[Closed] Redundant dropper?

Do you use a dropper on other bikes when just out riding - and find it beneficial?

If so, there is a good reason to keep it. XC courses are getting progressively more technical where it would be useful, especially if you are already familiar with the bike feel when dropped.

For what you'd get for it, and the fact it is wireless so can be switched in and out easily, unless you really need the funds I'd be inclined to keep it.

Flip side is if you really are convinced it will never be needed - as in you'd stop entering races if they became technical enough to warrant riding with one - or you need the pennies for something else, then get rid.

If it were a £4 or £5k bike it would be completely different but ultimately it's a £300 seat post so not really worth much deliberation.

XC courses are getting progressively more technical

Yes, they are.

I've been using dropper posts since the original GravityDropper came out nearly 20 years ago. Once you get used to them, it's second nature and you find you really miss them when you don't have them. I would suggest spending a month or two riding trails with steep, rough descents and dropping the saddle on every descent and raising it on every pedaling section so that you get used to it. Then, after a couple of months, try riding the same descent with your saddle up high. If you can ride rough stuff just as fast without the dropper, then you don't need it. If not, then you should keep it.

No idea whether you need one to race

But as above if you are gong to use it use it all the time. I'm really only a gear onto a dropper but I'm really sold now. Leading the button will, with practice, need no more thought than gear selection

For what you’d get for it, and the fact it is wireless so can be switched in and out easily, unless you really need the funds I’d be inclined to keep it.

This is a good point, I won't get one cheaper again.

if you are gong to use it use it all the time.

I'm not, and as its adding weight to my setup it therefore feels redundant hence the question.

World Cup XC courses might be getting more technical, but are courses in the UK? If they are not, which I suspect is the case, then you need to have one is not going to increase over time.

I’m not, and as its adding weight to my setup it therefore feels redundant hence the question.

Once you get used to using it properly, you’ll be faster over a lap, despite the extra weight.

Once you get used to using it properly, you’ll be faster over a lap, despite the extra weight.

I'd genuinely be fascinated to learn how I could be faster at your typical Gorrick course with a dropper than without.

You've been competitive off road cycling for a while, but I'm not sure how long exactly.

Did you switch from a hardtail to a full suss at some point, what were your thoughts then? That would have been a simialar weight gain for a techinical improvment.

26 to 29? better rollover, but more weight and slower acceleration

v-brakes?

But certainly, I would say that the current situation is the worst of both worlds, you are carrying the weight around, but still riding with the "classical" arse up technique, only remembering to use the dropper for a particularly big feature and therefore not utilising its benefits elsewhere.

I'm only riding XC recreationally, not racing, but my locals are the woods and courses often used in the Gorrick series (crowthorne, minley etc). I use the dropper more than the gears. Every rooty section, off camber corner etc the seat is down and I am carrying far more speed than I could otherwise.

You don't think you may as well get rid of your gears because of all the extra weight do you?

Use it all the time, get used to using it and keep using it, it will become second nature, like changing gear.

Dropper doesn't need to be only slammed or full, it is variable, it's not just about needing it for technical features, it means you can get away with less compromises.

You'll probably find that on the rougher pedaling terrain you find your quicker with a small amount of drop  maybe only 1/2" as it opened the possibility to allow the bike to move a little and gain speed from the terrain.  You'll be able to generate more grip in the corner, therefore you'll be able to hold more speed and brake less.

I’d genuinely be fascinated to learn how I could be faster at your typical Gorrick course with a dropper than without.

On rougher terrain, you'll be faster with a dropper. On really smooth stuff, it won't make much difference. The only way to know is to try it on different trails and find out what works for you. Also, it'll depend on the level you're racing at. I used to do some XC races for fun back in the day. A lot of riders are decently fit, but terrible at descending. Having a dropper post made it much easier to get past them on descents, especially when it was slippery.

Using it a single time on a single trail isn't a useful indication. You need to use it enough that it become second nature.

Using it a single time on a single trail isn’t a useful indication. You need to use it enough that it become second nature.

