[Closed] Refused water by mountain rescue

Wonder if they had any, or true to their word, saved it all for the runners

They had about 40 full cups and at least 12 bottles for the remaining runners a that petered out as we descended. We waited for them so we didn't get in their way or them ours

I don't think you can argue too hard about this. Can't imagine they would have refused you if you'd been suffering from dehydration. As it was you'd taken enough water for your ride.

I'm sure there were quite a few people not in the event who might have fancied a cup of water.

I’m sure there were quite a few people not in the event who might have fancied a cup of water.

They'd have been disapoìnted too

I don’t think you can argue too hard about this

Yup. I'd have done exactly the same in those guy's position. In the op's position I'd either not have asked or not taken the hump on refusal.

Not so much 'refused help' , more 'refused a cup of water that you didn't actually need'

How does the title relate to the story?

Surely you're trolling with that thread title?

Edit: changing it from help to water really doesn't make it that much better!

Not exactly 'refused help' by Mountain Rescue were you!?

Edit: Too slow, my drink evaporated in the time it took me to write the post

You asked for something you didn't need, you never got it and it didn't spoil your day.

Ok then.

I should change the title from help to water as we didn’t need help.

⬆️

And the prize for stupidest thread of the week goes to...

You weren't refused help. The thread title is a bit out of order.

Should have done a bear grylls on them RD, right there and then at the top of the mountain, naked of course, apart from your beard and helmet.

Seems to me that it was your problem not theirs.

Maybe if you'd have offered to give a donation to MR first they might have offer you some.

Either way they though you weren't going to die or they'd have been asking you if you "needed" water.

What’s the point of this post,

I met a mountain rescue team, medic and doctor a few weeks ago, they were excellent, and got my friend of a hillside,

all in good spirits and not judgemental they understand why people hike or mountain bike in remote places

all giving up their own time to ensure we are safe..

Wow.  What a dork.

They carried the water all the way up a hill for a specific purpose and you slag them off online because you didn't get a cup?

Entitled much?

Come on RD, suck it up and admit you were either trolling or got this one wrong. We'll think better of you if you do.

You weren’t refused help. The thread title is a bit out of order

Which is why I posted above

MR are all volunteers who give up their time and expertise, to help others in distress, they probably see a lot of poorly equipped casualties and some who dont bring enough liquids, then a cyclist turns up asking for a free drink, a cyclist in a group who should have had enough fluids between them.

Donation to mountain rescue would probably be a good idea !

Stranger walks up to man in pub/shop and asks for glass of water and is refused, same here. They can alL say no.

Click bait

I should change the title from help to water as we didn’t need help.

Or Cheeky Bugger gets told to do one!!

Which is why I posted above

So why didn't you write that in the first place as that is what actually happened?

Stranger walks up to man in pub/shop and asks for glass of water and is refused, same here. They can alL say no.

A licensed premises has to provide water on request so you're a bit wrong there project.

Nowhere near the level of wrongness as the OP's thread

Woo tough crowd.

Woo tough crowd.

Yeah imagine having a thread title bagging the shit out of a volunteer group who save lives while risking their own. Who give up their time free of charge and were probably giving up their time that day to do something and raise some funds at the same time.

Yeah tough crowd!!

Seems a bit tight not giving you a cup of water.

Has plenty water, asks for water, is refused as there is a need to supply water to those who may have none whilst working much harder than the requester.

Troll post no?

Yeah, really if they had been trying they would have counted every runner that passed and kept a constant water v runner total going, or alternatively they could have had several more mountain rescue volunteers posted down the track to advise on the remaining number of runners. This would have allowed them to give the water that they had been told to give to runner's to some cyclist's that would have liked a cup. Equally given the level of negotiation employed by the op, I cannot see how they weren't charmed into giving him the lot.

Maybe the poor judgement shown in the OP is as a result of dehydration blurring his senses and he is actually correct in that he needed help.

Personally, and this is just me, but if I was going out on a substantial ride in big hills, I'd have taken enough water with me. Just sayin.

Seems a bit tight not giving you a cup of water.

Drac in posting against the run of the thread (and common sense) shocker.

Whilst I agree that expecting to Get some water from them was a bit of a stretch, I also find it hard to believe that they took only enough water to share it out evenly to the amount of runners participating in the event.  So not giving some didn't really serve a purpose either.

