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Indeed should any sport where the pinnacle of achievement isn't considered to be an Olympic title?
Triggered by the news that Pogacar isn't going to be competing in the Olympics.
If the best in the world aren't turning up, what's the point?
Tennis also seems pointless in the Olympics to me too. Any other sports that people can think of?
GOLF
GOLF
Indeed.
Horse dancing (although not necessarily for the reasons above).
Golf is pointless whether it is in the Olympics or not. Football shouldn't really be in there either, but at least they make an effort to differentiate it from the senior game by having most of the team made of under 23's, under 21's would be even better IMO.
It's not really a course for Pog TBF also if I was him I'd be on beer and pizza for a month.
Football
I'd just have it as track and field, swimming, gymnastics and track cycling. Maybe triathlon too.
Swimming needs to get rid of all the different strokes and just have fastest at the distances.
I’d be on beer and pizza for a month.
Is that the Wayne Rooney diet plan?
Horse dancing (although not necessarily for the reasons above)
Dressage? Ah come on have a heart, it's the only way some of those kids are ever going to make it out of the ghetto...
I think the first just had running in it, didn't it? and they did it nekkid of course...
As for modern Olympics; isn't there going to be break dancing? If you're going to include stuff like that, then trad sports should definitely be in it, and I wouldn't be so sure that athletes don't think that an Olympic gold isn't he very pinnacle of their sport, judging by the lengths that Pauline Ferrand Prevot and Tom Pidcock are putting in I think they've very much centred this year around it.
If the best in the world aren’t turning up, what’s the point?
You can only race against the people that do.
if I was him I’d be on beer and pizza for a month.
And you've never won the Tour De France. Correlation or causation?
I'll add discus and javelin throwing to my short list of old events.
There weren't any bikes 2000yrs ago so no bike event allowed now! ?
The Olympic road race is a big event in the road racing calendar, arguably on par with a classic or World Champs.
What is the pinnacle or road racing anyway? The TdF GC? There are different pinnacles for different types of rider.
It has a much stronger claim than some of the other sports mentioned here - football seems particularly pointless.
Tennis is OK, as it's just like another tournament inserted in the calendar and the standard of competition will still be very high.
I'd go the other way, stuff all this gatekeeping and snobbery, let anything be an "Olympic" event.
If the International Tiddlywinks Federation can meet some basic threshold and find a room in Paris to host it then they should be allowed a gold medal. Or introduce a whole host of obscure local sports, boules, parcour, add the "Gaelic Shrug" to the weightlifting.
And Downhill MTB should 100% be in there IMO.
I don't care what anyone says, it would be brilliant for the sport.
@thisisnotaspoon not sure if you were serious or not, but that would be awesome.
I’d watch queens (the card game), scrabble, Olympic masterchef, and the one where they are flying around in squirrel suits through canyons.
I’d enter the Olympic make a sandwich while drinking beer event.
“Sports” that need to be decided based on style and/or artistic merit. - I'd go with that.
Any "sport" where you stand in one place and shoot a gun (worded so biathlon gets to stay in the winter Olympics)
If disciplines are too similar (so swimming) or competition is so sparse (para sports back in the day but less now) that an individual athlete can pick up more that say 3 or 4 medals something is way wrong.
And golf, football and tennis can all take their ball and play elsewhere. They get plenty of exposure at other times.
Road cycling is on the cusp for me - the design/style of the course is so dependent on the venue the favourite can almost be designed in, or at the very least you can cancel out people at will if you wanted to. Can't think of another Olympic event where the organisers have quite so much influence on who the winner would be (or not be).
The UCI are already **** up downhill and enduro, god help us if they become Olympic sports.
I said I don't care what you say, Olympic DH would be incredible 😛
And I hadn't thought of Olympic Enduro, but it might be the only way to get the budget to film the sport adequately for live transmission.
And golf, football and tennis can all take their ball and play elsewhere.
Given all the sports that don't get any exposure, it does seem on the face of it hard to justify including these, other than being very popular.
not sure if you were serious or not, but that would be awesome.
There used to be art, poetry etc so I don't see why not.
