didn't seem to have the super low gear I was expecting. Once that drivetrain wears out, I'll go to 1x11. Even in the Malverns 1x10 (32T/40T) on my Aeris is fine. Gets a bit tiring at the end of the day, but I prefer the simplicity / clearance / etc of a single ring.

The advice offered is good tho; ride in the middle ring, see if you miss the other ones. Zee cranks are pretty heavy, not sure you'd save much if you went that way!

Okay so there are some things to take away and think about here then.

I find that I use the granny ring a fair bit around here as there are so steep bits that I just havent got the legs for!

I dont think Ive ever used the big ring either.

One thing for certain is that I need two bolts for my granny ring as Ive just found its only held on by tow out of four??

Ive snapped the clutch engagement lever off my rear mech as well !

Dibbs - Member

Is freewheeling on a road descent a huge compromise?

Yes, when my tea's at home waiting for me.

I stupidly went out for a ride with some mates on a 2x9 mtb with them on roadies on the road, up and down I had no issues, tucked I was with one of them all the way down the hills. It was the flat that was the issue. But then again I don't do very much on the road on the MTB normally.

This shows where the differences are
[img] [/img]
In reality the SRAM is the 2x killer due to the 10t, the Shimano will always be less range (unless you get the 45t)

engaging a climbing gear has gone from:

'click'

to:

'click-click-click-releaseshifter-click-click-click-releaseshifter-click'

@martinhutch

The last time I did the Rylstone climb was at the end of the YD300 when you spotted me on the other side - I think having 280Km in the legs is a decent excuse 😀

I very nearly got the bridleway out of the car park at Buckden without dabbing last Saturday and that was with the bike loaded up for bikepacking plus a bit of damp under the trees after the Friday rain. It's probably the easiest climb out of Wharfedale - well worth a try.

Just thought of another that I've not cleaned: the BW up out of Stainforth. Another steep one with a loose surface.

#TRIPLE4LYF

#PreferablyBiopace

The advantages of a single chainring are also that you don't have to make front gear changes which are the ones that people mess up as they are reluctant to back off the power while it shifts thus damaging chains , chainrings , frames etc . You also get better clearance , no wondering what front ring to be in , you just put it in the gear you need . Lighter as well . Disadvantage is a smaller ratio of gears although 420% works for plenty of people .