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YT's full bikes cost about the same as many frame only prices.
I'd just get a full bike and flog the old one, you'll come out better off with newer kit.
assuming he can get a full bike for the same cost.
Hadn't looked at yt prices - for the spec they are so cheap. Under £2k for a capra with Lyriks or a Jeffsy 27.5 with pikes. Very tempted with them. Although I think the Capra is too much for what I do and perhaps the Jeffsy won't be as playful as say a Bird Aeris.
Going to book in a day to test ride the Aeris at Swinley I think as the first option. Decided the Transition is too expensive. The AirDrop is on my list too - probably marginally ahead of the Aeris as it wouldn't require a new back wheel.
as others have said, get a full bike and sell the old one, I have nearly always bought frames and moved parts about, it always starts as a bit of a compromise then as you replace more and more stuff ends up costing more than if I had just bought a complete bike, problem is once you start upgrading is addictive
This is a cracking deal and sounds like just the bike you are looking for, you probably wouldn't need to change anything (well maybe the rear tyre!) leaving your Boardman as a spare bike or to strip down and sell on (I got a carbon Strive from their factory outlet late last year, arrived in 3 days, beautiful bike and rides really well but I might have been better with the equally capable Spectral)
I'm 5'10" and my medium race geo Strive fits lovely, that bit longer and more roomy than the Commencal Meta it replaced, but still feels nimble yet stable at speed. Don't think I have ever test riden a bike before buying one, pretty much all my bikes/frames have been mail order
https://www.canyon.com/en-gb/factory-outlet/#category=mtb-bikes&id=20122
That Spectral is a great deal but I've always been a bit bothered by their statement thus:
"Bikes in this category include those from categories 1 and 2 and are designed for harsher, unpaved terrain. The scope for these bikes includes occasional jumps up to a maximum height of 60 cm."
I'm far from a great jumper or hucker of massive drops but I pop off stuff that size every day on the way to and from work on my hardtail! And occasionally go two or three times that height...
Joe Barnes (& his friends) has a Spectral and gives it some serious stick racing, traveling and messing about. It's safe to say he rides it beyond anyone's talents (and in the Scottish muck) and I believe he's not had any issues.
I have a spectral and did jumps and dropp offs higher than the 60 cm they said is the limit. It seems like it is more something they can hide behind when you claim warranty on a frame. I have only heard off one broken frame so far and the frames look and feel really sturdy.
Another vote for Kona Process 153.
It seems like it is more something they can hide behind when you claim warranty on a frame.
That's my feeling, especially as Joe Barnes often races on his. But that feels rather disingenuous to me...
Thanks for the further thoughts. I'm still not sure on the direct sales model where you're buying from overseas. Some of he comments I've seen worry me. That spectral seems an ok deal - but if I were going down that route yt Capra / Jeffsy 27.5 have better specs for the money I think.
better specs don't make a better bike
They're both gonna be good bikes poah
In terms of geometry the yt Capra seems better than the Canyon spectral for my purposes. If I were to go Canyon I think it'd be the strive. But I'm pretty sure I'm not going to go with an overseas direct sales model company.
Spoke with someone at Bird earlier and going to book a demo. I like what I've read about the Aeris 145. Might be less DH orientated than say a Capra, but more DH orientated hen things like the spectral / Jeffsy.
I think the Bird looks great.
Just to say a positive for the Whyte G160 - seing that it has dropped out of the thread. I have an RS and I absolutely love it. Great geometry and fantastic kit. It goes up and down with no issues (prefers down). Having said that, for a self build you'll not match the kit that comes with the Whyte full build for anywhere near the same price. I wouldn't swap mine as it is for any other bike but if I was building a bike from a frameset I would also look at the Pole Evolink 140.
I'm leaning towards the frameset purchase over a full bike at the moment. Appreciate this isn't always the cheapest route, but I'm pretty happy with the kit I'll have on the bike that I've already got. Bike will end up with a 160mm Pike rct3 at the front (tapered steerer). I've got near enough brand new sram GX 1x10 with new SLX ht2 cranks and oval chainring, sram guide rs brakes and ok ish mavic wheels with nearly new tyres. Also got near enough brand new 50mm stem and 780mm bars. Have a 27.2mm dropper post which just works all the time (is a bit ugly as it's an rsp plummet with the rubber boot) and use a shim in my current frame. Only issue I'll really have is if I go with a frame that has boost at the rear or has a non-threaded bb.