Basically get rid of the IOC and their rules.
It would also mean a full program of track cycling events was possible, as well as DH or Enduro. Although if you want Enduro on TV I suspect you'll be disappointed and find it's like the XC. Take a fun day out in the hills on a bike, and reduce it to multiple laps of the same small hill so it can all be covered form one camera and a telephoto lens.
Triggered by the news that Pogacar isn’t going to be competing in the Olympics.
If the best in the world aren’t turning up, what’s the point?
More stringent drug testing regime at the Olympics....
I think the success of "sport climbing" and BMX shows that just sticking with "classic" sports is foolish.
And on road racing... hell yes! It's one of very few events that matches the Marathon for taking over and taking in the host city. I'd miss it if it went.
Slight off topic.....but the thing I'd get rid of first is the ****ing medals table, and in particular the media's fascination with it. You've got one sport like hockey where 2 gold medals (well loads more than 2 because there are 11 in a team but you know what I mean) will get handed out after 2 tournaments that have lasted days then in swimming 4 get handed out before breakfast for the best arse scratch.
If you got rid of the medals table then Tinas' free for all would have a better chance.
Don't think I'd narrow it down just to road cycling, but a lot of Olympic sports that aren't track and field, set an age limit somewhere in the 16-21 range. For a road cyclist, winning would be a huge deal and would likely come before any full pro one-dayer or multi-day success.
I've not really paid attention to previous course profiles, but you would hope the road race profile rotates between favouring different phenotypes at each Olympics, so for example Cav/MVDP/Pog (ignoring my age criteria above) would be favourites in sucessive Olympics.
To answer the OP, no.
I put a thread out there a while ago with my views, which I'll paste below:
Promoted party by the Darts is not a Sport thread, and also but a discussion I had over a beer last week, what “sports” should and shouldn’t be in the Olympics.
As reference point, the Olympic Movements moto is Citius – Altius – Fortius, or Faster – Higher – Stronger.
So, as a start point, anything that’s scored subjectively and/or judged is out. Dressage, boxing, gymnastics, figure skating, skateboarding, surfing and most martial arts all gone.
In the pub we also argued that The Olympics should be the peak of the sport, if it’s not then it’s out. So that removes things like football, golf, baseball, basketball and road cycling.
Swimming can expect changes. You can’t have 4 different strokes at least 2 of them are just deliberately making life hard for yourself. So they keep freestyle and I’m prepared to discuss backstroke. Butterfly and Breaststroke are out. And they only get 2 relays too. To keep things fair, we’d offer athletics the option to include a second track discipline, ideally running backwards.
I’d welcome others thoughts on this…
I do find it strange that we British covert Olympic champions, no matter the sport of event, with lots of attention regardless of country of origin, yet when we have a British world champion in the same sport they'll barely get any media attention if at all.
There are many sports I think that shouldn't really be an olympic event, there are now almost too many sports/events/disciplines held within the Olympics imo. Cirtainly subjectively scored events are a little grey area - that would throw out most gymnastics which is a 'traditional' olympic sport.
Road race at the olympics is pretty much the inly true race craft race left isn't it? Ie no radios?
If the best in the world aren’t turning up, what’s the point?
There are limits per country, if you can only select two and you have 5 of the top ten... Some of the best in the world aren't turning up.
“Sports” that need to be decided based on style and/or artistic merit.
apart from breakdancing. That should definitely be in the Olympics.
I reckon they should add sports to the winter olympics rather than summer.
For example breakdancing stick it in the winter olympics.
Maybe Judo, boxing etc could migrate across too, to give more kudos to the winter olympics and stop the summer olympics being so swollen.
’ve not really paid attention to previous course profiles, but you would hope the road race profile rotates between favouring different phenotypes at each Olympics, so for example Cav/MVDP/Pog (ignoring my age criteria above) would be favourites in sucessive Olympics.
Apart from as the Olympics is only every 4 years you might well miss your window when you were at your peak because the olympics that were happening at that point did not suit you. You could easily be the most dominant sprinter for 5 or 6 years and win every race you enter that ends in a sprint finish but never stand a chance of an Olympic gold.
