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That's going to need quite a large crash pad below o)
Apparently it's for a ski jump event....
Well that is quite a suprise.
Looking forward to it even more now. Hopefully not cancelled due to weather this year!
Seems to be a considerable portion of the track missing!
What in the wide wide world of sports is that?
There is a landing too. They were a bit disingenuous with how they posted it, but even adjusted it still looks stupid!
Rampage canyon gaps go to mid Wales!
That's a pretty aggressive kick, considering you'll be going at a million miles an hour when you hit it
From memory of the site that's below the cliff drop so at least a third of the course will be different. Perhaps they've got fed up of people falling off near the top.
That’s a pretty aggressive kick, considering you’ll be going at a million miles an hour when you hit it
That was my first thought, admittedly I don't know the first thing about building jumps like that so I hope they've got it right.
At the Tasmania one they had Bernard kerr and a couple of other guys out beforehand to test everything but I don't know if that's the case here .
I don't know if it's because I'm getting old but looking at that makes me a bit uneasy. I love watching downhill racing but I'm not sure that's what i think should be in a course, hardline or any other race .
There are a few videos on instragram from Bernard and Matt Jones looking at the ramp down to the kicker. No jumps yet but it looks like getting enough speed won’t be a problem!
I’m looking forwards to watching it but I’m a bit gutted for the women who were probably hoping for the old course to finally clear all the features. It doesn’t look like there can be a ride-around line for this canyon jump so we might not get a full run by a woman. I hope I’m proved wrong though and they hit it - bus just seen that Lou Ferguson isn’t riding as her sponsors want her to focus on the WC races (which is the danger of having this mid-season).
Is it possible that the shape of that take off is to encourage tricks?
I’m pretty certain there will be a superman over that jump by the end of next weekend.
Loved the response from Mr. Gnarr himself on IG 🙈😆
I know that picture is distorted but is the kicker so severe because the landing is much higher than the takeoff? Could be a massive step up.
Doesn't matter to me I'll be watching on telly!
Well of course you can't just ride onto the thing, that'd be like a chicken line.
I like that it seems to be painted in some sort of grip paint but also it's all falling off up the steps they've had to build up the side everywhere it's been touched, that's a nice addition. You couldn't get me to <stand> on that thing. Barking.
It's a really long video but it had me smiling constantly, just really nicely done, informative but funny too, especially every time Gee's on camera "What's this called. Do you even know?" "Have you measured this?" "Yep" "With a tape?" "No". Definitely worth watching if you're going to watch any of the race I think.
It's a bit crazy that only after these guinea pig runs, they've then seemingly thought it's a good idea to put catch netting up!
That is wild, watch til the end………
I just hope no one gets a career limiting injury
I just hope no one gets a career limiting injury
Or dies. That's utterly mad. I'm surprised they can even run it as a legitimate event. 2 out of 3 almost miss the landing in that video.
@pothead those reels don't work for me through a browser - whose account are they on?
I've always defended events like this against the pearl clutchers but that even makes me clench my bumhole a bit.
Matt Jones had a go too.
Absolutely terrifying.
The 90 degree wooden feature further up looked insane as well although much lower consequence.
What do they think those blue pads are going to do, make it easier to collect the body?
“No broken bones, just a bump to the head……”
That’s a pretty aggressive kick, considering you’ll be going at a million miles an hour when you hit it
That was my first thought too.
I noticed in BK and Matt Jones videos that there's a guy from 'Monalith Curved Surface Specialists' there (he is holding the crash pad at the bottom of the ramp during some of the test run ins).
The have worked with red bull on some projects before, and they also build skate parks and BMX stuff, so I wonder if they've built that feature.
BMX and park ramps tend to have a tighter radius and kickier lips.
Matt Jones video just shows how close the last rider came to potentially being killed
I didn’t like the comment at the end of the vid where they said they are now going to put safety nets up. Maybe put the safety nets up first , and then remove them once all riders have cleared ? Rather than risk life changing injuries or death first .
Does just confirm it’s getting in to dangerous territory of being a spectacle of crashing being part of it or if there are safety nets that’s makes it a bit full to watch
BK ‘s crash last year must have attracted more views to the event than anything else. At least one rider has already helped on that front this year.
Also may as just cover the hillside in concrete berms and ski jumps from how it’s starting to look
Why hasn’t Brendan Fairclough been asked to test the gap jump, he’s clearly the king of gap jumps, does he sponsorship profile not fit with red bull ?
Fairclough is sponsored by Monster.