Also is MR doing this free?  I didn't realise you could run and event and get them to do this kind something. Is that a normal thing, just out of jnterest.

Also is MR doing this free?  I didn’t realise you could run and event and get them to do this kind something. Is that a normal thing, just out of jnterest.

Some will do it as fundraising, to run an event like that you would need medical and evac coverage probably. They have the skills to do it and it helps fund them the individuals may not be being paid but they are being funded.

I also find it hard to believe that they took only enough water to share it out evenly to the amount of runners participating in the event.  So not giving some didn’t really serve a purpose either.

Apart from the simple if one asks they all ask. If you needed water or were in distress I guess they would have assisted. Nut that wasn't the case was it.

Also is MR doing this free?  I didn’t realise you could run and event and get them to do this kind something. Is that a normal thing, just out of jnterest.

The team will probably be getting a donation from the event organisers for providing safety cover. Individual members wont be getting paid.

Drac in posting against the run of the thread (and common sense) shocker.

Nope just think one cup of water is really nothing at all.

I also find it hard to believe that they took only enough water to share it out evenly to the amount of runners participating in the event.  So not giving some didn’t really serve a purpose either.

Be a bummer if they split one.

Nope just think one cup of water is really nothing at all.

Freeloader.

Damn right.

MR team asked me yesterday if they could get some equipment off me as they’d had used some of theirs about £350 worth out of my budget. Did I tell them no this only for our patients or did I say yeah help yourself?

MR team asked me yesterday...

Sounds like a totally different scenario from the op's and therefore totally irrelevant.

“we were not out of water or in difficulty“

I mean, WTAF?!!

So you gave away resources paid for by taxpayers? Does your work know you are embezzlling?

Does my work know? Of course they know I helped them.

MR team asked me yesterday if they could get some equipment off me as they’d had used some of theirs about £350 worth out of my budget. Did I tell them no this only for our patients or did I say yeah help yourself?

Not sure Drac, after some of the snotty replies you post on here. 😉 🙂 😉

Hahaha!

Is that fact that they’re mountain rescue even relevant?  Round here we have a principle of looking after each other in the mountains, if someone asked me for water I’d share it without thought.

Just seems like a slightly petty attitude from the two water boys with their high quality h2o

if someone asked me for water I’d share it without thought.

Even if they had plenty and yours was being saved for something specific?

Is that fact that they’re mountain rescue even relevant?

It is of your slagging them off for calling you out as a cheeky bugger.

They carried water to the top of a hill for a specific event, and then some cheeky sod comes along with no link to the event and thinks he is entitled to some of that water 🙄

Next Time plan your rides so you have enough water. Or engage brain.

They're called Mountain Rescue, not Mountain Café.

Well and truly click baited there

as posted above (i know no one reads the whole thread before posting) i should have replaced "help" with "water" but was too late to get the edit in.

thinking about it over night, yes i was probably expecting too much for them to spare two mouthfuls of water but they also never asked at any point why i needed it, if i felt any dehydration symptoms, how far i'd come, how far i was going. maybe they can assess people just by looking at them.

i probably would have been happy if they had said

"are you feeling ok, it's only 20  mins downhill to the next town where you can get a drink if you need it ya big jesse, we might need all this water for a struggling runner"

which would have been fair enough and i've had said "yea, we under estimated the weather, forecast was for cooler and as it was Wales frankly we were expecting rain at some point but fair enough we'll carry on cheers" or similar

or maybe they were just two blokes given a mountain rescue jumper to wear so runners would recognise them and they had no mountain rescue experience?

anyway i'll put it down to experience. to those saying i need to donate to mountain rescue i shall continue my donation to both them and the air ambulance. cheers

The water marshal had seen a cyclist go through a red light that morning and you paid the (high!) price. 😆

anyway i’ll put it down to experience. to those saying i need to donate to mountain rescue i shall continue my donation to both them and the air ambulance. cheers

Well if you had told them you had paid already..... 😉

Interesting thread this, obviously with only one sides perspective.

I'll offer my MR team member perspective (not from the same team).