But someone said it earlier and I'd not really considered it - the road race is one of those races able to show off the host city and it's possible for many more people without a ticket to watch it. So for that reason alone - it's in.
I think sports such as the road race are great, not everyone in the host city will be able to afford tickets to go to the actual stadiums, and so few sports actually showcase the city itself.
Whereas road race, the marathon etc, actually show the city itself and give everyone a chance to part of it
Road race at the olympics is pretty much the inly true race craft race left isn’t it? Ie no radios?
This is a good point, it is very a different one day race, They're working as part of a national team not their normal trade team, or maybe even if their nation doesn't have a full squad individuals looking to cooperate and challenge where they can. it can be a much more mixed field fitness/ability wise.
No Radios so organisation is all going to be verbal between the team on the road, the tactics and strategy are going to be different, either whatever was pre-arranged or decided on the day.
Most competitors are probably on their trade team bikes, but the support vehicle with spares will be their national squad's carrying all sorts of different bikes, or they get the neutral support vehicle, the opportunities for significant cock-ups if someone has a flat/mechanical are therefore higher too.
All of that adds to the spectacle IMO. I don't think it's better or worse than a World Champs, spring classic or a Grand tour just another interesting variation on road racing that only happens once every 4 years, and from the POV of the organising city doesn't actually need a huge infrastructure or facility investment, just some road closures...
I kind of feel in my bones that any sport with judges handing out the scores shouldn't be in the olympics.
But then I remember how some former colleages would get SO excited at getting to see dressage on TV. They only get to see it once every four years and there's NO WAY it would get shown at any other time because it's quite frankly weird. So I have to remind myself that categorising sports into worthy and unworthy is a bit silly.
I do think there is a good argument to redoce the nuber of sports overall in the olympics both open up potential hosts by making it cheaper and reduce environmental impact. In that case I think I'd be OK with road racing coming off the program. Previously I'd have thought the status of the olympic race in the womens calendar should keep it in but that calendar is strong enough now to cope without an olympics.
Anything professional? If you haven’t got a normal day job then don’t bother turning up.
Ironically, in the modern Olympics as conceived by (Baron) de Coubertin, "no professionals" literally meant noone who was paid a wage. After all, you can't have a working class oik turning up and beating their betters, can you?
I think the Pros themselves still take some pride in winning the road race.
Wasn't Carapaz was riding his gold bike in the TdF? Fairly sure I saw it though it didn't stand out much.
Greg Van Avermaet even more so with plenty of gold on his helmet and gold stem/bars iirc. That usually reminded the pundits to mention it during commentary, less so with Carapaz.
As for Anna Kiesenhofer, a phenomenal tactical win, but sadly invisible at least in World Tour events and, in any case, apparently doesn't like riding in a peloton so prefers TTs where she hasn't had much success other than for Austria.
Carapaz thinks it should have a year off 😉
I’m of the measurement matters school. But then gymnastics is pretty cool, so they just need some measurement rather than artistic grading.
Defo go with the idea if it's not the biggest accolade in a sports calander then get it out. Free up tv coverage for less well publicised sports.
I'm not keen on the artistic/judged sports anyway so from a personal point of view they can go too.
I guess the 800m should be cancelled this time then too.
Just keep your hands off beach volleyball.
I’d prefer to keep my hands on that one
Road racing - yes, love watching it, but when did it become OK for professionals to compete in the Olympics? I always thought it was amateur only but over the last decade or two that seems to have changed. Would it be OK for Tyson Fury to join Team GB for the Olympic boxing?
Fast walking race is probably one of the most ridiculous events.
And golf, football and tennis can all take their ball and play elsewhere. They get plenty of exposure at other times.