Interesting that 3 of them tried that gap but none tried the smaller one further back up the hill, Bernard Kerr did say on his vid that they wouldn't have enough speed to clear it so possibly more track changes before the race. It definitely needs a safety net below that scaffold jump though
I’m in two minds about this.
I used to ski a quite a bit.
Part of me thinks that mountain biking YouTube is going through the same thing that “extreme” skiing videos went through about 15 years ago, where athletes were pushing the boundaries to the point that some of the big names in the sport started dying.
However I’m also aware that when I was skiing off piste I was also skiing lines that could (and did) look unnecessarily risky to less experienced skiers, when in reality it wasn’t that dangerous for my skill level at the time. The same applies to mountain biking, I ride stuff now that when I started I would have thought unrideable. These guys are just riding at a different level to us mortals, so I suspect the danger may not be as bad as it seems.
Kramer - kind of agree. They are people at the peak of their sport and they enjoy pushing the limits.
However what was interesting was that these jumps don’t appear to have been designed/built by the riders, which imo makes a big difference.
G didn’t ride it, Matt said himself on camera that he’s got more in life now to worry about than just messing around on bikes.
BK still is a big kid so less to loose
Yes they should push the boundaries and I fully get why they want to, but when a company is making money from it , they should act as the grown up in the room.
There was a lady with the riders who appeared to be the safety advisor, which appeared to extend to don’t do anything silly until we have a paramedic . A paramedic can’t do much if you have already paralysed or killed yourself
Danny Way done something similar on a skateboard 18-20 years ago!
I feel more uncomfortable watching this, maybe because I’m 50 now. Stunt show now!
However what was interesting was that these jumps don’t appear to have been designed/built by the riders, which imo makes a big difference.
Massive difference imo. That Instagram video is even worse, does he start losing it on the launch because of the compression going into it?
Does appear that he let go of the bike as soon as he left the ramp, I imagine wasn’t ready for the compression or the kick?
When they first looked at it the landing was straight on to the scaffold, then when they jump it the landing has been extended by a good metre or more
mrdobermannFree Member
Danny Way done something similar on a skateboard 18-20 years ago!
(which was very cool, but...) Danny had that built exactly as he wanted it, for him to hit. These lads have essentially turned up at the track and been told "there you go, you need to do that if you want to ride the event". Quite a different prospect imo
Well all I can say is I hope the safety netting is up to the task. I can imagine the forces of someone hitting it from 30/40/50+ ft up at those kind of speeds is going to be pretty large. The scaffolding towers, presuming they’re going to fix it to them, look somewhat sketchy to me but I’m not a scaffolder.
Personally I think this is a step too far and there’s too much chance of something going seriously wrong with this one. Once you need netting and loads of pads all over the place it just seems a bit like a circus. Maybe that’s the point.
I did see a (seemingly educated) comment elsewhere that the wind load from a safety net would mean needing a far bigger structure than they have there. Suppose we'll see what changes through the week.
I don't see it being used as is. 3 hits; BK was very close to the left side of the landing, Matt was way off to the other side and I didn't get the impression it was intentional, Jimbo is now laid up with a decent concussion. Not a great proving session.
elsewhere that the wind load from a safety net would mean needing a far bigger structure than they have there
BK was veryclose to the left side of the landing, Matt was way off to the other side
I did think before they even went down it that the chances of a full run will be limited as the wind will effect that jump massively and in these vids it was flat calm. There is no plan B wind effected possibility with that track… unless they are now going to dismount and run along those planks
BK only just landed , another foot to the left would have been a big accident.
I imagine wasn’t ready for the compression or the kick?
I did find myself wondering what the compression forces were just prior to the ramp and then thinking about Bernard Kerr's last frame failure...
Wee bit more focus on H&S needed, I reckon.
I'm honestly not sure how helpful a net would be?
Also looking at it, someone lands in the net in a bad way, how the hell are they going to get to them and stabilise and evacuate them?
KramerFree Member
I’m honestly not sure how helpful a net would be?Also looking at it, someone lands in the net in a bad way, how the hell are they going to get to them and stabilise and evacuate them?
Very, if someone loses it in the compression and plops onto the net it's saving them a xxft fall to the ground.
An awkward landing on a springy net with tricky recovery is still far better than scooping remains from the floor
Whoever their liability insurer is, they must be looking at this with their head in their hands
An awkward landing on a springy net with tricky recovery is still far better than scooping remains from the floor
Are the nets springy?
They needn't bother with a net. Just stick a shark tank in the gap. #facetiousbuttruenonetheless
Looking back to when they had a surplus of jobless carpenters in Utah, I thought that things had changed for the better since they stopped adding the structures at Rampage. The Athertons obviously beg to differ.
