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I have been enjoying riding my Plus bike, great for the riding I do. Smooth over stony stuff, super grippy and certainly a lot of fun. The only downside was the rumble on roads (got used to that) and terrible when it got muddy with both a lack of grip and almost no clearance when it got clogged up (on my Genesis Tarn). I have been reading about the "NEW" UK plus size being 2.6 instead of 3.0 but was it just hype? Popped into a very cool bike shop near Chicksands and got a great deal on some 2.6s so I thought I would give it a spin, I was running Spec Purgatory 3.0 so went for exactly the same but in 2.6. Went out last night for the first time and am really impressed, they were just as grippy but felt lighter in the corners and up hill, super fast downhill and almost no noise! Seems, so far that you can believe the hype.
I am waiting to try my 2.8s in proper mud. What with different makes of tyre being quite different in width, I might end up buying a 2.6 that is not much diff in size. The 2.8s (Minion/Nobby Nic) certainly look way narrower than proper 3.0s.
2.6 on 27.5" or 29" rims? (assuming 27.5")
Still mystified by the apparent lack of grip in mud. I'm on 3.0 purgatory and have no issue - yes they drift but it's hugely controlled rather than breaking away so it's fine for me at least. I'd still faster in the mud (particularly the worst of it) than pretty much everyone in my riding group and the big tyres make roots/rocks a lot more predictable in the wet.
Still mystified by the apparent lack of grip in mud.
Never really noticed that they were really bad in mud, they just weren't very good, certainly no better at anything my 'standard' tyres, which meant I wasn't making the full transition over to plus, and I canny be arsed running 2 tyre standards.
A big 2.4 Mary up front is as confidence inspiring as I need tbh.
Never fully trusted them in the lakes etc either, rattling over jaggy bastard trails.
I've never had a flat on plus tyres despite hammering them down rock trails, riding rigid trying to keep up with the rest of the group on FS 🙂 . Think they're more robust than you expect.
Standard tyres in mud tend to break away. IME plus tyres just drift but don't dump you on the ground. It's different but fine once you're used to it. Come to think of it, it's not dissimilar to fat bikes on dry trails where they also drift more than standard tyres but rarely let go.
Narrow tyres roll faster, accelate quicker and make less noise on the roads?
No real surprises there surely?
2.8s on hardtails, 2.6 on FS. I've not had issues in muddy conditions yet, they're just more grippier than o̶l̶d̶-̶f̶a̶s̶h̶i̶o̶n̶e̶d̶ standard tyres in all conditions.
Bought a 150/150 , 27.5+ all mountain frame und decided to go for 35 mm inner size rims and 2.6 Magic Mary addix soft front and back.
This bike is my more "downhill" focused bike. Just great. The more difficult the trail gets, the better the bike. And great so: my biking pals with older 170 mm Enduros and limited to 2.3 inch rubber are slower in those fast and rough downhill stretches. The 2.6 inch rubber somehow compensates for my "limited" 150 mm travel on my all mountain bike?
For "tame" trails and fast XC I use different bikes, differnt tyres, different tyre pressure. The Magic Mary soft rolls fast over rough stuff but is low on forest roads and similar.
Standard tyres in mud tend to break away. IME plus tyres just drift but don’t dump you on the ground.
Don't go assuming that my mud is the same as your mud now! 🙂
they’re just more grippier than o̶l̶d̶-̶f̶a̶s̶h̶i̶o̶n̶e̶d̶ standard tyres in all conditions.
Serious question, really, but how many guys racing at La Bresse last weekend rode plus tyres?. If they are faster as some say, grippier in all conditions, as you say, then lots must be the answer?.
If they are faster as some say, grippier in all conditions, as you say, then lots must be the answer?.
Grippier, yes. Faster, that's up for debate!
Standard tyres in mud tend to break away. IME plus tyres just drift but don’t dump you on the ground.
Not much experience with plus, but fat tyres certainly fit that description, with the caveat that you cans till push them past a point when the grip suddenly disappears, and sometimes that point can still come very suddenly!