As someone who plays golf it's one of the only events I'd watch, alongside the mtb, road race and time trial, for same reasons
They may not be the pinnacle of the sport but at least they aren't completely shit like 95% of the events on show
I'd also get rid of any 75% of the swimming events. And likewise track cycling, where a few nations hoover up dozens of medals due to the limited number of countries who actually take it seriously and the sheer volume of events that are all very much the same. And oddly, it's not nearly as enjoyable to watch on TV as it is in real life
Given all the sports that don’t get any exposure
Id go the opposite route. If it was down to me inclusion would be based on worldwide participation numbers. Which would mean you would not have any of these obscure events noone cares about other than the participants and their families. Although I suspect that would go against the ethos of the Olympics..
but when did it become OK for professionals to compete in the Olympics?
LA in 1984 was the last amateur Olympics from memory. So nearly 40 years ago.
But individual governing bodies set criteria, boxing is still amateur but most other sports have allowed professionals in.
I kind of feel in my bones that any sport with judges handing out the scores shouldn’t be in the olympics.
They probably had judges for the poetry in the Olympics back in the day, unless it was speed reading...
Yes, because selfishly it's one of the sports I absolutely love in the Olympics.
Obviously watching the actual race is great, but it's also fun to spot your favourite riders and usually from their helmets or bike guess which pro team they ride for.
It's also one of the few sports where spectators *don't need a ticket/pass and can watch for nothing.
Edit- *Sorry convert, I realised you had written that earlier on
I don't mind if it's in or not - however, it's not the pinnacle for road riders, really, is it? They don't plan 4 years for this one off race.....
Whereas that is exactly the ambition for XC MTB racers - and we only get to see 40 for each MTB race; and possible medal winners are sat at home (French/Swiss riders in particular).
I have to agree with a point made already; swimming & track cycling get numerous chances for medals; are they really all needed? So why not Downhill, or Short Track for cycling?
So why not Downhill, or Short Track for cycling?
the number of events is sanctioned by the IOC and then the governing body gets to decide which discipline is included. Hence the decision is really down to the UCI want Downhill? Lose the Omnium… why the number of medal events is fixed? History I imagine. Swimming has a lot of permutations due to distance and stroke. Track only has distance.
Swimming could/should lose all the variations on stroke and distance and quite possibly a lot of the relay stuff too.
Interesting that butterfly as a stroke was only included because some swimmers found a loophole in breaststroke!
Indeed should any sport where the pinnacle of achievement isn’t considered to be an Olympic title?
That would be true of most sports wouldn't it? Most sports have a 'world championship' of some sort, every year. Empirically you'd expect that to be the more important title.
The point of the Olympics is it's a festival of all sport and a whole heap of pageantry and celebration heaped on top. And becuase it combines so many sports and creates excellent coverage of them, it's the event that gets the biggest audience. Aside from one or two sports, for most competitors its by far the biggest crowd and audience they'll ever compete in front of.
In terms of cycling specifically - an Olympic gold medal isn't as big a deal as winning the TDF. But grand tours aren't an Olympic event. Compared to day races its only really comparable to the World Championships as theres aren't really other day races that are focused on an individual rider's sole performance rather than being trade-team based.
I think the only sport that gets considerably less audience traction during the olympics than its own individual world event is football
Considering the main favourite MVDP has ridden the Tour as purely preparation (see his TT on his road bike and being 20th to the top of the climb then letting it slide from there) for the Olympic road race those who think they have a proper chance of winning are taking it seriously. Similar for Wout and Pidcock who pulled out at the first sign of illness.
This didn't seem to be the case prior to London.
With swimming and track cycling, once you've built your venue, it makes sense to fill it for the whole two weeks, or it's even more of a white elephant than it already is?
I’d put the Olympic road race behind the grand tour classifications, World Champs, grand tour stages, and monuments in prestige. Its bias towards the traditional cycling nations in terms of team imbalance probably doesn’t help it either, but it’s hard to see how else it could be structured.
Compared to day races its only really comparable to the World Championships as theres aren’t really other day races that are focused on an individual rider’s sole performance rather than being trade-team based
Oh, the world champs (and the Olympics) is still ridden as a team. Just look up Charly Wegelius and his world championship 'error or judgment' to see. Roger Hammond was the British rider he was meant to be working for that day. Or Mark Cavendish where the entire British team was selected around ensuring he won.
It's still a team sport, just the teams are stirred up from the usual trade teams.
