Problems with GRX 12 Speed on Sonder Camino

Interested in how this pans as I am v close to pressing the button on the single chainring 12 speed GRX Camino.

Hopefully just a minor tweak as I would be surprised if yours was the first 12 speed GRX to be sold.

Do you (or did the shop) have another rear wheel to put in there? That would identify if it's a derailleur / hanger issue or something weird with the freehub.

12 speed is an unnecessary pile of ass on MTBs and likely worse on a gravel bike. But I get that there's little choice when buying new.

Which part of the derailleur is rubbing ? Can help work out where the alignment issue is

12 speed is an unnecessary pile of ass on MTBs and likely worse on a gravel bike. But I get that there’s little choice when buying new.

Opinions != Facts.

When you say checked alignment do you mean the rear hanger or the dropouts?

Dropouts might be wonky

Alpha, or Nova hubs? I had some issues with a Nova hub on the 1x12 GRX. Turns out, my Nova hub internals were different from every other Nova hub in existence

12 speed is an unnecessary pile of ass on MTBs and likely worse on a gravel bike. But I get that there’s little choice when buying new.

Camino GRX is available 2x and 1x. OP hasn't confirmed which it is.

Although my 1x12 seems like the perfect spread for me. The chain retention benefits and improved ground clearance are useful when riding Peak District stuff that I should really have taken the hardtail for.

OnzadogFree Member

Although my 1×12 seems like the perfect spread for me. The chain retention benefits and improved ground clearance are useful when riding Peak District stuff that I should really have taken the hardtail for.

Gives me nothing over 1 x 11 and is significantly more mechanically sensitive ime. Shimano, though - no experience with sram, perhaps that is better.

Of course it gives you nothing over 11, I wouldn't expect it to. It's my bike ?

Given the poor assembly standards on my Camino it could be anything.

^ not good.

@mattscom , which Alpkit shop did you get it from?

I'm a Sonder fan (Broken Road Mk1 and a new Camino Ti) but less so their wheels. The Broken Road rear hub fell to bits while I was in Oman some years back. The Camino Ti came with a front wheel about 5mm out of dish and the freehub ended up a rusty mess 3 months from new. When stripping it I found one of the 4 pawls was missing. Sonder offered a new freehub 2 weeks ago but yet to see it...

Great bikes but the out of dish wheel was visible from space and the bike should never have passed PDI, and the Alpha freehub was an assembly fault coupled with apparently poor sealing.

Hunt wheels now on the Camino and the Broken Road got Hope wheels 5 years ago and has been ace ever since.

Still a fan, but maybe think twice about wheel choice?

I’ve just got a Sonder Calibri and was pleasantly surprised by its assembly. I usually take a new bike to bits to put grease in places the manufacturer never does, but didn’t need to add any on the Sonder.

Thanks for responses.

It is a 1 x setup

It appears to be the inner plate of the derailleur cage next to the top jockey wheel that appears to be rubbing.

I didn't check the dropouts, just the hanger, but can't speak for the bike shop. All they said was that everything appears to be in alignment.

Wheels have Nova hubs.

I did consider wheel dish/ whether all the spokes had been tensioned properly as it appears to be only a couple of spokes it rubs against. The dish appears to be correct according to the bike shop.

Haven't tried another wheel in there, but might have difficulty getting a like for like wheel to compare

Where are you based? I have the same bike with spare wheels.

Nova hub internals were different from every other Nova hub in existence

Actually possible and wouldn't suprise me with Novatec hubs. Used to have to get spares in for OEM hubs and in the end we switched suppliers, couldn't keep up with the changes and odd non cross-compatibility levels.

Wheels have Nova hubs.

