You don't need to be an 'investor' to invest in Singletrack: 6 days left: 95% of target - Find out more
...in the UK at least. I've been using Extreme Blue for years but apparently it's no longer being imported (according to Merlin).
So I'm trying out Squirt. Any tips for use? Just how necessary is it to get the chain spotless before initial application?
Having been a squirt user for a few years my advice is use smoove instead. It lasts a good few more rides especially when in wet conditions.
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/reviews/smoove-lube-review
Agree, Smoove trumps Squirt.
Chain cleanliness matters a lot, especially for first application. Drip wax emulsions can often have issues with initial penetration.
Ideally, warm the lube, warm the chain.
Shift into largest sprocket, back pedal and apply to roller just before it gets to the top of the cassette. The chain angle helps pump the lube to the inside.
I'll bear that in mind once I've finished the two bottles of Squirt I bought yesterday...
Wonder if they are stopping importations because of this tariff thing?
For Squirt you need to get the chain absolutely spotless before the first application. It's easier to do with a brand new chain but you can still do it with a part-used chain. Best way is to degrease on the bike with something like citrus degreaser and a chain cleaner if you have one. Then take the chain off and soak overnight in white spirit. Rinse off then do two to three rinses in pure ethanol or isopropyl alcohol (whatever is easiest and cheapest to find in your local DIY shop). Chain needs to be completely dry after the last rinse so leave it somewhere warm.
Remount the chain on the bike, put the bike on your work stand or upside down and shift to the largest (easiest) cog on your cassette. Drip one drop of Squirt onto each chain roller just as it contacts the cassette tooth while backpedalling (Edit: like in @Onzadog 's video above). Supposedly this helps draw the lube into the roller. Do one drop for each roller then backpedal a few times. For the first application only, leave for 5 mins then repeat above. After this, wipe any excess from the outside of the chain only and then leave the bike for 24 hours.
The above sounds like a faff but in my experience once done you never really need to clean the chain again unless riding in really filthy clay mud.
Worth a nod to the likes of inaspin.co.uk who will sell you a pre-cleaned chain if you're too lazy (like me) or mess-phobic to clean it yourself.
As much as I like Smoove, you need to be careful not to put too much on, else you get 'build up' on jockey wheels etc.
Who stocks it these days anyway, I thought the UK importer/distributor packed up?
Wonder if they are stopping importations because of this tariff thing?
The guy at the shop implied the UK distributor had gone bust.
Gawd, this stuff sounds like a ball ache compared to R&R Blue.
I've gone from RnR to Peatys which is far less faff than the likes of Smoove and seems to hold up OK.
All chain lubes will benefit from going into a clean chain. They all claim special secret ingredients that bond to the surface metal to reduce wear. How can that work when the new lube is floating on a layer of grease?
I wonder how much of it is left, I might buy four bottles of the stuff while I can as I much prefer RR blue for dry days. I've tried peatys stuff and it's okay I guess but far from a clean chain whereas rock n roll blue you can barely see it.
Smoove > Squirt IME but doesn't look like theres a UK importer. BikeInn stock it though.
Clean chain essential - I used to use white spirit, then Shitshifter, then a lot of water.
I've moved to hot wax but in the process ended up on a zerofrictioncycling rathole. Their recommendation for degreasing is CeramicSpeed UFO ( https://www.sigmasports.com/item/CeramicSpeed/UFO-Drivetrain-Cleaner-500ml/10PYU). Expensive, but amazing stuff. Shake a new chain in a jar/pot and you need very little and can reuse (you can also put it through a coffee filter to get grease/dirt out of it).
I'm using Silca Super Secret wax and they do a compatible drip lube thats almost certainly better than either Smoove or Squirt but is also expensive https://www.condorcycles.com/products/silca-super-secret-chain-lube?.
Lastly, cleaning Smoove off was difficult - their own cleaner worked better than anything else. (though I wonder whether like hot wax the cheapest way is actually to take the chain off and use boiling water. I'm doing pan on camping stove. makes a mess of the pan thougH)
Oh no! R&R has been my go to lube for years.
Easy to use and chain etc stayed very clean.
Is there anything else similar out there?
Nothing else to add but noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.
Well, there is still some R&R to be had ... I've just ordered this:
EDIT - no idea why it won't copy the link. But search Amazon. 480ml for £38.
