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It would obviously not be popular with some, but in much the same way as ebay has a listing fee it could provide some, no doubt much needed, income for STW towers.
I'm not thinking a lot, maybe 50p per add, with perhaps wanted adds staying free so people still get to sell their kit if someone else needs it?
I could see the wanted adds degenerating in to people trying to offload their vaguely relevant stuff, but I'm sure that would be self policing by the more vocal classifieds users.
What do you think, would you be willing to cough up? I would, especially if it was a nominal amount like 50p, I think it would stop a lot of the overly optimistic adds, & make finding stuff you need at sensible prices easier.
Perhaps the adds could have a time limit?
I don't know if STW is [u]THE[/u] secondhand market now, but since the demise of the old forum, and the ability to 'sort by topic' rather than by last post, I find it very hard to use & the constant 'bumping' means a new add only stays on the front page for a few hours.
Your thoughts?
No.
No.
NO.
No, if they start to charge it will become less of a place for "mates" to trade gear and everything will just become at least 50p more expensive, and people will not bother offering low value stuff on the basis that someone else might want it/be interested.
I also suspect that it might not be worth the faff for STW for the income.
Seems reasonable to me. 50p per week?
Could be though that admin of such could be complex and cost money meaning a charge like 50p per week wasn't enough.
What do Mark/Chipps think?
No, send them a pint if you want to say thanks but keep it voluntary if you want the volume of traffic that the classifieds probably generates.
If they started charging we might as well just use ebay.
If I were selling a lot of stuff then an occasional donation would be a 'consicience clearing' gesture I suppose..
Seems reasonable to me
BLASPHEMER!
BURN HIM!!!
"...all I said was, 'that fish was good enough for Jehovah..."
There's a lot of discussion going on at the office regarding how to handle the classifieds - particularly the bumping issue. So far nothing manageable has really popped up. As soon as we're able to do the sort by post time it will be implemented, which should solve the issue. But don't hold your breath for it...
Any easy way round it is to RSS feed the classifieds by topic ([url= http://www.singletrackworld.com/forum/rss/forum/classifieds/topics ]Classifieds Topic RSS Feed[/url])
If there's going to be a charge for the adds, will there be a charge for the subtracts as well?
[i]If there's going to be a charge for the adds, will there be a charge for the subtracts as well?[/i]
Poor, very poor. Is that your coat?
Yep, I'm on my way out.
^ I always pay for takeaways...
I don't think the admin would be that tough, just use paypal to get through to the 'add new' page, the time limit would be tougher, but I suppose there must be a way of creating a filter that automatically deletes posts after a set time. I also do think a time limit wouldn't be necessary if new adds went to the top of the page, & subsequent bumping of old adds didn't put them back to the top, it would also mean people would make much more use of the search facility.
I'd love to know how much the 'buy us a pint' generates, but I bet its not enough to keep the forum free. By the looks of the amount of traffic in the classifieds, people are using STW instead of ebay, not a bad thing but I don't see why STW shouldn't benefit from it. I also understand that particularly cheap goods may not be worth selling, but if wanted adds were free, then there is no reason you couldn't sell anything provided someone has asked for it.
I'm sure its all doable, I just don't know if its worth doing.
Perhaps Mark will enlighten us by gracing us with his presence on this thread, if he sees it.
No, donations are fine. Also ads are adding to revenue
dont think so either,
not because i'm a skinflint,
how would wtd ads work, would they have to pay if a transaction goes through???
i've posted up free stuff before, i would be less likely to see if anyone wanted my junk before i threw it out.
would that mean that traders would be allowed in, as that would only be fair then????
too many minefields, even on the old site classifieds disappeared off the front page pretty quickly,
Just seen tomdebruin's reply, I guess that will sort out most of the problems if & when it's implemented.
I still don't see why STW can't earn a few quid from it though 😉
Jenga - Member
If there's going to be a charge for the adds, will there be a charge for the subtracts as well?
your right though should only the seller pay, what about the buyer that has used the site, should they pay a fee for using the classifieds
where does it all stop???
tom, if you're looking at this thread, can you tell us whether the search function will be changed at all? It might just be me, but it doesn't seem to be quite as good at finding what I'm looking for (eg 'Hope Pro II') as on the old forum.
And I know, looking a gift horse in the mouth and all that, so feel free to say it's fine and won't be changed 🙂
colande....I think you missed the point somewhere!
Ive bought and sold a few bits and bobs over the years which for me is how the classifieds works
Buying and selling from mates - everyones happy
Its pretty obvious that some people run it as a business though
In which case it only seems fair they pay their way as they must be saving shedloads on ebay and paypal fees
Maybe youre allowed a handful of free ads then are asked to make a donation for any extras?
TBH i'd probably go and use the bikeradar classifieds if there was a charge on here (though i have donated a little bit by paypal).
