[Closed] Please talk me out of getting a 29+ hardtail, especially as my only bike!

It'll take forever to pump your tyre up when you get a flat!? 😉

I rode the Stache and was very underwhelmed, I like the concept and wanted to like it but it was like a 29er with slightly bigger but very heavy tyres and not helped by the fork which was absolute bobbins. Going up I could feel the extra traction, on the flat it was alright if it was rolling and downhill it was a bit cack as it took effort to get it to move about. If you were OK to just roll in a straight line monster truck style it's fine but it wasn't nimble.

And it weighed shit loads. It was markedly heavier than my spectral. Run tubeless with rigid forks it might be better but it's starting from a low base for me.

Very meh.

You are wrong. The sensible approach should be to go for a 29+. They are fantastic bikes. The Krampus is like a two wheeled monster truck. Never had as much fun on a bike as I have had on this. It goes up and over everything. Use it as an everyday trail bike (I rarely bother with my full sus anymore) and also great for bikepacking duties.

Never tried the Trek, but it looks a great option also and I would be considering one now if I didn't already have the Krampus. In fact to be honest I have looked at them a couple times and thought about getting one also. So taken by the 29+ wheels that I am, and as you say they are both different bikes!

Just get one. I've got a Krampus and love it. Was looking at a 27.5+ wheel tyre combo yesterday and was surprised by how small it looked.

Good point Andy!
Mr Hoppy - I'd reserved some judgement on the Stache's weight and fork because I'd be going tubeless and the fork wasn't set up for me. Maybe I just liked it because it was a novelty? I haven't ridden a normal-wheeled hardtail in ages either. Thanks for your insight, it's helped cast some doubts (which I'm pleased about).

It's the Krampus I'd decided on, especially as I definitely wanted a double chainset. I was told that because of my short'ish legs that I might not be able to fit a saddlebag to any 29+ bike though. I've been and tried mine today and there's plenty of room - if it hadn't have, I would definitely have ruled 29+ out. I was put off that I was recommended the medium frame (17.5") even though I'm over 6'. Turns out the large Trek has the same effective toptube length, so nothing to worry about.

I felt that I'd get as good a ride from a 'good' 29er with the geometry I want running decent wheels and a decent set of larger (2.4 ish) standard tyres. And the Stache is stupidly expensive and uses boost.

Don't get me wrong, I can see the fun of riding along with monster truck tyres in view but it'd wear off too soon for me.

I have a yeti big top (100mm 29er hardtail) & a yeti sb66c (160mm full sus).... & for 95% of my riding it's the hardtail that is THE best bike.... But then I go and do something gnarly on my sb and all is forgiven.... What a confusing time.

If I absolutely HAD to get rid of one bike, I think it'd be the sb66c.... I think... Erm, would it? Yes.... Maybe.

In summary: pass

I think my problem is it's a while since I've had a hardtail, and they were always set up with poor Dual-control brakes and skinny tyres!
Regarding the Stache though, I was put off by not being able to mount a front mech and of course, the boost hubs, mainly because I can't just pop a standard wheelset on, plus I'd been thinking of a dynamo front hub.

If you get one then you'll die a horrible death, the like of which no-one should be subjected to.

Any good ?

I would double check the sizes. I think the Med Trek and Med Krampus have both effective top tube lengths of 609mm.

EDIT: Maybe not. I was assuming the Trek range goes from XS-S-M-L-XL and not S-M-L-XL-XXL.

Rob - I'm the same myself! I know I'll regret selling my current bike (mojo hd), but I'm just not using it as I'm not prepared to drive everywhere to ride anymore. I do live in the Lakes though, so know I'll really miss a full-sus on the descents!

Allthepies - you could be wrong, it would at least end the misery of reading up on all these different bike specs and new standards like I have been all week!

Rene - I'm confused as to where Trek take their measurements... I actually measured the 19.5 eff-toptube to be 24" C2C, but also measured the same on the 20.5 which is supposed to be nearly an inch bigger. I couldn't measure the med Krampus, as that the size they didn't have. I was caught out by their sizes though, as the 20 (actually 20.7) is the XL! I'd been confusing the med with the small before I went in the shop.

I thought you had wee legs? B+ would make a lot more sense.

Confirmed my thoughts, was sure you lived in the lakes, no way I'd go hardtail only in the lakes.

Scotroutes - not as wee as I thought! There was plenty of room for my saddlebag, plus more importantly, the eff-toptube will be slightly longer than my current bike, even with a 17" seat-tube.