Use it all the time, get used to using it and keep using it, it will become second nature, like changing gear.

In reflection of the last few posts above this seems to be the issue. I've a long Surrey Hills ride this Sunday and several long weekend forest single track rides before a mid September Gorrick so I'll slam the Vyron on and get practising with a view to using it for that race.

Thanks for all the advice!

Droppers are good but very flawed:

1. Too heavy.
2. Needlessly complex - hydraulics on a post that has to do one job that’s go up & down a bit? Come on! Surely a spring loaded mechanism is a more applicable solution..
3. Unreliable.
4. Expensive to service.

Fox have bought out the Transer SL which is an almost acceptable weight but it’s still cable operated & can’t be easily swapped between bikes. When a wireless, lightweight dropper comes out they can have my money. Till then on my trail bike it’s a seatpost qr & my xc bike I don’t bother.

I know it’s not the answer to your question Kryton, just my 2c FWIW..

For local XC riding where I now live, in the South Downs, I found a dropper was more useful than suspension when riding my rigid bike

I've also now got a full sus but even on that, I use the dropper all the time - particularly for short little sections. Up, down, up, down.

I probably should have posted this in my original comment but, took it that whilst racing you know how hard you're riding and if power/speed doesn't reduce over obstacles then would you go any faster with a dropper?

Still, the comment was that I never really thought anything about droppers and was a very late adopter. I'm not into racing by any stretch and over the previous 20+ years I'd never felt the need to even lower my saddle to get over / down anything.

Then one day I decided to get a Reverb. Tried it in the bike at the time (SC superlight) and just didn't get on with it. The bike suddenly felt really loose and unstable with the post dropped. I was spending so much time and thought worrying about that, that the net effect was I was slower and less confident anywhere the post was down. It came off after one ride and was returned.

Happy with the fact I'd not wasted my money I carried on without one for another couple of years. Was then talking to somebody who pointed out to me that I used to hold the saddle between my thighs when stood up descending and things got tricky. Not all the time, but in the main I did and it was that feeling that was missing with a dropper, and probably the reason the bike felt odd with one.

Armed with this information I got myself another one and persisted with it. The bike soon felt stable and then like a BMX moving around all over the shop underneath me. I loved it and found more speed than ever before on downs and undulating terrain.

Relatively recently built up a rigid lightweight single speed with a rigid post. The bike flew everywhere but as soon as I attempted a rock step up thing - disaster. Normally I'd now use the dropper to get my seat out of the way so I could move around and have room to position the bike where I wanted it. I instinctively went to push the dropper lever that wasn't there, got walloped in the lower back by the saddle as the rear wheel came up onto the rock and promptly fell off!

So using one does become intuitive after a while and does make the average joe riding better.

Whether it makes you personally faster is another thing - that is what you need to establish but to get to that point will take quite a few rides before the analysis can be made.

 can’t be easily swapped between bikes

Why would you swap droppers between bikes? Do you swap forks or any other components between bikes regularly?

Do you do your own damper service? If so you will find they a dropper is just as easy. If you don't then why moan about complexity?

The old gravity droppers and some of the cheap droppers just use a pin that locates in a hole, maybe that is what your looking for in mechanical simplicity?

The weight argument against droppers is pretty poor when you consider the benefits to it. It's not like it's an extra Kg of tyre. Even my gravel bike had a dropper and I use it when riding on the road. If your don't find them of use then it's questionable that you actually need an MTB rather than a hybrid 😉

When a wireless, lightweight dropper comes out they can have my money.

Thing is, that smaller, 27.2mm diameter necessitated a complete redesign of the standard Reverb's hydraulic internals.
RockShox Reverb AXS XPLR. James Huang photo.
The XPLR dropper offers either 50mm or 75mm of drop and can also be turned into a suspension seat post with the push of a button.