Every member of our team is a walker/runner/biker general outdoorsy person. Helping people out in the hills is second nature, not just to MR but anyone who enjoys hill culture. It is therefore surprising that they said no. I struggle to think of circumstances where I or any of my colleagues would turn someone down. I therefore suspect one of three things happened:

1. They genuinely didn't have enough water to share unless they thought you were in bother or risked getting in bother. Hot weather, runners drinking more than they planned and perhaps had to move on to another checkpoint later.  Priority needed to be runners and anyone else on the hill who needed help (rather than just restocking)

2. You are either a dick or came across as a bit of a dick (we still help people out when they are dicks, but generally only if they actually need help)

3. The team member was being a dick. MR teams are representative of society including occasional dicks. I admire everyone for defending the MR volunteers, thanks for doing so but it is okay to think this!

Anyway, you didn't die, you didn't get dehydrated and no baby robins were squashed so the world is all okay.

For those asking about funding, our team asks for donations for larger corporate type events, this money helps keep the team running throughout the year. If MR didn't do it the event organiser would need to pay another provider. They are generally happy to pay us as we are cheaper and know the area better. For us it is a good training opportunity, we get the vehicles out in the hills, do plenty of first aid (especially for biking events) and we are seen out and about. Team members never get paid, only the team itself.

I don't really get why you wouldn't share water.  I suppose it is very dependent on context, but as a general rule I'd share if someone asked me.  The way RD describes it makes it sound as though he made a polite request rather than a demand, and it's hard to think of the former getting anyone's back up.

I guess if the MR staff didn't know the current state of the fell-race they're supporting, it could be genuinely the case that they were expecting a huge throughput of runners in need of hydration.  In which case it's perhaps reasonable to keep the water for those runners rather than helping out the cyclist who does have some water to be going on with.

Even so, MR are in the business of helping out folks who come unstuck in the hills, and I'm sure prevention is better/cheaper than the cure in such situations.  A cup of water might not stave off dehydration, but possibly it'd be enough to stop someone making a bad decision which lead to more serious consequences.

2. You are either a dick or came across as a bit of a dick (we still help people out when they are dicks, but generally only if they actually need help)

I'm going with this and the OP's posting confirms it.

I must have been 40mins or more ahead of you. The MR rescue were just setting up when I passed and I met the runners coming up the North side. At no point did it occour to me to ask for something I didn't need.

I'd guess the MR team at the water station had no real idea how many runners were still to come through or how much water they'd need. I've done sportive's, MTB marathons were the feed stations have run out by the time the back markers have arrived.

i know no one reads the whole thread before posting

I've made an exception for this thread. I suspect it's going to become one of the classics so I aim to keep up to date with every thrust and parry.

I must have been 40mins or more ahead of you

We are way slower than that.

D

2. You are either a dick or came across as a bit of a dick (we still help people out when they are dicks, but generally only if they actually need help)

I’m going with this and the OP’s posting confirms it.

If "can I have a cup of water" makes me a dick then yes I am. Not sure it's the worst thing that's ever been said to anyone but hey, some people must have different levels of "dickness"

or came across as a bit of a dick

Just this really. Your probably an OK guy, it's just the inappropriate water request and then moaning about the refusal online.

But at the end of the day like me you had a good ride, that's what counts, all this is just a bit of banter that if your honest you probably deserve 😉

I've amended the title.

I also find it hard to believe that they took only enough water to share it out evenly to the amount of runners participating in the event.  So not giving some didn’t really serve a purpose either.

Given the amount the OP mentions being left and OP's guess at the runners still to come I'm going to go with: MR took plenty, the runners didn't, the weather turned out warmer than the runners expected, many of the runners took several drinks instead of one so MR were running short.

2. You are either a dick or came across as a bit of a dick

3. The team member was being a dick

And following from that: MR guy thought its obvious we're running short because we've gone through loads more than expected so OP came across badly for even asking.

OP thought MR were being dicks as he thought they had loads left and lacking any explanation it just looked like pettiness.

Having just read the thread, my thinking is this was probably policy.  They've instructed people who are presumably volunteers not to give out water to people not taking part in the event.  This seems sensible to me - it may well be "only" one cup of water to the OP, but then someone else sees them giving it out and asks as well, and so on.  Once they've given to one person there could well be a hundred spectators queuing up and they can no longer say no.

A licensed premises has to provide water on request so you’re a bit wrong there project.

Not quite true - this only applies to paying customers, you can't just rock up to a pub and drink free water all night.

Well if they are marshaling or running a water station for a organised event I'm not supprised they told you no.