That Pole evolink is unusual. Main issues are that it seems to be a 29er and I want 27.5 - plus it's really long in the top tube which maybe an issue for me.
Saw the g160 earlier in the week and it looked really nice. No frameset option though I don't think.
The airdrop edit V2 has everything you need in this regard. Ed is really quick and helpfull to answer al your questions. You should try to get a demo there as well to compare to the bird.
Wait a short while (May for UK, various locations), get yourself over to a YT Demo day ([url= https://www.yt-industries.com/en/campaign/index/sCategory/4/emotionId/258 ]YT Demo Days[/url]) and try the Jeffsy (29er, 27.5) and Capra.
Tried the Jeffsy 29 last year - loved it from the first pedal, even though I'd been wary of 29ers before for being 'too big to handle'. I have a Reign 27.5 and Trance 27.5 as well, but now selling the Trance as it's redundant - the Jeffsy is better (for me) in every single respect: easier to pedal up hill, far more fun downhill (and my Trance had 160mm forks), and generally more playful and livelier at everything.
I bought the Trance as the Reign was simply 'too much bike' for the majority of riding I do. It makes sense when I go to the Alps and do uplift days, but everywhere else it was hard work. I'm now considering taking the Jeffsy to Morzine this year instead - it's *that* capable.
AirDrop edit v2 is on the list, but it's trying to find a way to demo it. Haven't looked into it yet. Bird are only about an hour and a half from Bristol and conveniently placed for Swinley which I've been to a few times before.
Edit v1 didn't do that well in this months mbuk test - although that was a v1 with a coil shock so not sure how representative of he newer version.
Won't be buying for a few months yet though, so have time to try a few bikes out.
Edit V1 and V2 I believe are very similar, no real geometry changes but a few nice touches.
https://www.airdropbikes.com/blogs/news/edit-v2-everything-you-need-to-know
I'd not let what mbuk write put you off, I wouldn't touch a YT with a badge pole but plenty of people seem to like them.
I'd be interested to see that mbuk write up. I've tested a fair few bikes this year and prefered the airdrop over the Bronson, nomad and taniwha and that's with both the coil and the air shock.
Take what they say with a pinch of salt, and what I say for that matter, but I think you run the risk of missing out on a great if you don't give it a whirl. I reckon it's certainly worth a trip to the peak district for a test ride.
In slight comparison to the MBUK review (which i've not seen) the Dirt magazine loved the V1 Edit when they reviewed it last year.
If it is any help, I'm about an hour from Bristol with a V1 Airdrop (large, Pike, Monarch+) and the Malvern Hills to play on 5 mins away...
Peak District is a mega drive for me, I just don't have the time to go there for a test ride unfortunately.
Jamesfts where near the Malverns are you and how tall are you to fit on a large edit? I'm 5'9 with reasonably long legs, but with quite a short upper body / short arms.
4 of the 5 bikes in the mbuk test are direct sales models which isn't ideal. They did a shorter travel trails bike test in what mountain bike, but the Bird was under the 150mm travel for mbuk's test but over the max 140mm for wmb's test. Bit ridiculous!
Jamesfts where near the Malverns are you and how tall are you to fit on a large edit? I'm 5'9 with reasonably long legs, but with quite a short upper body / short arms.
Pretty much on them, couple of miles away (Castlemorton).
I'm about 6ft, slightly under, similar long legs/short upper body build. The large is quite big but has made me realise most of my previous bikes were probably too small for me (Meta v3, HT and a Spesh Enduro - all large)
I'm 5'10" and found the large airdrop a bit too long although I'm a large in most other brands. The medium was better for both me and the wife (5'9")
Sounds like the lathe will be too big unfortunately James, but thanks for the offer of a go on it. I'm on a medium Boardman and that feels fairly large to me in general - I wouldn't want to go bigger. Although that's mainly in stand over height rather than reach I'd say.
Just read the MBUK review of the bike in which they give it 3.5 stars, there's very little they complain about other than the coil shock not feeling "poppy" enough, though you can spec what shock you want when you buy it, so it's not really much of an issue. The rear brake hose does sometimes rub on the rear tyre, but it's never caused me any fuss.