R&Rubbish... whats a good alternative?
Well, there is still some R&R to be had
search Amazon. 480ml for £38
That's either profiteering or postage from the US; they're the big bottles Merlin were knocking out for £16.
Well, there is still some R&R to be had
search Amazon. 480ml for £38
That's either profiteering or postage from the US; they're the big bottles Merlin were knocking out for £16.
Oh, absolutely - but since Merlin don't have them in stock ... 🤷
https://www.merlincycles.com/fenwicks-professional-bike-chain-lube-57339.html
Been using this for a while now, no regrets but it does have a strong smell when first applied
Ah balls. Back to white lightning epic ride then
I used R&R Blue for a while but stopped as I felt it last long enough. Switched to Juice Lubes all conditions. Similar to R&R but lasts longer. Doesn't run quite as clean but I can live with that for the extra longevity.
I’m getting good results from Juice Lubes ceramic stuff. Chain is lovely and quiet.
I might try running one of those Juice lubes on the MTB alongside Squirt on the monstercross and see which one works best for me in terms of cost and performance.
Been using this for a while now, no regrets but it does have a strong smell when first applied
I've always got a bottle of Fenwick's Professional on the go as a sort of 'best of the rest' for applications when I don't want to hot wax. It really is pretty good although I still haven't learned to trust durability, I think once it has built up I might trust it for bigger/wetter days e.g. 100km+ winter gravel days. A bit dirty but not bad as a sort of hybrid wet lube/wax.
Synergetic is the obvious alternative but I was disappointed with how mucky it got if you WEREN'T riding in the wet and mud, it seems like it rejects a lot of excess from inside the rollers in the first 10km or so of riding which then picks up dust and grit and goes all horrible and manky unless it gets stripped off by rain and mud. It's like you have to take a rag with you on the first ride after an application to continually wipe the chain down. No thanks.
Ironically in winter if you apply Synergetic then DO ride in the wet and the mud, all the manky excess stuff gets stripped off for you and you end up with a very clean, quiet and well lubed (internally) chain that lasts for the duration of bigger days out.
I accidently tried Bike Medicine Purple Extreme once and it turned into my favourite chain lube immediately. Don't think I've ever cleaned my MTB chain and it looks brand new still 5 years (and not as many miles as there should have been) later.
I've tried smoove, it's ok, but it does build up and make a mess on the floor, purple extreme cleans your chain as you apply it, at least in the dry.
Purple extreme is my default choice of lube and I was super happy to learn it's now being imported again by the folk at 18 bikes . Not cheap but a little goes a very long way and the bottle lasts for absolutely ages. Apply at least the night before a ride and wipe off the excess. Give the chain another wipe before your first ride post lube and it's super clean and long lasting. I've never bothered with faffy chain cleaning processes pre lubing either, beyond a dishwashing sponge and fairy liquid and a quick rinse.
https://www.18bikes.co.uk/bike-medicine-purple-extreme-chain-lube-120ml.html
Hot wax is the best solution I’ve found; no need to clean the chain just effectively boil it in wax at 180 in a DFF for 10 mins to clean the crud off, then drop the temp to 130 for 10mins to thicken the wax so it stays in the rollers better. Quick wipe with a towel when it comes out to clean the outside of the chain
But I agree with the above posts re Purple Extreme- that’s the best bottle lube I’ve found
Purple was great until it was wet out....Not used for 15 years or so! Their Golden degreaser was pretty decent too though.
Squirt bettered by Smoove? How so / why ? Squirt works well for me in the baking sun / dusty trails.
My big bottle just ran out 😕.
I also have used synergetic and found it goes black/gacky and leaves a mess on the chain so gave up with it. the purple stuff above is out of stock so I'll give smoove a go.
I think I'll end up ponying up for the US shipping though and buying another bottle of R&R blue
As much as I like Smoove, you need to be careful not to put too much on, else you get 'build up' on jockey wheels etc.
You're not kidding and is why I gave up with Smoove. I never cracked the balance between being confident I had put enough on the chain and gunk all over the jockey wheels, chain and chainring. The gang was then on,y noticeable when I went out for a ride 🙄
I've actually been happy enough with Squirt on both the MTB and monstercross since I started this thread - but an almost unprecedented spell of dry weather hasn't been exactly the most exacting test. Judgement reserved until we hit consistent rain and mud.