I think the only sport that gets considerably less audience traction during the olympics than its own individual world event is football
I'd be interested to see how many bother to watch the olympic golf on telly worldwide. I guess you have to get your head around some sports being totally irrelevant in your country but an obsession elsewhere. Handball and wrestling for example.
And I think it'd be interesting to ask a non GT GC contender pro cyclist what they would cover most at the end of their career if they could only have one - a stage of the TdF, Paris Roubaix or Olympic Gold. I think PR would be top for most. Maybe it depends where you are from.
I feel blessed coming into cycling at such a time.
With Pogacar, Vingegaard and Evenepoel at the top, I think this era will be seen as the best ever. Having another opportunity to see these three greats battle it out is a perfect reason to include road racing in the Olympics.
I'm happy for the road race to stay as its usually a really hard fought event and the trade team vs country tactics are always amusing. Charlie Wegelius had a run in with the GB team BITD. edit, missed converts post above
Once a venue is built then you might as well run a full program. I find the pool swimming dull but I'm not a fan, be interested to hear some swimming fans views on all the different strokes and distances.
With Pogacar, Vingegaard and Evenepoel at the top, I think this era will be seen as the best ever. Having another opportunity to see these three greats battle it out is a perfect reason to include road racing in the Olympics.
Very funny. One of them might actually be doing it, even though I suspect it’s a race for someone more like Mads Pederson; I was surprised to see Remco on the PCS provisional start list.
https://www.procyclingstats.com/race/olympic-games/2024/startlist
out of those three think only Evenepoel is actually doing the Olympics?With Pogacar, Vingegaard and Evenepoel at the top, I think this era will be seen as the best ever. Having another opportunity to see these three greats battle it out is a perfect reason to include road racing in the Olympics.
As well as no radios, no support vehicles either please.
Carry your own spares and try not to puncture. Feel free to ask a competitor for a pump, but don’t be surprised if they ignore you.
Possibly standardised bikes too. No posh nations turning up on hyper-bikes while small impoverished nations get Tescos BSOs
Sticking with original question, Road Racing should not be an Olympic sport. If a medal is to be given to an individual winner then the sports included should be for individuals, not teams. Road racing is a team sport.
An Olympian is supposed to be the best in the world. If some riders (dometiques, sprint lead out riders etc.) sacrifice their own chances for the advantage of their nominated team leader then it is not a level playing field, some riders have an advantage.
In the past it has been known for riders to show allegiance to their trade teams instead of to their own national squads which makes the whole thing a nonsense. Ask Charlie Wegelius and Tom Southam their opinions on this.
Swimming has a lot of permutations due to distance and stroke. Track only has distance.
I think you could argue the keirin is a different permutation
Oh, the world champs (and the Olympics) is still ridden as a team.
It can be - but the prize is an individual one. I thought the course for the Glasgow world champs worked very well at breaking up efforts for countries to ride as teams and making it much more a test of the individual - it levelled the playing field a bit between countries that have a large cycling/sport infrastructure sending a dozen riders, coaches, mechanics and team cars, and riders from other nations who turn up on their own and have to borrow a bike.
Maybe both the worlds and the olympics require a much more specific course design in that respect. Glasgow really made riders compete more individually and the course design shattered the peloton and also meant there were no lines of sight, without radios unless your 'team mate' was on your wheel you had no idea where they were.
Worked brilliantly for spectators too.
Surely the Olympic race will stand below the Worlds which a) has a visible sign of winning all year and gives a better chance of taking place (just)
The Grand tours especially that French one will always be more significant. Isn't footy the same? Or tennis.
Not sure about MTB enduro. Isn't that just something with a very in appropriate name for those who go down hill fast but don't race uphill?
I don't really have an objection to any of the sports.
They should be accessible and atleast somewhat transglobal ie archery being Bhutan's only olympic sport potential ( i think).
I would argue that horses are largely innaccessable to the massess these days and i am not behind carting animals around the world for them to win trinkets for the rider. So human dressage?
Downhill is pretty niche and really not that accessible, equipment wise and suitable practice venues.
I would install a one event per entrant though.