Serious question, really, but how many guys racing at La Bresse last weekend rode plus tyres?. If they are faster as some say, grippier in all conditions, as you say, then lots must be the answer?.
I understand what you're saying, but that's not quite the same as being better (grippier or faster) for a more average rider.
An F1 car may well be the optimum tool for the job of getting around a race track really quickly with Lewis Hamilton driving it. I suspect given a lap in his Mercedes and a lap in a Honda Civic, I'd be faster in the Civic. Even if the comparison was a touring car to its road going equivalent I'd probably struggle.
Same with bikes, I'm sure Gee is faster down a downhill track two wheel drifting through hundreds of corners with pinpoint accuracy on whatever bike and tyres he chooses. Me on the other hand, 3" tyres would give some much needed safety margin. And be honest, you or I would drag our brakes down a DH track to a far greater degree than the difference in rolling resistance of our tyre choice Vs Gee's. I doubt there's significantly more grip in plus/fat tyres compared to their 2.3" versions, but there's a lot more useable grip when the imperfect squishy bit on top doing the riding gets involved.
plus tyres are not grippier cornering fast in soft conditions and let's be honest here there's not really a need for more grip anywhere else.
They are for folk who'll never corner hard
Ah but as pointed out above, most riders aren't Gnar-to-the-max shredders who'd win on the world cup DH circuit if they could be bothered, like you, geex 😉
Add to that that the Pro's get an almost unlimited budget, or rather they get the bikes that we'd pick with an unlimited budget. A FS bike with good tyres will be quickest up/down almost anything.
In the real world if you had £1k to spend on a bike and the choice was a 29er HT or 650b+ HT with otherwise identical builds, the big tyres may well get you down a hill quicker, just not as quick as a FS bike.
Obviously riding gods like geex don't have these issues and ride past people at trail centers cornering hard on their singlespeed CX bikes.
Anecdotally last night three out of seven of our group crashed on one particular feature (a steep muddy roll in, with a horrible step halfway down and a sharp turn at the bottom all made of a sort of horrible moist clay). I almost binned it but I'm convinced the extra margin for error with 4" tyres probably saved my ass. They're not faster than a good* rider, but they do act as a skill compensator, which is basically saying they're quicker unless your Pro/geex.
*I'd class myself as "not shit", mostly let down by fitness and a fear of the ninja roots at Tunnel Hill.
They are for folk who’ll never corner hard
This must be the one and only Gee Atherton, speaking from experience - we must pay attention.
do act as a skill compensator
haha. Like that.
Biking my 150/150 all mountain bike with 2.6 inch rubber: yes - there is skill compensator stuff going on.
Never was hoping to bike difficult trails so fast. My skill improved only a bit - but for me these 2.6 inch tyres work just great. Really in skill compensator fashion...
But the miracle stuff is over when biking forest roads. No miracle there - just drag...
I thought the new 2.6 sizes were normal, rather than plus tyres. Doesn't using these on a plus bike place the BB too low?
place the BB too low?
bit a matter of "taste". Yes - when using a 2.6 tyre instead 3.0 or so - the BB will be a bit lower.
I am not a great rider but my fat bike I was loads faster at glentress. Simply because of the grip and the confidence it gave me.
Rad to the max riders will roll plus tyres in hard cornering.
There I said it, despite being a massive fanboy with plus tyres of all sorts on my bikes.
However, if your 2hr ride consists of some soft stuff, roots, loose rock and techy climbs along with a few bermed corners where you can really load up the tyres, then the plus tyres will be a benefit overall.
If you ride trail centre stuff mainly, then you will corner harder more often and plus tyres maybe don't make so much sense.
I had mine in Morzine this summer where speeds are very high with endless squishing the bike into gert big berms. I put an extra ten psi in the tyres and all was good. The Plus tyre benefits are negated but it's just a case of adapting to the terrain you predominantly ride.
However, if your 2hr ride consists of some soft stuff, roots, loose rock and techy climbs along with a few bermed corners where you can really load up the tyres, then the plus tyres will be a benefit overall.
Yes.