And by "redesign," I mean they decided to not use any oil at all inside the XPLR dropper. Instead, there's an air-based system that can either lock the post into position or, at the push of a button, turn it into what RockShox is calling "ActiveRide" mode. I know it doesn't make it sound as cool, but I'm gonna call it a suspension seat post instead. Without any oil for the air to mix with, RockShox could skip using their Vent Valve system you'll find on the bottom of the mountain version.

RockShox XPLR Reverb AXS
There's no oil inside the XPLR dropper, just air.

Yes, I realize that suspension seat posts probably bring beach cruisers and hybrid bikes to mind, but they still do have a niche following with some hardtail riders. Being more comfortable is more better for a lot of people, but it can also give riders an advantage on choppy climbs where staying seated might be the difference between spinning out and being the only one in your group to clean it. The spring rate is adjusted via the same air valve that controls the return speed; more air means quicker rebound and a firmer suspension post, er, ActiveRide. And I know things can get a bit enduro-centric around here and we're spoiled with droppers that make your seat completely disappear, but there are plenty of places in the world where 75mm of stroke is more than enough.

The other possible upside: Thanks to its air-based internals, the 50mm version weighs 560-grams (with a battery), or about 100-grams lighter than the standard mountain bike Reverb and, according to James Huang over at the CyclingTips, 200-grams less than PNW's suspension/dropper post once the required cable and housing is put on the scale. That might not seem like many grams, but there are plenty of riders and racers out there who always want a lighter bike under them.

well they have lightened it (but added a ridiculous suspension feature)

Droppers are good but very flawed:

1. Too heavy.
2. Needlessly complex – hydraulics on a post that has to do one job that’s go up & down a bit? Come on! Surely a spring loaded mechanism is a more applicable solution..
3. Unreliable.
4. Expensive to service.

1. A dropper post will always be heavier than a normal post. The benefits are so overwhelming that they're worth the extra weight.
2. This is a fair criticism of Reverbs. I originally had GravityDroppers, then got a Reverb, then switched to Brand X. GravityDroppers have a spring. Brand X have a replaceable cartridge. The Brand X is much, much superior to the GD.
3. Reverbs have a bad reputation. Part of this is that you can't lift the bike up by the saddle with the seat lowered or you can suck air into the hydraulics. The other thing was that there is a circlip at the bottom that is not up to the job and fails. This is what happened to mine. Brand X posts seem to be very, very reliable.
4. This depends on the specific post. Reverbs are. I gather that Brand X aren't. Haven't needed to do any servicing yet.

Why would you swap droppers between bikes?

Save me the couple of hundred £ it would cost to have 2.

1. A dropper post will always be heavier than a normal post. The benefits are so overwhelming that they’re worth the extra weight.

In your humble opinion - but not in mine..

Do you do your own damper service? If so you will find they a dropper is just as easy. If you don’t then why moan about complexity?

Even the SRAM rep I spoke to last month thinks they are pointlessly over-engineer. It’s a dropper post not a suspension unit. A mechanical spring is more than capable of doing the job just as well at less weight & lower cost. (I also have no intention of learning how to service a hydraulic dropper nor pay for said service.)

Each to their own but they are still a flawed solution IMHO.

1. Too heavy.
2. Needlessly complex – hydraulics on a post that has to do one job that’s go up & down a bit? Come on! Surely a spring loaded mechanism is a more applicable solution..
3. Unreliable.
4. Expensive to service.

1. Negligible for somebody who weighs the best part of 100kg
2. Not complex at all (on a brand X) a cable pulls a pin that allows you to push it down. Opposite in reverse
3. Not had one (brand X) fail in thousands of miles across multiple posts and bikes
4. £10 for a service kit including brass keys and all seals. Can be done in 15 minutes max. If a new cartridge is needed then it's a massive £30 and involves 1 bolt.

Obviously the above refers to cable operated, some of the early reverbs were expensive and prone to failing but stuff has moved on a lot since then.

Needlessly complex – hydraulics on a post that has to do one job that’s go up & down a bit? Come on! Surely a spring loaded mechanism is a more applicable solution..