Jenga - Member
colande....I think you missed the point somewhere!
haha 😀
nah, i understood it!
it will become less of a place for "mates" to trade gear
all my mates consider STW to be ar*e*ole paradise and never visit it 🙁
and everything will just become at least 50p more expensive
why MORE than 50p extra ?
and people will not bother offering low value stuff
could have things under a tenner still free ?
simonfbarnes - Memberit will become less of a place for "mates" to trade gear
all my mates consider STW to be ar*e*ole paradise and never visit it
You do realise what you've just said there, don't you?
simonfbarnes - Member
and people will not bother offering low value stuffcould have things under a tenner still free ?
hope wheel for sale £9.99 + postage (unfortunately postage will be £60)
Be great if it was an areole paradise 😉
As soon as the word 'Paypal' was mentioned I switched off. I wont go near anything with Paypal as payment. Once bitten by their Customer service forever shy. I was once bitten by Dave Hinde's customer service. Same applies.
The volume of traffic generated through the ads being free probably does have a benefit for STW. Selling advertising space on the site is enhanced by the number of 'hits' the site receives; the busier the classifieds are, the more 'hits' are recorded, the better to gain revenue through commercial advertising.
I use it quite a lot, but would like to think i contribute to other areas of the forum enough to be a true member of our community. What kind of riles me is people who register and the first thing they do is put a FS ad up,(three like that on the FS front page now, and one very notorious Evil-owning member as proof).
Another (non bike) forum I visit started charging for their classified ads, it went from a place you could get good deals and do people favours to a ghost town in under a month, no one uses it now 'cause it's too much hassle. keep it free I say, donations work just fine.
I agree keep it free, but maybe have a time/posting limit that you must reach before you can post classified ad...?
There was a figure quoted, not too long ago, about the donations total. Think it was before the hack, but IIRC donations for a month amounted to £40. That won't go very far towards running costs.
Its not a bad idea.
It might stop people constantly reposting the same ads day after day pushing the ads by less impatient people down the list.
Of course the tight ar$es wouldn't like it (and there are plenty of them on this site) and would probably go elsewhere, such as Bike Tragic.
hora - Member
As soon as the word 'Paypal' was mentioned I switched off. I wont go near anything with Paypal as payment.
I'm sure most people would be happy about that Mark 😉
How about allowing subscribers to the mag to post for free and then allowing non subscribers x items or posts per year/month or pay for more adds?
I'm sure there was a thread disussion the donations system. If I remember correctly, somebody from the mag said that donations made in total, since it was introduced, was less than £50!
I once gave a tenner after selling a grand worth of broken up bike (smugly pats himself on the back), which I thought was more than fair. eBay would have been a LOT more than that...
Junkyard, I was shot down a long time ago for suggesting a two tear forum, you don't want to go there 😉
resurrection, £50 probably wouldn't buy them all a pint & kebab each, I think they deserve better.
I really can't believe that 50p per add would stop someone advertising something, it may stop some of the more optimistic posts though. Hora does have a point, paypal ain't the best, & that may put off more people.
Come on STW, give us your perspective.
I addicted to the classifieds at the momement and have bought ST a beer.
I'm completely non-plused as to why anyone, other than a few blokes in an office in Todmorden, would even think charging for ads is a good idea, bizarre.
since the demise of the old forum, and the ability to 'sort by topic' rather than by last post, I find it very hard to use & the constant 'bumping' means a new add only stays on the front page for a few hours.
I find this sooooooooooo annoying as well in all the forums, it's a mess!!
Can you please put it back the way it was Admins???
Eliminating WTD ads would stop a fair bit of unnecessary traffic.
I counted 20 WTD ads earlier. I wonder if any of these folk used the search first?
Another site I post on only lets you buy and sell stuff if you have paid a tenner to become a "sitesupporter" for a year. You can still browse the classifieds but you just can't post anything.
It is done to show that the seller isn't buggering around and that the buyer is more than likely genuine. Reduces the number of people just jumping on the site to sell or buy stuff to make a profit and keeps the second hand trade more between the biking community.
Most people pay their money not only to buy and sell but also to support the site and help with its up keep and you get a shiney "SiteSupporter" badge on your profile to show you're a paid up supporter of the forum (but to post on the general forum you don't have to pay).
I think its a good idea, even if they only charge 10p it will make people think before posting. There is no way I would stop using the classifieds if I was charged less than a pound to sell.
I wonder what the conversation at ST towers is on this subject.
Why not just charge 50p for any item being sold for say, £50 or less (inc P&P)? That's still going to be considerably cheaper than Ebay and is hardly going to put off any potential sellers or buyers, and STW will at least benefit from the extra income generated. The only issue I see from this is that the number of "what's it worth" threads would increase on the main forum as people try to bypass the Classifieds section to avoid the 50p charge.
I certainly wouldn't want to eliminate the "wanted" ads as this has been a great way of sourcing parts/spares that haven't already been advertised.