Why would you design a bike where the rear brake hose can rub on the tyre though?
I'm assuming in the v2 they may have amended the routing to avoid this problem though. Whichever bike I pick it'll have an air shock rather than a coil.
It's still in the running but depends whether I manage to sort a test ride on a frame the right sort of size for me.
The Edit's with the brake hose rubbing on the tyre, do they have routing above or below the down tube? I've seem bikes with both, different production runs?
My mates Edit has routing below the downtube (which I'm not a fan of) but after heli taping it for him and securing all the cables I don't recall it rubbing on the tyre, and I am fussy about cable rub. The little clamp on the stay gives some amount of adjusting the cable and clamping it in place, which can alter where it touches the stays. I'll try to remember to have a look next time we're out. Maybe it depend on hose length/positioning?
Edit: On the subject of sizing he's 6'ish and on a large frame with I think a 40mm stem. It's too big for me at 5'7".
Poppy or rebound set fast. Pretty easy to a coil to do that. I much prefer a coil to an air shock.
I think the original demo versions that were made with the black chainstays had the cable routed on the top of the down tube, every frame after that runs underneath the downtube.
Thought it might be something like that.
A Reign.
Still have yet to ride anything that feels so neutral, easy to ride and balanced across such a wide range of terrain. There's longer and more aggressive bikes but they suit a smaller percentage of terrain and speeds - and there are shorter and steeper bikes that are suited to a smaller percentage of terrain. Where as I enjoy riding the Reign and feel that it's competitive on the descents on 90 percent of trails.
I feel it's similar in WRC, you can have a car that's perfectly setup for loose, gravel big jump stages - but if that's only 30 percent of the stage - what's the point?
I love the chassis so much - and have spent so much time getting the suspension dialled on the front that I'm not sure I'd even want to move to the likely updated 2018 model, for fear of ****ing my settings up, I think I might just nitromors it and get a 1 piece rocker link knocked up....I dont want to ride for a year before its perfect again.
I'm liking all the ideas and suggestions coming in.
Just looked and you can't buy a reign aluminium frameset unfortunately. Nice looking bike though.
Decided my budget for a frame is about £1000 ish. Can get the Bird with shock etc for £1100 and the Airsrop Edit is in the same ballpark.
Transition is £1800 so unless in a fantastic sale when I come to buy it's too expensive.
Nukeproof Mega 275 would need to be in a sale too - seems to come in between £1400 and £1600 online.
Kona Process, Whyte g160, Giant Reign not available as frame only.
I've definitely ruled out direct sales from overseas bikes.
Anything I've missed around the price point I'm looking at?
If you want to try a Mk1 Aeris in the Malverns I might be able to help. It's a M. I'm 5ft11 and was on the cusp of M or Large. It's shorter than the new ones tho so not a direct comparison. Happy to let you try it out if it'd be useful.
Thanks for the offer Alex - really appreciate it. I've now booked a test ride on a new Aeris 145 with Bird at Swinley 🙂
How have you found yours? Have the bearings all lasted well / any problems with it?
I've really enjoyed riding it since buying one of the first or second batches in April 2015. I've not ridden it since Sept last year as I've 'gone all chubby' and currently prefer those types of bikes. Still rode it 4000km all over UK and trips to France and Spain.
First thing to say is any little issues I've had, the guys at Bird have been fantastic. Second thing is not really any issues! Changed the bearings at 3500km which included a wet winter. Very easy bike to work on. It's a fun bike to ride as fast as you're prepared to go. One of the things I found on the Capra (for example) is by the time it really made sense, I was going too fast to enjoy it! With the Aeris, it can go from some smooth Forest singletrack to the blacks at Antur without at any point feeling like the wrong bike.
If I had my time again, I probably wouldn't bother with the Cane Creek DB shock. It never felt as good as I expected it to be even after being serviced and tuned.
Otherwise, just a really good bike at a great price that never let me down. I'm sure you'll enjoy the demo,
Really hoping I like the demo on the Bird as I'm quite sold on the idea of it. But you just don't know until you have a go on one!
So I demo'd the AirDrop edit yesterday and the Bird Aeris 145 today.