One thing to note here is that the hydraulic droppers use a pneumatic spring. The hydraulic system is needed to lock and release the post. This is much more effective than the mechanical system used on the old GravityDroppers, which used a magnet to retract a pin that fitted into a hole drilled into the inner post. The biggest drawback of the GD system was that it was basically only up or down (some had a middle position too, but trying to set it to that position while you were riding was tricky). To lower the GD, you had to unweight it, unlock it, sit on it, then release the lever to lock it down. To raise it, you had to weight it, unlock it, stand up, then release the lever to lock it. It became second nature, but you did have to get your timing right to make it work. A hydraulic lock is much easier because you can unlock it with your weight on it.

It might be possible to make a better mechanical lock than the GD, but the hydraulic cartridges for the generic posts are cheap and reliable and just seem to work really well. They might be terrible in theory, but that's outweighed by being pretty good in practice.

In theory a hydraulic dropper should be much less complicated than a spring based system.

Hydraulic fluid can’t be compressed so can be used as the supporting piece if there is no leak path.

Therefore, the lever opens a valve which allows an adjustable amount of fluid past over a given time - hence return speed.

Release lever, fluid is locked held again and post become solid. Air in the chamber underneath creates the spring needed to push the fluid back into the chamber if there is no mass on the saddle. If there is, saddle mass is greater than the air pressure so said air is compressed and post drops.

In theory this is the best system
For a dropper. No movement, no catch system needed to prevent a spring based system from dropping when sat on and not many moving parts. (Other than the post push tube and bearings/seals etc, although they are in all droppers by design)

The theory is sound, the practice maybe not so - hence all reverb problems.

Edit - sorry Kryton, this is taking your post OT a tad.

This is just like all the arguments when disk brakes replaced rim brakes. Too heavy, too complex, unnecessary, etc. Then there were the mechanical disk advocates who swore that hydraulics were too unreliable and difficult to service.

A couple of decades later, everyone's used to hydro disks and the whole argument just looks ridiculous. Yes, Shimano had QC problems with some calipers, but hydro brakes will generally run for years without needing anything more than pad replacement, just like car brakes. The weight thing is long forgotten - having brakes that work when it rains is well worth an extra few ounces of weight. Anyone who's used a dropper post for very long will tell you the same thing - once you get accustomed to them, there's no going back.

Interesting stuff - thanks guys. Certainly learning some stuff about the mechanical in & outs. 👍

The weight thing is long forgotten – having brakes that work when it rains is well worth an extra few ounces of weight. Anyone who’s used a dropper post for very long will tell you the same thing – once you get accustomed to them, there’s no going back.

Umm no.

I’ve run a dropper on & off since the original Crank Bros nigh on 15 yrs ago so I’ve had plenty of time to get to know their pros & cons. They’ve always struck me a compromise.

FWIW me & I’m a bit of a weight weenie xc wannabe so dislike extra weight if I don’t feel it’s really adding anything. I rode BC Bike Race back in 09 without one & then again with one in 17(?). I have to be honest & say I didn’t really need it. Humble brag (& my apologies)? Maybe - but my experience tells me a seat post qr is more than adequate for me.

Also to add I had an ethirteen post a few years back. That used a coil spring, and a pin with a series of holes to keep it at a given height.

It weighed more than the mk1 reverb it replaced.

I bought it for one reason - pin in hole fastening meant zero sag when sat on it - the plague of the early reverbs and infuriating to me personally. In hindsight, in all other ways it was inferior.

They’ve always struck me a compromise.

All engineering is a compromise.

Definitely keep - I've got one on my 'full' XC bike now after getting used to one general trail riding. It becomes second nature imo, and I was beginning to find the seat getting in the way on the pure XC bike.

It's not just for the steeps! For any cornering getting the saddle out of the way helps you move around the bike more easily. I find I either go faster, or relax and recover a bit on downhill-ish sections.

I suspect they work better with modern LLS(-ish on an XC bike) geometries - i.e. bikes where you're not throwing your arse back over the rear wheel, but as I say I find it helps me move around the bike more full stop which keeps things far more relaxed in the corners and downs.