Easy test, now, in summer time: usually not such an good idea (lots of hidden dangers - like deep trenches which are hardly visible) - but sometimes we go onto a ski slope/piste with our bikes. Test run on this soft and very bumpy meadow stuff ... without pedaling, compare how quick the 2.6 inch rubber bike and the 2.3 inch tyre bike will pick up speed - and then which speed still feels controllable.
The difference is huge. Really huge.
But pedaling uphill, on roads or so: here you have to pay the price....
I'm back on a 2.4 on the rear of my hardtail after slashing the sidewalls on 2 brand new continental mountain king. I found the sidewalls to be fag paper thin. To get the weight down to a reasonable weight they have compromised on the thickness of the sidewall. The tyres didn't last long enough for me to form a reasonable opinion of them.
The der Baron 2.6 on the front is good, I like it.
I'm not a riding god (and currently have the bruises to prove it) but according to Strava I'm faster on my 150mm travel plus tyred eBike than on my 160mm travel gnarpoon enduro weapon and I feel much more comfortable doing it.
Cool story bro.
I like the idea of 2.6- but so far almost all of the 2.6 tyres are 2.5 or less and it's all a complete load of horseshit. Just total emperor's new clothes and the ultimate example of how much the bike industry think of their customers, "We'll just add .1 to the tyre and say it's a new thing!"
Actual plus wasn't for me, it wasn't better than 29 at anything for me and worse at lots, but if you like it then why not?
When comparing ebike to gnarpoon...how are you doing this? Ebike is pedal assist, so isn't the same as it will be assisting with the speed element (up to whenever it stops). Although they are both bikes, I suspect the comparison isn't equal and the faster isn't really the tyres at all.
(no gripe about ebike, just unsure how the comparison can be made fairly as there are many factors playing a part)
Not answering the question above ^^ - you could only make a fair comparison on the same bikes. However, my Specialized ebike comes with 2.8 Butchers. They are horrible and will be coming off - sketchy as hell. I first had the Butcher/Purgatory combo in non + 26" flavour and found them ok. I then stuck the same combo on my Capra and they didn't work in 27.5, or that bike in general - replaced with MM/HD, which are loads better.
Anyway, I digress - I'll be swapping the tyres on my ebike, but the general concensus on emtb forums, is that 2.5, or 2.6 tyres work far better than 2.8's
that 2.5, or 2.6 tyres work far better than 2.8’s
Difficult to develope those 2.8 tyres. But the tyre manufacturers were able to make fantastic 2.6 inch tyres.
Question of time?
same thing with plus tyres really.
Not really. They are different, they ride differently (of course they do, they are huge). Whether or not you like it is up to you and where/what/how you ride.
No need to be a dick about it. Ride what you like.
When comparing ebike to gnarpoon…how are you doing this? Ebike is pedal assist, so isn’t the same as it will be assisting with the speed element (up to whenever it stops).
Obviously it's going to be quicker up hill. I meant, but didn't say, it's quicker on the downs than the gnarpoon. It's seat of the pants comparisons allied to Strava numbers. If someone wants to lend me a set of set of boost wheels shod with 2.35" MM on the front and 2.3 DHR2 on the back I'll happily do some direct comparisons.
No need to be a dick about it.
It's what he does best.
Recently gone plus.. (27.5+ / with 2.8 crown gems / Marin b-17.1)
did my second ride ever ride onthe new bike on saturday.. on 2 quantock descents i've done 20+ times in the past several years (weacombe, higher hare knap) i got personal best times and i got a second best on bincombe plus the ascent i start with often i also got a PB. (done 40+ times)
i've had a big break from riding, gone from riding a 26er (santa cruz superlight) weekly a year ago to every 3 weeks ish. in the last 6 months. (and a 6 month gap of bugger all)
not even got the new bike dialed yet, was fannying with the dropper on weacombe and about to move the spacers a bit (currently all under..). btw first ride on the new bike was in the wet, and was impressed with the grip.
i was pushing really hard mashing over some rocks and did get a pinch flat - but i do think i was running the rear shock a bit hard as i floated over similar a few weeks ago.
in short: already quick, once i got this thing set up nice i'm gonna be very quick.