AirDrop looked well made and had some nice frame details. Ed was really helpful and confidence inspiring at Airdrop. I tested one with a Yari on the front and a DB coil on the back. Ed offered to swap it for a monarch air shock and in hindsight I should have taken him up on the offer. I felt the coil shock was far more capable than the Yari so a bit Mis-matched. The Edit pedals pretty well and the more steep / rocky the terrain the better. To me it felt like a downhill bike that could still pedal up.
Test ride the Aeris 145 at Swinley today. Just felt perfect from a couple of mins in once I'd got used to having my weight much further forward to load the front wheel given the length of the top tube. I felt at home on it almost immediately - and have got PR's on strava on the ups / flat and downhill. Just felt faster evrywhere and had so much fun. The bike is surprisingly light - and that's without light build kit on it - had Yaris / Sram GX etc.
Want an Aeris now - it was almost the most fun I've ever had on a bike (bar an uplift day at BPW).
When you find a bike that makes you feel like that - that's when you have found the right one!
It was just so good yesterday - I was probably boring my mate to tears about how good the Aeris was and how much fun I was having!
Photographed my Boardman his morning and put it in the classifieds on here and on eBay. Gumtree and anywhere else I can advertise also going to get done today! Not to say the Boardman is a bad bike - it's fantastic - just I'm ready for the next step up.
Joe what swung it for the Bird over the Airdrop? Also how tall are you and what size did you go for? I have a friend thinking about a 145 but undecided between M and ML. Will be speaking to the guys at Bird but also looking for other feedback.
It's really difficult to say why overall I think.
The AirDrop was a nice bike and I enjoyed riding on it. I think I just struggled to get it turned into tight bermed corners and I didn't have the same thing on the Aeris. Maybe the bird just felt livelier overall - I had a grin on my face the entire time.
That doesn't mean it would be the same for everyone of course - and having an air shock instead of coil on the Edit might have evened it up on the lively feel.
If you're interested I'd really recommend you try both yourself. Swinley is great for testing the bird - albeit it's not that technical a trail centre. Sheffield wise I used Lady Canning plantation and it's too peddally a place for the AirDrop in my opinion.
I'm 5'9 with 31" legs and quite short arms. I test rode the ML Aeris and it was great. I didn't try the medium to compare though.
I tried the Airdrop and the Aeris too, and would echo joebristol's comments. The edit i tried did have a monarch shock and was very good but for me the Aeris had the same confidence inspiring ride and also felt more fun and playful.
Thanks for the feedback. Interesting what you say about being too pedally for the Airdrop, I found my Mk1.5 Aeris pedals better than an Airdrop with the same shock.
Giant reign 2 is worth demoing if you can.I bought mine two weeks ago from je James for 2500 also they have a 15 percent of purchase offer to spend in store at the minute which gave me 375 quid to do up my old bike for selling so that offer worked for me.
Took the reign out today for first time to cut gate in Peak District handled great and climbed well too so couldn't fault my purchase.
I've seen the Reign mentioned a few times, but I have to say I'm sold on the idea of a British designed and built bike now (albeit the frame isn't welded in the UK) - and you don't see too many Birds out on the trails which is also nice. It's good you can pick and choose the bits that you upgrade too.
The guys at both Bird and AirDrop are great - really helpful and happy to talk through everything at length.
Only thing is I've got to wait until my bike sells now before I can order the Aeris
What Boardman is it?
Loving this thread guys.
Just had to sell my Spitfire and now thinking about what to replace it with. Like the look of both the Bird and the AirDrop but would be keen to know if anyone has ridden both coming from a Spitty as I was just starting to get a bit jaded with the Spitty and I'm looking for something a bit more playful/lively.
Also looking for a new enduro myself and looking at the bird aeris 145. Would you say it is capable dh. I will be using for places like revolution bike park, stiniog, black mountain ect so worried there isn't enough travel but I hopeful you guys will prove me wrong hahaha
Jamj1974 - the bike to have to sell is a Boardman Pro Fs 2015 (so 650b 150f/130r travel and 1x10 etc). It's pretty decent, I just fancy something a bit longer travel / more DH orientated. It's in the classifieds on here / gumtree / bike radar / eBay etc.
Swainy90 - I only rode it at Swinley so not very knar. It swallowed up any line I took downhill though and had plenty laid back geometry. Felt like it was quite 'long legged' and foot high rooty drops on corners just got flattened out.