Nobeers - I'm actually more concerned about the tyres holding up than I am about lack of suspension. I'm wanting a bike to do bigger distances on, with a view to going travelling for a few months next year. What will shock you more is that the bike would be rigid for a bit while I decide/find a suspension fork. Anyway, if I don't get on with it, it can soon be sold. My current bike has 26" wheels, so I'll get next to nothing for it, but that will go in my favour if I need to buy something similar back.

You won't need a suspension fork. Get the stooge.

I got rid of my full suss bike to get a 29er hardtail. I've not regretted it until last week when I was in Scotland, when I did, quite a bit.

If you can afford/have room for both, I'd do that. A 29er ht is a great option, but can get uncomfortable if it's rocky

I'd be waiting and trying some of the B+ bikes coming out. While the Stache felt loads of fun when I had a go, the wheels did feel huge and as you know I'm a very tall long time 29er fan. I've gone B+ on the Solaris. Tyre life remains to be seen.
Have you considered a Genesis Longitude? Getting some gripes from some quarters but lots of sense here - [url= http://www.genesisbikes.co.uk/blog/07/07/15/2016-longitude ]Longitude[/url]
Bikepacking, 29er, B+, rigid/sus fork, 2/3x10, decent price etc

Surely not worth selling a 26" Mojo anyway is it?

[i]Rene - I'm confused as to where Trek take their measurements... I actually measured the 19.5 eff-toptube to be 24" C2C, but also measured the same on the 20.5 which is supposed to be nearly an inch bigger. I couldn't measure the med Krampus, as that the size they didn't have. I was caught out by their sizes though, as the 20 (actually 20.7) is the XL! I'd been confusing the med with the small before I went in the shop. [/i]

It measures what it measures.

If you are looking for something for next year, ride your 26" FS until then, then buy something when you want/need something else.

You won't need a suspension fork. Get the stooge.

This.

If you intend to do more bikepacking I think the Surly with a double and more mounts is a better option, although having seen the Trek it does look like fun!

I've considered a full suss B+ that can take normal 29er wheels and I think that would make a good all rounder. Let's see what will come to market in the next year or so.

Regarding 29+ and monster trucks, I normally ride my Stooge around Thetford or on bridal paths but decided to bring it to the Peaks instead of my 140mm 29er. While it was certainly rattly and I wish I had suspension on the roughest bits I kept up with all the 6" on the decents but out climbed everyone on the loose rocky bits doing Jacobs Ladder, it's an amazing bike. With a double and a fatter rear tire I think you could climb a wall. (Almost).

I picked up a Krampus yesterday and did 143 miles on it. Great bit of kit but the Knards are rubbish in mud!

Aye - tyre choice is another consideration in the wheelsize debate. I think there are already more B+ tyre options than there are 29+

Stooge only comes in one size though, so if you're 6'+, it's compromised. Chap in 4Play has one - sure he'd give you a shot (if you've not already)

Jones Plus

I'm still not sure what to do. I think some demo riding is in order, otherwise I'm never going to make my mind up or might make a decision I regret. I'm even starting to consider an all-mountain hardtail with a travel-adjustable fork!

I definitely know rigid won't be for me longterm though, and a second bike is out of the question.

Thanks everyone for your input, it's brought me to my senses. It's a good job I didn't take any forms of payment with me yesterday!

Edit - Boxelder - MrVear up there is the man you mention! 😆

Rode a Stache the other week and would get one straight away if I didn't already have a fatbike and a hardtail 29er. But as it fits in between the 2 it would be a bit of an extravagant purchase. Plus the wife would kill me*

If I had to have just one mountain bike 27+ or 29+ would be it though.

*and then she'd go on to sell my bikes for what I told her they cost.

I've got a Krampus, as an only bike, nah

Drofluf - it was a Stache 7 I had a go on because that's what my budget would have allowed. I called in at another shop on my way home and they had the top model, which had been the owner's own, with £800 off. It's a good job it was a size too big!

Don't go adjustable forks - 120mm and a dropper much more sense. With B+ tyres, you'll conquer all before and below you.

Ha ha, I take it you must be liking your new wheels Boxelder?! I was told to ask you about your Solaris, but thought you must have the Mk.1? Unless that's B+ compatible also?

I'm 6"3 and am very happy on my stooge. It's an amazing bike and I'm enjoying raging it around the lakes.