I've used KS Lev-s for 7 yrs or so and (touch wood...) so far not had a problem, haven't even serviced them any more than a lower leg service equivalent to keep them moving.

Don’t get me wrong - I think the concept is a good one, but the execution is a tad flawed. If you’re happy with compromises then I understand how you’d think they were brilliant.

I’d genuinely be fascinated to learn how I could be faster at your typical Gorrick course with a dropper than without.

Droppers are like long-travel FS and many other things. You need to understand how to use it and what it gives you before you really get the benefits. Gorrick courses are (or were, haven't done one in a decade) very twisty. To ride these corners fast you need to be able to move your body around a lot. If you've never dropped your saddle, you won't be aware of the technique so you'll just do the same thing with a dropper as without a dropper, and you will wonder what the fuss is all about. But if you persist with a genuinely open mind (not just doing it because everyone says to do it even though you aren't going to change your mind) then you should be able to work out how to get the benefit. Then when you are able to get the benefits, you won't want to do without them.

Much like a sports car, your bike is much more manoeuvrable with the centre of mass lower. The CoM of you and the bike is pretty much in or near your torso. When you go from a left hand corner to a right hand corner on a twisty trail if you are sat in the saddle, this mass has to pendulum from side to side. Or, because your mass is larger than the bike you will end up running the bike wider left and right to get the angle and your body stays in the same place more or less. With your CoM lower, you don't need to move your CoM anywhere near as much, nor do you need to run the bike wider. On top of that, because the saddle's not there you can twist your body and get your hips right out to one side or the other, which allows much greater flexibility on where your mass is. This all adds up to a MUCH greater increase in speed on twisty singletrack. It's NOT all about going down steep stuff.

If you think it's only for steep stuff and you are leaving it up all the time, you will miss all of the above. If you are just riding around with one now, make yourself drop the post on twisty singltrack, even if it's flat, and move your body around a lot.

Look at this guy from an MBR instructional page. There's no way he could get his body in these positions if his saddle were up:

There are some slow-mo shots on the video on the page too:

https://www.mbr.co.uk/how-to-2/how-to-corner-347805

I rode without a dropper for decades, then I tried one out on my long travel bike, then my XC bike, now even my rigid adventure bike has one. Really, the benefits for twisty Gorrick style singletrack are huge, and the weight penalty is utterly insignificant. Mine is now always dropped for singletrack, and it only goes up for climbs and flat pedally bits.

Oh, and if you are an XC rider worried about hydraulics then the Specialized Command Post is for you. All mechanical, many positions, super easy to service (no bleeding or oil), can't leak or get soft, and they are the lighest around AFAIK. Short drop, but I have a 100mm model and all the above I wrote applies to my XC race bike with that post fitted as much as any other.

Oh yeah - AND you can move the bike up and down underneath you a lot more. This means you can pump things, but also means that if you get a big-ish obstacle like a rock or section of roots or some kind of step you can use your legs to soak it up much more, without having to slow down. This apples to flat XC stuff when racing as much as anything else.

AND you can position your bike a lot better in the air and plant the wheels down properly after jumps. This lets you go a hell of a lot faster if it's jumpy OR if you need to jump to clear rough stuff.

It really is a whole new chapter of skills you can use to make you a lot faster on XC race courses. I mean, I drop my saddle coming up to road corners and roundabouts when riding back from the trails as I can corner so much faster, even on road.

On the off chance it is going to be up for sale? What size is it? It might fit my 21 year old hardtail and I can then stop worrying about seriously bruised inner thighs...or it might fit my daughter's bike and I can revel in the wireless wizardry and have 1 less cable to maintain... assuming it'll be getting sold for peanuts (or for a race entry) as it is of no use to you.

Suspect once you start using it and get accustomed to the range of movement it provides you'll not be selling it and looking to use it more...but if it is going to be sold, I may be interested...

but if it is going to be sold, I may be interested…

I'm going to give it good tryout until the end of my season / September - I'll let you know then. Its a Vyron 31.6 FWIW.

