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I don't typically do intervals on the turbo, spend more time doing threshold stuff e.g
2 minutes threshold, 10 second all out sprint, 2 minutes threshold, 10 second all out sprint, 3 minute recovery. Repeat 5-6 times. Feels like a great workout, much sweating and wobbly legs when I get off.
However figured I needed to introduce some more intense intervals so tried a standard 30/30 routine last night
30 seconds all out, 30 seconds recovery, repeat 5 times, 5 minute recovery X 4
Quickly reduced 30 seconds all out to 20 seconds, with 40 seconds recovery. Was quite obviously tailing off on the 4th and 5th intervals, losing 1-2km/h on the speedo (don't have power meter). Didn't even make it to the 4th set 🙁
So what's more important, spending 30 seconds at lower intensity, or sticking to 'all out' but just accepting I can only maintain it for 10 seconds perhaps, with 50 seconds recovery.
TLDR? Weakling can't complete basic intervals, more time at lower intensity or less time at higher intensity?
Ta
30secs all out (tabata?) reps isn't "basic" it's fairly advanced. Just give it time and work up to them
or go to the pub
Ah, good to know I'm not struggling with the basics then!
I've got a pretty good balance between booze/fitness/baby right now, extra intervals is just filling in the gaps when I'm not being daddy and not drinking 😉
Those are rather short intervals, nothing wrong with doing that sometimes, but I would suggest longer intervals make up most of your training.
Maybe use something like sufferfest or traineroad to guide your sessions, you can still select to train a specific area or weakness within them.
If it's really all out, you're unlikely to be able to maintain for more than 20 secs, so a 20/40 workout would be more appropriate. Or dial the intensity of the "on" interval back slightly and increase the intensity of your "off" interval.
I agree, an all out sprint interval session/tabata/HIIT doing 30seconds on or off sounds too long to start with.
Excellent, I'm at least relieved that my inability to finish the session isn't as embarassing as I thought!
By 'all out' I mean seated, but spinning (apparently) up to 130RPM and doing approx 450W (according to the A4 printout of my trainer's power curve, so loads of error in there no doubt!).
Since I virtually never ride like that, even racing CX, I'll dial back, but dial up recovery intensity.
kind of reminds me of this image...
The key with any length of effort is for you to be able to just about complete it. So the effort you put in for 30 seconds will be slightly less than for a 20 second set, but more than for a 1 minute set. You basically want to be hanging on for the last couple of seconds unsure whether you'll get through it, however long the set is.
30/30's are hard, but then 20/40's are no easier. And if you're blowing at the end, you're definitely doing some good.
Someone asked Joe Friel about this the other day on twitter. He suggested it should be 120% of FTP. I personally couldn't do 130rpm for 30s/30s but I'm not a spinner (though not a grinder either) My efforts are usually consistent across all sets somewhere between 120-150% of ftp depending on how I feel that day, probably around 100rpm. Many years ago I asked my coach whether it was better to be consistent across all efforts and how it should feel as I felt for me it was like making repeated attacks on a climb because of the fluid turbo. We felt it was better to be consistent and feeling like that was good (for me racing). Key is to gauge how hard to go and not blow in the first effort or go eyeballs out in the first 5 sec then be unable to hit 30s. I would dial it back a notch and aim to complete (imo of course) the set. New intervals also a shock to the system so could just be time to adjust, or bad day(s) or fatigue.
Hmm, my memory for user names isn't great but I suspect it was YOU who put me on the path of 30/30 in the first place DGOAB! 😉
What you say makes sense and I think you've filled in the final blank, completing the session! Although instinctively I think I knew that going eyeballs out but only managing half the session wasn't really the key to improvement.
I think 120% of my FTP puts me somewhere around the 300W mark (does that sound right for a relatively untrained but regular cyclist?) which works out in the low 40km/h on my trainer. Sounds a bit too easy but will try it first and hopefully manage 4 sets of 5 intervals...
For reference Revolver is a SF workout at 135% for 1 minute, 1 minute off, x 16. It's a good benchmark for a very hard workout - a proper go at that will have you jake-legged and speaking in tongues. Some experienced riders on the TR thread were saying they thought it was a bit of a joke, but now and again you want something that irons you out.
Blocks of 5 30secs on / off at 120% might not have the intensity you're looking for. Could be wrong but I think you'd be comfy there - nowt wrong with that just depends on what you're after.