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Have to say, the paint job on that 2020 Ragley Big Wig Race looks mint.
Yes, I commented on the news item.
Seems a little expensive for a direct brand bike though
Yeah that is nice. First mountain bike in a while I've actually wanted to part with money for.
I was just thinking the same. They've done really well with the 2020 stuff.
It does look lovely and if I was in the market for a new bike I’d definitely be tempted.
Very pretty bikey.
Agree with the pricing comment though. Ragley seem ambitiously priced, much closer to Cotic than to On One.
Not sure if the quality of the frame will justify that though?
Look very nice indeed. We have/had 2xBluePigs amongst the cornucopia of steel hardtails in our garage and if I was looking at replacing my Chromag that would defo be on the list!
Nice looking bike. Bloody expensive for a hardtail though. Could do a similar build with any frame you like for that money.
Like the look of this but why do all have decent steel frames seem to start at £550 these days?
"Like the look of this but why do all have decent steel frames seem to start at £550 these days?"
Likely because it's easy to position yourself in the market for that price and also most of these frames are probably made at the same couple or so of factories for similar costs
Nice looking bike. Bloody expensive for a hardtail though. Could do a similar build with any frame you like for that money.
I demo'd a Cotic Soul last year which was very nice. The build would have cost me £3100 from Cotic - Helm fork, mid-range groupset, Hope brakes. It rode nicer than my £1k alu HT but not £2100 nicer..
Oh of course, I'm sure you could spec something much more expensive, but you'd have to live in a parallel dimension where people actually pay RRP for bike parts.
Thing with Ragley (and any CRC brand) is you kind-of expect them to be going for 50% off at some point.
Oh of course, I’m sure you could spec something much more expensive, but you’d have to live in a parallel dimension where people actually pay RRP for bike parts.
I agree - I was struggling to achieve the Cotic's price based on RRP never mind real world prices.
Yes, I commented on the news item.
Seems a little expensive for a direct brand bike though
Ragley is customer direct now? No dealers?
Does seem quite expensive for a bike kitted out with SLX. Nice fork, but over £2k seems a lot. Don’t Ragley have a decent warranty though?
Ragley seem ambitiously priced, much closer to Cotic than to On One.
It used to be the case that they were value frames, but there was much fanfare for the *I think* 2018 (So late 2017) stuff where materials quality and quality control was pushed up. There was a fair marketing drive, but clearly not enough.
I have a 2018 blue pig and it's an amazing bike, the paintwork is absolutely flawless and the welds all look tidy. I also have a 3-4 year old Marley which has a damaged drop out and ragley have offered a very generous crash replacement with a 2020 frame.
I would definitely buy another one of there bikes.
Ragley is customer direct now? No dealers?
I guess you're suggesting that there are, which is cool.
I would be cautious as a dealer because I know they will be sold off cheap at some point by CRC, but good to know.
Even if they aren't direct, there is a link missing form the usual Manufacturer>Distributor>Dealer chain.
Was interested in that because I'll be in the market for a new bike within a couple of months, (bikes to work scheme woo hoo!) but it's pricey compared to the likes of the White 629. Shame they don't offer the Big Al with a slightly better spec.
Even if they aren’t direct, there is a link missing form the usual Manufacturer>Distributor>Dealer chain.
Which link is that then?
Like
The Whyte 629 has a recon fork so way below a Lyrik. Other than that I get your point.
I've not got round to the detailed comparison yet, but we've been told that there's the traditional £1k limit, I'm likely to want to break it, but not totally smash it! I don't think I'm skilled enough to be bothered about the difference between forks, and the Revs are 35mm so should be decent enough.
Are mtb monster Ragley ?
Well they're a stockist. Ragley are distributed by Hotlines.
Ah I thought they were direct sales ?
Ah I thought they were direct sales ?
No
You guys think £550 is expensive? In 1995/6 a Kona Kilauea frame was £400. Yes they used a much nicer steel and the whole bike was £900 for full XT and some trick kit but I don't think given how far frames have came in the last 24/25 years that £550 is expensive.
Also that paint job looks to be a complete rip off of the Stanton Iridescent Lagoon.
Which link is that then?
CRC/Hotlines are the manufacturer and distributor - Just like they are for Vitus and Nukeproof.
You guys think £550 is expensive? In 1995/6 a Kona Kilauea frame was £400.
Yes. And that Kona was also expensive too.
I got a 1996 Marin Team made from quad-butted Fuji cro-mo for about £700 for the full bike back then, which was comparable to the higher-level Explosif rather than the Kilauea IIRC.
Ah I thought they were direct sales ?
No
Nobody tell this guy about CRC, he might get upset.
CRC/Hotlines are the manufacturer and distributor – Just like they are for Vitus and Nukeproof.
Oh, I hadn't realised that they'd built a frame building factory in Northern Ireland / Scotland for Ragley / Vitus and Nukeproof. My bad.
Blimey - do I have to spell it out.
ok - I'll complete the chain for you.
Pretty normal:
Taiwanese factory > Bike Company > Distributor > Dealer > Customer
Ragley:
Taiwanese factory > Hotlines/CRC > Dealer (or this last bit is missed if you buy from CRC/Wiggle).
But that was still 25 years ago. If you're comparing what youre saying is two relatively expensive frames then that's still only an increase of £6 a year, way below inflation.
