[Closed] Rugged Android phones - who's got one?

Why do you want to replace your GPS? It sounds very much like that's the better solution for what you're talking about?

Personally, I wouldn't use a shiny new phone on my handlebars, just in case it gets knocked off.

For that reason, I bought a second hand HTC Hero with no sim card for £50. I only have one app (MMTracker) installed on it, and it sits in a [url= http://www.ultimate-mobiles.co.uk/mobile-phones/htc/htc-hero-accessories/motorcycle-bicycle-mounts/ua-bike-mount-waterproof-case___423.htm ]waterproof case[/url] mounted on my stem (with a lanyard to the bars just in case. The case has a double zip, so has potential to be charged on the go, but the 2800mAh battery I bought gets about 8 hours, with the display on.

Whole setup cost me less than £100 and it works a load better (ie, it does work) than the Mem Map Adventuer 3500 its's replaced.

I have a "normal" phone that resides safely in my bag.

i have a defy. it has lasted 18 months which is staggering for one of my phones, and even better given that it is a 'smart' phone.

only issue (and its quite a bit one for a waterproff phone) is that if you get ANY moisture on the screen, it spazzes (un PC sorry) out wildly, thinking you are pressing where the moisture is.

and by moisture, i mean anything from a ever-so-slightly clammy finger upwards.

i wouldnt swap it for a garmin for gps duties in a million years.

I've got a Defy. It's definitely rugged (dropped, kicked, crashed and if you get it muddy you can rinse it under the tap), but it's a bit laggy and the touchscreen seems to have a mind of it's own sometimes.
Battery life is so-so, obviously using the GPS chews through it quicker.

Another Defy user here, mine seems happier when the screen is wet than tracknicko's. Again, battery life won't be great for GPS routefinding. Mine goes more than halfway through a charge running endomondo for half a day in my back pocket.

I've got a Defy. The screen is virtually impossible to read in sunlight, and while the GPS works well enough and the battery life would probably get you round most routes, I'm not sure why you wouldn't just use a GPS instead...?
My Defy just stays in my jersey pocket with Strava or My Tracks running on it.

EDIT: Can't say I've noticed any issues with the screen being wet either.

"[i]Why do you want to replace your GPS? It sounds very much like that's the better solution for what you're talking about? [/i]"

- the maps are outdated and are expensive to replace
- it needs to be hooked up to a PC to get anything on and off
- I need to use Windows to get maps onto it
- if I forget to load maps for where I'm going it's not much use
- when I plan a route in advance, the Garmin doesn't reproduce it, it has different ideas which are sometimes downright idiotic
- it won't upload my position to the Internet
- the screen is tiny
- zooming/moving the view across the map takes forever
- I can't customise the map rendering
- the water sealing isn't great
- I can't use simple online tools like Google Maps to plan routes quickly
- it can be a bit temperamental when using the dyno charger
- etc

So, no - apart from having a barometric altimeter and good battery life, it's not the better solution at all 🙂

+1 tracknicko - that's exactly what mine does when the screen gets even a bit moist; has a complete fruit until i buff the screen gently and convince the phone it's in a warm, dry, safe place with people that love and care for it deeply

If you run out of power with any of them you are up poo river. Amazingly, a map enables rapid route changes, can be read in sunlight and is incredibly easy to zoom across.

You can download free legit maps from talkytoaster or the like which are easily the match of topomaps IMO (I have topomaps and use the free ones by preference)

There are loads of free online mapping tools which solve your 'if I plan a route in advance' issue

It should be completely waterproof - one of the big advantages over a phone - if it's not, send it back to garmin.

I would love a phone solution but having looked into it, I just don't think there is one (yet). I use my garmin on the bars for navigation and my phone for logging the routes and uploading to the internet.

I've got a Defy and never had much problem using it when the screen is a bit wet, sure if I try use it underwater it doesn't work, but its OK when it's raining lightly etc.

TooTall - Member
If you run out of power with any of them you are up poo river. Amazingly, a map enables rapid route changes, can be read in sunlight and is incredibly easy to zoom across.

Ah, the luddite defence. I recall helping some walkers out when they were lost in the wilderness with night descending because their map blew away 🙂

[quote="clubber"]
Why do you want to replace your GPS? It sounds very much like that's the better solution for what you're talking about?