It's getting a bit daft imo.
Lulz at this 😀
https://www.change.org/p/a-petition-for-gee-atherton-to-chill-out-already?utm_medium=custom_url&utm_source=share_petition&recruited_by_id=407796c0-e214-11e4-99c1-e9d83942eca5
I can’t watch that. Fine saying they are grown adults making a choice, but these top level Red Bull events make & sustain careers so there's a pressure on riders to participate that is close to exploitation.
If there was some obvious sense that Red Bull had put in a structure that looked after rider & course safety and post crash care I'd be able to watch it. Maybe Redbull do behind the scenes, but it feels like they don't want to talk about it, so it ends up appealing mostly to teenage boys and men hoping to see some gore.
There's a way of constantly increasing progression that doesn't involve scaring the living daylights out of skilled pros. F1, for all of it's faults, demonstrates how a sport can use danger as part of the appeal while still constantly talking about and improving safety.
If it emerges that it was a safely run event and there's some cool footage, I'll watch the highlights, but this years one has no appeal to me as a live sporting event.
There is no plan B wind effected possibility with that track… unless they are now going to dismount and run along those planks
Where they turn left and head to the first stream jump is just above the old (pre cliff drop) course so it'd be possible to re-join that. It'd not really matter though as there's still the 90 footers and the road gap.
Just seen those videos. It does make you wonder if someone at the more sane end of the self-preservation scale will just say, “nah, ‘ollocks to that”, and decline to compete. The risks there just seem stupid. If you come up slightly short you are straight into a timber knife edge.
I do wonder if they have already had some riders voting with their feet, just not entertaining it. Surely that feature is going to be heavily adapted for the actual event.
Turns out it may not actually give you wings shocker.
Hmm getting less and less natural each year.
Im actually disappointed
Agreed. The same can be said for a lot of the WC DH too. Motocross tracks without the loop and some gradient. It gets more a test of bottle than all round bike riding skill.
Cuz da Internet wants da big jumps and da big roosts in da cornaz innit.
It actually makes me not wildly bothered that the UCI has sold its soul to Discovery-ESO-WB with Messrs Ball and Cunningham.
If the Athertons get away with another event this year with no life-limiting injuries or fatalities, the ante will just get raised each year until there is one.
Ed Masters has it right "the Internet wants death".
Just seen those videos. It does make you wonder if someone at the more sane end of the self-preservation scale will just say, “nah, ‘ollocks to that”, and decline to compete.
It's no different to previous years in that respect then. The cliff drop was a big deal the first year along with the 90 footers 2 years ago. Multiple world cup riders have turned up for practice and declined to ride the full course or actually race it.
isn’t the reason BK and Co are there early is so that they can give feedback and change the features accordingly?
Yes, Matt Jones actually explains it in his latest video and says that BK’s ‘job this week’ is to test and check to see what is rideable and what needs to be changed. They didn’t go near the 90° hip over the stream higher up but said what would need to change.
I got the impression that BK, and maybe Jim Monro, are there to work and be paid. Jones just seemed to go along for a laugh - but he’ll also be getting massive hits on SM and YT so probably will be able to afford to eat this week 😉
I’d guess they’ll be back tomorrow and Wednesday to fettle some more.
It does make you wonder if someone at the more sane end of the self-preservation scale will just say, “nah, ‘ollocks to that”,
im sure plenty already so given the lack of top wish riders on the list. Bruni for example as clearly declined his sponsor invitation. I’m sure many others do too
$15k for the winner apparently according to pinkbike.. if that's accurate I don't think it's just reward for that risk
The line into the hip wasn't built on the last video that why it wasn't ridden.
I love the track, really making people sit up and notice.
Some right fannies on here worried about the danger element of an extreme sport.
Looks bloody amazing. WIll most definitely be watching!
The more I see of the track the more I'm looking forwards to being there on Sunday.
I really want as many riders as possible to have clean runs and hit all the big features. I do hope the canyon gets work to make sure the entry list can all clear it - currently looks like it sends them too high!
Racing should be about who in the field can do it the fastest, not who can survive the course.
Same reason the grand tour stages aren’t 400km & 10000m of climbing.
Building that with no regard to safety is asking for trouble, consenting pros or not.
Some right fannies on here worried about the danger element of an extreme sport.
Im all for people being able to do what they want and try and kill themselves how they want. I used to jump off cliffs skiing , jump over crevasses etc.
