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And for my next mix and match question!
I have rs505 shifters, off spec 105 hydro road sti thingys (official term).
If I buy a grx-812 (long cage clutch style mechanical rd), this is compatible because they're all the same pull and 11sp. Easy peasy.
However can I match this with a wide range 10sp cassette instead, by simply limiting out the mech? I'm totally thinking so, but thought I'd check the wisdom of crowds here.
I just happen to have quite a lot of 10sp chains and cassettes i'd rather wear out first and for the sake of cross compatibility I don't actually care about 11sp (shocking I know).
I tried to get my TT shifters to work with 10 speed with an r8000 rear mech as I have a large jockey wheel cage and wheels for that.
It just doesn't work indexed . Tried alsorts of hacks.
Works fine as a friction shift with TT shifters but no Bueno on an indexed system.
Bummer, yeah on second thoughts the shift ratio of the 11sp mech is probably different (slightly less) to the 10sp to accommodate at slightly narrower gap between the 11sp cogs on the cassette.
I was focusing on the 11sp/10sp road pull ratio being the same.
I think I'll have to buy an 11sp wide range cassette and chain.
I hate new standards when all my old ones were fine 😂
Actually, the grx-400 rd would work with a 10sp cassette, since it's designed for that. However I don't think it has as long a cage as the 812?
Hmmmm:
https://bike.shimano.com/en-AU/product/component/grx-10-speed/RD-RX400.html
You can space the cassette with 11 speed spacers but the riveted cogs will not shift cleanly. You’ll need an 11 speed chain as they are thinner (outside width) than 10 speed. The cogs are the Same width, it’s just the spacing.
Actually, the grx-400 rd would work with a 10sp cassette
I don't think that's right. The 400 RD uses the 11 speed pull ratio. The GRX 400 (or tiagra 4700) shifters with an 812 mech would give you a wide range 10 speed setup. I think.
Definitely giving it a try. Afaik the rs405 and rs505 use the same pull ratio (that of 11sp road).
Which means the 10sp grx400 mech should be setup with a shift ratio of the above in mind to translate it to a 10sp cog pitch, whereas the grx800 to an 11sp cog pitch.
Assuming the grx 10sp hydro shifters are basically the rs405 (which is a good bet).
Which means the 10sp grx400 mech should be setup with a shift ratio of the above in mind to translate it to a 10sp cog pitch, whereas the grx800 to an 11sp cog pitch.
That's not how it works, grx400 has the 11 speed shift ratio, the grx400/tiagra 4700 shifters pull more cable to convert it to the 10 speed spacing.
The problem is that 10spd cassettes have a 3.95mm spacing whereas 11spd is 3.74mm. You might be able to fudge it by changing where the cable clamps onto the rear mech.
The increased cable pull of 11spd is way smoother than 10spd.
Funny thing is on the MTB I use an 11spewd xt mech to a much better shift than the previous 10speed....using a 10speed shifter chain and cassette .
Hence I thought I might get it to work on the 10/11 ultegra mixup
The 11-speed 11-34 cassettes fit on 10-speed freehubs by not using the supplied spacer.
I've had fun this afternoon, fitting one of the above, along with an r7000 GS mech and a kmc x11 chain to marry up with my Cube's existing RS505 hydraulic brifters and 105 5800 compact chainset.
About to head out for a test ride, as 34/34 might come in quite useful up Prestatyn's 33% wall during an upcoming first post-covid visit.
What you need is a shifter that is 10 speed either 4700 Tiagra of similar with a matching mech or other road 11 speed mech
I bet you can buy a ratio changer thing or they'll be crazy youtube video on botching the much by moving where the cable bolts on or where the cable pulls from
What you need is a shifter that is 10 speed either 4700 Tiagra of similar with a matching mech or other road 11 speed mech
It'd be considerably cheaper just to buy an 11 speed cassette / chain.
Jtek shiftmate would probably do the trick, but it's not a cheap solution: http://www.jtekengineering.com/shiftmate/shiftmate-1/
Maybe i'm wrong then, i guess we'll see soon enough, since i've got one coming 😂
Here's a little thought experiment, stop me where i'm wrong, but this is my thinking.
In shimano's perfect world i'd have a rd-rx400 10sp mech paired with a 10sp cassette, and rs405 (off spec 4700 tiagra) sti levers. This would all work, the shifter pulls 1.7mm ("11sp road" pull ratio) of cable per click, and the assocaited mech takes that into account with its own actuation ratio to shift over the wider pitch 10sp casette, because they were designed to work together. And the Shifter obvs has 10 clicks.
Now swap out the shifter for an rs505, it also has a pull ratio of 11sp (suprise suprise) so the mech doesn't know/act any different, except the shifter can now "pull" 11 clicks not 10. So you limit out the 11th click essentially.
To "upgrade" to 11sp in the future, i'd need a rd-rx812 and of course an 11sp cassette.
This would all work, the shifter pulls 1.7mm (“11sp road” pull ratio) of cable per click, and the assocaited mech takes that into account with its own actuation ratio to shift over the wider pitch 10sp casette
It's here.
4700 pulls 2.8mm
11 speed road pulls 2.7mm
11 speed / 4700 rear mechs have a shift ratio of 1.4.
2.8mm x 1.4 = 3.92mm (3.95mm sprocket spacing)
2.7mm x 1.4 = 3.78mm (3.72mm sprocket spacing)
Was there a link there? I guess i need to read up!😬