Your Team Marin must have been in one helluva sale as the Eldridge Grade was their £700 bike back then. Pine Mountain was the Kilauea equivalent and Team Marin was Explosif as you say but they were all priced about the same. I know as it was 1995 I bought my Kilauea (which I still have 😉) and the Pine Mountain was £845 in Alpine bikes in Glasgow and all of these bikes were on my radar. The Kilauea is Tange Prestige double butted ovalised (tear drop shaped) heat treated tubing so not really overpriced in my eyes. Particularly as the 1994 version which had the same frame and was Bike of the Year. The top tubesets at the time were Tange Prestige Ultimate/Ultrastrong/Ultralight, Reynolds 853 etc and the Kilauea tubeset was only one step below these. Probably Reynolds 631 level.
Go to any off the peg builder today and you won't be getting a full Reynolds 631 or Tange prestige frame for £500 which is what the Explosif was back then I believe. I'm waiting on a Stanton Switch9er just now which is Reynolds 631 and the base frame on that is £700. Cotic Solaris only has an 853 top and down tube and isn't far kicking the arse of £700 either and the rest of it's tubes are nothing special.
I'd bet the price difference between the Ragley and the Cotic for those two tubes isn't over £100 but that's essentially what Cotic are charging.
Ah, I do like a nice bit of retro bike chat.
Well the Team Marin was a 1996 model that I got on sale from Marshall's Cycles - perhaps reduced from £1k-ish. I've always liked a bargain and I do remember I paid £700 or £750 because that was more than a month's wages as a cub reporter.
WRT the price difference between Cotic & Ragley, I guess Ragley frames won't be massively cheaper to produce than Cotics - and they probably sell fewer - but they certainly used to sell steel frames much cheaper and they should be able to leverage CRC/Wiggle's buying power for components and make the full builds much more competitive.
Still think it's a high price with a view to discounting later.
Well the Team Marin was a 1996 model that I got on sale from Marshall’s Cycles – perhaps reduced from £1k-ish. I’ve always liked a bargain and I do remember I paid £700 or £750 because that was more than a month’s wages as a cub reporter.
At around the same time I bought a Klein Pulse, to replace a Marin Eldridge Grade which I'd broken. The Klein was around £750, but the frame separately was £600, I'm sure. (I just tried looking the prices up and found https://knowyourbike.com/klein/pulse/comp which says "Due to the frame materials and other factors, we estimate that this bike weighs around 35 pounds. The Pulse Comp has fork suspension and has saddle suspension." 😀 Not to be trusted, I think!
(I put Pace forks on the Klein, and the XT/XTR components from the Marin, making a very light, stiff XC racer. Still got the frame and forks because they are worthless due to the Trek onnection.)
It's definitely too expensive. Not for a Ragley with a great build, I'd pay good money for that- I've got a Bigwig and it rides great, even if it is a bit of a lump. My old Mmmbops were cheaply made basic frames and man did it show, but the Bigwig is in a different class to that or say an On One. Is it a £550 frame? Maybe, I think not quite.
But it's just not that great a build is it? It's all decent, solid stuff and pretty well considered, very nice tyres... well, except the short dropper posts- it's a sensibly small front triangle, it doesn't need a stubby dropper, I have a 185mm in my medium with tons of room to spare and I'm 5'10, they're selling it with a 150.
I was curious... Real world SLX groupset and brakes together is 470 euros, Lyrik RC is £640, wheels are £310, £100 for dropper and tyres, the rest of the kit is decent enough own brand. That's not even trying very hard to get best prices. I bet 10 scottish pence I could source every part on that bike for less than the full build cost.
I wonder what the real price is going to be once they do the discounting? I'm going with £1800 tops. And at that price I'd be asking for a seatpost upgrade
Lyrik Select btw.
You guys think £550 is expensive? In 1995/6 a Kona Kilauea frame was £400. Yes they used a much nicer steel and the whole bike was £900 for full XT and some trick kit but I don’t think given how far frames have came in the last 24/25 years that £550 is expensive.
I was more thinking that this type of frame seemed to come in at around £300/350 not too long ago then all of a sudden jumped up a couple of hundred quid? Wasn't the pound fluctuation after the brexit vote blamed?
Pretty normal:
Taiwanese factory > Bike Company > Distributor > Dealer > CustomerRagley:
Taiwanese factory > Hotlines/CRC > Dealer (or this last bit is missed if you buy from CRC/Wiggle).
Props for adding "Customer" to one list but not the other, to help prove that one of them's got more links in. Subtle 🙂
You guys think £550 is expensive? In 1995/6 a Kona Kilauea frame was £400. Yes they used a much nicer steel and the whole bike was £900 for full XT and some trick kit but I don’t think given how far frames have came in the last 24/25 years that £550 is expensive.
Yeah, I bought a Kilauea in 1993, it was £759 for the basic bike but the frame was (IIRC) £450. And it seemed to me at the time that those numbers didn't make sense if Kona were trying to shift frames on their own.
If anyone is thinking the same way as I am about frame prices these days, it's not that £400+ is unreasonable, because it is reasonable for a good quality frame. It's more that we were spoiled about 15 years ago by a whole raft of properly cheap (ie sub £200 and often around £100) frames of all sizes and shapes. Even Surlys were £200-250 at that time. Nowadays it seems hard to find things at the low end.
Kona always seem overpriced to me. Always have low end gear and forks