Edit – sorry Kryton, this is taking your post OT a tad.

Blimey, don't worry about that, there's been some hugely useful posts about a variety of things. Every days a school day and its appreciated.

Cheers, let the engineering discussions continue then 😊

I've just been out on my bike. The dropper got used loads, even though it is just a local mediocre route. One of the best places I find to use it is a section of singletrack through woods. It goes down overall but has a lot of flat slightly off camber. Dropping the saddle on that allows for better positioning and allowing the tyres to grip, whilst keeping my bodyweight central to give some elephant like forces into the tyres.

Sounds like I'm a pro but 120KG and strava says otherwise - it's more to point out (as Hols says tbh) that droppers are not just for the downs.

I also use mine on the road sections between trails and give my legs and back a bit of a rest, not that that is important at all for racing.

I also use mine on the road sections between trails and give my legs and back a bit of a rest, not that that is important at all for racing.

What height are you using on the road? I rode it fully up on the road when pedalling - will drop it for corners and coasting downhill). But I am a former roadie, so very used to and comfortable in this position.

 can’t be easily swapped between bikes

Why would you swap droppers between bikes? Do you swap forks or any other components between bikes regularly?

I swap mine between bikes. Externally routed Thomson one. A doddle to swap as its external and I do it because the Thomsons are good but horribly expensive and I can't afford to have one on the Solaris and one on the Stinky, for the two minutes it takes to swap its just not worth buying another.
It isnone of the easiest parts to swap and one of the most expensive.
.
To come back to the OP, I have the dropper on the fun bikes as above, and use it a lot and really like it. But I don't have one on the XC race bike and never feel like I need one. I do race 24hrs though, maybe the 24hr courses are a bit less technical than those for shorter races. Just done 24/12 on the same course used for the NPS or whatever it's called nowadays and it was absolutely fine without. But that is a much easier course than the tracks at Yair, my local, where I use a dropper a lot!
Maybe lose it for most races to save weight but keep it in the bits box to put back on if you go somewhere harder, always nice to have the option

What height are you using on the road? I rode it fully up on the road when pedalling – will drop it for corners and coasting downhill). But I am a former roadie, so very used to and comfortable in this position.

@ayjaydoubleyou 31.743mm 😁

Not sure if I have confused the issue as I wasn't meaning road riding in general, just sauntering on the road on my mtb during or after a ride mainly off road. And then only if I feel the need to relax and sit back a bit. If I am pressing on, it will stay up for sure.

Don't think I'd have a dropper on a proper road bike tbh as I couldn't go fast enough round public roads to feel the need - not without taking all the road and potentially getting squashed anyway.

To come back to the OP... ... I don’t have one on the XC race bike and never feel like I need one. I do race 24hrs though, maybe the 24hr courses are a bit less technical than those for shorter races. Just done 24/12 on the same course used for the NPS or whatever it’s called nowadays and it was absolutely fine without. But that is a much easier course than the tracks at Yair, my local, where I use a dropper a lot!

Maybe lose it for most races to save weight but keep it in the bits box to put back on if you go somewhere harder, always nice to have the option

TBH this is me - I race 4-12hr races and my justification would be the same. I do have a Brand X on my play bike. As mentioned, I'll stick it on the race bike and use it for the next few long rides and the Gorrick September race and see how it goes.

Not sure if I have confused the issue as I wasn’t meaning road riding in general, just sauntering on the road on my mtb during or after a ride mainly off road. And then only if I feel the need to relax and sit back a bit. If I am pressing on, it will stay up for sure.

Yeah thats what I meant, the unavoidable, got to ride this thing on tarmac for a bit to link things up or get home.

If I'm turning the pedals on tarmac or fire road, hard or gently, I have the seat fully up, its by far the easiest/comfiest on my legs and body.

On the road bike I'd do this for hours at a time.

So these days I can still do it with no leg or back issues, but the taint is the limiting factor when in mtb kit.