[quote="Bez"]
- the maps are outdated and are expensive to replace
- it needs to be hooked up to a PC to get anything on and off
- I need to use Windows to get maps onto it
- if I forget to load maps for where I'm going it's not much use
- when I plan a route in advance, the Garmin doesn't reproduce it, it has different ideas which are sometimes downright idiotic
- it won't upload my position to the Internet
- the screen is tiny
- zooming/moving the view across the map takes forever
- I can't customise the map rendering
- the water sealing isn't great
- I can't use simple online tools like Google Maps to plan routes quickly
- it can be a bit temperamental when using the dyno charger
- etc

So, no - apart from having a barometric altimeter and good battery life, it's not the better solution at all 🙂

1 - 0 to Bez... 😉

"[i]If you run out of power with any of them you are up poo river. Amazingly, a map enables rapid route changes, can be read in sunlight and is incredibly easy to zoom across.[/i]"

Yes, but unfortunately a map does almost arse-all of what I actually want, which is the stuff that a phone does - not the stuff that my Garmin does, or the stuff that a map does, or the stuff that astral navigation does, or the stuff that a bloke on the pavement does when I pull over and ask him the way to Amarillo.

Stand down and await threads titled "Should I buy a map?"

Thanks for the feedback from the Defy owners. Sounds like the touchscreen on the Xperia could indeed be the killer feature. Would be ace to hear about battery life if anyone has one, though. But I guess they're pretty thin on the ground - only just found out about them myself...

Another Defy user here. Its is a tough little phone. Its best feature is probably its water resistance. I left mine in a fleece pocket and ran it through the washing machine. Was pretty sure that it would be knackered when I took it out.

It worked fine and was also nice and clean!

I am a Defy owner and would never think about using it as a substitute for a map. It is an OK phone but no substitute for actually having the tools to know where I am and where I am heading. I'd not use it instead of my Garmin either. I use an extra life battery (plenty out there) but the GPS still kills the battery, never mind having the screen on at full brightness all the time.

1 - 0 to Bez...

How very dare you! 🙂

GPS is still the better solution IMO. As I said, I would like to do the same as the OP but I don't reckon we're there yet.

"[i]I am a Defy owner and would never think about using it as a substitute for a map.[/i]"

But I would. (What's the absolute worst case scenario? - find a petrol station and buy a map.)

"[i]It is an OK phone but no substitute for actually having the tools to know where I am and where I am heading.[/i]"

Except that since it is precisely a tool for knowing where you are and where you are heading, it strikes me as an [i]excellent[/i] replacement. Particularly if, say, you wanted to ride for 200 miles or so without having to fish maps out of your pocket every 20 minutes or without realising you've taken a wrong turn only once you're 5 miles off course.

"[i]I'd not use it instead of my Garmin either.[/i]"

But I would. (In fact on my last ride I had to, because I'd forgotten to load the maps for London, so it failed to plot my route and left me to follow my nose into the City.)

"[i]GPS is still the better solution IMO.[/i]"

But it's not the better solution IMO.

It's just a thought, but maybe some of us have different requirements. I've used maps, I've used GPS units and I've used smartphones, and I'm well aware of the pros and cons of each. I suspect most people are. What I happen to want is, functionally speaking, best served by a smartphone. In fact [i]only[/i] by a smartphone.

The main things I'm asking about are, for any given phone: (a) whether the touchscreen becomes unusable in a downpour, (b) how long it'll go for on a single battery before I have to swap batteries, plug in my piggyback battery, or use the dynohub, and (c) whether there are any surprising idiosyncracies that anyone else has found in using one of these specific devices.

Best thing about having a [b]working[/b] GPS on the handlebars is not haveing to stop at every available junction, get the map out, check wehre you are, check where you're going and repeat it in 200 yards.

Of course, there are other solutions:

1) You could grow a beard, get a Mount Vision and put a map-board on it.

2) You could follow way-marked trails in a forest somehwere, anywhere, they're all the same.

I use a Samsung Galaxy W and Endomondo free which has been pretty good for me so far. Don't have it bar-mounted though it stays in my pocket!

bez.

a) yes - completely unusable.
b) hard to gauge probably sub 3 hours if screen is on constantly
c) yes. constantly dropping suitable signal for maps in 3G. takes AN AGE to find location when you have limited connectivity. regularly shows that it could connect, but wont, and definately not at a pace that would be useable for serius trailfinding. wont use GPS locator without map background, and needs 3G to find map.

this is all in and around the peaks too. **** knows what would happen if you went somewhere genuinely remote rather than just a bit hilly.

@tracknicko - Fantastic. Exactly the sort of information I was after. Thankyou.

constantly dropping suitable signal for maps in 3G. takes AN AGE to find location when you have limited connectivity. regularly shows that it could connect, but wont, and definately not at a pace that would be useable for serius trailfinding. wont use GPS locator without map background, and needs 3G to find map

As I said, I don't use a sim-card, so no 3G. I have all the memory map data copied onto my phone from my PC. The MMTRacker app just reads it all in.