The AirDrop has 150mm travel vs 145 on the Bird and felt more solid / DH orientated. The back end of it is seriously built. With a coil shock on it nothing upset the back end at all and it was so plush the Yari on the front felt very underwhelming. With a lyric I imagine it would be a beast - yet still cycled uphill.
That said I've heard of people doing some DH racing on the Aeris 145 and winning some races / it taking all the punishment thrown in its direction.
So either would probably suit the bill.
Thank joe, possibly a silly question but doesn't the aeris run 150mm travel, not sure on the back. I'm not clued up on the technicalities which probably makes me think I need 160/170mm travel when maybe I don't. Hopefully you can clarify to travel for me mate. I'm personally looking at the 11 speed slx version aeris if I buy cheers
Cheers Joe, I have a mate looking for his first full suspension bike. He's strictly a red route level rider - so it might be an idea. I'll check the ad.
This is my Boardman (if I'm allowed to post a link)
The Bird Aeris is called the 145 as it has 145mm rear travel. But 5mm travel isn't much of a difference to 150mm. It's more how it rides / the geo though.
I've not ridden the Capra / Swoop / G160 etc - I'm imagining they probably are more capable downhill, but will be less lively as an all round bike. Test riding is the only way to work out which you like. I think in May there are YT demo days at FOD and Swinley if you want to try a Capra. Think you can test ride a Whyte G160 at swinley too.
Sold my Boardman today (sob sob - it was a nice bike that I really enjoyed).... but got to put in an order for a brand new shiny Aeris 145
What colour Joe?
Hopefully slime green, but looks like that's mostly out of stock so maybe the bright orange colour.
Gone for GX / Yari 160mm / Guide R and the rest mostly standard kit.
So excited!
I got a slime green Large Aeris 145 after demoing it in January - trust me, you will not regret it one bit! The guys at Bird are just so passionate about what they do, and the way the bike rides is a testament to that. Enjoy!
Cheers for the comment - what spec did you go for on your Aeris?
Everyone who has one seems to be so pleased with their new bike I'm hoping I've made the right choice. Never spent so much money on a bike before sonit was a hard choice.
Keep seeing Nukeproof Mega 275's when I'm out and wondering what they are like but couldn't easily sort out a test ride.
Brilliant Joe. Pictures when it's arrived!
Got a green on order too, hoping it won't be too much longer!
Think they suggested from order yesterday it would probably a couple of weeks before dispatch. I tend to ride mid week rather than on the weekend (too mamy DIY projects on at the moment) so the weekend it arrives I may not even get to ride it 🙁
I understand the pain of your wait joe, ordered my new bike last Friday for an early mid week delivery. Courier damaged it in transit and had to take it back to the shop. Still got it turned around to arrived yesterday though, winner!
I went for the Super Deluxe rear shock, boost Lyriks, Hope/DT502 and GX - figured that I'd be better off getting the best suspension and wheels I could (not really) afford! Did Ben tell you about putting lighter weight oil in the Yari to make it a bit suppler?
Slow rider - what bike is it you've got?
IDB - sounds like a great spec of Aeris. If I could have justified an it more spec I would have done. Didn't talk in huge depth about the Yari, but my reasoning there is it has the same chassis as the Lyrik so at a later date if I felt the need I could put a charger damper (or Ann other upgraded damper) in.
I'm been riding on 150mm travel Revelations for a year ish until now so figure the Yari will be better than those.
I went for the middle spec shock - but couldn't justify the super deluxe unfortunately. I'm not a huge fan of clicky hope hubs myself so just went with the standard wheels - not sure if they'll be clicky or not! Will be my first tubeless setup bike and first time on Maxxis tyres so keen to see how much more grip I'll have.
You'll have to update us on how the bike is once you've had a chance to ride it.
I plumped for a kona process 153 dl. Really like it
Did you get a bargain on a 2016 model or go for the 2017 one? Looks a good spec if you got one in the sale. A mate has the Process 134 from a few years back with Revelations / SLX kit mostly and he loves it. Front end is a lot more poppy than the Aeris - couldn't believe how easy his bike manuals. Never ridden a 153 though.
I wrote a big post about the reasons for the build choices but no-one will really care!
Suffice to say it rides great - I have a suspicion I'm going to have a proper off on it before long, it's that easy to ride fast!
That is the danger as bikes get more capable - you run out of talent going much faster.....