If you were bonking and dehydrated and about to collapse I'm sure the response would be more accomodating, but it doesn't sound like that was the case.

I think its the MR who were being dicks. Next time i'm stranded on a mountainside i'm gonna call crimestoppers instead. that'll teach 'em!

I see half the title has changed.

Now if it could be finished off.

Refused water by feedzone of event I was not entered in whilst not in danger of dehydration

After all if it was beer they were handing out would you still expect to be given a cup ?

Isn't the biggest crime in this whole saga that it actually made it into a thread?

I find myself surprised that MR wouldn't give out a cup of water but I also know that if I'd been in the OP's situation myself I would've said 'ah, ok, no worries' and thought nothing more of it.. . .ever.

The fact that anyone harbors enough anger to finish the ride, return home and then start a thread about it just astounds me.

Are you new here?......

Sadly not...

One replied “we’ve got to supply 350 runners, there won’t be enough”

I'd imagine they had already been discussing this.... easy to get wrong and potentially those at the back are probably more in need than the first ones past.  Just as a basic calculation if they too enough for 300 runners + 50% and after less than half the time they only have the 50% left they were probably saying to each other ... loops.. what if we run out.  I doubt they were ticking off the numbers passing more dividing what they had up into equal time increments.

Replace "water" with "sandwich" and "mountain rescue" with "sportive feed station" and nobody would be surprised that they told you to do one.  Don't see any difference here really.  I'm sure if you were out of water and needed help to finish your ride or get to an alternative water source then they would have obliged.

If you're out on your own then you should be expected to carry everything you need (as you did), if you're taking part in an event then you might be relying upon resources at a feed station.

If you had enough water then why even bother asking for more?

MR member here (not that team) - I've read the whole thread. I'm torn.

Mostly what fransinatra said up there though, but...

1. I probably wouldn't have refused. If I had to refuse i'd like to think I'd have said why (but shit happens).

2. We run events like this to raise essential funds. I've manned feed/water stations where everything gets hoovered up by the first third of the runners stuffing their pockets, and I've had people not on the event sneaking food and drinks, and I've also had the misfortune to be manning a feed station that has run out of food/water. If you've got 400 runners they can get through a lot of water. Now that is horrible as it's either a massive ballache (eg an hour's off road drive) to restock from somewhere, or a pile of very unhappy (and underfed and watered) runners. Anyway - you can get very protective of what you have!

3. We provide safety cover to events like this to raise essential funds - but that tends to mean just that, not manning feed stations.

4. MR teams don't go out looking for customers. If you look like a grown up then it's assumed you can look after yourself. You have to look pretty bad to get unsolicited help to be honest 😉

And for Drac... our casualties end up as your patients! Sore point here as the local AS wanted to charge us a lot of money for medical gases to give to their patients, usually at their request 😉

And for Drac… our casualties end up as your patients!

Or discharged by us but yes you’re right and why we shouldn’t restock you I see no harm in giving a volunteer group some of our supplies. We’re both there to help the public and my budget can stretch to the very rare occasions we’re asked.

Or discharged by us but yes you’re right and why we shouldn’t restock you I see no harm in giving a volunteer group some of our supplies.

What that really needs is joined up thinking where MRT are funded for supplies from the NHS and the budget is allocated.

Absolutely - and I have to say no ambulance crew (or staff) has ever refused me supplies! It's people a long way from the front line that sometimes have other ideas - all sorted now, although we do sometimes find ourselves knocking on ambulance doors saying "Hey mister - can we have our entonox back" 😉

 although we do sometimes find ourselves knocking on ambulance doors saying “Hey mister – can we have our entonox back”

Don't ask them for water though!

TOPIC TANGET ALERT: Mike - it is difficult as the NHS is so strapped for cash. We get some expenses (fuel for team vehicles etc) from the police when they activate us, but not from the ambulance service. But again services in different regions, both police and ambulance, are different and have different demands on their budgets. Apart from those limited expenses from the police and very occasional restock from an ambulance (swapping a gas bottle, grabbing a collar), all the medical supplies we use are paid for through donations. Drugs and medical supplies (as they go out of date) are some of our biggest expenses.

And water, obviously 😉

Replace “water” with “sandwich” and “mountain rescue” with “sportive feed station” and nobody would be surprised that they told you to do one.  Don’t see any difference here really.

well, on the mountain there's less likely to be a Spar around the next corner.