Because its not using a mobile signal, it does take a while for initial triangulation, but equally, it will take just as long whether I have a signal or not.

yes i should caveat my review with the fact i have never tried hard to make it work with apps or maps or owt, as it was so woeful as standard i assumed it would continue to be shit.

defy owner too
so far mine survived

3 crashes, more drop from the car top than I care to count, a dive in the toilet (no comment please) several kms of riding, it Has enough batery life to do what i want (5-6 hours of riding).
To be fair, if the pay monthly on orange wasn't such a reap-off i'll happily renew it just to get another phone.

Oooh... the Xperia has a barometer!

http://developer.sonymobile.com/wp/2012/01/04/new-barometric-sensor-app-and-code-example-available-for-xperia-active/

Looks like a winner...

Defy plus owner here. It has a larger battery capacity and a few improvements over the original defy. Its similarly waterproof too. The screen doesn't go crazy when wet either, although, it doesn't really do much when its wet either.

Its not amazingly tougher than any other phone, but is a bit more rugged.

For navigation, MMtracker, with maps uploaded to to SD card is brill. For general tracking and recording, I just use endomondo.

Have the original Defy.

Utterly cr@p! I do use it as a GPS and for mapping, however.

Useless with any moisture present. Battery life beyond poor. Software slow to frustration. Gets reset 5 times a day.

It does make good quality calls though. And it can be left in a wet bag/Camelback etc.

I can't wait to see how it performs against my axe when I'm due for an upgrade.

Worst phone I've ever owned.

I use my old Nokia 5800 for GPS duties. Pop Viewranger and Sports tracker on it and its all good. The resistive screen means its fine in the damp and with gloves on. The camera is considerably better than the defy also which is a bonus. You could probably pick one up for £50 on Ebay. Obviously not totally rugged and waterproof but mines had a fairly rough time of it and is still working fine.

As an aside viewranger offer the Defy+ plus with full uk mapping preloaded for a decent price [url= http://shop.viewranger.com/products.php?category_id=31 ]Click[/url]

I'd keep an eye on eBay and look for a second-hand Satmap Active 10, as they are starting to pop up now. Or for the price linked to on that Viewranger site you could get the Satmap new, with full UK OS mapping. No need to worry about uploading maps, planning routes on the unit is perfectly doable, and you can just keep stuffing AAs into it even on a multi-day epic.

I have a Defy and get on with it OK, but the battery only lasts 5-6 hours max with GPS on, it needs a bit more juice than a stand-alone unit to get it to charge, and the problems with the touchscreen are very noticeable, unless you only use it in completely dry conditions and never sweat.

However it did survive 10 minutes in the washing machine recently. Shame Norris MacWhirter wasn't there to witness it.

Actually I've already got a 5800 and I hate it. It's a dog to use compared to Android and I find it inoperable with gloves on or even in a freezer bag, whereas my Desire is fine with both. Plus I've tried developing for it in WRT and it's the most buggy, ill-documented framework I've used in ages. Horrible thing.

Well, I've ordered an Xperia Active and a Sportypal bar mount for it, but - possibly more interestingly - I also found this:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Anker-Walkpower-Colorful-External-Motorola/dp/B005QITSDG/

Now, that's a 2600mAh USB charger, but - unusually - it's cylindrical, and has a diameter of 0.9". Which happens to be pretty much the exact same diameter as the little Acor extension bar I have my GPS on. So, I can just replace the bar with the charger and - bosh! - the phone's battery capacity is tripled with no need for extra gubbins hanging about the place. Plus I can charge either from the dynohub and I can carry a spare charger if need be.

ORSUMS

I think mine has sensed I'm speaking ill of it. It's earpiece has just gone. Again.

Mikertroid, the earpiece recently went on mine too. It's very easy to fix yourself, you literally just need a Torx T5 screwdriver/bit. I used a Defy earpiece (£3 off eBay) rather than the k850i one recommended, but swapping to a Sony Ericsson could be worth a try if yours is going through multiple ones.

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=12094566#post12094566

Also mine went very slow and rubbish after upgrading to Android 2.2, solved by rooting it and tinkering with the virtual memory settings.

http://newtechworld.net/how-to-improve-performance-of-motorola-defy-after-2-2-froyo-update/

Mr Agreeable;

an old iPhone 3G is getting wheeled out. I am looking forward to testing the Defy's resilience to my axe.....

I use Galaxy Ace with MyTrails, find it perfect, got a solid case for it that mounts on the bars and is 100% waterproof.

Just taken my Defy back in; CPW wouldn't do it under warranty, despite me mentioning the EU directive.

Worst phone I've owned!

Brief update...

Just left the Xperia Active running with GPS on and everything else off, but with the screen on permanently, at full brightness. A lot of the time it was hunting for GPS but this generally seems to be no less power-hungry than maintaining a signal.