Wouldn't suprise me either if the flange spacing wasn't compatible with 12s clearances. Older hub body with newer freehub fitted, that kind of thing (to be fair though I'm not sure if 12S systems have clearance needs beyond the cassette itself)

I don't want to seem down on Novatec hubs, some of them are pretty good, just got to that 'what next..?' stage with them a few years back.

just ordered a camino ti,  gone with sram AXS, had wanted shimano, but friends all like the sram and my carbon wheels have XD hubs

Guessing you have a microspline 12s, wide ratio 10-45 on the back? The largest sprocket on those sits 5-8mm further inboard from the cassette's central body inside face than a smaller 2x12 or a 1x11 cassette. There is a chance the freehub is allowing fitting of a cassette that puts the chain and mech too far inboard for the spoke / flange position - ie an older 11S hub shell matched with a larger 1x12 cassette.

Had a quick look at the tech book - 11s Shimano hubs are generally about 4-5mm between the end of the freehub body cassette stop and the outer of the driveside flange but 12s microspline MTB specs are a bit over 10mm there.

Mine was online. Whilst I guess I have to accept that all the m5 bolts on a bike made to a price won't be the best, I didn't expect cheese. Rounded heads off taking them out to put good ones in. Probably to do with the  threads being jammed with paint. Hadn't been cleaned out first I guess. Same with the seat post. Brakes bled completely differently. Indexing wrong from the first pedal stroke.  Cassette rattles from new. Paint is so poor that when I dropped a bottle cage bolt, a cheese one. it chipped the paint from a good 6" up. Wheels not true after a short ride. Levers not completely level. 12 speed GRX eats chains. I wouldn't have gone that way if SRAM doubles were offered.

What’s happening with your chains and what ones are you using?

I just received my Camino and the paint was chipped when it arrived. The PDI sheet said customer aware of frame damage, the thing is I wasn't as nobody had made me aware. They were inconsequential so I accepted a £100 voucher off them instead of sending it back.

The wrong chain was fitted too, a flat top on a mullet build so they sent a replacement eagle chain out but the quick link was missing.

Bit irritating.

Anyway I don't think the mech hanger is aligned properly as the chain catches the cogs in both directions despite setting the B screw with the sram tool and using the AXS micro adjust in every position I could.

First chain was the original Shimano. Second was an identical replacement. Best so far is a Taya.

Yeah setup is microspline 12 speed with the 10 - 45 cassette.

I did also think the wrong hub body could be the issue, but it's difficult to know without trying others.

Onzadog - I have sent you a message btw

@mattsccm XTR chains aren’t cheap but last way longer than lower tier Shimano chains. And looking at some other brands’ 12spd chains makes them look very reasonable!

@ricko1984 I've tried replying but no idea if this platform is letting all messages through. I'm near J29A/30 of the M1

Hi there, did you ever get answer to this?  I've had several issues since I got my mullet spec Apex AXS Camino back in Sep 2023.  I love it, but the process of getting things sorted has been painful.

Firstly it arrives with the wrong cassette (not Eagle) paired with a flat top road chain (non Eagle) and the Eagle AXS XI rear mech (which was correct).  They then organised for the correct cassette and chain so I drove to the nearest shop (2 hours away).  Turns out they didn't realise that Eagle cassette needs the XD driver (not Shimano HG) which they didn't stock and they hadn't ordered the chain, so I ended up getting the bike sent back a week later.  The team are always super helpful, just appears that they didn't know much about how to set these up. 

Then last August the chain kept getting stuck when freewheeling - the free hub was shot. I spoke to their customer services team and they were happy to sort it, as I was heading to the Lakes for a week to go biking they suggested that the Ambleside store would sort it - which sounded great.  Turns out the store were sent an HG driver for the Alpha hub which obviously wasn't right and they didn't have any in stock.  They were very apologetic again and super helpful, but surely their system would flag this somewhere.  Anyway, got the bike back with new free wheel on the last day of my trip.

Have recently started having the chain suck thing again when freewheeling, every rotation the chain gets stuck and pulls the mech forward and then releases.  I've done about 1000 miles on it since getting it fixed, surely it can't be trashed already? 

I am now wondering if these hubs can really cope with the larger 50t Eagle cassettes. I find their knowledge of this type of set up pretty poor as each time, regardless of the store or customer service person, I have to explain how it works each time, which makes me question whether their kit is really cut out for the mullet set up.