Keep the classifieds as is and free, but sort by topic.
Then offer a seperate 'featured' page for say £5 per week. This would just consist of title, thumbnail pic and link to the advert details in the classifieds forum. This page could become the landing page after clicking 'classifieds' with a futher click to continue to the forum itself. This page would contain all the featured items.
It would be a couple of minutes work for someone from STW to add a featured listing, but be a nice little earner from those wanted to sell more valuable items like complete bikes/frames/forks. Plus it would make it a little more safer as spotty little oiks trying to scam people are unlikely to cough up to place the advert.
Obviously the chaos of the main classifieds would remain for free. The beauty of this option is you could post your ad, and then get it featured at a later date when it doesn't sell.
Bushwacked's idea seems like a good one IMO.
I think STW should charge 2unfit2ride for all ads placed
I too am slightly confused why a user is suggesting the Towers make more money out of them. And removing WTDs would neaten it out a little but also lose stacks of traffic, people putting WTDs also buy, and people selling also search WTDs.
Leave it be - why the constant need to change things that arent broken for gods sake.
I am a newbie here... i found this place by looking for ads and this place seems to hav such a high turnover...
The site is great and i can't contrib a lot to most of the bike chat as i'm not that knowledgeable and so personally would had something where thres a minimum post count, sites with that tend to increase random crap posting! or force noobs to make comments they shouldn't!
From my view the wanted ads are just as good as the for sale as i think they given people a chance to unearth items not for sale yet but maybe they could be moved once the item has been found? maybe an archive? for items that have been sold and items that are no longer, purely as personally i find old ads given an idea of prices and of feedback on sellers.
I am new but i do find the constant bumping a little annoying... Its bound to happen but when its days apart i can live with it, but theres time i have seen an ad bumper 4-5 times in a day and this means when you come to look through the ads you're seeing a mixtures of fresh ads and the same ads you saw 2 hours ago! The idea to stop it soted by recent post would be amazing and ttake away some of that hassle. I would certainly sign up to a yearly site supporter system, with maybe some sort of premium ad? My grounds wouldn't be to generate profit for ST tho i am sure tey deserve it but more to control the classifieds a little and stop the randomness of it...
And after that massive ramble... ON the search function.. does it have a time limit? i search for items for sale and i feel i'm never getting a full answer, i searched for "frame" expecting pages and pages of stuff but got maybe 20-30 results? am i missing something?
It might just be me but I don't think that the search is as obvious as on the last forum, maybe why there are more Wtds coming through.
They do appear to be a bit of an afterthought floating around on the RHS in amongst all of the ads.
Chris
Some people on here just love making life complicated.
Leave it alone, WTD ads are fine, FS ads are free on 99% of internet forums so why should one of the largest in the UK suddenly start to charge and pee people off?
No charging IMO. I suspect there's much more to a website re: traffic / hits / links / commercial ads / blah blah rather than poncing about adding 50p to some ad selling barge-like stems. If you're bothered, donate.
Besides, charge someone and you're starting to get into offering a service which brings in more rules, expectations, standards etc. I doubt the grief would be worth it.
A function to filter what shows in classifieds between "WTD", "FS" or both (as is) might be useful, sort some peoples problems and sounds easy to accomplish (to an IT illiterate).
If they are going to put some time and effort into the layout of the classifieds section then yeh, charge away. But as it stands 30 minutes after posting your ad is on page 3.
For the time being their will be no charging for ads on the forum. The donations button is the only method we intend to use in order to earn any revenue from the classifieds.
We may in the future introduce some kind of enhanced service that makes ads more prominent or the like that is either chargeable or free to say, mag subscribers or both. We just don't know yet. But for the time being donations are very much appreciated if you feel you have done particularly well out of the classifieds.
Question then now that is sorted out
who has donated and what % of the items cost is deemed reasonable
Well that question was a right show stopper 🙄
Tom dB - Administrator
There's a lot of discussion going on at the office regarding how to handle the classifieds - particularly the bumping issue. So far nothing manageable has really popped up. As soon as we're able to do the sort by post time it will be implemented, which should solve the issue. But don't hold your breath for it...
Many thanks for sorting that out, I for one really appreciate it.
I think it also shows that you guys really listen to what is said on the forum, it also makes me feel as if you all care, and we do indeed 'belong'.
Cheers.
They'd lose viewings and eventually their ads plus they'd pay tax etc.
Can they wait till I have sold my gear first?
Whats with STW being seen as some sort of charity? I'm getting bored of them pleading poverty, asking for donations etc. It's a commercial business, they get revenue from all sorts of sources, mag sales, mag advertising and the website, contrary to popular belief is a source of revenue as well in the form of ad revenue, the STW shop and the further promotion of the mag.
It's almost like Gordon Browns best spindoctor is working overtime, convincing us all they're doing a public service when they are a commercial entity just like any other.
In answer to the question, no of course I don't think they should charge!