It started at 88% battery and powered off at 4%, and was up for 5h40m in between. That implies 6h30 of usable runtime, which - going on nominal capacities - extrapolates to around 20h with the additional battery pack (which is 22mm diameter and fits just dandy in the extender clamp). This was only the second charge of the phone battery so there may (or may not) yet be a smidge more performance to eke out of it.

Seems good so far then, pending a proper 'in the field' test and a test with the additional battery - which I'll do once the mounting bracket shows up.

[img] [/img]

So here it is all mounted. Acor extension bracket with the Anker battery fitted in place of the carbon bar. That's then shimmed using a stem split shim so that the Sportypal bracket sits on that, and then into that goes the phone.

It's not heroically clear from that picture, but it's a very tidy little setup. The battery is supplied with a nice short cable that is perfect for this application.

I just need to get an old handlebar grip to cut up to make a little rubber johnny for the business end of the battery to stop rain getting in, and we're sorted.

Reporting back... Phone was on for 13 hours today, logging for about 11 of those at 20s intervals using MyTrails. Phone antenna on, screen mostly off, but on occasionally. Battery started at 100% and went to 37%. I'd say that's surprisingly good. Very good. Extrapolates to about 48 hours with the extra battery...

Bez I like your set up and will give it a go myself but probably with a Galaxy S 2 and a waterproof case that I have my eye on. This will be for a tour I'm doing in summer and not off road. Have you tested this with a dynamo yet? What I want to do is connect the Anker battery directly to my hub dynamo via the mini usb in whilst also charging the phone via the usb out. I don't have the Anker battery yet but it's on order. I'm hoping this will act as a buffer to provide a consistent power output to the phone but am a bit concerned that I'll need something between the dynamo and the Anker battery to smooth the flow, similar to the E-werk.

Got a Griffin Military Survivor case for the 4s. Using Viewranger on it so all the functionality I need. Also the case makes the screen useable in the wet

"[i]Have you tested this with a dynamo yet? What I want to do is connect the Anker battery directly to my hub dynamo via the mini usb in whilst also charging the phone via the usb out.[/i]"

You'll need something to give a stable 5VDC output - the Kemo works for me, I run it off the parallel tabs on my B&M IQ Cyo so that it get light and USB power together (there is no discernible effect on the light output).

Most if not all batteries of this type tend to shut off their output when the device being charged reports full charge, and need to be manually switched on, so it's not a fit-and-forget buffer. And you'll struggle to get connectors into both ports on the Anker, too: they're very close together.

Bez, I intended to buy an Xperia Active phone last week and I was wondering how to set it all up for a long day's ride - your posts were invaluable, thanks!

I bought a veho pebble smartstick because the battery you suggested wasn't available from Amazon at the time I pressed the order button. The supplied cable is just long enough to reach the phone.

My only disappointment when I gave it a trial this morning is that Endomondo Pro doesn't capture the cadence data from the Garmin GSC 10 I set up on my road bike. Which apps do you use? I saw your other post re google maps >GmapToGPX > MyTrails (I'm playing with Viewranger which worked well on the road this morning).

I need to find an app which supports interval training on the turbo trainer (about to go on work secondment which is going to curtail week day rides) and supports the Garmin HRM and speed/cadence sensors. Endomondo was close to perfect, strava may do it but is costly (I may try the free version to see if it supports the sensors).

I primarily use it for following a planned route and uploading my position to one of my own websites. So until I find time to write my own, I use MyTrails for the former and Tasker for the latter; when I'm lost or need to check a general map I use Google Maps. That all pretty much covers me - I'm not fussed about cadence/HR/etc so I have no other devices attached to it.

Viewranger is a fantastic app - but I like two things about MyTrails: the ability to use custom tile servers (so I've used CloudMade to create a super-clear map style that makes the routes stand out and is readable even in bright daylight) and the ability to crank the sample rate down to 20s intervals for long rides - though I wish it would go even lower.

One other app worth mentioning is "No Lock" - it lets you drop a widget onto your launcher that allows you to turn the screen lock on and off. This is absolutely invaluable for use on the bars, because it means you can use just the power button to turn the screen on and off, and not have to swipe to unlock the screen. Really useful, makes the device so much easier to use on the move (and you may have noticed that when dry the screen doesn't work if you have gloved hands, unlike my HTC).

The batteries vanished from Amazon soon after I bought mine, sadly - I got a second one recently from an American vendor on eBay for a similar price, but that was the only place I could find them.

Thanks for mentioning the Smartstick - didn't know of that. Have you used it the same way I have, ie is it the right diameter for a bar replacement?