Well the Krampus was my only bike and few weeks ago, but now it's been joined by a Gnarvester, so two 29+ and no other bikes. For me 29+ just felt right straight away having always been a fan of the largest 29er tyres previously. If you are currently on 26 the jump will be huge and perhaps you would be better on the b+. The Krampus is set up single speed and rigid now, while the Gnarvester is geared, suspension and dropper. There is not much that bike will not barrel though and I've never felt out of my depth on the same trails I used to ride full suss on.

Scrufftv get some photos up of your Gnarvester, best bike name ever?

As much as I've moaned about it, boxelder is right, the 2016 Longitude sounds perfect for you. Never thought I'd ever recommend it, but the fact you can put a sus fork on it without causing geometry issues may be a winner. Although, having said that, it has stupid hub spacings...
Sod it, get a krampus...

[img] [/img]

Stupid stupid bikes...

Here you go 1 shed. Gnarvester and the Krampus...

[img] [/img]

[img] [/img]

Very nice scrufftv, I think I would enjoy harvesting the gnar.

Thanks, well chuffed with it. They do an aluminium model as well which is lighter than the Krampus. It has a lower bottom bracket than the Krampus and handles the tall suspension fork much better. In fact the Krampus bottom bracket is high enough to run normal 29er tyres, or even the true 3" + B+ tyres if the OP wanted to cover all their options.

I don't know if this is any help but (after waiting for ages for them to come in stock) I recently bought a pair of Trailblazer B+ tyres, which I intended to try on my Mk1 Solaris. However, I'm now having second thoughts.

I was out on my Five the other night and coming down a set of rocky steps the bike felt terrible. I thought the rear shock had failed, but on getting to the bottom I realised that I'd lost a load of air from the rear tyre and was running around 15psi. If that's what low pressure feels like (bouncy and hard to control) I'm not sure I'm going to like it much.

They do an aluminium model as well which is lighter than the Krampus.

do they? its not on the site

them nextie rims look awesome compared to the RH's as well 8)

My Krampus in it's natural habitat, love it to bits...

[IMG] [/IMG]

http://carverbikes.com/frames/aluminum-gnarvester/ that frame and their carbon fork looks a winner.

Has been the first thing on their front page for months, just checked still there. This is the link> http://carverbikes.com/frames/aluminum-gnarvester/ /p>

The Nexties do perk up the ride, pick up is great. I Did notice the other day that after riding just the Nexties for a month, went back to the Rabbit Holes with tubes and it didn't feel as bad as I thought, the gyroscopic never going to stop freewheeling you get with heavy wheels was a pleasant surprise. If I could afford another pair of Nexties I would get them though.

sorry i thought it was a Travers!

Ah yes, easy mistake. Nearly went that way but I wanted a threaded bottom bracket. Did get the wheels from them though, great service.

Krampus will make your other bikes redundant.
[URL= http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r699/mf_kuman/image.jpg1_zpsitqn9rkv.jp g" target="_blank">http://i1362.photobucket.com/albums/r699/mf_kuman/image.jpg1_zpsitqn9rkv.jp g"/> [/IMG][/URL]

Hey! Have some of you forgot the title of this thread! You're supposed to be talking me out of wanting one, although I seem to be doing a good job of that myself. 😀

Fin25 - it has 135mm qr rear. Is that stupid spacing already?

I think he might mean the 'boost' front. It would definitely limit suspension fork choices, at least at the moment.

I realised that I'd lost a load of air from the rear tyre and was running around 15psi. If that's what low pressure feels like.

It's not. You're confusing a semi flat with a large volume tyre.
Not even vaguely like each other.

Might one suggest an Ice Cream Truck? I'm running one in both full fat and 29+ mode. Absolutely brilliant fun! Handles like a Krampus in 29+ mode with the option of going full fat. I used it in fat mode for the Capital Trail and loved it. It definitely warrants a double at the front as you'll be amazed at the traction you get. I seem to spend most of my time riding it these days at the exclusion of my other bikes. 😀

I was a sceptic about the press fit bb but it has been rock solid.

Check out Coastkid's blog for all things 29+. The new Surly Wednesday could be a great option too!

Be prepared to enjoy yourself!

This probably won't help but I had the Ice Cram Truck up Helvellyn twice in a day last month.....it was bloody good fun. The big wheels and rigid coped better on the steps of despair down Dollywagon Pike than my mates 650b full sussers. It's a different riding style but is definitely a hoot! Hmmmmm! I'm no help really, am I? 😀

No, you really are not!

If you are near Jockland, you are welcome to try it........that REALLY doesn't help!