Conversly pedalling with the seat down hurts my knees and back.

Just wondering if I'm the weirdo, or you are...

No one has mentioned a great thing about droppers - when you're broken and tired and need to get off or on the bike, a dropped saddle makes it so much easier!

The greatest inventions in the history of offroad cycling for all disiplines:

1) SPD pedals
2) Dropper Seatposts
3) Suspension that works

I'd put all those ahead of gears.

You need to re-learn how to ride with a dropper. If you aren't using it all the time you aren't going fast enough.

Bit more of a hi-jack...

But I was looking at the very seatpost you have Kryten, the Magura Vyron, and have seen some mixed reviews. Will be fascinated to see how you get on with it.

I really want an AXS Reverb, but seems that they are £700, if you can get one at all.

In the meantime, anyone else with experience of the Vyron specifically willing to recommend (or not)? £300ish seems a bit more palatable than the Reverb.

It's for my hardtail that won't take an internally routed dropper and I quite fancy wireless having gone AXS on the road bike.

But I was looking at the very seatpost you have Kryten, the Magura Vyron, and have seen some mixed reviews. Will be fascinated to see how you get on with it.

I have actually used it several times although not "properly" as per the above. Easy to swap, battery life as per specs, seems very sturdy and the issue with not holding the butting down to lower/raise seems to vanish in about 5 minutes of use. Happy to write more after my next month of use. Seems to be one of those "just get on with it" no fuss pieces of kit in my currently limited experience.

the issue with not holding the butting down to lower/raise seems to vanish in about 5 minutes of use

When I read that in the review initially I really did think was the writer just being Uber picky..

Thanks Kryton.

For the record, my dropper on the other bike is a Brand X, bought for £90. It has been flawless.

Thought I might trade up to wireless this time so the reassuring words on the Vyron are welcome.

For the record, my dropper on the other bike is a Brand X, bought for £90. It has been flawless.

Thought I might trade up to wireless this time so the reassuring words on the Vyron are welcome

My spare/play bike (Clockwork EVO 27.5) is also a Brand X, I just haven't been out on it much. If anything the Brand X is wobblier - although thats not very wobbly at all - than the Vyron by hand at the saddle. The main different between the two is the electronic and rather satisfying "Zoop!" of the Vyron motor.

The Brand X is about to get about 200 miles of a more educated use in Surrey / Thetford this week while my Spark is in the shop for a bearing overhaul. Perfect for me to try the advice given.

The Brand X is about to get about 200 miles of a more educated use in Surrey / Thetford this week

Enjoy!

I've been using Vyrons for 5-6 years and prefer it a LOT over any and every other dropper i've tried, i've tried most... but not AXS.

I'm the least 'rad' rider out there & a proper old giffer locked in an xc bubble, but I couldn't ride a bike without a dropper now.

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wzzzz
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The greatest inventions in the history of offroad cycling for all disiplines:

1) SPD pedals
2) Dropper Seatposts
3) Suspension that works

I’d change that a bit....

Disc brakes
Dropper posts
Disc brakes....

I had one of the original Vyrons and it was faultless over nearly 2 years. Ended up selling it because it didn't fit my next frame.

Took minutes to get used to the action and it honestly never bothered me.

I now have a Reverb AXS and that is like a step up! Reacts faster than a cable dropper and has been flawless so far.

Reacts faster than a cable dropper

I don't see how this could happen unless the cable dropper has a problem. You push the lever and the cable moves, there is zero lag.

Either this thread has triggered dropper post fans or(and) I’m on a different wavelength.

Full Suspension bike “normally” has a dropper and in “normal” use is very very good, but 100% (to me) not as good as disc brakes/effective suspension/geometry/gears. Never noticed it causing issues when working flat out.

There are definitely rides where it’s dead weight, even times I’d remove it. You’re mainly looking at rides in the Highlands that use estate/farm tracks.

The hard tail (bike packing type bike) normally has a rigid post. I do have a dropper for it, but rarely is it worth being installed, although there are definitely times where it’s an essential item.