Putoline, obvs
Or another wax solution of your choice.
Honestly!!!
My homebrew wax is absolutely cheap as chips, lasts ages, and way less faff overall.
Ignore all the overlay faffy threads on here.it doesn't need to be a pain in the arse it's dead easy!!!
Honestly!!!
My homebrew wax is absolutely cheap as chips, lasts ages, and way less faff overall.
I think it's the initial investment and learning I can't quite be bothered with - multiple chains etc etc. I've a ordered a bottle of squirt and will see how I get on with it. Might try wax when I replace my cassette/chain in the near future.
The only downsides of waxing chains that I can think of, really, are 1. space to store the deep fat fryer 2. You need somewhere you can make a bit of a mess (e.g. hot wax drips - I just cover my workbench with a bit of cardboard) and 3. You need somewhere to hang the chains up to cool off/store
That's it.
No other downsides IMHO
Eve ln the initial outlay is going to cost you less than a couple of big bottles of lube, and aside from that you're going to save money, particularly if you go the homebrew route.
Drivetrains last *ages*
I think it's the initial investment and learning I can't quite be bothered with - multiple chains etc etc. I've a ordered a bottle of squirt and will see how I get on with it. Might try wax when I replace my cassette/chain in the near future.
That's fair, I'm still learning to be honest. Multiple chains not necessary unless you're doing back-to-back huge days and need a freshly waxed chain each day. Silca recommend their super-secret blend as a top up for back-to-back days but I've yet to really trust it for long days in wet conditions.
- Would suggest a slow cooker rather than a deep fat fryer, deep fat friers heat up too fast apparently, you want a nice gently controlled heat.
- If you're replacing a chain anyway, buy one pre-cleaned from the likes of inaspin.co.uk. Saves messing about with jars of white spirit etc.
- I've watched a few Silca videos on the subject and they suggest using 1/3rd bottle Silca Synergetic in your wax pot for better wet weather performance (i.e. durability). I've tried it and although I've yet to see a drop of rain, the drivetrain performed flawlessly otherwise, smooth, quiet and lasted 160km on the first application (I never trust first applications but had no choice). My pot is now 1 bag Silca hot wax, 1 endurance chip, 1/3rd bottle Synergetic.
Anyway, this is isn't a hot wax thread but just thought I'd share that.
The only downsides of waxing chains that I can think of, really, are 1. space to store the deep fat fryer 2. You need somewhere you can make a bit of a mess (e.g. hot wax drips - I just cover my workbench with a bit of cardboard) and 3. You need somewhere to hang the chains up to cool off/store
That's it.
No other downsides IMHO
Eve ln the initial outlay is going to cost you less than a couple of big bottles of lube, and aside from that you're going to save money, particularly if you go the homebrew route.
Drivetrains last *ages*
Sorry thought of one other downside. Sort of.
4. The tendancy of people to overcomplicate it which just makes it look difficult, faffy and a high barrier to entry when it really doesn't have to be
It's not witchcraft.
It's supposed to be easy and in fact it is unless you overcomplicate it needlessly
Degrease the chain as best you can with some white spirit or whatever.
You don't need to go mad with ultrasonic cleaners or 3 step processes or specially stripped chains or whatever. Any lube you don't get off will come off eventually once you've processed it a few times and it won't knacker the wax
Heat up your wax and dump the chain in the wax. Give it a swirl.
Take chain out of wax, allow to cool a little then wipe down with a rag.
Fit to bike
Done
So far I've done 1000km on half a 120ml bottle of Squirt, albeit over the dry conditions this summer.
I see KMC are selling pre-waxed chains, plus top-up wax. Has anyone tried these?
https://www.merlincycles.com/kmc-x11el-pre-waxed-chain-11-speed-326494.html
https://www.merlincycles.com/kmc-go-chain-wax-321076.html
I started using Putoline and some of the other downsides are the general grime that comes from it, my old shiny silver cassette got a coating of black wax, plus get it on your clothes and it doesn't really come out which is easy done when lifting bike over stiles, or loading into the car etc. I still use it on my commuter as I find it less of an issue on there and it does last for ages.
I'm now using dumonde tech pro x chain lube on the mountain bikes as I find it's very clean and lasts ages.