Thanks for the offer, but as much as I know I'd like it, I definitely won't be going full-fat (or getting a bike that has the capability of becoming one).
It is good to hear someone like yourself sing the praises of them though, as I know you don't mince the descents. Most other folk I know that are recommending them either aren't quick or have never had a decent full-sus. The ones who are/have and also have any bike I'm considering still wouldn't give up their full-sus'!

Most other folk I know that are recommending them either aren't quick or have never had a decent full-sus. Thanks that's me that is.

😆

Me too.

Hi,

Having one, universal but quite niche bike is making you accept all the pross and cons it is bringing into the game.

Personally if I'll be completely and utterly down to ONE bike and not bothered about weight I would go with 29+ ready fattie. Next step would be 2 or even 3 wheels sets (full on fatty, 29+ and standard 29) shortly followed by Bluto.

If you are at least part weight-conscious I would go custom Ti to accommodate all my needs. Pact by Brant Richards for example, as it is not requiring to sell kids, kidney, liver and start prostituting yourself 😀

Cheers!
I.

dan and mrvear - fancy a quick bikepack overnight sometime soon?
Would involve a pub

It's not. You're confusing a semi flat with a large volume tyre.
Not even vaguely like each other.

I'm sure you're right, but does 15psi in a 27.5x2.8 tyre really feel that much different to 15psi in a 26x2.25 tyre? Different enough to go from hating the feel to liking it? I know there is only one way to find out, but it's going to mean buying some wheels (or buying some rims and building some wheels), so it would be handy if somebody could try and put into words the difference in feel between a low pressure "plus" tyre and a low pressure "normal" tyre.

could try and put into words the difference in feel between a low pressure "plus" tyre and a low pressure "normal" tyre.

Low pressure on standard 29 inch tyre for me is anything around 12-17PSI.
And that is standard I was running on my 29-er HT with 2.4 and 2.3 tyres on 21mm internal width rims. 10.5 stones, not very aggressive rider, not jumpy.

On 29+ my low pressure was around 6-8PSI set up tubeless on 45mm internal width rims. Extra low, just for the sake of testing was around 4PSI to explore tubeless set up.

That one gave me feeling of run-on-flat standard tyre. Sidewalls were bending and washing out, whole experience of riding was very, very unpleasant.

With 6-8PSI in my case I had perfect balance between cushioning and support. No unwanted bending, rolling or washing-out of the tyre. And still bucketloads of comfort.
Especially visible on the cobbled or small bumps uneven surface.

Sure thing as soon as it is going choppy you can feel that there is not enough suspension to aid you but that is beauty of riding fully rigid.

You either suffer or apply you body-English and pick you lines carefully and deliberately.

Cheers!
I.

does 15psi in a 27.5x2.8 tyre really feel that much different to 15psi in a 26x2.25 tyre?

I think in very basic terms low pressure on normal ish tyres feels like the tyres is collapsing when you side load in corners and + tyres don't.
You don't get as many rim strikes either.

Thanks IvanMTB and singlespeedstu, that's very helpful. I guess there is an optimum pressure for any wheel, based on the size (and construction) of the tyres, width of the wheel and rider preferences. That pressure will likely be lower for a 27.5x2.8 setup than a 26x2.25 one, but it's still going to be a case of fiddling around to see what suits each rider best.

I think I've got it now 🙂

Boxelder - I'm sure we can organise something. I've still got your number, so I'll speak to MrVear and be in touch.

It's not just the tyres Rover, a lot of the + feel is attributed to the wider rims. even a regular size tyre feels better at lower pressures. A plus size rim allows the tyre to fill out in a more square profile reducing the rolling effect of the balloon profile you'd have on regular rims.

Get a grip man. They flatten out the trails, don't turn so well, look out of proportion, unless you are a giant....

We'll love you whatever you ride. You'll love whatever you ride.

When's the bike up for sale? It's an awesome bike.

Hope to see you out on the tasks soon buddy. X

Boxelder, I'm on for a bivvy, give me a bell at the shop.

I really didn't want to read this thread...

And more pictures please...

[img] https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/CSz6KqyE1YtNiIfjSlUAEMBNsdZnwAlY_4s55nPv2Eo=w1442-h1071-no [/img]
HTH

Why yes it did. Thank you.

[img] [/img]

It's brilliant, still can't get my head around Genesis changing it so significantly this year, especially after it sold out in no time

Les - thanks for the advice and the lurve - give me a shout if you want to ride sometime, I don't necessarily mean a bike one either. When's your Mrs next away? 😉