There’s no ****ing way I’d place dropper posts as more important than gears, **** that shit. They’re awesome sure, but gears are a bigger deal.

(I’m going by off road cycling, and not MTBs in their modern form)

Mind you

1) SPD pedals
2) Dropper Seatposts
3) Suspension that works

1) Flats, even on my gravel bike now

2) Yeh, sometimes you that

3) Fully rigid in winter

🤷

When I read that in the review initially I really did think was the writer just being Uber picky..

It’s not, they are shyte. There is a reason why every review is the same.

I mean, if it was the only dropper in existence, I would put up with it, but it is by far and away the worst one I have used.

I don't think people that say a dropper is more needed than gears etc mean it quite so literally.

What is probably more correct is that when your bike is working as you would like in terms of what you want, a dropper is the next best thing to add over anything else.

For example, if I wanted a lightweight rigid singlespeed mtb and built one, it would be as I wanted. Then after riding it a bit, I was being held back and not quite feeling the ride.

Assuming everything else is working as intended and to how I expected, a dropper post could be deemed the 'best' thing I could add to give me the ride I wanted. Sure I could add 'better' brakes, crankset, bars - anything, but the dropper gives the most reward at that point.

This was exactly my situation as it happens and although I wanted to keep the bike light, direct and responsive, a dropper gave me more control and enhanced the rides far more than any other upgrades I could have made. Changing things like the frame or forks to more boing orientated could also be viewed as upgrades but, these fundamentally change what type of bike it is and still leave the rider wanting/needing the feeling and riding that a dropper post allows.

The fact that I ended up going to a front suspension 1x10 on that bike as well is a moot point but the dropper will now always be part of any mtb build I put together.

@thols2

With a cable you've always got a bit of slack and a certain distance that the lever has to pull the cable.

With the AXS, the button is depressed and the action is instant. It's not major and I doubt anyone would buy one just on that alone, but it's there.

Also depends on the routing of your frame too. I've had frames in the past that have had more "difficult" dropper routing than others, and that gets noticed at the lever.

Marginal gains. AXS does react faster. A button press that has probably 1mm of low force movement at most before the motor operates and the post is on its way down, as opposed to pressing a lever that needs to move significantly further with a much greater force (in comparison) to drop at the same rate.

A bit tongue in cheek tbh as I've not really found the AXS to be too much different to a regular reverb on my other bike. What is a fair bit better is the ability to inch it up or down and from fully down it snaps back up very quickly.

Then the flip side, being without it 10 weeks because the electronics packed up for no reason at all was a bit of a pain... doh.

With a cable you’ve always got a bit of slack and a certain distance that the lever has to pull the cable.

If you set it up and adjust it properly, this isn't a problem.

If you set it up and adjust it properly, this isn’t a problem.

Assuming perfect setup then, how far do you have to push the lever before the post actually drops, and with how much effort? If either of those is more than that of a mouse click, the AXS dropper is better. I’m not claiming it’s vital to have, but it is nicer, and I miss it when I don’t have it.

Never measured it, but I'm guessing mine are set up so they release when the lever is pushed about 5 mm. There is zero lag once the lever is pushed. I have no doubt that wireless droppers are very nice to use, but I also doubt that there would be any measurable difference in the time from hitting the lever or button and the post being fully depressed.

Owning them both (and a couple of cable ones), I'd say there is very much a measurable difference.
The AXS drops faster without a doubt.

However we're picking at straws as I've never been in a position where even the 'slowest' to drop post has been a problem.

Coming back up it is also a fair bit quicker and that does make a difference.

The biggest thing control wise (for me) is being able to flick the button and the saddle moves tiny amounts down.

Again, real world needs are different for all folk but I find this especially useful when going over loose or slightly aggro flat or even uphill sections.

Whether or not I'd miss it if I didn't have the AXS - again questionable, but I do and it's good.
Trying to get the same out of a non electric post is difficult as the system doesn't react as fast.

Really is nit picking and looking for an argument though.