But all that wasn’t in the name of making other people rich, or trying to get mass social media and mainstream media coverage.
The danger with the way Redbull appears to be going with Ramoage and Hardline is that someone will die or have life changing injuries which gets this level of organised sport banned .
Idf you are going to do it ‘professionally’ like this is being done you have to take safety seriously
Anyhow didn’t headline start with the ethos getting a bike down the most challenging natural mountain, to now get your bike down the most challenging heap of scaffolding 😂
Some right fannies on here worried about the danger element of an extreme sport.
We want to see cool riding, we dont want to see those who have more ambition than ability, or are just plain unlucky, paralysed or killed.
The danger with the way Redbull appears to be going with Ramoage and Hardline is that someone will die or have life changing injuries which gets this level of organised sport banned .
The Isle of Man TT has fatal injuries pretty much every year as far as i know and I've never heard anyone say that should be banned
The Isle of Man TT has fatal injuries pretty much every year as far as i know and I’ve never heard anyone say that should be banned
loads of people have called for the TT to be banned. However they have done all they can realistically do with safety
Marshals have site of every section of the track, areas are heavily padded. There are qualified trauma doctors on site in various positions along with lots of paramedics. There is also dedicated helicopter support. So I would say they take safety a lot more seriously
I’m very much in the they are free thinking adults who can make their own decisions on what they want to do camp, no one is forcing them to do it. And equally no interest in the inevitable go fund me page if it does go wrong.
I don’t think red bull really care how many mountain bikers watch it live, it’s more of social media content gathering exercise
That (TT) course hasn’t changed in a century and is very much a known quantity, what’s made it dangerous is the speed the riders do it at as time has gone on
This is the course being changed to make it deliberately more dangerous.
Matt Jones is an absolulute gift to mountain biking- good enough to ride this mad stuff, but normal enough to be shit scared, I love seeing them arguing about who'll go first, walking round stuff etc, just like my lot on a normal ride except multiplied by a million. His Rampage video added a ton of value in the same way. I'd rather watch him working his way down than the winning run I reckon.
FunkyDunc
Free MemberI didn’t like the comment at the end of the vid where they said they are now going to put safety nets up. Maybe put the safety nets up first , and then remove them once all riders have cleared ? Rather than risk life changing injuries or death first .
I guess the important thing is that this is the test runs, the course isn't finished and there's literally no pressure, even Bernard Kerr who's job ultimately is to approve it and ride it, can say "no". Matt says partway through "I didn't know this was happening today" which fits too.
I guess the nets are going to be catch near the top, rather than big trapeze style full nets? Stop the fall early rather than try and save it at the bottom. If anything it's the awfulness of the landing that hit me- you can't come up short of course but you also can't go long, you go straight into unprepared hill, you've got to land and turn. And if you land to the left it's just a less awful cliff, to the right it's more unprepared hill. You obviously would choose to go long or right if it goes wrong but that's not how it works, you've got to get it <right> and getting it right means you've no choice but to be close to the big hazard.
The whole thing would feel a lot less iffy to me with a better landing, without really losing anything of the obvious peril. In that way it's comparable to the trailbuilding we do, a little double or rock feature can be an unacceptable risk but we often can fix that by taking out the fall hazards, brashing the trees and shifting rocks, improving sightlines etc, so that the failures are less bad.
thebunk
Full MemberI can’t watch that. Fine saying they are grown adults making a choice, but these top level Red Bull events make & sustain careers so there’s a pressure on riders to participate that is close to exploitation.
I'm always really relieved when someone just walks away. It's a sort of proof of concept, if everyone who was signed up rides it that leaves me a wee bit twitchy at this level.
But as long as it's standalone events I don't really see the pressure in that way, like rampage there's so few riders that actually <do> it that you can't really say anyone can feel they have to. There's a lot of riders these days that could do it and don't, it's just not that obvious because they're just not doing it. Yoann Barelli's inputs always welcome 😉
loads of people have called for the TT to be banned. However they have done all they can realistically do with safety
Marshals have site of every section of the track, areas are heavily padded. There are qualified trauma doctors on site in various positions along with lots of paramedics. There is also dedicated helicopter support. So I would say they take safety a lot more seriously
All of this may be true but people still die every year, everyone taking part knows the risks involved and are prepared to take those risks, the same applies here in my eyes. Plenty of the the top racers don't think it's worth the risk and don't turn up despite being sponsored by Redbull
Hard-line had always been a man made track with huge features dug, never just a natural ride down a mountain that's the whole punta
Same for rampage, man made lines where athletes go to have free choice not bound by overbearing international federations etc.